The horrific death of Ana Kriegel

Snake Plisken

Dial Hard wrote: »

I know absolutely nothing about poor Ana's case but my niece is also a first year student in the school and was subjected to absolutely vicious bullying earlier this year. An Instagram account was set up for this express purpose and when it was brought to the attention of the school, the principal was horrified, but didn't ultimately do a whole lot about it. Certainly the Gardaí weren't involved at any stage.

My brother showed me the messages involved. I'd consider myself a very tough cookie but I've never seen anything like it in my life. It's not just the sentiment involved, it's the fact that someone actually felt the need to take the time and effort involved in setting up an Instagram account, sitting down, thinking about and actually typing out the very lengthy messages to my niece telling her how much they hate her. That at no point did they go "Hang on a sec, maybe this isn't really funny/warranted/a bit of a laugh".

It literally beggars belief the cruelty some teens are capable of. Nothing will ever bring Ana back to her family but I hope to God they see some semblance of justice done.

That is a disgrace, in <snip> as well? I thought that school had a good name, students from Lucan get bused there everyday.
Sounds like a bully culture exists there and the Principle hasn’t stamped it out so they should be questioned about their lack of action.

Compared to say Lucan Comminity college where there was a situation involving bullying of a pupil a few years back the principle came down hard on anyone she caught or reported to be bullying the girl. School management needs to come down strong on bullies.

OwlsZat

It's impossible for schools to police anonymous social media bullying. That's why I was saying we should start teaching of the long term impact of bullying on individuals. We've seen people commit suicide, and now murder. Surely the writing is on the wall that it's a pandemic and needs practical training in schools.

jeonahr

Strazdas wrote: »

It should be pointed out btw that the main reason someone thought of a go fund page for Jastine is because she was living in a foreign country and her body would need to be repatriated to the Philippines, which would be a very expensive process not to mention the expense for her family and friends wanting to travel over there.

In the Philippines whenever someone passes away everyone in the community will come together to help the family financially by giving them money. The nationwide Filipino community wanted to do this for Jastine and hence a gofundmepage was set up.

J Mysterio

https://ie.gofundme.com/jastine-valdez-memorial

evolving_doors

Snake Plisken wrote: »

That is a disgrace, in Confey as well? I thought that school had a good name, students from Lucan get bused there everyday.
Sounds like a bully culture exists there and the Principle hasn’t stamped it out so they should be questioned about their lack of action.

Compared to say <snip> where there was a situation involving bullying of a pupil a few years back the principle came down hard on anyone she caught or reported to be bullying the girl. School management needs to come down strong on bullies.

Sounds like indeed.
You don't know Jack about there or Lucan.
Ok except for 'a situation a few years back' :rolleyes:
Bullying happens in every school and outside school when kids are up till 1am on Instagram and parents let it happen.
Did this incident take place IN the school?

Electric Sheep

OwlsZat wrote: »

It's impossible for schools to police anonymous social media bullying. That's why I was saying we should start teaching of the long term impact of bullying on individuals. We've seen people commit suicide, and now murder. Surely the writing is on the wall that it's a pandemic and needs practical training in schools.

The sort of kids who bully others to the point of suicide tend to be quite proud of their ability to do that, and really are not going to give a duck about the long term impact of bullying on individuals.

evolving_doors

Electric Sheep wrote: »

The sort of kids who bully others to the point of suicide tend to be quite proud of their ability to do that, and really are not going to give a duck about the long term impact of bullying on individuals.

How do you know that. Is this from a psychology journal or something?

tupenny

Snake Plisken wrote: »

If this is true those boys should be charged for something as they knew where Ana was last seen and never told the authorities. Little scumbags the lot of them, I hope they are named and shamed locally!

They are already..

