VW Neo (eGolf replacement)

Shefwedfan

Phibsboro wrote: »

I don't understand that point. The price is in the slides, the 1st will start at 40k in Germany pre grants. So that means the entry level one will be 40k in Germany. Which would be, what, mid 40's here? If we follow the UK and only offer the mid spec one, then we are up around the 50k eur mark here (which would agree with the autocar article talking about 40k sterling UK pricing).

As for the grants, they are surely understood at this stage? Is there talk of them changing before the id.3 comes out?

In general, given the 64kWh Niro is 47k I'm not sure we were really expecting VW to be pricing it's mid battery offering at much less, let alone a "special edition" specc'ed model.

What price? the vague "Starts below 40k"

Phibsboro

Mike9832 wrote: »

Agree

They'll get the eager one's

And I'll probably be one of those eager ones, on the basis that a VW in the hand is better than a Tesla in the bush (or a Niro, ...maybe).

Tbh, I'm not sure a race to the bottom is going to come from Europe, or the States. The main cost in an EV at the moment is the battery and that is where any significant drop is going to come from. I suspect the Chinese have that side of things wrapped up, they have been buying up chunks of Africa for the last few years to nail down the requisite mineral supplies. And they now in a position to move up the food chain and offer a finished product to the world instead of supplying bits of it. The upcoming Chinese EV startups might be the game changers we were all hoping for, not Tesla or VW.

Phibsboro

Shefwedfan wrote: »

What price? the vague "Starts below 40k"

Sure yes, but that means the base spec model starts at 40k. Are you honestly suggesting that it means anything other than that? If you were the marketing manager for VW and you had to put a price up on a slide at a global launch event and you knew the aim was to deliver the base 1st at 35k, would you put up "starts below 40,000 eur" in the slide? Maybe you would, but that would be why you aren't the VW marketing manager

Shefwedfan

Phibsboro wrote: »

And I'll probably be one of those eager ones, on the basis that a VW in the hand is better than a Tesla in the bush (or a Niro, ...maybe).

Tbh, I'm not sure a race to the bottom is going to come from Europe, or the States. The main cost in an EV at the moment is the battery and that is where any significant drop is going to come from. I suspect the Chinese have that side of things wrapped up, they have been buying up chunks of Africa for the last few years to nail down the requisite mineral supplies. And they now in a position to move up the food chain and offer a finished product to the world instead of supplying bits of it. The upcoming Chinese EV startups might be the game changers we were all hoping for, not Tesla or VW.

Nio are the ones to watch, unfortunealty they have no plans in near future to release in Europe.



If Nio was a US company you wouldn't hear a whisper about Tesla....


It will be interesting to see the tech in the VW to see if it is on a par or close to Nio.


Most of the chinese start up will die, Nio have the backing, they have European sponsors, they could really kill the competition

drunkmonkey

Batteries are recyclable and will be used as portable chargers. https://www.autoblog.com/2019/05/10/volkswagen-ev-battery-reuse-recycling-official/?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmllLw&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAACAvd824cOIpTgTeaPbexXhurxo9S56VK53w8oHnEbME6NzIhcC2T8O3woYVLaMLv8b4QUt4iBQwzonrUe6saGrDBO9_faMAd33GsjQfNuwQ0C_qYjjFdtEQfnlBzNUA9mVT-iWHL8215312bsovAN-4WA3VWRKihoyMELWXU1D8

Mike9832

Phibsboro wrote: »

And I'll probably be one of those eager ones, on the basis that a VW in the hand is better than a Tesla in the bush (or a Niro, ...maybe).

Tbh, I'm not sure a race to the bottom is going to come from Europe, or the States. The main cost in an EV at the moment is the battery and that is where any significant drop is going to come from. I suspect the Chinese have that side of things wrapped up, they have been buying up chunks of Africa for the last few years to nail down the requisite mineral supplies. And they now in a position to move up the food chain and offer a finished product to the world instead of supplying bits of it. The upcoming Chinese EV startups might be the game changers we were all hoping for, not Tesla or VW.

