Ryanair Strike, Industrial relations discussion Mod note in post 1

billy few mates

In my opinion any reputational damage that was done by the faking and posting of the picture was restored when they proved it had been faked. When they sacked the people involved it was lost again.

I'm not saying the people involved shouldn't have been disciplined or suspended or whatever but they lost the moral high ground by sacking them if you ask me.

rivegauche

https://www.aero.de/news-30347/Piloten-erwarten-baldige-Einigung-mit-Ryanair.html

German report.

German pilots' union seem fairly confident of reaching agreement with Ryanair this side of Christmas and probably be end of november as they have three meetings with Ryanair planned.

JuanJose

Have been following this thread with interest. Just to state that I've no skin in the game as such other than arranging flights home for Christmas, from Spain. Forewarned is forearmed, so to speak.

Spotted this in a national paper here this morning (in Spanish obviously so Google translate if necessary)
https://www.larazon.es/economia/los-sindicatos-de-ryanair-preparan-una-semana-caliente-en-plena-navidad-LP20584834

The bones of the story...

seeing as union hopes of reaching an agreement with Ryanair by Christmas are seen as close to zero, cabin crew union reps from the countries involved in the dispute - Spain, Portugal, Belgium, Italy, Holland & Germany - are set to meet in Cyprus tomorrow to decide whether or not to strike at Christmas with possibly up to three or four stoppages within the same week, on peak travel days. Their thinking also seems to be to give the absolute minimum notificiation of strike action as required by law, thus to cause maximum disruption for the airline.

Article strikes me as a bit of sabre-rattling in advance of the meeting but that's just my tuppence worth.

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Unfortunately for passengers, industrial action is most effective during peak holiday seasons and a minimum notice strike will prevent the airline from bringing in crew to cover the strike.

Ryanair have been dragging their heels with regards improving conditions for staff and so unions have really no other avenue to go down.

If Ryanair really wanted the staff problems put to beb

rivegauche

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2018/1204/1014965-ryanair-passenger-numbers/

Ryanair today announced it had reached a framework agreement with German pilot union VC on wages and benefits in a breakthrough in its efforts to bring a year-old staff revolt to an end.

VC was responsible for Ryanair's first ever pilot strike in December last year.

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http://www.itfglobal.org/en/news-events/news/2018/december/ryanair-chief-executive-wins-prize-for-worlds-worst-boss/

Ryanair chief executive Michael O’Leary has been voted the world’s worst boss at the Congress of the International Trade Union Confederation (ITUC).

No surprise there!

Tenger

I wouldnt put must stock in that award.
I doubt Mick will either

rivegauche

Ryanair applies for Collective dismissal of remaining staff in the Netherlands.

https://www.luchtvaartnieuws.nl/nieuws/categorie/2/airlines/ryanair-vraagt-collectief-ontslag-aan-voor-nederlands-personeel
(Dutch)

rivegauche

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/business/ryanair-says-aircrew-double-taxation-could-see-company-lose-5m-a-year-892832.html

A win may give Ryanair additional negotiating space on wage with their employees outside of Ireland.
They're paying for senior counsel in the high court so they must have some confidence in a favourable outcome.

IngazZagni

rivegauche wrote: »

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/business/ryanair-says-aircrew-double-taxation-could-see-company-lose-5m-a-year-892832.html

A win may give Ryanair additional negotiating space on wage with their employees outside of Ireland.
They're paying for senior counsel in the high court so they must have some confidence in a favourable outcome.

Nothing is stopping them from providing local contracts where this would not be an issue. Ryanair choose to do this to maintain more control.

rivegauche

Spanish Cabin Crew Unions are calling or threatening to call three strikes for January.
I don't expect these strikes to have much if any impact on service.

https://www.express.co.uk/travel/articles/1066477/flights-ryanair-strike-spain-cabin-crew-holidays-2019

Strike Action in 2018 probably prevented Ryanair from hitting the mark of 140million passengers carried in the year

duskyjoe

Tenger wrote: »

I wouldnt put must stock in that award.
I doubt Mick will either

he wouldn’t give a rats ars@ about it- i trust the man himself is reflecting on a great loss and innovator the aviation industry has lost today re Herb K

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duskyjoe wrote:

he wouldn’t give a rats ars@ about it- i trust the man himself is reflecting on a great loss and innovator the aviation industry has lost today re Herb K

I wouldn't say MOL gives a rat's @rse about Herb either. Too self consumed.

rivegauche

rivegauche wrote: »

Spanish Cabin Crew Unions are calling or threatening to call three strikes for January.
I don't expect these strikes to have much if any impact on service.

https://www.express.co.uk/travel/articles/1066477/flights-ryanair-strike-spain-cabin-crew-holidays-2019

Strike Action in 2018 probably prevented Ryanair from hitting the mark of 140million passengers carried in the year

First day of strikes cancelled by Unions which either means progress with employer has been made or they fear that the strike will be shown to be ineffective.
German report:
http://www.airliners.de/spanische-flugbegleiter-ryanair-streik/48350

rivegauche

Ryanair staff at Eindhoven not yet fired:
https://www.nu.nl/ondernemen/5671511/uwv-ryanair-mag-personeel-eindhoven-niet-ontslaan.html
Dutch language.

Only a matter of time and those pilots are earning little while grounded.

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rivegauche wrote:

First day of strikes cancelled by Unions which either means progress with employer has been made or they fear that the strike will be shown to be ineffective. German report:

Could have something to do with Ryanair threatening to close some Spanish bases in March if cabincrew don't sign up to a new crappy contract.

The bully boy tactics continue!

rivegauche

Canaries bases. Holidaymakers don't want to fly in late at night and leave first thing in the morning. I can see operational reasons to reduce or cut bases. Can you?

