So Patrick street is bus only from Thursday 9th August

beer enigma

Seems to be a lot of mixed opinion as to whether its a good or bad thing. I know a lot of traders who are opposed to it whereas buses, taxis and cyclists seem delighted.

I'm concerned it could kill a lot of passing trade, but what are your thoughts ?

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/cork-city-car-ban-a-recipe-for-disaster-833706.html

What about motorcycles? I frequently use the motorcycle parking spots on Patrick Street.

cgcsb

Great news. It'll be needed to form the central part of an improved bus and BRT netowork. The 15:00 to 18:30 window is pretty conservative though, that'll need to be extended in the future.

Dbu

Cant wait to see where all the traffic coming from the west (washington St) will go when they are directed onto grand parade/south mall.
The whole idea sounds mad in my opinion

If they think that doing this will get the public to travel on a bus instead of driving they are wrong IMO.

beer enigma

traffic from Grand Parade directed through daunt square to the Quays

beer enigma

Deleted User wrote: »

What about motorcycles? I frequently use the motorcycle parking spots on Patrick Street.

worth asking, looks like buses, taxis and cyclists & emergency vehicles only.

deRanged

beer enigma wrote: »

traffic from Grand Parade directed through daunt square to the Quays

really? that used to be a pedestrian priority zone, I guess they're just giving up on that entirely now. it certainly won't handle the volume of traffic either.

cgcsb

Dbu wrote: »

Cant wait to see where all the traffic coming from the west (washington St) will go when they are directed onto grand parade/south mall.
The whole idea sounds mad in my opinion

If they think that doing this will get the public to travel on a bus instead of driving they are wrong IMO.

Traffic evaporation is what happens. This has been an observed phenomenon across the western world for about 20 years:

https://www.onestreet.org/resources-for-increasing-bicycling/115-traffic-evaporation

When you remove capacity for private cars in an urban area, modal shift occurs, because the diversion and lack of car capacity on that diversion presents an unattractive alternative. This has been observed in Dublin where car commuting is on a downward spiral and over the next few weeks and months there is going to be a serious squeeze on cars because the issue has been forced by the arrival of luas and subsequent pedestrianisation of College Green. Heaps of car capacity in Dublin City Centre will be handed over to 24hr bus lanes. cork won't be far behind.

Unlike Dublin, Cork is quite small, you can cycle from the City Centre to the N40 in 20 minutes, so banning cars isn't exactly going to mean a huge amount. If people are spending an hour driving to some Cork suburb, for what is equivalent to an hours walk or a 20 minute cycle, they need to re-examine their commuting habits.

Dbu

beer enigma wrote: »

traffic from Grand Parade directed through daunt square to the Quays

So a forty foot truck that turns left from Washington street has to go down the coalquay via the little junction outside Argos? Surely wont fit

Oafley Jones

Dbu wrote: »

So a forty foot truck that turns left from Washington street has to go down the coalquay via the little junction outside Argos? Surely wont fit

Commercial vehicles wouldn’t be included.

Dbu

Oafley Jones wrote: »

Commercial vehicles wouldn’t be included.

Unfortunately they are included, so no vans, trucks etc
only exemptions are
'Buses, taxis, emergency vehicles and bicycles'

j8wk2feszrnpao

beer enigma wrote: »

Seems to be a lot of mixed opinion as to whether its a good or bad thing. I know a lot of traders who are opposed to it whereas buses, taxis and cyclists seem delighted.

I'm concerned it could kill a lot of passing trade, but what are your thoughts ?

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/cork-city-car-ban-a-recipe-for-disaster-833706.html

It's tough to tell until it's trialed really.
All those that are delighted will have less traffic to deal with, who wouldn't be happy with that

We had a thread on it earlier, and a major concern is that the council are doing nothing to enforce it, they are leaving it to the Gardai (who are already stretched and have other things to focus on). So I can see plenty of people in cars or on motorbikes taking advantage of the reduced volume on Patrick St.
"Inspector Finbarr O’Sullivan of the Traffic Corps said gardaí will focus on raising awareness of the changes, rather than on enforcement, in the early stages."

