So who's going to see the Pope?

ohnonotgmail

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Do you mean that you believe abuse by Priests is continyuing to this day with children?


And of course the dog and the street knows that abusr was coveres up at different branches.

Whether i think this pope was involved, i doubt it or have seen zero evidence of it.

Id be surprised that church officials were not co operating with investigations in this country with new guidelines in place

are you capable of giving a straight answer. Obviously not. Typical church supporter.

Cabaal

Edgware wrote: »

So dont give any recognition for all the positive contribution in health, education, social care, care for physically and mentally disabled when various governments made f..all contribution.
No just jump on the bandwagon.

You appear confused regarding what went on.

The government didn't step away from providing education, health etc. At the foundation of the state the church took control of these things. If you think they somehow did this out of charity then bigger fool you, it wasn't done for free or for the good of the people of our nation.

it was more of a power grab that set this country back decades and allowed the church via the likes of McQuaid to defectively dictate government policy esp when it came to women.

Even the mother and baby homes, the church billed the Irish state for looking after those kids. In some cases like in Tuam they continued to bill the Irish state for "caring" for children who they had already dumped into a septic tank.

The church didn't do all of this stuff for the good of the people, it benefited the church as an organisation far more.

Cabaal

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Do you mean that you believe abuse by Priests is continyuing to this day with children?


And of course the dog and the street knows that abusr was coveres up at different branches.

Whether i think this pope was involved, i doubt it or have seen zero evidence of it.

So the fact he won't release records and has made previous negative comments towards abuse victims means he's just a-ok eh?

ok, try this, what about the previous pope?
Do you think he was ever involved?

Id be surprised that church officials were not co operating with investigations in this country with new guidelines in place

How are they doing this if authority's won't be shown Vatican own records exactly?

ELM327

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

What has he personally done to cover up child abuse?

Actively refused to provide evidence or cooperate with the authorities


I can't find the link, but he refused to cooperate with the irish authorities.
Here's the same crap in canada too
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-pope-wont-personally-apologize-for-catholic-churchs-role-in/

TheValeyard

In this country they are complying with new laws. Just at the weekend a priest stood aside while an investigation takes place. Common sense approach. I presume it be the same if allegations were made against anyone in a profession who was working with children.

Hitman3000

PlaneSpeeking wrote:

Edgy. Not.

Not at all, just an easy way to protest.

TheValeyard

ELM327 wrote: »

Actively refused to provide evidence or cooperate with the authorities


I can't find the link, but he refused to cooperate with the irish authorities.
Here's the same crap in canada too
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-pope-wont-personally-apologize-for-catholic-churchs-role-in/

Thats about historic abuse of native tribes in Canada. Not how this pope as personally engaged in sexual abuse as you have claimed.

ohnonotgmail

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Thats about historic abuse of native tribes in Canada. Not how this pope as personally engaged in sexual abuse as you have claimed.

nobody has said the pope personally engaged in sexual abuse. Your attempts at deflection are pathetic. You catholic lot are not overly keen on practicing what you preach. Hypocrites.

RustyNut

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

In this country they are complying with new laws. Just at the weekend a priest stood aside while an investigation takes place. Common sense approach. I presume it be the same if allegations were made against anyone in a profession who was working with children.

Do you think that the Vatican should inform the relevant authorities in countries around the world where they hold information on priests suspected of crimes against children or should canon law take precedence?

TheValeyard

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

nobody has said the pope personally engaged in sexual abuse. Your attempts at deflection are pathetic. You catholic lot are not overly keen on practicing what you preach. Hypocrites.

Previous prosters have stated very publicly that the pope is the ringleader in a child abuse club.

The rest of your post is drivel.

Allinall

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

nobody has said the pope personally engaged in sexual abuse. Your attempts at deflection are pathetic. You catholic lot are not overly keen on practicing what you preach. Hypocrites.

Post #1280.

TheValeyard

RustyNut wrote: »

Do you think that the Vatican should inform the relevant authorities in countries around the world where they hold information on priests suspected of crimes against children or should canon law take precedence?

