UFC 228 SUN. SEP. 9, 2018 WOODLEY VS. TILL

tommyboy26

Till said in the press conference that woodley got the better of him tonight but he isnt a better fighter than him.

anyone agree with that?

dulux99

tommyboy26 wrote: »

Till said in the press conference that woodley got the better of him tonight but he isnt a better fighter than him.

anyone agree with that?

No.

Subcomandante Marcos

Woodley is the best WW in the world, I don't think till is actually top 5, yet.

The points win against Wonderboy I feel was swayed by home advantage, he didn't do enough to win that fight.

I'd have T-Wood, Wonderboy, Rory, Lima and Askren all ahead of him.

I think Till would whoop Colby though.

Dave0301

tommyboy26 wrote: »

Till said in the press conference that woodley got the better of him tonight but he isnt a better fighter than him.

anyone agree with that?

Absolutely not. Till was hyped up for marketing purposes, and should not have been anywhere near a title fight really.

dulux99

Till sh*t himself last night. He barely threw a punch in a world title fight. Very disappointed in him

dulux99

Dave0301 wrote: »

Absolutely not. Till was hyped up for marketing purposes, and should not have been anywhere near a title fight really.

Well that's not true. He beat cowboy cerrone and stephen thompson. He merited his title fight, he just didn't perform on the night.

Whelo79

I echo the same as others here, disappointed in how Till performed and impressed by Woodley being more aggressive than we have seen for a while.

I'd like to see Woodley v Covington now and Usman v Till or Wonderboy.

pastorbarrett

dulux99 wrote: »

Well that's not true. He beat cowboy cerrone and stephen thompson. He merited his title fight, he just didn't perform on the night.

He came in way over weight in Liverpool in a fight that could have been decided for either contender. With every respect to his talents, he was in the fight last night largely at Dana's behest - Dana wants another UK/ European star and Dana wants Woodley out. Till likely could have done with 1 or 2 more tests at WW before facing Woodley. Of course, the cut isn't going to get any easier, so maybe the UFC was thinking it was now or never.

I think he has to go to MW now. Not because he couldn't be in title contention again relatively soon (he could), but because of the cut.

sonofenoch

dulux99 wrote: »

Till sh*t himself last night. He barely threw a punch in a world title fight. Very disappointed in him

He had nothing, as one side a title fight as McGregor/Alvarez ......just aswell, can't be doing with a gobby scouser on the mic :cool:

The Nal

Any word on Stamanns knee?

Useful.Idiot

sonofenoch wrote: »

He had nothing, as one side a title fight as McGregor/Alvarez ......just aswell, can't be doing with a gobby scouser on the mic :cool:

I also thought that Woodleys pull back right hand counter almost looked a mirror image of McGregor's pull back counter that started the barrage that put Eddie away. Both counters were on a strike that nearly brushed the face too.

dave1982

Great quote from woodley, im the champion im supposee to win, i done nothing spectalur

tommyboy26

dulux99 wrote: »

Well that's not true. He beat cowboy cerrone and stephen thompson. He merited his title fight, he just didn't perform on the night.

i dont agree i think he should of fought another top contender like usman, rda or lawlor before he got the title fight. he beat cerrone but he wasnt top 10 (i could be wrong) then thompson which was very close. if he beat wonderboy clearly or one sided then i would of said maybe a title fight.

i dont see why dana has a problem with woodley. i noticed he didnt do the press conference after the fight i suppose that says everything about dana

Autecher

tommyboy26 wrote: »

i dont agree i think he should of fought another top contender like usman, rda or lawlor before he got the title fight. he beat cerrone but he wasnt top 10 (i could be wrong) then thompson which was very close. if he beat wonderboy clearly or one sided then i would of said maybe a title fight.

i dont see why dana has a problem with woodley. i noticed he didnt do the press conference after the fight i suppose that says everything about dana

After Woodley had Till down for about a minute they switched camera angles so that Dana was in the shot while Tyron was smashing Darren with punches & elbows. Dana kept throwing worried looks to his left (at Sean Shelby maybe?) then glumly staring back at his monitor. I did enjoy seeing that I have to admit

dulux99

Woodley rocks the boat. He doesn't pander to the UFC the way most do. Dana doesn't like people who stand up to him, it's as simple as that.

Autecher

dulux99 wrote: »

Woodley rocks the boat. He doesn't pander to the UFC the way most do. Dana doesn't like people who stand up to him, it's as simple as that.