The times doesn't make much sense either. 7 days a week? Is it really required on a Sunday? And it's just evening traffic, so won't help the bus services in the morning, not sure why it isn't at both rush hour times.

Funneling traffic down onto Cornmarket Street and St Pauls Ave is just gonna be mental in those pedestrian areas.

munstermagic11

munstermagic11 wrote: »

It's tough to tell until it's trialed really.
All those that are delighted will have less traffic to deal with, who wouldn't be happy with that

We had a thread on it earlier, and a major concern is that the council are doing nothing to enforce it, they are leaving it to the Gardai (who are already stretched and have other things to focus on). So I can see plenty of people in cars or on motorbikes taking advantage of the reduced volume on Patrick St.
"Inspector Finbarr O’Sullivan of the Traffic Corps said gardaí will focus on raising awareness of the changes, rather than on enforcement, in the early stages."

The times doesn't make much sense either. 7 days a week? Is it really required on a Sunday? And it's just evening traffic, so won't help the bus services in the morning, not sure why it isn't at both rush hour times.

Funneling traffic down onto Cornmarket Street and St Pauls Ave is just gonna be mental in those pedestrian areas.

In fairness motorbikes don't cause traffic congestion anywhere in Ireland and there is dedicated motorcycle parking on Patrick Street. Bikes shouldn't be included in this.

Cork Boy 53

Deleted User wrote: »

In fairness motorbikes don't cause traffic congestion anywhere in Ireland and there is dedicated motorcycle parking on Patrick Street. Bikes shouldn't be included in this.

Well, the powers that be have decided otherwise. It remains to be seen how strictly these new regulations will be enforced though. I could see a fair few people flaunting them.

Cork Boy 53

[QUOTE=munstermagic11;106507986

The times doesn't make much sense either. 7 days a week? Is it really required on a Sunday? And it's just evening traffic, so won't help the bus services in the morning, not sure why it isn't at both rush hour times.

Funneling traffic down onto Cornmarket Street and St Pauls Ave is just gonna be mental in those pedestrian areas.[/QUOTE]

That was mentioned in the link that you posted in the above quote.

"Banning private cars from the city’s main street was agreed in principle in 2012 as part of the Cork City Centre Movement Strategy — a multi-pronged plan to deliver one of the single largest overhauls of traffic flow in the city in over 50 years.
However, initial proposals for a 12.30pm to 6.30pm car ban were shot down by city councillors in 2015 amid concerns over the length of the car ban period.
A year later, they voted to proceed with a reduced three-and-a-half-hour evening ban."

j8wk2feszrnpao

Deleted User wrote: »

In fairness motorbikes don't cause traffic congestion anywhere in Ireland and there is dedicated motorcycle parking on Patrick Street. Bikes shouldn't be included in this.

Maybe not, but they are.
I guess, if you park there oin the morning, then you are entitled to leave, even in between the 3pm to 6:30pm timing?

j8wk2feszrnpao

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

That was mentioned in the link that you posted in the above quote.

"Banning private cars from the city’s main street was agreed in principle in 2012 as part of the Cork City Centre Movement Strategy — a multi-pronged plan to deliver one of the single largest overhauls of traffic flow in the city in over 50 years.
However, initial proposals for a 12.30pm to 6.30pm car ban were shot down by city councillors in 2015 amid concerns over the length of the car ban period.
A year later, they voted to proceed with a reduced three-and-a-half-hour evening ban."

No it's not. I spoke about the two rush hours, morning and evening. 12:30pm is the afternoon.

