So Patrick street is bus only from Thursday 9th August

timmyjimmy

munstermagic11 wrote: »

You're not educating anyone with that information, car owners are aware of that, and it was mentioned.

Whatever. Getting the bus is always going to be cheaper than driving/paying for/wear and tear/tax/insurance/maintenance etc of a car.

j8wk2feszrnpao

timmyjimmy wrote: »

Whatever.

Yeah. You keep repeating something that was already mentioned. But whatever.

timmyjimmy wrote: »

Getting on a bus is always going to be cheaper than driving/paying for/wear and tear/tax/insurance/maintenance etc of a car.

So what?
People don’t have a car with the mindset that they might pay more for travel.
Time can also be money. Not waiting at a bus stop for a bus that may be late, or not turn up at all, is a factor.
The ability to have greater independence with a car is a factor.
Having to go one direction to drop kids to school/crèche and then go the other direction to work with a lot more ease is a factor.

It’s not just the equation of 1 person taking a route in a car compared to another person taking the same route on a bus.

timmyjimmy

munstermagic11 wrote: »

Yeah. You keep repeating something that was already mentioned. But whatever.

So what?
People don’t have a car with the mindset that they might pay more for travel.
Time can also be money. Not waiting at a bus stop for a bus that may be late, or not turn up at all, is a factor.
The ability to have greater independence with a car is a factor.
Having to go one direction to drop kids to school/crèche and then go the other direction to work with a lot more ease is a factor.

It’s not just the equation of 1 person taking a route in a car compared to another person taking the same route on a bus.

Yes, of course some people need cars but there's also plenty of people sitting in cars causing traffic and they're only traveling 5k down the road.
Hopefully public transport ups its game making itself more attractive to these types of people taking them out their cars causing less traffic for people who actually need to use their cars.

John_Rambo

Rayne Gigantic Pliers wrote: »

Also if you are actually doing a bit of shopping (as opposed to just browsing around) the bus isn’t practical imo. What are you going to do with your bags of stuff? Drag them around all day, adding more bags as you go and that’s not even considering wanting to do some food shopping along the way.

With the car you can pop back and put stuff into it if needs be etc leaving you have a much nicer and more relaxed time around town.

We don't drive in to Dublin city any more, nor do most Londoners or Parisians etc.... Too much hassle. The DART or bus is actually quicker and cheaper, we can have a glass of wine with lunch, or have a sneaky pint. Same with most of my friends and family, even my elderly parents wouldn't dream of driving in to town. It's going to go that way with all European cities, cars are going to be less and less welcome & it's going to be more difficult to traverse cities in them.

In saying that, we choose to live in areas with good public transport and I appreciate that you're now 100% locked in to a car & carbon reliant lifestyle.

Although we have three vehicles of our own we use public transport and bikes. Also, we've signed up for go-car and are going to mothball one of the cars.

TheChizler

timmyjimmy wrote: »

Whatever. Getting the bus is always going to be cheaper than driving/paying for/wear and tear/tax/insurance/maintenance etc of a car.

Only if you're getting rid of the car to take the bus instead. Personally I'd be paying 50% of my motoring costs anyway if I left the car at home for the year for day to day stuff. Add in bus fare and I'd be paying 150% of what I'm paying now.

Magnatu

There are very few European cities where people still drive into and through the city center to the same extent that they do in Cork.
People generally use out of town malls that are designed to be driven to for the bulk of their shopping.
They use public transport to get to city centres. While you can of course still shop in city centres it is not the entire focus. They have become much more public spaces to wander around, enjoy the ambience, have a coffee or a drink while people watching etc.
Cork is going in the opposite direction with initiatives like free city center parking and non enforcement of driving restrictions. I doubt that allowing cars to drive through a pedestrianised street like Oliver Plunkett Street would be tolerated in Europe. Even if the authorities were unwilling like here to enforce it the public would by making it socially unacceptable.
We should be taking measures to discourage cars going through the city center. Not the opposite.

mire

Magnatu wrote: »

There are very few European cities where people still drive into and through the city center to the same extent that they do in Cork.
People generally use out of town malls that are designed to be driven to for the bulk of their shopping.
They use public transport to get to city centres. While you can of course still shop in city centres it is not the entire focus. They have become much more public spaces to wander around, enjoy the ambience, have a coffee or a drink while people watching etc.
Cork is going in the opposite direction with initiatives like free city center parking and non enforcement of driving restrictions. I doubt that allowing cars to drive through a pedestrianised street like Oliver Plunkett Street would be tolerated in Europe. Even if the authorities were unwilling like here to enforce it the public would by making it socially unacceptable.
We should be taking measures to discourage cars going through the city center. Not the opposite.

