All quiet on the Korean peninsula, but is Spain about to erupt?

faceman

Not sure how to embed Tweets but this chap sums up the current situation quite well. You will have to click the tweets to see his subsequent discussion points.

https://twitter.com/lukestegemann/status/914625022634762240

Gringo180

Arent Spain one of the very few European member states who dont recognise Kosovo as an independent state?

tonycascarino

Floki wrote: »

Since when did Ireland join the bully boy club? Whatever happened to defender of small nations? We must have evolved upwards from those notions when we joined the club.

Does it surprise you? Varadkar is a complete lick arse but so are those gone before him. If the EU wanted Ireland to kill every firstborn child then the good little Irish would obey.

Floki

Gringo180 wrote: »

Arent Spain one of the very few European member states who dont recognise Kosovo as an independent state?

Yep the Spanish state doesn't recognise Kosovo.

As far as they're concerned it's Serbia.
Tells you all you need to know really about Spain.:rolleyes:

Neon_Lights

Don't Spain only recognise real madrid as the only real football club due to the brown envelopes from King Carlos

Collie D

Neon_Lights wrote: »

Don't Spain only recognise real madrid as the only real football club due to the brown envelopes from King Carlos

Think you're being tongue in cheek but there have been complaints of favouritism towards them all right. I read today that current head of La Liga is a Real Madrid fan who is not shy about showing his allegiances.

Las Palmas added a Spanish flag to their jersey yesterday for their game against Barca which was played behind closed doors

Harry Palmr

The rise of regionalism (be it an actual country like Scotland or a culturally distinct historic region like Catalonia or Cornwall) is a real poser for the EU as well as the nation state, ideally there would be enough freedom within structures to allow everyone to have their head but the ultimate aim of the EU project is to create an entity that is clearly going to be inimical to self-governance.

Nabber

Some shameful behaviour of the police. How a multiple batons to the head is not treated as a murder attempt is beyond me.

Youd have to assume that another attempt to vote, which surely will happen will come with some organisation of the people and there will be plenty more violence perpetrated on both sides.


Spain may see themselves isolated from Europe geographically if the end up with basque and Catalan boarders.

Del.Monte

I haven't read the whole thread, but I'm sure it must have been mentioned that the Spanish government should read the history of the Easter Rising for some tips as to how not to go about these things.

I have little interest in what they do in Spain, but they are more likely to succeed in suppressing this attempted secession through financial and political manoeuvring. However, if the Catalans go on to declare UDI the military will go in and there will be hand-wringing in the EU corridors of power and little else.

faceman

Del.Monte wrote: »

I haven't read the whole thread, but I'm sure it must have been mentioned that the Spanish government should read the history of the Easter Rising for some tips as to how not to go about these things.

I have little interest in what they do in Spain, but they are more likely to succeed in suppressing this attempted secession through financial and political manoeuvring. However, if the Catalans go on to declare UDI the military will go in and there will be hand-wringing in the EU corridors of power and little else.

There are lots of comparisons with 1916 but it’s 2 very very different situations entirely.

seachto7

end of the road wrote: »

why rightly so. 90% of those who voted, voted in favour of independence.

90% according to who and how accurate is the 90%?

Plus you would think those against tye referendum stayed at home and those fanatical enough to want to vote yes risked their own safety to vote yes so 90% is no way accurate.

Vote early and vote often...

bilston

Things had gone quiet in the last day or so (probably due to events in Las Vegas news wise). However the Spanish King has been on TV tonight and from the snippets I've read wasn't particularly conciliatory towards Catalonia.

I've now just got a news alert from the BBC saying that the Catalan leader has announced Catalonia will declare independence in the next couple of days. Interesting times indeed...

Doltanian

bilston wrote: »

Things had gone quiet in the last day or so (probably due to events in Las Vegas news wise). However the Spanish King has been on TV tonight and from the snippets I've read wasn't particularly conciliatory towards Catalonia.

I've now just got a news alert from the BBC saying that the Catalan leader has announced Catalonia will declare independence in the next couple of days. Interesting times indeed...

And so will start the Second Spanish Civil War, the EU battle groups will be sent in to side with the Spanish Crown. I think this is the beginning of something much much bigger and I'd like to see Putin fly a few cargo-plane loads of weapons into Barcelona post haste. They will need them very shortly. I am certainly on the side of the Catalans here and an Independent Catalonia will not be won peacefully.

Gringo180

Doltanian wrote: »

And so will start the Second Spanish Civil War, the EU battle groups will be sent in to side with the Spanish Crown. I think this is the beginning of something much much bigger and I'd like to see Putin fly a few cargo-plane loads of weapons into Barcelona post haste. They will need them very shortly. I am certainly on the side of the Catalans here and an Independent Catalonia will not be won peacefully.

After the thuggish behaviour from the Spanish police I would say most are now on the side of the Catalonians. There was some amount of people out on the streets of Barcelona today in protest. I wonder was there a figure of how many marched?

Harry Palmr

Oh yeah I can see the Catalan's phoning Moscow for arms and it'll be just as likely that Putin would fly them in! :pac:

alchemist33

Doltanian wrote: »

And so will start the Second Spanish Civil War, the EU battle groups will be sent in to side with the Spanish Crown. I think this is the beginning of something much much bigger and I'd like to see Putin fly a few cargo-plane loads of weapons into Barcelona post haste. They will need them very shortly. I am certainly on the side of the Catalans here and an Independent Catalonia will not be won peacefully.