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rivegauche wrote:

Only a matter of time and those pilots are earning little while grounded.

Fair play to them for holding their ground!

It's clear that Ryanair are punishing crew in the Netherlands for engaging in industrial action last summer. This is how FR "negotiate" with the unions. (They tried the same tactic in Dublin.)

Thank God the Dutch legal system actually favours the employees rather than the big companies and the judge ruled Ryanairs closure illegal.
[Note: FR stated they closed the base because it wasn't making money, while still operating full flights in and out but now from other bases.]

rivegauche

Since when is serving a target market from a lower cost base "punishment". It is normal business practice.

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rivegauche wrote:

Canaries bases. Holidaymakers don't want to fly in late at night and leave first thing in the morning. I can see operational reasons to reduce or cut bases. Can you?

But late arrivals/early departures are acceptable if they sign the contract???

rivegauche

If they sign a contract at a price that makes the operation viable.
Polish operation Ryanair Sun has a clue in the name as to what it is set up to do.
That is what Spanish staff are competing with.

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rivegauche wrote:

If they sign a contract at a price that makes the operation viable. Polish operation Ryanair Sun has a clue in the name as to what it is set up to do. That is what Spanish staff are competing with.

Good auld cheap Polish labour eroding T&C's for the rest of Europe.
Ryanairs race to the bottom continues.

Didn't take long for all of Mr Bellews promises of improving staff conditions and moral to amount to nothing.
And so the staff exodus will continue......

rivegauche

Rolling forward a few years when there will be plenty of ramp space and morning slots at Dublin

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Good auld cheap Dublin labour eroding T&C's for the rest of Europe.
Ryanairs race to the bottom continues.

Didn't take long for all of Mr Bellews promises of improving staff conditions and moral to amount to nothing.
And so the staff exodus will continue......

A more dynamic labour market doesn't always equal lower take home wages and Ireland's dynamism has allowed for creation of thousands of well paying jobs and a fair few poorly paid jobs too in the aviation industry which didn't exist 30 years ago.
Ireland be it through Aer Lingus or Ryanair or ACMI is the enemy of protectionist Unions elsewhere in Europe.
Which side of the fight are you on?

billy few mates

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Good auld cheap Polish labour eroding T&C's for the rest of Europe.
Ryanairs race to the bottom continues.

Didn't take long for all of Mr Bellews promises of improving staff conditions and moral to amount to nothing.
And so the staff exodus will continue......

I would imagine that labour costs for Polish pilots wouldn’t be any less than it would be for any other qualified type rated EU citizen. Why would any fully qualified type rated Polish pilot undersell themselves for a job in Poland when they could travel a couple of hundred KMs for a job with any number of operators at the going market rate..?
It wasn’t that long ago they were threatening to man this operation with striking pilots from DUB if the union didn’t back down...

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billy few mates wrote:

Why would any fully qualified type rated Polish pilot undersell themselves for a job in Poland..
.

Because they have a job in their home country.
Ryanair imposed a new AOC on all Polish crew recently. Either sign up or get fired or transferred out of Poland. Most of the cabin crew were all fired for refusing to sign the new contract.

And in typical Ryanair fashion the new Ryanair Sun contract includes clauses like: if you happen to be late for work and the flight is delayed. You the pilot pay Ryanair a penalty of around €400.
If you are sick, you pay Ryanair a financial penalty!!
Madness!

rivegauche

https://www.aero.de/news-30676/Ryanair-und-spanische-Flugbegleiter-einigen-sich.html
German report.

Ryanair and Spanish Cabin Crew have reached agreement.

rugbyman

View Profile wrote: »

Because they have a job in their home country.
Ryanair imposed a new AOC on all Polish crew recently. Either sign up or get fired or transferred out of Poland. Most of the cabin crew were all fired for refusing to sign the new contract.

And in typical Ryanair fashion the new Ryanair Sun contract includes clauses like: if you happen to be late for work and the flight is delayed. You the pilot pay Ryanair a penalty of around €400.
If you are sick, you pay Ryanair a financial penalty!!
Madness!

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I read with interest where you said that most of Ryanair cabin crew in Poland were fired. I find this amazing as I imagine Ryanair have well over 100 cabin crew based in Poland. that Ryanair can lose this many and obviously have the same amount ready to start work is amazing.

Is it perhaps moving staff from Ryanair proper to Ryanair SUN is the issue.


We ,in Ireland may not see news of this. Would the "sacking"/"leaving " of this many not have caused havoc there

Regards


re the comment of being sick costing the crew member money ,I find this difficult to understand.
Some years ago I had the pleasure of a long chat with a Ryanair cabin crew member. She told me that if she was sick, flat tyre, other mishap she had to ring in one hour before her scheduled e.t.a to let them know. But to suggest that ringing in sick costs the ringer a fine is hard to imagine

rugbyman

Rivegauche, I have enjoyed all your posts, and the enmity generated to them. Whats the story now in Eindhoven, are pilots and cabin crew turning up for work, when there is none, Might they get paid something when/if they do.you mentioned they are earning " little"

rivegauche

No idea. I just read the news and report what I see.
This seems to be the best place to get Dutch news; https://www.upinthesky.nl//?s=ryanair

Not taking much interest. The staff have no future. The base is moved. The pilots need hours and they don't get hours. Battle over and the rest is just for the lawyers to sort out.

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https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-ryanair-unions-netherlands/dutch-refuse-ryanairs-right-to-fire-pilots-and-cabin-crew-idUKKCN1P21T5

AMSTERDAM (Reuters) - Dutch authorities have denied Ryanair (RYA.I) the right to lay off pilots and crew members who refused to move away from the Netherlands following the contested closure of the company’s base in the country.