It depends on if they bring money in too, Conor & Nate bring money in, stand up to him yet he never really criticises them. Also Woodley did publicly call the UFC a racist company many times promoting the second Wonerboy fight. If I was a boss and an employee (or contractor I hired :pac:) called my company racist without any legitimate proof I'd be well pissed off at them.

tommyboy26

cliggg wrote: »

After Woodley had Till down for about a minute they switched camera angles so that Dana was in the shot while Tyron was smashing Darren with punches & elbows. Dana kept throwing worried looks to his left (at Sean Shelby maybe?) then glumly staring back at his monitor. I did enjoy seeing that I have to admit

watch from 5:30 on that video its awesome

Autecher

tommyboy26 wrote: »

watch from 5:30 on that video its awesome

Removed unfortunately, nevermind though it'll be on Fight Pass in a day or two.

dulux99

Watched the fight back for a third time. Cant remember ever seeing such a limp performance from a title challenger. So disappointing. Till looked clueless once it hit the deck.

VW 1

Just rewatched the main event again, anyone else notice the puncture marks on the inside of tills arm around the crease of hhis elbow? Would they be down to blood tests?

VW 1

VW 1 wrote: »

Just rewatched the main event again, anyone else notice the puncture marks on the inside of tills arm around the crease of hhis elbow? Would they be down to blood tests?

Yes!!! His right arm. Quite a lot of bruising. Was wondering too and it looked recent/new enough. Don't think USADA take blood? And presumably no chance he chanced an IV bag....

JoeyJJ

dulux99 wrote: »

Watched the fight back for a third time. Cant remember ever seeing such a limp performance from a title challenger. So disappointing. Till looked clueless once it hit the deck.

I think he got too comfortable in the position before Woodley transitioned to the Darce, He winked (iirc) at the ref about a min before that, he was prepared to lose round for a chance to start next round standing however didn't defend sub in order to get there.

mangobob

Reflecting on the card again, I have to say I thoroughly enjoyed it. It was absolutely worth missing sleep for. A couple of thoughts occur in no particular order.

On the night I was really disappointed in Till. I didnt expect him to win, but to be outclassed like that was just embarrassing. He danced around and barely fired a shot before getting the ever living crap kicked out of him. It looked like he was overwhelmed by the occasion or just plain afraid to engage. I felt at the time that he could possibly have set his career back, not by the loss, but by the manner of it. Over time though I have developed a little sympathy for him. I believe him when he says his game plan was to figure Woodley out for the first round or two while allowing him to deplete his gas tank, then take the fight to him. Also I was impressed with his physical strength in the clinch and his toughness. He got hit with a bomb on the chin that would have ended many other fighters, and that was followed up by a nightmarish ground and pound that again I feel would have finished most others but Till toughed it out. Woodley hit him with everything he had but couldnt finish him and so resorted to the submission. So there are some positives to take from it, but the fact remains he got unreservedly outclassed. Also the fact that a guy as risk averse as TW was WAY more aggressive than against Wonderboy suggests to me that he didn't feel DT posed nearly as much of a threat.

Secondly Woodley made me a fan, at last. I always had an ambivalence toward him. On the one hand he seems like such good guy when you saw him at home. He has a beautiful family and seems like a great husband and father. In the cage it was obvious that he was super talented and could be really dynamic and exciting when he wanted to be. Also despite some resistance and push back, he still stepped up and defended his belt against the best guys as a champion should. On the other hand his constant race baiting (a real pet peeve of mine) was beyond tiresome and his recent tendency toward an ultra cautious style (however understandable strategically) really made him a bore to watch. Chael was boring as hell too, but he had the mic skills and charisma to still make me interested. Woodley just doesnt. However that performance really showed him for what he is. An absolute beast, a true martial artist and a great champion. But his reaction after the fight really won me over, especially his words of encouragement to Till and even the interaction between his mother and DT was just fantastic. While I never exactly booed him, from now on I will be actively cheering for the guy.

Thirdly this card, although nothing to do with Conor, actually made me appreciate him even more. Watching Till being given his moment and then fluffing his lines, just served to emphasise how incredible Mcgregors achievements have been, both inside and outside the octagon. I am the first to admit that some of his antics outside the cage get on my nerves, and even totally cross the line at the times. He can be both hilarious and obnoxious in equal measure and I think he has made some bad choices in the company he keeps. But love him or hate him the man is truly everything you could ever ask for in a prize fighter. He ducks no one, turns up every single time on weight and on point. He takes crazy risks that other champs like Woodley or Jon Jones would never even dream of. He is a sh1t talker par excellence, possesses a mental warfare game that is second to none, has an inhuman level of confidence and most of all he has a style of fighting that ANY fight fan just loves to watch. He just seems incapable of having a boring fight. Best of all, he is Irish. How long will we have to wait to see another Irish champion? A very very long time I suspect. He may never be quite at the level of a Jones or a GSP or even guys like Zabit in the future, but he is still damn good. For a short few years, he single-handedly put Irish mma not just on the map but arguably at the centre of the mma world. This will probably rub some the wrong way, but I really don't think we will fully appreciate the guy or the magnitude of his achievements until he is gone.