State law above all law. Each country should deal with it there own way.

Skylinehead

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Previous prosters have stated very publicly that the pope is the ringleader in a child abuse club.

The rest of your post is drivel.

He is. The Catholic Church is a child abuse club, and he's the leader of it

Doesn't have to mean he's a pedophile himself for the statement to be true.

ohnonotgmail

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

State law above all law. Each country should deal with it there own way.

tell that to your beloved church. They put their own law above state law.

TheValeyard

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

tell that to your beloved church. They put their own law above state law.

My beloved church? Is it now?

ohnonotgmail

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

My beloved church? Is it now?

you are very vocal about defending it.

TheValeyard

Nixonbot wrote: »

He is. The Catholic Church is a child abuse club, and he's the leader of it

Doesn't have to mean he's a pedophile himself for the statement to be true.

Yes it does. A number of posters have directly made statements accusing this pope of active child abuse.

Also, saying the Catholic Church is a child abuse club is factually incorrect and quite a terrible statement to make against nearly a billion people

TheValeyard

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

you are very vocal about defending it.

No, just a bit of balance to the vile anti Catholic bigotry.

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Yes it does. A number of posters have directly made statements accusing this pope of active child abuse.

Also, saying the Catholic Church is a child abuse club is factually incorrect and quite a terrible statement to make against nearly a billion people

Nope. It's perfectly acceptable to insult Christianity. Less so to say anything bad against Muslims and absolutely outrageous to suggest transgenderism is anything but an absolute and undeniable reality that must be accepted.

But yeah, if you happen to like God (the Christian one), then you are part of some depraved sex ring....

ohnonotgmail

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

No, just a bit of balance to the vile anti Catholic bigotry.

the only thing vile is the organisation you are defending. For some bizarre reason you seem to think you have the moral high ground. laughable.

Skylinehead

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Yes it does. A number of posters have directly made statements accusing this pope of active child abuse.

Also, saying the Catholic Church is a child abuse club is factually incorrect and quite a terrible statement to make against nearly a billion people

I didn't say all Catholics were child abusers, put that straw man down before you hurt someone with it.

The Church itself though, another story. Walk like a duck, quack like a duck, have thousands of abuse cases like a duck, cover up said abuse like a duck, guess what, it's a duck.

Edgware

....... wrote: »

Do you think their good deeds outweighs their abuses and if so why?

Normally people think that even 1 bad deed outweighs many good deeds - its interesting that you have the opposite view.

If someone did good work helping the elderly for years and then raped some children, do you think that they should be let out of prison because they did a lot of good stuff and it outweighs the bad stuff?

Was Hitler ok because he was an animal lover?

I understand Hitler was very popular with the German people

ohnonotgmail

Edgware wrote: »

I understand Hitler was very popular with the German people

He made the trains run on time. No wait, that was mussolini. Another great lad.

Cabaal

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Yes it does. A number of posters have directly made statements accusing this pope of active child abuse.

Also, saying the Catholic Church is a child abuse club is factually incorrect and quite a terrible statement to make against nearly a billion people

when people refer to the catholic church they mean the organisation of the church, the Bishops, The Vatican etc. Not the general mass goers. Thats evident.

It would be accurate to say the catholic church organisation (Vatican and church leaderships) knew about, wrote rules on and knowingly covered up and the rape and sexual abuse of children and the mistreatment of women. When these abuses came to light the Vatican actually sent over representatives who accused victims of lying and making up stuff just for money.

Would you disagree with my comment about what the vatican has done?

TheValeyard

Nixonbot wrote: »

I didn't say all Catholics were child abusers, put that straw man down before you hurt someone with it.

The Church itself though, another story. Walk like a duck, quack like a duck, have thousands of abuse cases like a duck, cover up said abuse like a duck, guess what, it's a duck.

Yeah, the memebrs consider themselves part of said church so you are condemning all those memebrs

TheValeyard

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

the only thing vile is the organisation you are defending. For some bizarre reason you seem to think you have the moral high ground. laughable.

Never claimed a high ground. Equally laughable.

