Fire at Metro Hotel in Ballymun

Actually looking at that photo from this morning it doesn’t look like those windows open.

Paulzx

Varik wrote: »

How does liability work for fires when the fire spreads, in the case of houses, apartments, or here in a hotel. It's apparently a private apartment where it started.

The insurance company of the premises the fire originated on are responsable for all costs related to the fire including damage caused by the fire and by the Fire Service.

For example if a semi detached house goes on fire and spreads into the adjoining house the insurance company where the fire originated is liable.

If the fire service decided to demolish an adjoining building to stop fire spreading the damage is attributed to the original fire (even if the building demolished did not go on fire).

By law insurance companies cannot write in exemptions to this

muckbrien

tara73 wrote: »

my guess (or hope, better to say) the hotel rooms had fire rated walls and the escape routes were sprinklered, as somebody else already mentioned.

but the fire obviously broke out and spread in the apartment area. I'm not sure if the old containment (stay put) theory is any good, look at Grenfell tower...I think there should always be the concept of containing a fire, but this must include the escape routes too, speak emergency staircases and hallways leading to this e-staircase.

Funnily enough, I stayed in the Metro Hotel one year ago for a night. Huge hotel, but I got the feeling there were not many guests at all. Which obviously was the case...
I didn't realise at the time there were apartments above the hotel. And I find this very odd from the planning concept. Why put the apartments in the upper levels and not the hotel? From many aspects and especially fire aspects it doesn't make much sense..

The Grenfell tower fire and fire containment are two separate matters .

The cladding on Grenfell caused the traditional containment to fail.

tara73

Vojera wrote: »

If anyone is interested in what these apartments were like inside, these pictures are up on Daft (archive in case it's taken down).

My wife and I viewed one a few years ago when we moved to the area (obviously not for that price!). They were a mixture of residential and corporate lets, but I got the impression they were all owned by the hotel (could be completely wrong in that). We didn't move in because it was expensive for the area and had a very "hotel" feel (open wardrobes with don't-rob-me hangers) so we felt like we'd never feel at home there.

We live down the street now, but just happened we weren't home last night so thankfully missed it all.

thanks for that. after seeing the pics of the apartments, my guess is the whole tower block was planned as a hotel, (as crazy amount of hotel space was planned in pre crash times 2007) and they later decided to rebuild apartments in there...

CeilingFly

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Ah feck off. All I can see on your link is one tweet from Dublin fire brigade showing inside of building.

Considering how this fire spread to other floors, I actually expect RTÉ to be onsite this morning reporting and investigating. Just because nobody died doesn’t make it any less serious.

Thanksfully RTE donl;t subscribe to teh sensationalism fo the print media like the indo.

It was a fire.

It was yesterday.

There were no injuries, there were no deaths.

Its not major news

Excellent job done by hotel/apartment management to evacuate everyone.

Excellent job by DFB to extinguish the fire and ensure safety of both their crews and the public.

If you need to salivate over a few pictures - go to twitter or look at the hysterical media - they'll have loads of photos taken from various facebook / twitter accounts of members of the public in the area.

Sofiztikated

tara73 wrote: »

thanks for that. after seeing the pics of the apartments, my guess is the whole tower block was planned as a hotel, (as crazy amount of hotel space was planned in pre crash times 2007) and they later decided to rebuild apartments in there...

Nah, was always designed as apartments.

languagenerd

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Just went onto RTÉ website to view pictures of how the building looks this morning. There are none. It’s nearly 9am, are their reporters and cameramen still in bed?

RTÉ radio have been reporting on it all morning, so their reporters are there. The first main TV news bulletin isn't until 1pm so maybe that's why there are no photos. I agree that there probably should be a more up-to-date photo for the website, but their radio reporting has been quite good so far.

I'd much rather their cautious reporting btw to the stuff in some of the papers/websites. "Terrified families were forced to flee"... yet no-one has found any terrified families to interview.
"Last night five floors were ablaze" - but it looks like only 2 floors were on fire (10th and 13th).
And few are differentiating between the private apartments (badly damaged) and the hotel rooms (relatively unscathed).

musiknonstop

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Ah feck off. All I can see on your link is one tweet from Dublin fire brigade showing inside of building.