Heres Johnny

Job for the parents to stamp out bullying really. I went to the school in question (apologies for ninja edit i didnt mean to mention any school) and while I wouldn't class it as a great school, it's ok.
Can't really see how the principal would have any control after out of hours stuff on Instagram etc...thats not fair to expect that.
Hundreds of students in that school, they all know right from wrong.
Now, the bullying and a murder took place so it's the law that has to come down hard. And I hope it does.
Some of the more recent posts are the bleeding heart stories heard in court that gets people off......
Why children kill, never shown love or affection, and now we have some people saying it's the schools fault.
It's not, it's the children's. I don't care about upbringing or environment, they have to be very harshly punished.
So does anyone that knew about this and didn't stop it or report it, including fellow classmates and family members, if they did that is.

Snake Plisken

evolving_doors wrote: »

Sounds like indeed.
You don't know Jack about there or Lucan.
Ok except for 'a situation a few years back' :rolleyes:
Bullying happens in every school and outside school when kids are up till 1am on Instagram and parents let it happen.
Did this incident take place IN the school?

I know more then you!
My kids go to <snip> and that incident that I mentioned happened in one of the empty unfinished houses in Adamstown! I don’t want to elaborate but cops were involved and the girl was wrongly picked on afterwards and the Principle had to step in to stop it!

degsie

J Mysterio wrote: »

https://ie.gofundme.com/jastine-valdez-memorial

Sorry, but there seems to be a crossover of threads here.

degsie

tupenny wrote: »

They are already..

Charged or named or both?

Electric Sheep

evolving_doors wrote: »

How do you know that. Is this from a psychology journal or something?

Read about the case of Phoebe Prince for an example of this type of person.

Franz Von Peppercorn

Why do we not have laws already on internet bullying? Why are the gardai not doing anything.

Heres Johnny

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

Why do we not have laws already on internet bullying? Why are the gardai not doing anything.

Is there actual laws on bullying at all? Internet or in person?
I'm not sure if there are or not. Usually the remit of school counsellors etc......doesn't really make it law though.

I could call someone fat, ugly, anything I want really and I wouldn't be in fear of any law enforcement coming down on me.

Captain Obvious

Heres Johnny wrote: »

Is there actual laws on bullying at all? Internet or in person?
I'm not sure if there are or not. Usually the remit of school counsellors etc......doesn't really make it law though.

I could call someone fat, ugly, anything I want really and I wouldn't be in fear of any law enforcement coming down on me.

Harassment is the catch all offence

Any person who, without lawful authority or reasonable excuse, by any means including by use of the telephone, harasses another by persistently following, watching, pestering, besetting or communicating with him or her, shall be guilty of an offence.

Beechwoodspark

Irish times reporting an arrest is imminent.

limnam

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Irish times reporting an arrest is imminent.

This was been reported yesterday..

degsie

Hopefully they are building a strong case.

Grayson

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

Why do we not have laws already on internet bullying? Why are the gardai not doing anything.

Did you answer your second question with your first question?

We do have laws on harassment. And bullying in general would count as a type of harassment. However someone would still need to inform the gardai.

https://spunout.ie/life/article/deal-with-harassment

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ChikiChiki

OwlsZat wrote: »

That's a truly awful story, also sounds hauntingly similar. I'd share that with the Garda tbh it might actually be of some significance.


Children are so hateful and without being a psychologist I can't understand the motives. However, I'd think instead of molly coddling them we'd be far better off teaching them relationships. The how to's; do's and don't practical advice for a practical world. Instead of burying head in the sand and pretending they are always up to good. Secondary students are effectively adults these days. Better to set a curriculum and teach them a bit of respect for one and other early days.


What's the area like are there socioeconomic factors that means there is a section of deprived individuals?

Im from that area and went to that school. Certainly things were very respectful in my year and all personalities were accepted. It disheartens me to hear of rampant bullying. As an area, it is (was) very safe and not deprived by any means. Intel pumps a lot of money into the local area and employs a lot of people.

Heres Johnny

Heres Johnny wrote: »

Job for the parents to stamp out bullying really. I went to the school in question (apologies for ninja edit i didnt mean to mention any school) and while I wouldn't class it as a great school, it's ok.
Can't really see how the principal would have any control after out of hours stuff on Instagram etc...thats not fair to expect that.
Hundreds of students in that school, they all know right from wrong.
Now, the bullying and a murder took place so it's the law that has to come down hard. And I hope it does.
Some of the more recent posts are the bleeding heart stories heard in court that gets people off......
Why children kill, never shown love or affection, and now we have some people saying it's the schools fault.
It's not, it's the children's. I don't care about upbringing or environment, they have to be very harshly punished.
So does anyone that knew about this and didn't stop it or report it, including fellow classmates and family members, if they did that is.

