Munster V Leinster Build up Thread

Well lads, this should be a turnip for the boks.

Expect a fresh Munster to have too much at home for a primarily academy team venturing south. It's going to be wet too and with the prospect of muck the savages will undoubtedly be feeling confident.

Provided Munster can keep their coaching ticket in place until kick off I'd expect a dominant first half from the local(s) and with Leinsters bench comprising mostly of players we'd be willing to let move to Ulster, it's hard to see where the impact will come from.

Anyway, have at it lads and be nice, It's Christmas!

shootermacg

Deleted User wrote: »

Well lads, this should be a turnip for the boks.

Expect a fresh Munster to have too much at home for a primarily academy team venturing south. It's going to be wet too and with the prospect of muck the savages will undoubtedly be feeling confident.

Provided Munster can keep their coaching ticket in place until kick off I'd expect a dominant first half from the local(s) and with Leinsters bench comprising mostly of players we'd be willing to let move to Ulster, it's hard to see where the impact will come from.

Anyway, have at it lads and be nice, It's Christmas!

Our very own Franno by the looks of things.

Burkie1203

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Well lads, this should be a turnip for the boks.

Expect a fresh Munster to have too much at home for a primarily academy team venturing south. It's going to be wet too and with the prospect of muck the savages will undoubtedly be feeling confident.

Provided Munster can keep their coaching ticket in place until kick off I'd expect a dominant first half from the local(s) and with Leinsters bench comprising mostly of players we'd be willing to let move to Ulster, it's hard to see where the impact will come from.

Anyway, have at it lads and be nice, It's Christmas!

Best preview thread. Ever.

Serbian

It’s frustrating that this fixture has become a bit of a farce for the second season in a row. This used to be a game that was fiercely contested between two good teams, but Leinster have decided to send mostly second and third+ choice players this time around again.

You can’t really blame them, the divisions in the Pro14 are largely already decided, realistically there’s very little for either team to play for at this point.

I’d expect Leinster will be competitive but comfortable win is on the cards for Munster again here.

ScrubsfanChris

Serbian wrote: »

It’s frustrating that this fixture has become a bit of a farce for the second season in a row. This used to be a game that was fiercely contested between two good teams, but Leinster have decided to send mostly second and third+ choice players this time around again.

You can’t really blame them, the divisions in the Pro14 are largely already decided, realistically there’s very little for either team to play for at this point.

Fully expect Munster to send a weakened team to Belfast the week after and target the Connacht game again.
This looks like the norm for the foreseeable future

Akrasia

As long as we're competitive in Europe, the Christmas interpros will be all about player management

Former Former

There's another interpro six days after.

If you want Leinster to go full strength here, it means sending the seconds out at home against Ulster.

sydthebeat

Serbian wrote: »

It’s frustrating that this fixture has become a bit of a farce for the second season in a row. This used to be a game that was fiercely contested between two good teams, but Leinster have decided to send mostly second and third+ choice players this time around again.

You can’t really blame them, the divisions in the Pro14 are largely already decided, realistically there’s very little for either team to play for at this point.

I’d expect Leinster will be competitive but comfortable win is on the cards for Munster again here.

Second season?? It's about the best fifth or sixth season that it's a glorified seconds game.

Actually this year is much better than previous years, selection wise.

pickarooney

Surely that's as strong a Leinster side as could reasonably be expected?

CIARAN_BOYLE

sydthebeat wrote: »

Second season?? It's about the best fifth or sixth season that it's a glorified seconds game.

Actually this year is much better than previous years, selection wise.

Leinster Munster used to be kept apart at Chirstmas. There would be a full tilt match in the Aviva before the first European game and a full tilt game before the European quarter final.

shootermacg

Serbian wrote: »

It’s frustrating that this fixture has become a bit of a farce for the second season in a row. This used to be a game that was fiercely contested between two good teams, but Leinster have decided to send mostly second and third+ choice players this time around again.

You can’t really blame them, the divisions in the Pro14 are largely already decided, realistically there’s very little for either team to play for at this point.

I’d expect Leinster will be competitive but comfortable win is on the cards for Munster again here.

I totally agree, it's disrespectful to the fans who pay a lot of money to support the home games. I understand the why of it, but it still doesn't make it right.

This is the second year Leo has sent down a second string, and this second string is actually worse than last year. It will stand to Leinster's seconds to get taste of a derby, but he's killing what was once a highlight of the season.

swiwi_

That Leinster side looks decent enough to me. Based on some of the posts I was expecting a bunch of complete no-names.