Very true. Cork still has quite a small town provincial mentality when it comes to discussions about car parking. Many people think that the city centre should become a more suburban experience and think that incentivizing car use should be an ambition. When reading some of the complaints about the bus lane on patrick street, you could be forgiven for thinking that it was a discussion about a small county town.

namloc1980

mire wrote: »

Very true. Cork still has quite a small town provincial mentality when it comes to discussions about car parking. Many people think that the city centre should become a more suburban experience and think that incentivizing car use should be an ambition. When reading some of the complaints about the bus lane on patrick street, you could be forgiven for thinking that it was a discussion about a small county town.

Many of the retailers hark back to the 1970s & 80s when Mary and Jimmy could nip into town, park on Patrick Street and do their messages.

FrStone

timmyjimmy wrote: »

You know it costs money to own a car as well?

Sure the people making the decision to take the bus already own a car so have those costs if they take the bus or not...

Before they upgraded the bus service from Blarney a year or two ago it was cheaper for two people to get a taxi from Blarney to town than take the bus.

It's gotten a lot cheaper now but just isn't convenient. 36 stops from Blarney to Mahon Point!!! That journey is less than a half hour by car.

Our bus system is really only fit for the elderly and students who have plenty of time to waste.

FrStone

mire wrote: »

Very true. Cork still has quite a small town provincial mentality when it comes to discussions about car parking. Many people think that the city centre should become a more suburban experience and think that incentivizing car use should be an ambition. When reading some of the complaints about the bus lane on patrick street, you could be forgiven for thinking that it was a discussion about a small county town.

Well let's be honest we are a large town at best by us standards. We are no New York, London or Berlin.

FrStone

John_Rambo wrote: »

We don't drive in to Dublin city any more, nor do most Londoners or Parisians etc.... Too much hassle. The DART or bus is actually quicker and cheaper, we can have a glass of wine with lunch, or have a sneaky pint. Same with most of my friends and family, even my elderly parents wouldn't dream of driving in to town. It's going to go that way with all European cities, cars are going to be less and less welcome & it's going to be more difficult to traverse cities in them.

In saying that, we choose to live in areas with good public transport and I appreciate that you're now 100% locked in to a car & carbon reliant lifestyle.

Although we have three vehicles of our own we use public transport and bikes. Also, we've signed up for go-car and are going to mothball one of the cars.

The vast majority of people come to town to shop.

The only time I don't come to shop is when I'm going to a show or to a restaurant, but sure you can park anywhere in the evening so there is no hassle there.

mire

FrStone wrote: »

Well let's be honest we are a large town at best by us standards. We are no New York, London or Berlin.

Talk about missing the point spectacularly

namloc1980

FrStone wrote: »

The vast majority of people come to town to shop.

The only time I don't come to shop is when I'm going to a show or to a restaurant, but sure you can park anywhere in the evening so there is no hassle there.

I would have thought a huge number come to town to work? Looks like I'm in a tiny minority.

richiepurgas

FrStone wrote: »

Sure the people making the decision to take the bus already own a car so have those costs if they take the bus or not...

Before they upgraded the bus service from Blarney a year or two ago it was cheaper for two people to get a taxi from Blarney to town than take the bus.

It's gotten a lot cheaper now but just isn't convenient. 36 stops from Blarney to Mahon Point!!! That journey is less than a half hour by car.

Our bus system is really only fit for the elderly and students who have plenty of time to waste.

What do you expect, a non-stop service from Blarney to Mahon ?
Hundreds of people use the service from either terminus to access the city centre. Bus driver told me that, around 5 or 6 in the evening, 90% of passengers from Mahon disembark at either Grand Parade or Patrick street, most coming from call centres in Mahon.

FrStone

richiepurgas wrote: »

What do you expect, a non-stop service from Blarney to Mahon ?
Hundreds of people use the service from either terminus to access the city centre. Bus driver told me that, around 5 or 6 in the evening, 90% of passengers from Mahon disembark at either Grand Parade or Patrick street, most coming from call centres in Mahon.

I expect nothing from the county and citys bus service. I am around long enough to know the service provided is abysmal.

36 stops means most people will drive. The bus service is not fit those who are time poor. If that doesn't change, people will continue to drive.

I honestly don't understand how you could encourage someone from Blarney to take the bus to their workplace in mahon if there are 36 stops!!! You would really be devaluing someone's worth it you think they can afford to waste all that time on a bus.

namloc1980

FrStone wrote: »

I expect nothing from the county and citys bus service. I am around long enough to know the service provided is abysmal.

36 stops means most people will drive. The bus service is not fit those who are time poor. If that doesn't change, people will continue to drive.

I honestly don't understand how you could encourage someone from Blarney to take the bus to their workplace in mahon if there are 36 stops!!! You would really be devaluing someone's worth it you think they can afford to waste all that time on a bus.

