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Property Market 2018
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You say the government isn't investing in rural Ireland, but then tell us that they are investing so much in you that you can ignore a job offer...engiweirdo wrote: »
The point is though it's not bettering yourself with the state of the property market in Dublin. I would be entering a significantly worsened situation.engiweirdo wrote: ».....
And if it's a case of companies wanting to go where talent is why am I contacted multiple times a day about "fantastic" opportunities in Dublin? Surely if its overflowing with talent they neednt look toward uninterested outsiders?
They might reckon you'd be interested in bettering yourself. If things are as bad as you make them out to be outside of Dublin etc you can't be enjoying it :pac:
I am currently unemployed in Waterford. I was contacted a few weeks ago by both internal and external recruiters for the same position at a large company in Dublin, all but begged me to interview for them, outlined salary, I said No, they upped it by €3k, I said Id think it over. now I have a young family so would need a 2 bed property minimum, did the maths based on what was available on daft in the area and take home after tax and not even allowing for having to stump up a serious deposit and uproot all our lives, Id be worse off on what was a very generous salary for a graduate in Dublin than unemployed in Waterford. Thats actually sick in fairness. Baffles me why any company could be bothered with the place.
*Note to others, please don't get angry at this, I'm only being facetious... He seems to think he's entitled to a well paid job in his chosen profession wherever he likes. I certainly wasn't able to support a family on my graduate salary... Urban or rural...0 -
You say the government isn't investing in rural Ireland, but then tell us that they are investing so much in you that you can ignore a job offer...engiweirdo wrote: »
The point is though it's not bettering yourself with the state of the property market in Dublin. I would be entering a significantly worsened situation.engiweirdo wrote: ».....
And if it's a case of companies wanting to go where talent is why am I contacted multiple times a day about "fantastic" opportunities in Dublin? Surely if its overflowing with talent they neednt look toward uninterested outsiders?
They might reckon you'd be interested in bettering yourself. If things are as bad as you make them out to be outside of Dublin etc you can't be enjoying it :pac:
I am currently unemployed in Waterford. I was contacted a few weeks ago by both internal and external recruiters for the same position at a large company in Dublin, all but begged me to interview for them, outlined salary, I said No, they upped it by €3k, I said Id think it over. now I have a young family so would need a 2 bed property minimum, did the maths based on what was available on daft in the area and take home after tax and not even allowing for having to stump up a serious deposit and uproot all our lives, Id be worse off on what was a very generous salary for a graduate in Dublin than unemployed in Waterford. Thats actually sick in fairness. Baffles me why any company could be bothered with the place.
*Note to others, please don't get angry at this, I'm only being facetious... He seems to think he's entitled to a well paid job in his chosen profession wherever he likes. I certainly wasn't able to support a family on my graduate salary... Urban or rural...
Yeah thats the takeaway alright. Maybe there wouldnt need to be so much "investment" in social welfare payments for (define rural Ireland, last time I checked this was the 5th largest urban area in the state) if there was proper diversification of employment rather than saturation of Dublin and Cork only.
I mean its the easy play though right, dont want to move your family into a mouldy Celtic Tiger era apartment for €2k a month? Scrounger obviously. Not that spatial development strategy is horribly broken and needs drastically overhauling.0 -
You suggest you are a graduate, can you explain why you chose a career path that was not viable in your chosen location?engiweirdo wrote: »
You say the government isn't investing in rural Ireland, but then tell us that they are investing so much in you that you can ignore a job offer...engiweirdo wrote: »
The point is though it's not bettering yourself with the state of the property market in Dublin. I would be entering a significantly worsened situation.engiweirdo wrote: ».....
And if it's a case of companies wanting to go where talent is why am I contacted multiple times a day about "fantastic" opportunities in Dublin? Surely if its overflowing with talent they neednt look toward uninterested outsiders?