Skylinehead

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Yeah, the memebrs consider themselves part of said church so you are condemning all those memebrs

Cabaal wrote: »

when people refer to the catholic church they mean the organisation of the church, the Bishops, The Vatican etc. Not the general mass goers. Thats evident.

.

Don't tell me what I do and don't condemn please, I can speak for myself.

Auguste Comte

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

What has he personally done to cover up child abuse?

Why has he not done everything in his power to expose and bring to justice any and every criminal paedophile that the church has files on?

The Vatican has refused to hand over the files of Australian priests accused of sex crimes to the child abuse royal commission.

The Vatican said the commission's request for documents on each allegation involving an Australian cleric was "neither possible nor appropriate".


Reasons included ongoing church investigations, and that internal working documents were the sovereign property of the Holy See

Cabaal

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Yeah, the memebrs consider themselves part of said church so you are condemning all those memebrs

if a general mass goer wishes to believe they are part of the same aspects of the church that abused children then thats very worrying. Any Catholics i know see themselves as Catholic but do not for one second see themselves as part of the church that abused.

You like making comparisons, so here's a little example for you to compare.

Imagine if you will the GAA had coaches that raped and abused children, now imagine they covered it up for decades and kept detailed records of the abuse. During this time leadership of the GAA covered up the abuse and specifically wrote guidelines which they instructed GAA coaches to follow to silence victims, they also moved around coaches that abused to other areas.

Now imagine it comes to light and numerous government reports are written about the abuse commited by the GAA. The GAA acts surprised and at first claims victims are making false claims and says they are in it for the money.

As time passes they finally apologise but they refuse to provide their very, very detailed records to any authority that requests them. They also refuse to compensate abuse victims and the current leadership of the GAA (think pope) refuses to instruct county boards to release their records and refuses to instruct them to compensate victims.

Would you consider yourself a member of that same organisation or would you merely just like Gaelic games?

Would you trust even the current GAA leadership? Would you welcome them with open arms?

The people is no different in this record. If he refuses to make change then he is not part of the solution in the church.

TheValeyard

Cabaal wrote: »

if a general mass goer wishes to believe they are part of the same aspects of the church that abused children then thats very worrying. Any Catholics i know see themselves as Catholic but do not for one second see them as part of the abuse.

You like making comparisons, so here's a little example for you to compare.

Imagine if you will the GAA had coaches that raped and abused children, now imagine the covered it up for decades and kept detailed records of the abuse. During this time leadership of the GAA covered up the abuse and specifically wrote guidelines which they instructed GAA coaches to follow to silence victims, they also moved around coaches that abused to other areas.

Now imagine it comes to light and numerous government reports are written about the abuse commited by GAA. The GAA acts surprised and at first claims victims atre making false claims and says they are in it for the money.

As time passes they apologise but they refuse to provide their very, very detailed records to any authority that requests them. They also refuse to compensate abuse victims and the current leadership of the GAA (think pope) refuses to instruct county boards to release their records and refuses to instruct them to compensate victims.

Would you consider yourself a member of that same organisation or would you merely just like Gaelic games?

Would you trust even the current GAA leadership?

There are a fair few posters here who do not make that distinction.

Under His Eye

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

There are a fair few posters here who do not make that distinction.

Says more about them doesn't it.

ohnonotgmail

Under His Eye wrote: »

Says more about them doesn't it.

well it would if those people actually existed. they dont.

TheValeyard

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

well it would if those people actually existed. they dont.

So, you havent read this thread or the other one then.

.......

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

There are a fair few posters here who do not make that distinction.

No. You thinking that people do not make that distinction does not mean that people do not make that distinction.

Lets make it real simple eh?

Catholic Church - composed of clergy and congregation.

Clergy - abuse and cover ups and murder and torture and cover ups, decades of cover ups. Culture of crime and cover up. Hard to understand why anyone would want to join such an organisation - as a priest or nun.

Congregation - some complicit non clergy members. And up to a point in time MOST ignorant of whats been going on. However - in the past few decades, after whats come to light - hard to understand why anyone would want to associate themselves with such an organisation - as a normal mass goer.