“Turnip for the boks” I chuckled...

Burkie1203

shootermacg wrote: »

I totally agree, it's disrespectful to the fans who pay a lot of money to support the home games. I understand the why of it, but it still doesn't make it right.

This is the second year Leo has sent down a second string, and this second string is actually worse than last year. It will stand to Leinster's seconds to get taste of a derby, but he's killing what was once a highlight of the season.

Leo is not responsible for this. Blaming him is wrong. He has to take games in blocks and plan accordingly. He can only plan with the fixtures how they fall and cannot put the first xv out every week

irishbucsfan

Burkie1203 wrote: »

Leo is not responsible for this. Blaming him is wrong. He has to take games in blocks and plan accordingly. He can only plan with the fixtures how they fall and cannot put the first xv out every week

Correct. The IRFU have decided that sticking all these interpros together suits them, because it removes some of the most intense fixtures from the league calendar. It's all about risk management.

But hopefully Martin Anayi will put a stop to it and they'll all cop on and give the league a bit more respect.

MugMugs

shootermacg wrote: »

I totally agree, it's disrespectful to the fans who pay a lot of money to support the home games. I understand the why of it, but it still doesn't make it right.

This is the second year Leo has sent down a second string, and this second string is actually worse than last year. It will stand to Leinster's seconds to get taste of a derby, but he's killing what was once a highlight of the season.

Christ I truly hope our disrespect throttle you lot

To think that that team is unable to turn over that Munster side is incredibly short sighted.

irishbucsfan

MugMugs wrote: »

Christ I truly hope our disrespect throttle you lot

To think that that team is unable to turn over that Munster side is incredibly short sighted.

There's a difference between 'this team has absolutely no hope of ever winning a game' and 'this is a weakened team in what used to be one of the best fixtures in European league rugby'

MugMugs

irishbucsfan wrote: »

There's a difference between 'this team has absolutely no hope of ever winning a game' and 'this is a weakened team in what used to be one of the best fixtures in European league rugby'

To state its disrespectful is incredibly disrespectful to the players making the run to Limerick. 13 of whom are Irish internationals. You sound like Tony Ward

Fortune favours the brave etc etc etc.

shootermacg

MugMugs wrote: »

To state its disrespectful is incredibly disrespectful to the players making the run to Limerick. 13 of whom are Irish internationals. You sound like Tony Ward

Fortune favours the brave etc etc etc.

No, you can blame their manager for the fact that most of them don't get to play in first team. After all he picks the team.

irishbucsfan

MugMugs wrote: »

To state its disrespectful is incredibly disrespectful to the players making the run to Limerick. 13 of whom are Irish internationals. You sound like Tony Ward

Fortune favours the brave etc etc etc.

I completely disagree that it's disrespectful to call 2nd choice players what they are, which is 2nd choice. Noone is saying they're rubbish, they're just stating the facts.

Former Former

We all knew this was going to happen.

We all know why it has to happen.

Could we not just get on with it?

irishbucsfan

Former Former wrote: »

We all knew this was going to happen.

We all know why it has to happen.

Could we not just get on with it?

So... let's all just shut up and keep the discussion away from discussion boards?

MugMugs

irishbucsfan wrote: »

So... let's all just shut up and keep the discussion away from discussion boards?

Or just enjoy the game you'll be given..... That works too......

Former Former

irishbucsfan wrote: »

So... let's all just shut up and keep the discussion away from discussion boards?

Now you're on the trolley!

shootermacg

Former Former wrote: »

We all knew this was going to happen.

We all know why it has to happen.

Could we not just get on with it?

Quickly! Someone rename the thread!!!

irishbucsfan

MugMugs wrote: »

Or just enjoy the game you'll be given..... That works too......

I will enjoy the game. I love watching Ryan and Larmour play.

And I'll also point out that we've lost what used to be a major event from the Irish rugby calendar, due to the fixture being intentionally sidelined.

I am capable of doing both. You don't have to if you don't want to.

Former Former

It's just we might as well be complaining that it's cold and wet in December. It's just the way of it.

irishbucsfan

Former Former wrote: »

It's just we might as well be complaining that it's cold and wet in December. It's just the way of it.

Maybe if it had gone from being warm and balmy a few years ago to being cold and wet in December due to a decision by Met Eireann, and if that was the case I'd probably complain about it as well.

shootermacg

Former Former wrote: »

It's just we might as well be complaining that it's cold and wet in December. It's just the way of it.