They might reckon you'd be interested in bettering yourself. If things are as bad as you make them out to be outside of Dublin etc you can't be enjoying it :pac:
I am currently unemployed in Waterford. I was contacted a few weeks ago by both internal and external recruiters for the same position at a large company in Dublin, all but begged me to interview for them, outlined salary, I said No, they upped it by €3k, I said Id think it over. now I have a young family so would need a 2 bed property minimum, did the maths based on what was available on daft in the area and take home after tax and not even allowing for having to stump up a serious deposit and uproot all our lives, Id be worse off on what was a very generous salary for a graduate in Dublin than unemployed in Waterford. Thats actually sick in fairness. Baffles me why any company could be bothered with the place.
*Note to others, please don't get angry at this, I'm only being facetious... He seems to think he's entitled to a well paid job in his chosen profession wherever he likes. I certainly wasn't able to support a family on my graduate salary... Urban or rural...
Yeah thats the takeaway alright. Maybe there wouldnt need to be so much "investment" in social welfare payments for (define rural Ireland, last time I checked this was the 5th largest urban area in the state) if there was proper diversification of employment rather than saturation of Dublin and Cork only.
I mean its the easy play though right, dont want to move your family into a mouldy Celtic Tiger era apartment for €2k a month? Scrounger obviously. Not that spatial development strategy is horribly broken and needs drastically overhauling.0 -
You are not alone. I'm unemployed also, in an ideal world I would move to Dublin but like you I can't due to family reasons and I can't afford the rents anyway.engiweirdo wrote: »The point is though it's not bettering yourself with the state of the property market in Dublin. I would be entering a significantly worsened situation.
I am currently unemployed in Waterford. I was contacted a few weeks ago by both internal and external recruiters for the same position at a large company in Dublin, all but begged me to interview for them, outlined salary, I said No, they upped it by €3k, I said Id think it over. now I have a young family so would need a 2 bed property minimum, did the maths based on what was available on daft in the area and take home after tax and not even allowing for having to stump up a serious deposit and uproot all our lives, Id be worse off on what was a very generous salary for a graduate in Dublin than unemployed in Waterford. Thats actually sick in fairness. Baffles me why any company could be bothered with the place.
Once you count the Jobpath etc figures there is major unemployment out there in many areas. Total employment is laughable there are around 70k on Jobpath not on the Live Register. Jobpath is a 10 minute meeting once a month.0 -
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engiweirdo wrote: »The point is though it's not bettering yourself with the state of the property market in Dublin. I would be entering a significantly worsened situation.
I am currently unemployed in Waterford. I was contacted a few weeks ago by both internal and external recruiters for the same position at a large company in Dublin, all but begged me to interview for them, outlined salary, I said No, they upped it by €3k, I said Id think it over. now I have a young family so would need a 2 bed property minimum, did the maths based on what was available on daft in the area and take home after tax and not even allowing for having to stump up a serious deposit and uproot all our lives, Id be worse off on what was a very generous salary for a graduate in Dublin than unemployed in Waterford. Thats actually sick in fairness. Baffles me why any company could be bothered with the place.
I don't know about your industry but usually graduate salaries increase pretty heftily for the first couple of years. Not to mention, if you stay unemployed for too long, you drastically reduce the chance of getting employment in that field as newer graduates have more recent experience from college.0 -
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Why on earth would a multi national company set up anything in waterford?
A "city" of 50,000 people.0 -
How do you gauge viability 4 years into the future? I graduated from a class of 12 in a city of 50,000 people in Mech/Manufacturing Engineering, I had previous experience in manufacturing I also undertook learning Application Development and Java to try gain an extra skill, there is manufacturing here but as Ive seen post graduation the companies we have are not quite as on the ball with R&D and not expanding like elsewhere and we arent getting new ones like elsewhere. Its not like its a hotbed for any other industry either. I took a punt on the most viable option and it failed largely because while the other 4 cities thrived, Waterford stood still and stagnated, again thanks to being completely ignored by the IDA. Was it hugely optimistic/foolish to expect progression in line with pretty much every other major urban area in Ireland? Apparently so.