Finally, Karolina....:(:(:(

The Nal

Till probably has one more shot to do something special. Otherwise hes a Fox journeyman type guy. 7 fights in the UFC now and 2 TKO wins, 1 loss, 3 decisions and a draw. And hes a risk making weight.

Hardly box office.

I thought he looked out of his depth physically. A more risk adverse fighter would've finished him quicker on the floor maybe. He took a few elbows well in fairness to him though but trash talking aside he hasn't offered anything special.

rob316

We all knew it was way too early for Till and we didn't really know what he was capable of against an elite opponent. He was battered but he's young and could well go on to beat a few ranked fighters around him and get back in the title picture.

DrPhilG

mangobob wrote: »

He takes crazy risks that other champs like Woodley or Jon Jones would never even dream of.

Just to play devil's advocate a little...

Can we really make that comparison, given that he has never defended a belt?

Yes of course he has fought after becoming champ, but never with the risk of losing his title that tends to make others fight safe.

AlmightyCushion

DrPhilG wrote: »

Just to play devil's advocate a little...

Can we really make that comparison, given that he has never defended a belt?

Yes of course he has fought after becoming champ, but never with the risk of losing his title that tends to make others fight safe.

Definitely we can. Taking a crack at RDA for the 155 belt was definitely a lot riskier than just defending his belt. Sure if he lost he'd still have the belt but a loss could have taken away a lot of his momentum at the time. Then to change opponent less than 2 weeks out was even riskier. Turns out the loss made him bigger than ever instead of hurting him but it was by no means a safe move.

mangobob

DrPhilG wrote: »

Just to play devil's advocate a little...

Can we really make that comparison, given that he has never defended a belt?

Yes of course he has fought after becoming champ, but never with the risk of losing his title that tends to make others fight safe.

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

Definitely we can. Taking a crack at RDA for the 155 belt was definitely a lot riskier than just defending his belt. Sure if he lost he'd still have the belt but a loss could have taken away a lot of his momentum at the time. Then to change opponent less than 2 weeks out was even riskier. Turns out the loss made him bigger than ever instead of hurting him but it was by no means a safe move.

I understand where you are coming from, but as AC said above, I think we can definitely say that.

Firstly look at what happened when the Aldo fight fell out a couple of weeks before 189. He accepted a short notice replacement who was completely different from the guy he was training for. Not just any replacement, but the best wrestler in the division. In other words, his kryptonite at the time. If he lost to Mendes then he would have lost the title shot and all that momentum he worked so hard to build. On top of it all, we later find out that he spent most of that training camp in the physio room due to a serious injury that prevented him from training. Ballsy doesnt even begin to describe it.

Then moving up to 155 against a guy like RDA, only to once again have a last minute change of opponent. Once again the guy in question was a nightmare match up for him - taller, long, excellent on the ground, just as good a boxer, cardio for days and a titanium chin. Not only that, he agreed to fight him in a weight class he never competed in before and oh by the way had just come off a course of antibiotics for a serious staph infection which by all accounts wipes your energy out. Sure he might not lose the belt, but there was no real upside to taking the fight and on the downside he risked losing a ton of prestige, his reputation would take a hammering and he would be exposed to sh1t ton of ridicule (still going on in many quarters). How many champions would have done that? Jones, GSP and Woodley would have run a fupping mile.

Then you have his insistence on the rematch with Nate. Most other fighters would have played up all the (legitimate) reasons for the loss I outlined above and retreated to 145 to shore up their reputation. Instead CM demands another crack at the same opponent whose attributes so clearly neutralised his own and who this time would have an entire camp to prepare. Not only that, but he insisted that it be at 170 again, the same weight class that he was obviously unsuited to, instead of 155 (which everyone including Dana and his coach were begging him to do) which is his optimal weight class for his engine and gas tank. This time the upside was not much better and the downside was even worse. Lose twice to the same guy and his reputation would be in tatters. He took the fight under ridiculous pressure and won.

I would say all of the above are crazy risks for fighters in those respective situations to take, and very few top fighters would be prepared to take them. There is a lot of talk about McGregor getting preferential treatment from Dana and the promotion, but this is just one of many reasons why he does. He saved - and made - some of the biggest cards in UFC history with this attitude alone. Add to that how he fights when he actually gets in the ring, and its no surprise that he is Danas golden boy.

VW 1

If only wonderfullife would come back to the thread, just remembering him there, and missing his inputs. if you're reading, hope all is well mate.

mayordenis

dulux99 wrote: »

Watched the fight back for a third time. Cant remember ever seeing such a limp performance from a title challenger. So disappointing. Till looked clueless once it hit the deck.

Ngannou and Volkan say hello.