How long have you been visiting the match threads now FF? Lets just put it this way... The first rule of MatchThreadClub is, you pile on the bile and then they pile on the bile and soon you have a nice cesspit of bile built up. Take the Frannoesque opener, it's a concentration of the first rule of MatchThreadClub.

Former Former

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Maybe if it had gone from being warm and balmy a few years ago to being cold and wet in December due to a decision by Met Eireann, and if that was the case I'd probably complain about it as well.

I guess the question is why should Munster v Leinster be a sacred cow and the other interpros be treated as lesser fixtures?

Because that's basically what this whole thing boils down to.

MugMugs

Former Former wrote: »

It's just we might as well be complaining that it's cold and wet in December. It's just the way of it.

Quite mild actually :pac:

irishbucsfan

Former Former wrote: »

I guess the question is why should Munster v Leinster be a sacred cow and the other interpros be treated as lesser fixtures?

Because that's basically what this whole thing boils down to.

You're right, it shouldn't be in an ideal world, and all the interpros should be played at a time when full sides can be put out (or at least 4 of them on the weekends leading into Europe). But at the very least we could get back to where we were.

Former Former

shootermacg wrote: »

How long have you been visiting the match threads now FF? Lets just put it this way... The first rule of MatchThreadClub is, you pile on the bile and then they pile on the bile and soon you have a nice cesspit of bile built up. Take the Frannoesque opener, it's a concentration of the first rule of MatchThreadClub.

You're dead right.

In fact, we could pick the same XV, only invert it so that Jordan Larmour was playing loosehead and Michael Bent at outside centre, and we'd still wipe the floor with yiz.

Jump_In_Jack

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Noone is saying they're rubbish, they're just stating the facts.

Use "nobody" or "no one"
Noone is a surname

thomond2006

Munster:
Andrew Conway; Darren Sweetnam, Sammy Arnold, Rory Scannell, Keith Earls; Ian Keatley, Conor Murray;
Dave Kilcoyne, Rhys Marshall, Stephen Archer; Jean Kleyn, Billy Holland; Peter O’Mahony (c), Tommy O’Donnell, CJ Stander.

Replacements: Niall Scannell, James Cronin, John Ryan, Darren O’Shea, Jack O’Donoghue, Duncan Williams, JJ Hanrahan, Simon Zebo.

Tough on Alex Wootton to miss out but it shows the depth Munster have in the back 3. Kevin O'Byrne is also unlucky. We may have a battle for the hooker jersey between Marshall and Scannell over the next few games.

shootermacg

thomond2006 wrote: »

Munster:
Andrew Conway; Darren Sweetnam, Sammy Arnold, Rory Scannell, Keith Earls; Ian Keatley, Conor Murray;
Dave Kilcoyne, Rhys Marshall, Stephen Archer; Jean Kleyn, Billy Holland; Peter O’Mahony (c), Tommy O’Donnell, CJ Stander.

Replacements: Niall Scannell, James Cronin, John Ryan, Darren O’Shea, Jack O’Donoghue, Duncan Williams, JJ Hanrahan, Simon Zebo.

Tough on Alex Wootton to miss out but it shows the depth Munster have in the back 3. Kevin O'Byrne is also unlucky. We may have a battle for the hooker jersey between Marshall and Scannell over the next few games.

Given the team that Leinster are fielding, I'd have rested / benched CJ, PoM, Kleyn, Archer, Marshall, (if possible)Killer. Given the amount of injuries Munster has had, I would say our second string is now a better team that Leinster's.

thomond2006

shootermacg wrote: »

Given the team that Leinster are fielding, I'd have rested / benched CJ, PoM, Kleyn, Archer, Marshall, (if possible)Killer. Given the amount of injuries Munster has had, I would say our second string is now a better team that Leinster's.

I don't think it's a good look to rest too many for a home interpro vs Leinster.

shootermacg

thomond2006 wrote: »

I don't think it's a good look to rest too many for a home interpro vs Leinster.

Well, we really cannot afford injuries, so why play our first choice front row. John Ryan needs some game time under his belt, why risk Marshall or Killer?

Likewise we'll be sick if CJ or PoM picks up an injury. Kleyn should be wrapped in cotton wool for Europe, until he proves to be more durable.

Copeland and JoD are OK to start against this team IMO.

thomond2006

shootermacg wrote: »

Well, we really cannot afford injuries, so why play our first choice front row. John Ryan needs some game time under his belt, why risk Marshall or Killer?