Battery is just a component like the thousands of others they buy in

The problem autogiants have is the transition, which could kill alot of them off

Likes of VW are in colossal debt already and will have to write down further billions in ICE tech/equipment/plant's that will be obsolete once transitioned to EV's

Look at Jaguar, a tiny company to the autogiants, they wrote off 4.4 billion recently by moving to an EV

https://www.autonews.com/automakers-suppliers/jaguar-land-rover-takes-44b-hit-writes-down-value-cars-plants

Shefwedfan

Phibsboro wrote: »

Sure yes, but that means the base spec model starts at 40k. Are you honestly suggesting that it means anything other than that? If you were the marketing manager for VW and you had to put a price up on a slide at a global launch event and you knew the aim was to deliver the base 1st at 35k, would you put up "starts below 40,000 eur" in the slide? Maybe you would, but that would be why you aren't the VW marketing manager

Most customers are forgetful, they can’t remember numbers, especially in a presentation

Fairly standard rules for presenting and advertising is use round simple numbers

So if you say one car is below 30k then don’t stick up a slide saying below 39k...

All I was saying is I will wait and see what price it is....not sure why you have an issue with that?

Phibsboro

Mike9832 wrote: »

Battery is just a component like the thousands of others they buy in
...

Look at Jaguar, a tiny company to the autogiants, they wrote off 4.4 billion recently by moving to an EV

https://www.autonews.com/automakers-suppliers/jaguar-land-rover-takes-44b-hit-writes-down-value-cars-plants

In the near term I think battery supply will be key. It is an unusual situation for the big auto companies to be in but it is not so unusual in other industries. Apple is a past master at buying up long term supplies of upcoming key parts, aiming to get a multi-year head start on the competition. Batteries are hard to get right and contains scarce(ish?) materials. Tesla planned the giga factories from early on as they identified battery supply as key.

Re Jag, I'm not sure if you linked the wrong article? That one doesn't mention EV at all. Even the underlying financial statement from Tata doesn't blame EV once.

Phibsboro

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Most customers are forgetful, they can’t remember numbers, especially in a presentation

Fairly standard rules for presenting and advertising is use round simple numbers

So if you say one car is below 30k then don’t stick up a slide saying below 39k...

All I was saying is I will wait and see what price it is....not sure why you have an issue with that?

I'm just pointing out the silliness of expecting it be anything other than 39,999 And that's in Germany... for the base model...

Shefwedfan

Phibsboro wrote: »

In the near term I think battery supply will be key. It is an unusual situation for the big auto companies to be in but it is not so unusual in other industries. Apple is a past master at buying up long term supplies of upcoming key parts, aiming to get a multi-year head start on the competition. Batteries are hard to get right and contains scarce(ish?) materials. Tesla planned the giga factories from early on as they identified battery supply as key.

Re Jag, I'm not sure if you linked the wrong article? That one doesn't mention EV at all. Even the underlying financial statement from Tata doesn't blame EV once.

Vw have done what apple do, just blow the competition out of the water by buying more than anyone else, leave the rest of the guys to fight over the scraps.....

Who are battery companies going to supply? Kia/Hyundai/etc with the odd order or keep VW group sweet with the multi billion contract....

This was from 2017 when VW kicked off the process
https://www.google.ie/amp/s/mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKCN1BX1RE

Mike9832

Phibsboro wrote: »

In the near term I think battery supply will be key. It is an unusual situation for the big auto companies to be in but it is not so unusual in other industries. Apple is a past master at buying up long term supplies of upcoming key parts, aiming to get a multi-year head start on the competition. Batteries are hard to get right and contains scarce(ish?) materials. Tesla planned the giga factories from early on as they identified battery supply as key.

Re Jag, I'm not sure if you linked the wrong article? That one doesn't mention EV at all. Even the underlying financial statement from Tata doesn't blame EV once.

My bad

https://europe.autonews.com/automakers/jaguar-land-rover-seeks-1-billion-funding-after-shock-write-down

Shefwedfan

Phibsboro wrote: »

I'm just pointing out the silliness of expecting it be anything other than 39,999 And that's in Germany... for the base model...

Why?

Have you got the prices?

Silent Running

I'll wait until September and see what happens. But unless the 1st is the full Max spec, or very near to it, then I'll cancel out. What then?..

I don't know.

I don't like the saloon shape of the Model 3.

I won't buy a stripped out Kona, and I don't like the reports I'm reading about efficiency.

The Niro is stripped out a bit less than the Kona. Still stripped out a bit.

The Leaf 62. Chademo and analogue speedo? Also efficiency issues. Don't think so.

BMW I3. I could only drive it in the dark. Approaching that thing in daylight would be tough. (sorry I3 drivers, but it's a taste I haven't acquired).