Sorry for asking the obvious but do you understand how public transport works?

FrStone

namloc1980 wrote: »

Sorry for asking the obvious but do you understand how public transport works?

Do you understand that people won't use public transport if it is inconvenient?

namloc1980

FrStone wrote: »

Do you understand that people won't use public transport if it is inconvenient?

You're complaining that people won't use the bus because it stops at bus stops. Interesting. 12m+ journeys on the Cork city bus service would indicate that quite a few people use it in fact.

FrStone

namloc1980 wrote: »

You're complaining that people won't use the bus because it stops at bus stops. Interesting. 12m+ journeys on the Cork city bus service would indicate that quite a few people use it in fact.

So you are happy with the numbers in Cork using the bus service?

If that's the case, those of us still using our cars can continue to do so and there is no need to improve the infrastructure for the bus service....

cgcsb

Under CMATs a train from Blarney to Kent and the luas from Kent to Mahon would take about a half hour, regardless of the time of day. It'd be an irregular commuter journey though and Blarney Station is a bit of a hike from the town. I don't follow what the above argument is about, buses are currently too slow to provide a significant incentive for car drivers to switch. Well yes I think everyone agrees on that. Hence putting in more bus priority and more bus only streets will change that.

namloc1980

FrStone wrote: »

So you are happy with the numbers in Cork using the bus service?

If that's the case, those of us still using our cars can continue to do so and there is no need to improve the infrastructure for the bus service....

Nice strawman there. Not worth responding to.

Mardyke

Some people are just one or all of these - lazy, ignorant, stuck in a time gone by.

richiepurgas

FrStone wrote: »

I expect nothing from the county and citys bus service. I am around long enough to know the service provided is abysmal.

36 stops means most people will drive. The bus service is not fit those who are time poor. If that doesn't change, people will continue to drive.

I honestly don't understand how you could encourage someone from Blarney to take the bus to their workplace in mahon if there are 36 stops!!! You would really be devaluing someone's worth it you think they can afford to waste all that time on a bus.

If you expect nothing, then you're never disappointed.
Let's try this again, slowly if necessary.
Not everyone who gets on the bus in Blarney goes all the way to Mahon and the same applies in reverse.
For many, the bus brings them to where they want to go along the way or to another bus connection to bring them to their final destination.
As I said, a bus driver has told me that most of the passengers on the 215 from Mahon in the evening get off in the city centre. It slows the bus timing down, but it provides a service that people want. The number of stops between Blarney and Mahon is irrelevant.
I'd say there are even more on the 220 route.
Figures recently released show that the number of passengers using Bus Eireann in Cork is increasing. Will try to find it later but my bus is about to come

John_Rambo

FrStone wrote: »

The vast majority of people come to town to shop.

Really? I'd say the people that work in those shops go to work every day. Retail is the second biggest employer in Cork with State agencies being the largest. Think of the University and hospitals along with the professional services.

When you're not shopping they're still there!

FrStone wrote: »

The only time I don't come to shop is when I'm going to a show or to a restaurant, but sure you can park anywhere in the evening so there is no hassle there.

That's just you though. Although you don't work in the city, the city is a big employer. Each of those restaurants and shows employ plenty of staff and they're busy.

what the hell!

The guards were pulling cars again today which was good to see.

richiepurgas

what the hell! wrote: »

The guards were pulling cars again today which was good to see.

The traffic in town today moved very quickly even on the quays which had been a problem. Went through city centre about 5.30pm.

Harika

For the 36 stops, it was suggested like 100 pages before that there should be buses directly connecting main hubs directly. E. G Blackpool to mahon non stop. Or Wilton to mahon and from there busses that stop more often

richiepurgas

Harika wrote: »

For the 36 stops, it was suggested like 100 pages before that there should be buses directly connecting main hubs directly. E. G Blackpool to mahon non stop. Or Wilton to mahon and from there busses that stop more often

Impractical as there would be little demand. Who's looking for buses to bring them from one shopping centre to another as would be the case in the two examples you've given ?

j8wk2feszrnpao

richiepurgas wrote: »

Impractical as there would be little demand. Who's looking for buses to bring them from one shopping centre to another as would be the case in the two examples you've given ?

I have no idea about the demand, but Wilton/Blackpool are more than shopping centers, people do live there as well.

Harika

richiepurgas wrote: »

Impractical as there would be little demand. Who's looking for buses to bring them from one shopping centre to another as would be the case in the two examples you've given ?

Let's say you want to go from blarney to a doctor in the atlantia clinic. Now you have to endure 32 stops. With this concept you go to the shopping centre first and then take a bus to the clinic with two stops. That should shorten the journey time massively.
Same concept as airlines use hubs to collect and distribute people.