Considering how this fire spread to other floors, I actually expect RTÉ to be onsite this morning reporting and investigating. Just because nobody died doesn’t make it any less serious.

The building will be locked down, no one will be going near it apart from DFB, Gardai and forensic investigators.

For Forks Sake

musiknonstop wrote: »

The building will be locked down, no one will be going near it apart from DFB, Gardai and forensic investigators.

So says common sense.

Unfortunately we seem to be beset by imbeciles who think the media should be allowed in for a nose around to satisfy their own curiosity. :rolleyes:

tara73

muckbrien wrote: »

The Grenfell tower fire and fire containment are two separate matters .

The cladding on Grenfell caused the traditional containment to fail.

can't state it like this. wasn't just the cladding, it was a mixture of everything not in the slightest up to any fire standards. the 'traditional containment' wasn't working anymore at all. Too much alterations were made within apartments, the hallways and the staircase.
There was no emergency staircase at all as far as I remember, just a very narrow main staircase with additionally fitted openly laid electrical cables and god knows what else.

tara73

Sofiztikated wrote: »

Nah, was always designed as apartments.

how do you know for sure? did you work on the planning or construction?

Jeez some of you like to exaggerate to extreme levels.

I made a comment that RTÉ website had no morning pictures as of 9am this morning. I didn’t say they should be kitted up and roaming around inside. But as someone said, their 1st televised report is at 1pm today but that doesn’t mean that they can’t keep people informed of a very newsworthy story via their website. The fire was still ablaze when most people went to bed so it’s very probable that, like myself, they woke up wondering what the story was now.

I’m relieved no one has been hurt and the staff at the hotel and the emergency services deserve huge pats on the back. It still doesn’t take away from the fact that this was a serious fire not contained to one area.

I’m sorry now that I made a comment earlier.

weldoninhio

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Jeez some of you like to exaggerate to extreme levels.

I made a comment that RTwebsite had no morning pictures as of 9am this morning. I didn’t say they should be kitted up and roaming around inside. But as someone said, their 1st televised report is at 1pm today but that doesn’t mean that they can’t keep people informed of a very newsworthy story via their website. The fire was still ablaze when most people went to bed so it’s very probable that, like myself, they woke up wondering what the story was now.

I’m relieved no one has been hurt and the staff at the hotel and the emergency services deserve huge pats on the back. It still doesn’t take away from the fact that this was a serious fire not contained to one area.

I’m sorry now that I made a comment earlier.

There was a story on the website, just no pics. That kept people informed.

What is very newsworthy about an evacuated building being on fire, then put out?

The fact that it wasn’t a fire contained to one apartment or even adjacent floors?

Sofiztikated

tara73 wrote: »

how do you know for sure? did you work on the planning or construction?

Worked in the hotel, long before the apartments were finished.

There was talk of them being serviced apartments, but I left before they were done.

muckbrien

tara73 wrote: »

can't state it like this. wasn't just the cladding, it was a mixture of everything not in the slightest up to any fire standards. the 'traditional containment' wasn't working anymore at all. Too much alterations were made within apartments, the hallways and the staircase.
There was no emergency staircase at all as far as I remember, just a very narrow main staircase with additionally fitted openly laid electrical cables and god knows what else.

Yes my bad

The cladding was the main factor causing rapid spread but all the other factors contributed to the tragedy

It's all very well posters here saying non-story and great job DFB etc.

Let's not be so quick to move on ,it may be very different next time

weldoninhio

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

The fact that it wasn’t a fire contained to one apartment or even adjacent floors?

And what would you propose RTE report a few hours after the fire is out and before any fire investigators would have gotten access to the apartments??

weldoninhio

weldoninhio wrote: »

And what would you propose RTE report a few hours after the fire is out and before any fire investigators would have gotten access to the apartments??

Yes, that is exactly what I propose. They are the national news broadcaster. People went to sleep whilst it was still ablaze and I’m sure they woke up wondering if it still was.

Personally, I would have liked to have seen the extent of the damage when I woke. But I’m in a minority obviously. I guess what I would expect from RTÉ and what they themselves, and others expect is different.

I’ve seen daytime pics now so accept my apologies for derailing the thread with my expectations.