Cork Boy 53

munstermagic11 wrote: »

It's tough to tell until it's trialed really.
All those that are delighted will have less traffic to deal with, who wouldn't be happy with that

We had a thread on it earlier, and a major concern is that the council are doing nothing to enforce it, they are leaving it to the Gardai (who are already stretched and have other things to focus on). So I can see plenty of people in cars or on motorbikes taking advantage of the reduced volume on Patrick St.
"Inspector Finbarr O’Sullivan of the Traffic Corps said gardaí will focus on raising awareness of the changes, rather than on enforcement, in the early stages."

The times doesn't make much sense either. 7 days a week? Is it really required on a Sunday? And it's just evening traffic, so won't help the bus services in the morning, not sure why it isn't at both rush hour times.

Funneling traffic down onto Cornmarket Street and St Pauls Ave is just gonna be mental in those pedestrian areas.

munstermagic11 wrote: »

No it's not. I spoke about the two rush hours, morning and evening. 12:30pm is the afternoon.

OK fair enough. Actually it was the OP who posted the link not you. My apologies.

whisky_galore

Dbu wrote: »

Unfortunately they are included, so no vans, trucks etc

How are they supposed to make deliveries during that time? Not every place has a back/side entrance.

Unless it's enforced, people will chance their arms and ignore it or plead ignorance.

Rooy

How is this being policed ? , is there a permament red light at the junctions ?

grogi

beer enigma wrote: »

Seems to be a lot of mixed opinion as to whether its a good or bad thing. I know a lot of traders who are opposed to it whereas buses, taxis and cyclists seem delighted.

I'm concerned it could kill a lot of passing trade, but what are your thoughts ?

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/cork-city-car-ban-a-recipe-for-disaster-833706.html

Passing trade? You cannot park there anyway, nobody was shopping there unless they went to town on purpose.

There will be no loss to city trade.

j8wk2feszrnpao

grogi wrote: »

Passing trade? You cannot park there anyway, nobody was shopping there unless they went to town on purpose.

There will be no loss to city trade.

I think he meant more that Patrick Street was an avenue to get to some of the City center car parks, in terms of passing trade (although I have seen plenty of people park there as well). I think the timing will hurt less, as less people may tend to enter the city at that time.

j8wk2feszrnpao

Rooy wrote: »

How is this being policed ? , is there a permament red light at the junctions ?

It's not being policed initally:
"Inspector Finbarr O’Sullivan of the Traffic Corps said gardaí will focus on raising awareness of the changes, rather than on enforcement, in the early stages."

http://www.eveningecho.ie/corknews/Patricks-Street-car-ban-to-begin-in-March-ced49c79-59d1-408e-b527-01944d457aed-ds
"There will be no physical barriers introduced to enforce the change as access will be maintained for public transport. CCTV is also in place on the street, though City Hall says this will not be used to monitor and target those who breach the new rules."

"Instead, signage will be rolled out as part of an information campaign in the coming weeks once dates are finalised."
Anyone see the informational campaign so far? Was in the city over the weekend and didn't notice anything.

Cork Boy 53

munstermagic11 wrote: »

It's not being policed initally:
"Inspector Finbarr O’Sullivan of the Traffic Corps said gardaí will focus on raising awareness of the changes, rather than on enforcement, in the early stages."

http://www.eveningecho.ie/corknews/Patricks-Street-car-ban-to-begin-in-March-ced49c79-59d1-408e-b527-01944d457aed-ds
"There will be no physical barriers introduced to enforce the change as access will be maintained for public transport. CCTV is also in place on the street, though City Hall says this will not be used to monitor and target those who breach the new rules."

"Instead, signage will be rolled out as part of an information campaign in the coming weeks once dates are finalised."
Anyone see the informational campaign so far? Was in the city over the weekend and didn't notice anything.