You suggest you are a graduate, can you explain why you chose a career path that was not viable in your chosen location?engiweirdo wrote: »
You say the government isn't investing in rural Ireland, but then tell us that they are investing so much in you that you can ignore a job offer...engiweirdo wrote: »
The point is though it's not bettering yourself with the state of the property market in Dublin. I would be entering a significantly worsened situation.engiweirdo wrote: ».....
And if it's a case of companies wanting to go where talent is why am I contacted multiple times a day about "fantastic" opportunities in Dublin? Surely if its overflowing with talent they neednt look toward uninterested outsiders?
They might reckon you'd be interested in bettering yourself. If things are as bad as you make them out to be outside of Dublin etc you can't be enjoying it :pac:
I am currently unemployed in Waterford. I was contacted a few weeks ago by both internal and external recruiters for the same position at a large company in Dublin, all but begged me to interview for them, outlined salary, I said No, they upped it by €3k, I said Id think it over. now I have a young family so would need a 2 bed property minimum, did the maths based on what was available on daft in the area and take home after tax and not even allowing for having to stump up a serious deposit and uproot all our lives, Id be worse off on what was a very generous salary for a graduate in Dublin than unemployed in Waterford. Thats actually sick in fairness. Baffles me why any company could be bothered with the place.
*Note to others, please don't get angry at this, I'm only being facetious... He seems to think he's entitled to a well paid job in his chosen profession wherever he likes. I certainly wasn't able to support a family on my graduate salary... Urban or rural...
Yeah thats the takeaway alright. Maybe there wouldnt need to be so much "investment" in social welfare payments for (define rural Ireland, last time I checked this was the 5th largest urban area in the state) if there was proper diversification of employment rather than saturation of Dublin and Cork only.
I mean its the easy play though right, dont want to move your family into a mouldy Celtic Tiger era apartment for €2k a month? Scrounger obviously. Not that spatial development strategy is horribly broken and needs drastically overhauling.0 -
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That does seem unfortunate... I will reaffirm my previous comment however, that the people of Waterford can improve its attractiveness to businesses... Via, hospitality, leisure, retail, lifestyle... If a business sees a place that is miserable, with miserable people and no outward expression of industry, it's not going to be very attractive, IDA or not.engiweirdo wrote: »
How do you gauge viability 4 years into the future? I graduated from a class of 12 in a city of 50,000 people in Mech/Manufacturing Engineering, I had previous experience in manufacturing I also undertook learning Application Development and Java to try gain an extra skill, there is manufacturing here but as Ive seen post graduation the companies we have are not quite as on the ball with R&D and not expanding like elsewhere and we arent getting new ones like elsewhere. Its not like its a hotbed for any other industry either. I took a punt on the most viable option and it failed largely because while the other 4 cities thrived, Waterford stood still and stagnated, again thanks to being completely ignored by the IDA. Was it hugely optimistic/foolish to expect progression in line with pretty much every other major urban area in Ireland? Apparently so.
You suggest you are a graduate, can you explain why you chose a career path that was not viable in your chosen location?engiweirdo wrote: »
You say the government isn't investing in rural Ireland, but then tell us that they are investing so much in you that you can ignore a job offer...engiweirdo wrote: »
The point is though it's not bettering yourself with the state of the property market in Dublin. I would be entering a significantly worsened situation.engiweirdo wrote: ».....
And if it's a case of companies wanting to go where talent is why am I contacted multiple times a day about "fantastic" opportunities in Dublin? Surely if its overflowing with talent they neednt look toward uninterested outsiders?
They might reckon you'd be interested in bettering yourself. If things are as bad as you make them out to be outside of Dublin etc you can't be enjoying it :pac:
I am currently unemployed in Waterford. I was contacted a few weeks ago by both internal and external recruiters for the same position at a large company in Dublin, all but begged me to interview for them, outlined salary, I said No, they upped it by €3k, I said Id think it over. now I have a young family so would need a 2 bed property minimum, did the maths based on what was available on daft in the area and take home after tax and not even allowing for having to stump up a serious deposit and uproot all our lives, Id be worse off on what was a very generous salary for a graduate in Dublin than unemployed in Waterford. Thats actually sick in fairness. Baffles me why any company could be bothered with the place.