Hector Savage

5k a month rent for one of those apartments ????

w. t. f. ! ! !

weldoninhio

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Yes, that is exactly what I propose. They are the national news broadcaster. People went to sleep whilst it was still ablaze and I’m sure they woke up wondering if it still was.

Personally, I would have liked to have seen the extent of the damage when I woke. But I’m in a minority obviously. I guess what I would expect from RTÉ and what they themselves, and others expect is different.

I’ve seen daytime pics now so accept my apologies for derailing the thread with my expectations.

People who went asleep would have woken up to the RTE news story that was linked when you first complained there was no “carnage porn” for you to look at.

Vojera

Hector Savage wrote: »

5k a month rent for one of those apartments ????

w. t. f. ! ! !

When we looked into renting one back in ~2010 they were €1200 per month, all utilities included (not a penthouse one, obviously). And that was hugely expensive for the time (we took a place down the road for €750 a month).

The €5k pricetag is obviously aimed at short-term corporate lets, companies that are sending staff over for short stays only, and I'm sure it's highly negotiable too. But still, massively overpriced imo, because it's not a great area at all, lots of noise at night, anti-social behaviour etc.

jd

A fireman posted on politics.ie

http://www.politics.ie/forum/current-affairs/262773-metro-hotel-ballymun-fire-18.html#post11936906

Talking to the lads who were at the fire.

It started on the 13th floor. When the alarms tripped the automatic smoke vents opened on ALL the floors. Unfortunately they opened sloping out from the top and on non return springs. Flaming debris from the 13th floor then dropped in to the 10th floor through the vents igniting a fire on that floor.

tara73

jd wrote: »

A fireman posted on politics.ie

http://www.politics.ie/forum/current-affairs/262773-metro-hotel-ballymun-fire-18.html#post11936906

that is very interesting. smoke vents are always on the top (roof ) of the emergency staircases, so in compliance with the fire regs...but after this incident, I'm sure the used vents will be under intense scrutiny...

Sofiztikated

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Yes, that is exactly what I propose. They are the national news broadcaster. People went to sleep whilst it was still ablaze and I’m sure they woke up wondering if it still was.

Personally, I would have liked to have seen the extent of the damage when I woke. But I’m in a minority obviously. I guess what I would expect from RTÉ and what they themselves, and others expect is different.

I’ve seen daytime pics now so accept my apologies for derailing the thread with my expectations.

There was a fire. RTE reported it. DFB did their job, and put it out. (I'm not knocking the Fire Brigade, but literally, putting out a fire is their job.)

If you want gory details on deaths and damages, from fires, see

http://www.housing.gov.ie/search/archived/archived/archived/current/category/local-government/sub-topic/statistics-fire-service-activities/topic/fire-and-emergency-management/type/statistics?query=

How many fires do you think the Fire Brigade attended to, all over the country, yesterday? Should every one of them be on the news? Complete with photos of damage, burnt family photos fluttering in the wind, a good close up of any charred bodies for good measure?

Sofiztikated

jd wrote: »

A fireman posted on politics.ie

http://www.politics.ie/forum/current-affairs/262773-metro-hotel-ballymun-fire-18.html#post11936906

I made the mistake of reading a couple of other posts under that one.

**** me.

SEPT 23 1989

Sofiztikated wrote: »

I made the mistake of reading a couple of other posts under that one.

**** me.

The Field Marshall is some boyo

TanyGray

Scary stuff. I don't ever want to live in a building where the window is higher than i can safely jump.

Fann Linn

TanyGray wrote: »

Scary stuff. I don't ever want to live in a building where the window is higher than i can safely jump.

Rules out every thing except a bungalow so.

TanyGray

Fann Linn wrote: »

Rules out every thing except a bungalow so.

I reckon I could handle 3 floors.
I've jumped out the top floor of a semi before easily enough when my son locked me in the bedroom, so I think three floors wouldn't be too bad either if you had to jump. Four and I reckon it is certain death though.

So three is my max.

Franz Von Peppercorn

I think the criticisms of RTE are entirely valid. I first heard about this fire here. Then some tweeted me a link on twitter so I got a notification. That was from ABC in Australia. That was around 9:10 so I turn on the RTE news to an inane discussion on the Pope. They mentioned the fire for ten seconds and then moved on to other stuff, all precorded from the 6pm news no doubt.

Remember the fire started at 7:30