I want to buy new in 2020, so it's either wait and order the Max spec when it's released or, ??? Any suggestions?

Munurty

Silent Running wrote: »

I want to buy new in 2020, so it's either wait and order the Max spec when it's released or, ??? Any suggestions?

Any chance of the Polestar 2 coming to Ireland in 2020 at a decent price?

Mickeroo

Silent Running wrote: »

I'll wait until September and see what happens. But unless the 1st is the full Max spec, or very near to it, then I'll cancel out. What then?..

I don't know.

I don't like the saloon shape of the Model 3.

I won't buy a stripped out Kona, and I don't like the reports I'm reading about efficiency.

The Niro is stripped out a bit less than the Kona. Still stripped out a bit.

The Leaf 62. Chademo and analogue speedo? Also efficiency issues. Don't think so.

BMW I3. I could only drive it in the dark. Approaching that thing in daylight would be tough. (sorry I3 drivers, but it's a taste I haven't acquired).

I want to buy new in 2020, so it's either wait and order the Max spec when it's released or, ??? Any suggestions?

If it wasn't for the question marks over charging speed the Ioniq rejig would be the obvious choice.

Shefwedfan

Munurty wrote: »

Any chance of the Polestar 2 coming to Ireland in 2020 at a decent price?

I doubt it, maybe 2021


If it goes out that far I will go for the Crozz

McGiver

Silent Running wrote:

I want to buy new in 2020, so it's either wait and order the Max spec when it's released or, ??? Any suggestions?

Kia Soul? Should be well speced, unless paddy speccing happens

Shefwedfan

McGiver wrote: »

Kia Soul? Should be well speced, unless paddy speccing happens

Kia Soul sits in the category I put the i3 and Leaf 1 into....grand car but not a car I would ever buy(for myself)

unkel

Silent Running wrote: »

I want to buy new in 2020, so it's either wait and order the Max spec when it's released or, ??? Any suggestions?

Wait another year and you'll have more choice. Tesla Model Y (hatchback), Polestar, probably a few others

Silent Running

Mickeroo wrote: »

If it wasn't for the question marks over charging speed the Ioniq rejig would be the obvious choice.

I really do like the Ioniq and I'd love to keep the thing, but I need range in my next car. I want to be able to do my regular 520km, mostly motorway, trip with only one recharge stop. Will the 2020 Ioniq do that? I don't think the battery can be big enough in the Ioniq to cover it.

Silent Running

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Kia Soul sits in the category I put the i3 and Leaf 1 into....grand car but not a car I would ever buy(for myself)

Agreed, I don't think it's as visually challenged as the I3, but still... probably not.

Silent Running

Shefwedfan wrote: »

I doubt it, maybe 2021


If it goes out that far I will go for the Crozz

If it goes that far I'd probably fill the gap with something and go for the Buzz.

McGiver

Silent Running wrote:

Agreed, I don't think it's as visually challenged as the I3, but still... probably not.

Then why? And I actually consider it very ugly, but otherwise a good car. Smaller boot alright but good specs.

Silent Running

McGiver wrote: »

Then why? And I actually consider it very ugly, but otherwise a good car. Smaller boot alright but good specs.

Are the Irish specs available? Linky?

Mc-BigE

Someone asked About alternatives to the ID.3 for 2020, what about the seat el-born? Same batteries as the I.D. and the they will have to undercut the I.D.3 like the Leon Vs Golf , ateca Vs Tiguan etc .
But will it be ready in 2020 ?

Silent Running

Mc-BigE wrote: »

Someone asked About alternatives to the ID.3 for 2020, what about the seat el-born? Same batteries as the I.D. and the they will have to undercut the I.D.3 like the Leon Vs Golf , ateca Vs Tiguan etc .
But will it be ready in 2020 ?

That's the big question. I actually like the El Born styling a bit more than the ID3.

Mike9832

Silent Running wrote: »

That's the big question. I actually like the El Born styling a bit more than the ID3.

Looks way better

Alot sportier

Only a concept at this stage?

Silent Running

Mike9832 wrote: »

Looks way better

Alot sportier

Only a concept at this stage?

I read somewhere that it'll also launch in Frankfurt. I'll be keeping an eye on it for sure.

Silent Running

Here's a decent look at the El Born.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFxNLQpdzv0

Mc-BigE

why is it the Volkswagen put stupid camouflage on their nearly complete car , but Seat don't have a problem showing their car (post production i assume)