*Note to others, please don't get angry at this, I'm only being facetious... He seems to think he's entitled to a well paid job in his chosen profession wherever he likes. I certainly wasn't able to support a family on my graduate salary... Urban or rural...
Yeah thats the takeaway alright. Maybe there wouldnt need to be so much "investment" in social welfare payments for (define rural Ireland, last time I checked this was the 5th largest urban area in the state) if there was proper diversification of employment rather than saturation of Dublin and Cork only.
I mean its the easy play though right, dont want to move your family into a mouldy Celtic Tiger era apartment for €2k a month? Scrounger obviously. Not that spatial development strategy is horribly broken and needs drastically overhauling.
Haven't been to the city recently, but dungarvin is a great example of a rural town, small businesses, great hospitality, new leisure facilities such as the greenway, it even has a large scooter club... I took a tour of one of the local factories and was very impressed... While it was small in scale, that's how all microeconomies begin.0 -
KevinCavan wrote: »One notable problem is say a couple on a combined €100,000 per year salary, can’t borrow more than say €370,000. €100,000 is a good combined salary of two average professionals. If the average 3 bed semi becomes €450,000 in Dublin, who is going to buy them?
Is that not what I said? That's why the rise has stopped, hopefully starts falling slowly to about 10% lower than now.
A 3 bed semi in "Clonsilla" is on average 320k now, probably only worth 280k and in my opinion will sell for that soon, but won't go further IMO. Maybe the 3 bed semi you want is 450k??
The problem is the deposit first time buyers and people in negative equity are expected to pay. It's ok for 2nd time buyers with equity obviously.0 -
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First time buyers only need to save 10% + bills and are encouraged to buy in the west of the city (I am talking about Dublin specifically)... If they manage to build up any equity they'll have the ability to look inside the M50... A three bed semi in clonsilla was 320k 15 years ago, when I was considering a house there... So not much has changed really except earning power has increased significantly.0
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First time buyers only need to save 10% + bills and are encouraged to buy in the west of the city (I am talking about Dublin specifically)... If they manage to build up any equity they'll have the ability to look inside the M50... A three bed semi in clonsilla was 320k 15 years ago, when I was considering a house there... So not much has changed really except earning power has increased significantly.
Yes. I agree. I think people want to see the three bed house in Clonsilla seeling for 180k. Without thinking of the scale of recession that would lead to this.
Right now you can buy inside the M50 for a good price, Finglas for example would be affordable. Invest close to the city. Cabra is now a very sought after address, it wasn't 20 years ago. Unfortunately your ma's estate in clontarf isn't working class anymore.
Take a look at London, no go areas of the past now million pound properties. City living ain't cheap.0 -
Dublin cannot be compared to London the difference in size and population is ridiculous, London has more people than all of Ireland. Nor would I want Dublin to morph into London either.0
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engiweirdo wrote: »They probably are offering them to a hundred other people (if they can find them) I thought the bustling metropolis was supposed to cure their hiring problems though not cause them. But sure cram a few more in. Bus in more talent to pay €800 a month to share a bedroom out of your princely €30k salary in the hope of one day owning your own shoebox, maybe you could afford a child in your mid 40s. Keep the recovery going ya know.
And IDA visit numbers speak for themselves. The In Dublin Always only show companies regional sites as an afterthought.
Are we talking about why companies want to locate in Dublin, or why you don't?
The cost of living is high here, I can completely understand not wanting to relocate. And it is an issue for companies because it drives up salaries. But Dublin is still where you find high numbers of skilled employees.
(The IDA numbers don't speak for themselves because they don't show the requirements companies bring to the table)0 -
Redneck Culchie wrote: »Wasn't Waterford earmarked as a city that will increase population and employment in the Fine Gael 2040 plan?
Although just more government lies as usual
Got it in one. Lies from fg.