Understanding why and asking questions doesnt mean there is no harsh punishment.

Assetbacked

No further update on arrests in the media but hopefully, as they’ve reported, they are imminent. Then, subject to anonymity in terms of reporting of the identities in case it prejudices a fair trial, the full details of the crime will emerge and the perpetrators will feel, not just the brunt of the law of the state; but the arbitrary, albeit righteous, brutal fist of mob and vigilante justice. Depraved and inhuman creatures, unworthy of enjoying in any way the rest of their lives.

corner of hells

Assetbacked wrote: »

No further update on arrests in the media but hopefully, as they’ve reported, they are imminent. Then, subject to anonymity in terms of reporting of the identities in case it prejudices a fair trial, the full details of the crime will emerge and the perpetrators will feel, not just the brunt of the law of the state; but the arbitrary, albeit righteous, brutal fist of mob and vigilante justice. Depraved and inhuman creatures, unworthy of enjoying in any way the rest of their lives.

Mob and vigilante justice ? I'm grew up not to far from the area where the deceased was found , have friends and family in Leixlip and Lucan and am a parent myself.

Let's not do the mob and vigilante stuff .

Heres Johnny

Assetbacked wrote: »

No further update on arrests in the media but hopefully, as they’ve reported, they are imminent. Then, subject to anonymity in terms of reporting of the identities in case it prejudices a fair trial, the full details of the crime will emerge and the perpetrators will feel, not just the brunt of the law of the state; but the arbitrary, albeit righteous, brutal fist of mob and vigilante justice. Depraved and inhuman creatures, unworthy of enjoying in any way the rest of their lives.

Are you going to hit them with your keyboard?

knucklehead6

I feel strangely conflicted. I have the tiniest degree of sympathy for the kid who’s about to be arrested, and his family.

I’d rather it was some over 18 yr old scumbag that could have the full weight of the law thrown at them.

orangerhyme

knucklehead6 wrote: »

I feel strangely conflicted. I have the tiniest degree of sympathy for the kid who’s about to be arrested, and his family.

I’d rather it was some over 18 yr old scumbag that could have the full weight of the law thrown at them.

I've a feeling it will be more than one kid

ginandtonicsky

Fcuking evil little scumbags. I hope their lives come to a brutal end when they're inside. I hope they suffer emotionally, physically, I hope they are raped to death. I'll take the red card for that one.

The events of the past two weeks are truly beyond comprehension. I just don't and can't understand. Two young women set out in broad daylight, one was raped and murdered, the other abducted and murdered.

I am absolutely relieved to my core that the second murdering b@stard was shot dead. I hope he suffered right until his final breath. And I will be sick to my stomach if these other cretins aren't made an absolute example of and an exception is not made to go harder than the current justice system will allow.

Jastine was a 5 foot woman walking home from work, Ana was a fourteen year old child in a public park. It doesn't matter what the statistics show about violence against men. In most if not all circumstances, women are indefensible against a man with designs on violence or assault against them. This is not acceptable.

knucklehead6

orangerhyme wrote: »

I've a feeling it will be more than one kid

Fair point. It’s widely assumed that it’s at least two.

But I’d prefer if they were over 18. There’s a part of me thinks they will get treated a bit easier cos they’re kids. And their families will have to leave the area

iamwhoiam

knucklehead6 wrote: »

I feel strangely conflicted. I have the tiniest degree of sympathy for the kid who’s about to be arrested, and his family.

I’d rather it was some over 18 yr old scumbag that could have the full weight of the law thrown at them.

I am not having a go but am interested to know why you would have sympathy for anyone who could inflict such horror on a child and her family ?
Feeling sympathy for his family I do get but I cannot understand it for him ?