You'd like weapons flown in to fuel a war? What the hell is wrong with you?

Gringo180

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Oh yeah I can see the Catalan's phoning Moscow for arms and it'll be just as likely that Putin would fly them in! :pac:

Better to side with the Catalonians than the Spanish police state :pac:

bilston

Doltanian wrote: »

And so will start the Second Spanish Civil War, the EU battle groups will be sent in to side with the Spanish Crown. I think this is the beginning of something much much bigger and I'd like to see Putin fly a few cargo-plane loads of weapons into Barcelona post haste. They will need them very shortly. I am certainly on the side of the Catalans here and an Independent Catalonia will not be won peacefully.

I've a lot of sympathy for the Catalans after Sunday's shambles but Putin getting actively involved in Western Europe in a NATO country? Nah, that has unmitigated clusterf*** written all over it.

The One Doctor

Probably an ignorant comment, but... I'm wondering if these last few years will be seen by history as the beginning of the end for the EU. And if so, the results will not be pretty.

(I'm pro-EU by the way).

theoneeyedman

Doltanian wrote: »

And so will start the Second Spanish Civil War, the EU battle groups will be sent in to side with the Spanish Crown. I think this is the beginning of something much much bigger and I'd like to see Putin fly a few cargo-plane loads of weapons into Barcelona post haste. They will need them very shortly. I am certainly on the side of the Catalans here and an Independent Catalonia will not be won peacefully.

Can we expect Leo to follow the historical Blueshirts support of the Spanish nationalists, and send troops to support Madrid??

GhostyMcGhost

Gringo180 wrote: »

After the thuggish behaviour from the Spanish police I would say most are now on the side of the Catalonians. There was some amount of people out on the streets of Barcelona today in protest. I wonder was there a figure of how many marched?

700k says RTE (also same figure on RT)

Danzy

Who knows what will happen but the only thing i'm certain of is that if Madrid can find a new and innovative way to **** the situation up for itself it will push hard on it.

It could end with bodies on the street yet.

Floki

bilston wrote: »

Things had gone quiet in the last day or so (probably due to events in Las Vegas news wise). However the Spanish King has been on TV tonight and from the snippets I've read wasn't particularly conciliatory towards Catalonia.

I've now just got a news alert from the BBC saying that the Catalan leader has announced Catalonia will declare independence in the next couple of days. Interesting times indeed...

They had to declare independence.
This is the only chance they've got to do it and couldn't let it slip by when they've got some sympathy for them from around the world.
Any more aggression from Spain now will make them look even worse than they've been already.
I'm not sure they're going to get any support from Eu governments though.
Maybe private parties will travel to Catalonia on their own bat from all over Europe and the world? Haven't a clue what will happen.
There's no point negotiating if you have no power though.

Back to the Future on this one.

Edit: Probably banking on the UN stepping in.:pac:

A Little Pony

I thought they should have had the vote and allowed to vote. But Rajoy has declared it an illegal vote, it's illegal in law and so it looks like war. Rajoy will have to take military action now and crush the rebellion.

A Little Pony

The One Doctor wrote: »

Probably an ignorant comment, but... I'm wondering if these last few years will be seen by history as the beginning of the end for the EU. And if so, the results will not be pretty.

(I'm pro-EU by the way).

Absolutely. Brexit was the end of the EU. Said it at the time.

Gringo180

A Little Pony wrote: »

I thought they should have had the vote and allowed to vote. But Rajoy has declared it an illegal vote, it's illegal in law and so it looks like war. Rajoy will have to take military action now and crush the rebellion.

As in kill innocent civilians who want to vote/or gain independence? This is Spain not Saudi Arabia.

A Little Pony

Gringo180 wrote: »

A Little Pony wrote: »

I thought they should have had the vote and allowed to vote. But Rajoy has declared it an illegal vote, it's illegal in law and so it looks like war. Rajoy will have to take military action now and crush the rebellion.

As in kill innocent civilians who want to vote/or gain independence? This is Spain not Saudi Arabia.

He has to act, it's unfathomable that he doesn't.

Danzy

A Little Pony wrote: »

I thought they should have had the vote and allowed to vote. But Rajoy has declared it an illegal vote, it's illegal in law and so it looks like war. Rajoy will have to take military action now and crush the rebellion.

Which would lead to a suspension of their membership from the EU, well depending on the EU applying Article 7 of the European Union Treaty and it is not certain that they won't fudge it, I'm guessing they would given that fudging is a chronic problem in the EU.

If he sends in the Guardia or the army to stop it then people there are going to start fighting back, given the last day's events you'd have to assume they weren't coming up to make friends.

Life and history often present problems where there is bad and less bad paths, this is a real doozy.

Danzy

A Little Pony wrote: »

He has to act, it's unfathomable that he doesn't.

It is Catalan and Basque money though that will be paying for most of the Soldiers and Police to get on the Bus heading up North.

There are about 17,000 in the Mossos, the Catalan Police, they are armed, out of the 7 million Catalans there will be a lot with rifles etc.

Rajoy can act but can he and Spain afford the price.

His approach so far seems to be to do everything in his power to guarantee that Catalonia becomes Independent.

bear1

Bet the government activates article 155 and that's when the cluster**** will start for real.