Waterford has great plans and potential to be a great city to live in but is hamstrung by Ida/government incompetence.
Have many friends Stuck in Dublin who would give anything to get out of there. They all hate the place and would do anything to get a job at home and try to buy a house. At the moment they are all paying crazy rents.
I'd say a lot of people from other rural areas would be the same.
This govt aren't delivering for these people.0 -
Anyone who has the pleasure of going through Castlemartyr and Killeagh in the morning knows most of those people in Dungarvan are commuting to Little Island, Cork each morningHaven't been to the city recently, but dungarvin is a great example of a rural town, small businesses, great hospitality, new leisure facilities such as the greenway, it even has a large scooter club... I took a tour of one of the local factories and was very impressed... While it was small in scale, that's how all microeconomies begin.0 -
Sorry guys... but Waterford is not attractive to large international businesses... What makes Dublin attractive is that there are people with different skills from all over ireland and the world there... Waterford cannot attract the talent. Even if a large multinational was to locate to waterford & miracuously finds a CEO, CFO, Marketing team, suitable accountants with experience in international dealing, engineeers, World class IT people all living there and wanting to work for them... what happens if one of those people leave? what pool are the going to pluck someone from? Its not viable. That is unfortunate, but reality. You're gonna have to accept it eventually...
If there are so many skilled and experienced people from waterford dying to go back, why don't they band together and develop suitable businesses and pool all of their talent? Sounds like you have everything you need... Homegrown business rather than expecting something thats not viable to land.0 -
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I think the best thing for smaller urban areas to do is not to try and attract thousands of jobs from a Facebook/Apple/Google type company. Instead they should try and attract smaller operations with around 100 people or less. This is a hell of a lot easier to cater for and for employers to find/attract suitable employees. It gives people in the area or who attend the local IT/university somewhere to work after they finish college, that doesn't involve moving to Dublin,Cork,etc. Not to mention if one of these companies goes under or closes shop it won't be anywhere near as devastating to the town/city as it would if it was a company employing thousands.0 -
Sorry guys... but Waterford is not attractive to large international businesses... What makes Dublin attractive is that there are people with different skills from all over ireland and the world there... Waterford cannot attract the talent. Even if a large multinational was to locate to waterford & miracuously finds a CEO, CFO, Marketing team, suitable accountants with experience in international dealing, engineeers, World class IT people all living there and wanting to work for them... what happens if one of those people leave? what pool are the going to pluck someone from? Its not viable. That is unfortunate, but reality. You're gonna have to accept it eventually...
If there are so many skilled and experienced people from waterford dying to go back, why don't they band together and develop suitable businesses and pool all of their talent? Sounds like you have everything you need... Homegrown business rather than expecting something thats not viable to land.
Unfortunately this is the attitude prevalent in FG/government/IDA circles too. Pure arrogance. Someone compared Dublin to London, someone else mentioned New York, talk about notions ffs. What's really at stake is if the "culchies" are offered a realistic chance to return home, the arse would well and truly fall out of the Dublin "global city" scam.0 -
engiweirdo wrote: »Unfortunately this is the attitude prevalent in FG/government/IDA circles too. Pure arrogance. Someone compared Dublin to London, someone else mentioned New York, talk about notions ffs. What's really at stake is if the "culchies" are offered a realistic chance to return home, the arse would well and truly fall out of the Dublin "global city" scam.
The chip on your shoulder is interfering with your vision0 -
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engiweirdo wrote: »Unfortunately this is the attitude prevalent in FG/government/IDA circles too. Pure arrogance. Someone compared Dublin to London, someone else mentioned New York, talk about notions ffs. What's really at stake is if the "culchies" are offered a realistic chance to return home, the arse would well and truly fall out of the Dublin "global city" scam.