Me neither. I was in the city centre including the Grand Parade/ Patrick St /Daunt Square areas for a few hours yesterday and no info whatsoever about this.

hufpc8w3adnk65

So hang on they are banning commercial vehicles also? So delivery vans and things like that won’t be left? Also my company maintains 10/12 premises on Patrick’s street the fact I won’t be able to get access in my private van is crazy! Ban cars sure but banning commercial vehicles makes all the loading bays useless

TheChizler

I presume this has something to do with the bus lane which has replaced the left lane heading East on Washington Street?

whisky_galore

munstermagic11 wrote: »

It's not being policed initally:
"Inspector Finbarr O’Sullivan of the Traffic Corps said gardaí will focus on raising awareness of the changes, rather than on enforcement, in the early stages."

http://www.eveningecho.ie/corknews/Patricks-Street-car-ban-to-begin-in-March-ced49c79-59d1-408e-b527-01944d457aed-ds
"There will be no physical barriers introduced to enforce the change as access will be maintained for public transport. CCTV is also in place on the street, though City Hall says this will not be used to monitor and target those who breach the new rules."

"Instead, signage will be rolled out as part of an information campaign in the coming weeks once dates are finalised."
Anyone see the informational campaign so far? Was in the city over the weekend and didn't notice anything.

All in all, about as useful as an inflatable dartboard. :pac:

namloc1980

MrMac84 wrote: »

So hang on they are banning commercial vehicles also? So delivery vans and things like that won’t be left? Also my company maintains 10/12 premises on Patrick’s street the fact I won’t be able to get access in my private van is crazy! Ban cars sure but banning commercial vehicles makes all the loading bays useless

How do they manage in pedestrian zones all over the world? Grafton Street in Dublin for instance or even Oliver Plunkett Street in Cork?

j8wk2feszrnpao

namloc1980 wrote: »

How do they manage in pedestrian zones all over the world? Grafton Street in Dublin for instance or even Oliver Plunkett Street in Cork?

Patrick St won’t be a pedestrian zone like Grafton St or OP St (with the barriers up), it’s just changed to a bus lane setup.

MrMac84

MrMac84 wrote: »

So hang on they are banning commercial vehicles also? So delivery vans and things like that won’t be left? Also my company maintains 10/12 premises on Patrick’s street the fact I won’t be able to get access in my private van is crazy! Ban cars sure but banning commercial vehicles makes all the loading bays useless

You'll have to work around it

And that shouldn't be too difficult to be fair " with private cars banned from St Patrick’s Street between 3pm and 6.30pm seven days a week"

I reckon this will be very positive. A car free Patrick Street might well be great of an afternoon

Sonics2k

MrMac84 wrote: »

So hang on they are banning commercial vehicles also? So delivery vans and things like that won’t be left? Also my company maintains 10/12 premises on Patrick’s street the fact I won’t be able to get access in my private van is crazy! Ban cars sure but banning commercial vehicles makes all the loading bays useless

To be fair it's only between 3pm and 6pm. I'm sure you, much like most other companies, can arrange the deliveries be done outside those hours.

hufpc8w3adnk65

Sonics2k wrote: »

To be fair it's only between 3pm and 6pm. I'm sure you, much like most other companies, can arrange the deliveries be done outside those hours.

I’m not a delivery driver tho. I attend to breakdowns. I think banning cars is enough with out the need to ban commercial vans but sure I guess we’ll see Tuesday

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

namloc1980 wrote: »

How do they manage in pedestrian zones all over the world? Grafton Street in Dublin for instance or even Oliver Plunkett Street in Cork?

To be fair, in Oliver Plunkett Street they manage by driving up there whenever they want anyways

j8wk2feszrnpao

Gatlin Delightful Gearshift wrote: »

To be fair, in Oliver Plunkett Street they manage by driving up there whenever they want anyways

Commercial vehicles have access when the barriers are up? I frequent the City a lot less than I previously would have, so not fully aware of the OP Street access.

Jlayay

Good, about time. Sick and tired of almost being run over outside the awkward intersection outside Dealz/Argos.

SleetAndSnow

Jlayay wrote: »

Good, about time. Sick and tired of almost being run over outside the awkward intersection outside Dealz/Argos.

will that section not be busier as cars won't be going down the street? Im not sure of the exact layout of the new boundaries and where you can and can't drive.