The Pope - heads it all up. Has personal experience of covering up, reported on, its not a secret. Presides over the whole organisation.

Easy to see why some thing that the church and anyone who supports it are as bad as each other.

Hard to understand why anyone would defend it.

CruelCoin

Captainsatnav wrote: »

Would deleting the email not serve the same purpose whilst saving paper?;)

This way he gets to put it up to the tree huggers at the same time.

CruelCoin

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Also, saying the Catholic Church is a child abuse club is factually incorrect and quite a terrible statement to make against nearly a billion people

What rock have you been hiding under?

fryup

will he sing any songs?? the last pope didn't which was very disappointing i might add

wouldn't it be great if he came on stage with this blasting in the background

CruelCoin

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Definitely comparable. Just not as as edgy to have a go another group.

Members of a group that blow themselves up or helped create an Isis style world view. Same thing.

I think you're abusing the term edgy.....It can't just be taken to denote everybody you disagree with.

ELM327

fryup wrote: »

will he sing any songs?? the last pope didn't which was very disappointing i might add

wouldn't it be great if he came on stage with this blasting in the background

If the promo videos are anything to go by, its more likely to be dance music than AC DC https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tt-M-mctf9Q

volchitsa

Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »

Suppose all Muslims are guilty of Islamic terrorism then.

To the same extent as all Christians - or even all Baptists - are responsible for the Westboro Baptists' antics. IE, not.

Those who belong to the same group share responsibility. Those who don't, don't.

pcuser

I still have tickets. Just over 0.5% of the which is a hell of a lot. All my coach tickets have being finalized as well as the standard tickets. Again as I have always said. I will give these tickets away for free once a donation to the 1in4 charity has being made.

Tilikum17

pcuser wrote: »

I still have tickets. Just over 0.5% of the which is a hell of a lot. All my coach tickets have being finalized as well as the standard tickets. Again as I have always said. I will give these tickets away for free once a donation to the 1in4 charity has being made.

They may need to change the name of that charity yet. 1000 more kids abused by over 300 priests in Pennsylvania. They think the number of children is actually in the 1000’s

Hotblack Desiato

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

If anyone has any doubts or misgivings about this World Meeting of Families, leave it out. Don't go, leave them at it.

They are a small minority of people who will self destruct soon enough anyway. The Abortion Ref was a big signal anyway, whether you agree with it or not. It is the will of the people against the ultras.

This lot still control over 90% of the primary schools we fund through our taxes. Their mission in life is to poison our young childrens' minds and make them think that that churches's perversions are normal.

Telling a 5 year old newly arrived in school that they will burn eternally unless they obey the instructions of the man in black is completely perverted.

Fcuk the RCC, fcuk the pope, and **** our saps in government fawning over the child rape apologists. They might think fawning over the pap will reflect well on them - I think not - they better watch their step next weekend and not get too cuddly with the rape cover-uppers - the voters are watching.

realdanbreen

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Fcuk the RCC, fcuk the pope, and ****

Wow!
And here's me thinking bigotry was a thing of the past.

ohnonotgmail

realdanbreen wrote: »

Wow!
And here's me thinking bigotry was a thing of the past.

When there are very good reasons for doing something it is not bigotry.

realdanbreen

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

When there are very good reasons for doing something it is not bigotry.

It is out and out bigotry end of. Shades of what was endured in the 6 counties until fairly recently.

ohnonotgmail

realdanbreen wrote: »

It is out and out bigotry end of. Shades of what was endured in the 6 counties until fairly recently.

so you dont think there is any basis for it other than we dont like the RCC?

realdanbreen

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

so you dont think there is any basis for it other than we dont like the RCC?

What part of 'fcuk the RCC, fcuk the pope...' do you think is not bigotry?

WanderlustIre

I'll be there myself for a few selfies for Snapchat and me Cead Mile Failte Franner t shirt straight out of Penny's.

ohnonotgmail

realdanbreen wrote: »

What part of 'fcuk the RCC, fcuk the pope...' do you think is not bigotry?

try and answer the question.