Ask yourself what can Dublin offer to a multi-national company that Waterford can't. If you begin to answer that question honestly, you'll realise it's not arrogance but prudence as to why businesses favour Dublin.0 -
Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 35,056 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Join Date:Posts: 33497
engiweirdo wrote: »Unfortunately this is the attitude prevalent in FG/government/IDA circles too. Pure arrogance. Someone compared Dublin to London, someone else mentioned New York, talk about notions ffs. What's really at stake is if the "culchies" are offered a realistic chance to return home, the arse would well and truly fall out of the Dublin "global city" scam.
It really wouldn't. Plus, not all the culchies would move back even if there was a realistic chance to return home. Dublin has plenty of advantages over their home town (disadvantages too of course) so a lot would still stay in Dublin0 -
engiweirdo wrote: »Unfortunately this is the attitude prevalent in FG/government/IDA circles too. Pure arrogance. Someone compared Dublin to London, someone else mentioned New York, talk about notions ffs. What's really at stake is if the "culchies" are offered a realistic chance to return home, the arse would well and truly fall out of the Dublin "global city" scam.
I think you'll find a lot of people in London & NY are from elsewhere & if similar jobs were at home they'd return. Does that preclude them from being global cities too?0 -
engiweirdo wrote: »Unfortunately this is the attitude prevalent in FG/government/IDA circles too. Pure arrogance. Someone compared Dublin to London, someone else mentioned New York, talk about notions ffs. What's really at stake is if the "culchies" are offered a realistic chance to return home, the arse would well and truly fall out of the Dublin "global city" scam.
Hmmm, Waterford doesn't seem to feature on this list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Globalization_and_World_Cities_Research_Network#Alpha_%E2%88%92
Dublin is considered an Alpha World City by International organisations. These sorts of studies would be important for corporations in choosing where to locate. Most will never have heard of Waterford.0 -
Yearning so much for a property crash of 30%. Would love it.
Don't think it'll happen though.0 -
Pussyhands wrote: »Yearning so much for a property crash of 30%. Would love it.
Don't think it'll happen though.
It could happen. The problem is there is a queue of people like yourself lying in wait, so demand at the new (lower) price level would be crazy. Especially with the insane money being charged for rental properties. The dip wouldn't last long.0 -
Pussyhands wrote: »Yearning so much for a property crash of 30%. Would love it.
Don't think it'll happen though.
I wish the thing I want was 30 percent cheaper but in isolation from everything else0 -
Don't think anyone is suggesting Facebook, Google etc move to small towns. I think that is just a straw man from Dubs intent continuing their one city state mentality.AlmightyCushion wrote: »I think the best thing for smaller urban areas to do is not to try and attract thousands of jobs from a Facebook/Apple/Google type company. Instead they should try and attract smaller operations with around 100 people or less. This is a hell of a lot easier to cater for and for employers to find/attract suitable employees. It gives people in the area or who attend the local IT/university somewhere to work after they finish college, that doesn't involve moving to Dublin,Cork,etc. Not to mention if one of these companies goes under or closes shop it won't be anywhere near as devastating to the town/city as it would if it was a company employing thousands.
I would prefer if people were just honest in their opinions, they only care about Dublin thriving. If 80% of the rest of the country burned down they would barely notice. In that sense it is very similar to the London vs England mentality.0 -
Imagine comparing Dublin to New York or London. Another planet the Dubs live on. I would love if the American MNC's piss off to somewhere with cheaper tax. Their pathetic house of cards would collapse.engiweirdo wrote: »Unfortunately this is the attitude prevalent in FG/government/IDA circles too. Pure arrogance. Someone compared Dublin to London, someone else mentioned New York, talk about notions ffs. What's really at stake is if the "culchies" are offered a realistic chance to return home, the arse would well and truly fall out of the Dublin "global city" scam.0 -
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Redneck Culchie wrote: »I think that is just a straw man from Dubs intent continuing their one city state mentality.
I think it's well covered that it's not just Dublin... It's Dublin, Cork, Galway, Limerick, Sligo... but everytime someone mentions that they are ignored... Dublin is however an international city, cosomopolitan, attractive to foreign labour, attractive to multinationals... I don't know why there is so much bitterness, it's just a fact.0
This discussion has been closed.
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