Likewise we'll be sick if CJ or PoM picks up an injury. Kleyn should be wrapped in cotton wool for Europe, until he proves to be more durable.

Copeland and JoD are OK to start against this team IMO.

All fair points. Ultimately though Munster are charging European game prices for this and there would be backlash if a weakened side was sent out. If anything the person who needs a rest is Billy Holland. He's started every game this season and been an iron man when Munster desperately needed it.

On LH, Brian Scott got a decent runout last week and with the long turnaround I think we're ok to go with Kilcoyne again. Cronin and John Ryan will start in Belfast. Marshall is cleared from concussion so I don't see the issue starting him.

shootermacg

thomond2006 wrote: »

All fair points. Ultimately though Munster are charging European game prices for this and there would be backlash if a weakened side was sent out.

If anything the person who needs a rest is Holland. He's started every game this season.

On LH, Brian Scott got a decent runout last week and with the long turnaround I think we're ok to go with Kilcoyne again. Cronin and John Ryan will start in Belfast.

I totally agree about Holland, he's a victim of that wolverine blood, one of the most under rated players in Irish rugby. But given our lack of options at second row I'd see him as a huge leader. Copeland can play second row and does relatively OK there when I've seen him, we are really missing a player like Dave o'Callaghan who plays well at 6 / 5.

I suppose the Munster coaching staff want to see how our full lineout goes against Toner.

Absolutely disgusted by what I've seen in this thread. The accusations against Odo and the 'nicest person alive'TM are completely unreasonable.

Honestly, people saying that Leinster are about to get a lesson are completely correct. That's why we've sent the kids, so they can learn from the best.

The severe hiding they are about to get is secondary. I mean I wouldn't be surprised if we ended up losing 44 - 16 (too soon?) but I'd be happy enough with that if the lads learned to negotiate these kinds of encounters without selling themselves short.

I'd like to see some of our young bucks pick up a few tricks from experienced operators like Stander and O'Mahony. These guys could negotiate a win out of less air than you could fly a kite with.

I always feel like our guys leave too much out on the pitch, and need to hold a bit back for serious encounters against big spending clubs like Montpelier.

These young lads need a solid performance if they ever want to make the big bucks. No point going out there unless they are ready to gamble their future for a serious pay out.

Good day of entertainment on Tuesday though, first the Munster v Leinster match and then the RTE Sports Agent of the year awards straight after. The holiday season really is great.

This disrespect stuff is such a load of entitled nonsense. Munster will send second string sides off to play whoever when it suits them as well.

Having said that I'm a bit disappointed by the Leinster selection, Leinster have won a number of times down in Thomond in the recent past but you're not going to do it with a team like that.

Tim Robbins

Serbian wrote: »

It’s frustrating that this fixture has become a bit of a farce for the second season in a row. This used to be a game that was fiercely contested between two good teams, but Leinster have decided to send mostly second and third+ choice players this time around again.

You can’t really blame them, the divisions in the Pro14 are largely already decided, realistically there’s very little for either team to play for at this point.

I’d expect Leinster will be competitive but comfortable win is on the cards for Munster again here.

Reality is there is very little difference between the top 30 players in Leinster and top 25 in Munster. The difference between this fixture is that it is "want to win" rather than "must win". That means if Larmour who could be the best full back Ireland ever has had in time to come - who knows, makes a mistake in this match, it is not the end of the world. Whereas the most experienced player Kearney is less likely to make a mistake in a tight game, so he is better suited to the "must win" game.

At the same time, if you don't give the likes of Larmour a better test than Zebre you will never know how good he really is. Again, what happens if we have our top two 15's injured in the last game of the VI nations and Larmour plays the 15 for a Grand Slam game.

Is it better that he has experience playing in Thomond park in a Derby match or just Zebre?

pickarooney

Who exactly are the second string players in that team? Bent and possibly Murphy in the pack and Jordi is a seasoned international who should first choice next season.

JGP - clearly behind Luke McGrath but it's not like dropping Aaron Smith for Paul Marshall.

Lowe and Larmour - people have been jizzing themselves in anticipation of seeing these guys take the field.

Is Ringrose injured again? He's maybe the one surprise omission from me if not.

irishbucsfan

pickarooney wrote: »

Who exactly are the second string players in that team? Bent and possibly Murphy in the pack and Jordi is a seasoned international who should first choice next season.

JGP - clearly behind Luke McGrath but it's not like dropping Aaron Smith for Paul Marshall.

Lowe and Larmour - people have been jizzing themselves in anticipation of seeing these guys take the field.