Gatlin Delightful Gearshift

Gatlin Delightful Gearshift wrote: »

To be fair, in Oliver Plunkett Street they manage by driving up there whenever they want anyways

How do they pass the barriers?

j8wk2feszrnpao

Jlayay wrote: »

Good, about time. Sick and tired of almost being run over outside the awkward intersection outside Dealz/Argos.

Already covered above, but you should check the new traffic “diversion”. Expect a serious increase in the number of vehicles passing outside Dealz/Argos.

hufpc8w3adnk65

Jlayay wrote: »

Good, about time. Sick and tired of almost being run over outside the awkward intersection outside Dealz/Argos.

Mmmmmmmmm you mean the road outside deals? The road that’s for cars to drive on? It’s not a footpath! I’d suggest you look and check for oncoming traffic in future to avoid “almost” been run over

TheChizler

Augeo wrote: »

How do they pass the barriers?

Go the wrong way up the exit streets...

namloc1980

TheChizler wrote: »

Go the wrong way up the exit streets...

Breaking the law. Great.

TheChizler

namloc1980 wrote: »

Breaking the law. Great.

Just saying what I see

ofcork

You often see cars parked facing the wrong way on the side streets off oliver plunkett st.

ofcork

TheChizler wrote: »

I presume this has something to do with the bus lane which has replaced the left lane heading East on Washington Street?

They have also extended the bus lane on merchants quay up to the lights at the junction with Patrick st.

Padraig Mor

MrMac84 wrote: »

Mmmmmmmmm you mean the road outside deals? The road that’s for cars to drive on? It’s not a footpath! I’d suggest you look and check for oncoming traffic in future to avoid “almost” been run over

I believe it's actually a pedestrian priority zone?

whisky_galore

MrMac84 wrote: »

I’m not a delivery driver tho. I attend to breakdowns. I think banning cars is enough with out the need to ban commercial vans but sure I guess we’ll see Tuesday

Maybe they can arrange to have breakdowns outside of these hours....

cantdecide

Deleted User wrote: »

What about motorcycles? I frequently use the motorcycle parking spots on Patrick Street.

There are two motorcycle only spots on Patrick st so imagine being able to park your motorcycle or scooter (free of charge) on Patrick st and then coming back to your bike between 3.00 and 6.30?? It doesn't make much sense when the street isn't being pedestrianised or barriers employed. I think motorcycles might get exempted if enough noise were made. I'll be following this.

deRanged

The street outside Argos/Dealz is indeed pedestrian priority, not that you'd know.


to be fair, the only sign is very hard to see.



and the new bus lane, active from 15:00 to 18:30, according to the road markings. I didn't see any signs for it at all, I imagine they'll be installed soon.

j8wk2feszrnpao

deRanged wrote: »

the new bus lane, active from 15:00 to 18:30, according to the road markings. I didn't see any signs for it at all, I imagine they'll be installed soon.

Thanks for the pics.

I guess if that is a bus lane only from 3pm, then no cars will be turning left at Finns Corner, so there may be even less traffic passing by Dealz (just cars coming from the Grand Parade side)?

I hope they have the lights at that junction re-programmed from 3pm as well. They're be far less traffic coming from Patrick St going to Grand Parade/Washington St; and a lot more going from Washington St onto South Mall.

deRanged

deRanged wrote: »

.....
to be fair, the only sign is very hard to see......]

Hard to miss it surely for motorists. If you think that's hard to see you shouldn't be driving.

Tom44

Well the map says you can turn left from Washington street to Daunts square
So it's already a WHF info release

Sorry
Can't upload it (map) , but its on this original link.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/cork-city-car-ban-a-recipe-for-disaster-833706.html

That will be fun if you can turn left from the center of (road) Washington street.
Formally the lane for right turns onto Grand Parade.

.