Is Ringrose injured again? He's maybe the one surprise omission from me if not.

Jack McGrath is 2nd choice these days. Bent is potentially 3rd choice. James Ryan is obviously behind Fardy. JvDF is a clear starter. JGP and Byrne obviously miles off the standard of the starters. ROL a long way off Ringrose. Back 3 all changed from Europe.

So basically, almost the entire team.

It’s not a choice by Leinster really, very little else they could do. But no point denying it’s a weakened team and the Thomond fixture has suffered from being moved from April.

pickarooney

pickarooney wrote: »

Who exactly are the second string players in that team? Bent and possibly Murphy in the pack and Jordi is a seasoned international who should first choice next season.

JGP - clearly behind Luke McGrath but it's not like dropping Aaron Smith for Paul Marshall.

Lowe and Larmour - people have been jizzing themselves in anticipation of seeing these guys take the field.

Is Ringrose injured again? He's maybe the one surprise omission from me if not.

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Jack McGrath is 2nd choice these days. Bent is potentially 3rd choice. James Ryan is obviously behind Fardy. JvDF is a clear starter. JGP and Byrne obviously miles off the standard of the starters. ROL a long way off Ringrose. Back 3 all changed from Europe.

So basically, almost the entire team.

It’s not a choice by Leinster really, very little else they could do. But no point denying it’s a weakened team and the Thomond fixture has suffered from being moved from April.

And you're both forgetting the obvious one, I remember reading that Toners day's in green were numbered back in 2012 so surely he has to be almost done at this stage.

irishbucsfan

[Deleted User] wrote: »

And you're both forgetting the obvious one, I remember reading that Toners day's in green were numbered back in 2012 so surely he has to be almost done at this stage.

Well he’s lucky to make this side, if the game was in April it’s be Fardy and Ryan, because Ryan is currently pencilled in to hit The Big Time (tm) during the Ireland England match in March

.ak

thomond2006 wrote: »

Munster:
Andrew Conway; Darren Sweetnam, Sammy Arnold, Rory Scannell, Keith Earls; Ian Keatley, Conor Murray;
Dave Kilcoyne, Rhys Marshall, Stephen Archer; Jean Kleyn, Billy Holland; Peter O’Mahony (c), Tommy O’Donnell, CJ Stander.

Replacements: Niall Scannell, James Cronin, John Ryan, Darren O’Shea, Jack O’Donoghue, Duncan Williams, JJ Hanrahan, Simon Zebo.

A veritable who's who of failed Leinster/Ulster players, Munster turncoats, over-the-hills and southern hemisphere mercenaries.

A gazillion to nill, Leinster.

.ak

.ak wrote: »

A veritable who's who of failed Leinster/Ulster players, Munster turncoats, over-the-hills and southern hemisphere mercenaries.

A gazillion to nill, Leinster.

Ah come off it .ak, no need to be bringing that kind of provincialism to the thread, we've all been getting along so well and you had to go too far as usual.

.ak

Deleted User wrote: »

Ah come off it .ak, no need to be bringing that kind of provincialism to the thread, we've all been getting along so well and you had to go too far as usual.

Sorry, sorry... I really need to learn to reign it in, especially after I heard POM prints off my posts and puts it up on the dressing room wall.

connemara man

.ak wrote: »

Sorry, sorry... I really need to learn to reign it in, especially after I heard POM prints off my posts and puts it up on the dressing room wall.

Apparently the Reggie Corrigan interview with POM is being replayed over and over again in Limerick this week...

pickarooney

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Jack McGrath is 2nd choice these days. Bent is potentially 3rd choice. James Ryan is obviously behind Fardy. JvDF is a clear starter. JGP and Byrne obviously miles off the standard of the starters. ROL a long way off Ringrose. Back 3 all changed from Europe.

So basically, almost the entire team.

It’s not a choice by Leinster really, very little else they could do. But no point denying it’s a weakened team and the Thomond fixture has suffered from being moved from April.

Well, personally I believe selecting a suspended Healy and Sexton on a RTTP would be poor judgement on behalf of the selectors. If we're going to play Fardy in every game how do we lord it over the AP and the Top14 and their slavedriver attitudes to their players?

Are we back to saying Ryan is not the Messiah and Larmour is not the Second Coming but McFadden is the hero we need? I can't keep up with all these twists and turns.

Leavy is surely a use it or lose it option. If he's not good enough for this kid of game he's going to up sticks and be a key player for another team. Not sure we want that.