Colm Cooper's 'corporate-sponsored dinner'

partyguinness

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

Amateurism means not getting paid to play a sport.That is all the GAA can control , they cannot control anything else that a player does therefore if they want to use the fame they have got from playing gaelic games to generate some money for themselves nobody can stop it and it isn't against the GAA's rules and Cooper might as well do the best he can for himself.

My only issue with what Cooper is doing is the charity angle attached to it to try and convince people this is something other than what it is.I makes the whole thing seem sleazy and underhanded.

Also there is no way I'd be willing to pay for some fella's testimonial in any sport why should a sportsperson be entitled to get a nice lump sum paid for by the fans we've already paid to see you in action as a player get yourself a job like the rest of the world does when you finish up playing sport be it professional or amateur sport.I'd be all for helping out someone in genuine trouble but I don't think Cooper is that in fact I'd say he's a quite well off individual.

That's where the greyness comes in and even semantics.

It's like athletics- strictly speaking Usain Bolt is an amateur. He does not get paid to run as such and is not under a contract for service like professional footballers but he lives of sponsorship money.

High profile GAA footballers are not getting paid to play football but pocketing sponsorship money which quite frankly they are only getting because they are high profile GAA footballers. If the GAA footballer stops playing, the sponsorship stuff dries up

So it is a case of: -

'We are sponsoring because you play football but not to play football but we all know that if stop playing we will look to next bright thing.'

In the world of profesisonal football testimonials are generally granted to a player after 10 years at the same club. But that was because in days of yore: -

a. It acted as an incentive for a player to stay put;
b. The player once retired found himself at 35 unemployed and with with no skills or qualification. They quite often fell on hard time- the testimonial was a 'Thank you' and to ease the pressure once the reality of unemployment hit home

The economics has completely changed and players are set for life.

Colm Cooper does not all of a sudden find himself washed up, broke and unemployed.

While you cannot blame Cooper and those who will no doubt follow for trying to cash in, I'm sorry to say but it is grubby and greedy.

partyguinness

Make no mistake.

GAA players are using the status/profile within the game to make money. Fine.

So this amateur rule is now a load of bollocks and redundant.

Bonniedog

So who is this Culhane chap that seems to be organising it, and has been involved in other such events? Is he an agent?

That seemed to me to be one of the real original motivations in establishing the GPA. One of those involved was an agent and clearly saw it as a means to build a stable of high profile GAA players who he could market to advertisers and others.

That has taken place anyway. I suppose it just reflects the nature of modern society and marketing. Hardly anyone could name let alone recognise say the top scorer in the League of Ireland or the captain of the Irish cricket team; but almost everyone will know Gooch or Bernard or Henry or Katie Taylor or Brian O'Driscoll.

Having people like that in your ad sells stuff.

partyguinness

Bonniedog wrote: »

So who is this Culhane chap that seems to be organising it, and has been involved in other such events? Is he an agent?

That seemed to me to be one of the real original motivations in establishing the GPA. One of those involved was an agent and clearly saw it as a means to build a stable of high profile GAA players who he could market to advertisers and others.

That has taken place anyway. I suppose it just reflects the nature of modern society and marketing. Hardly anyone could name let alone recognise say the top scorer in the League of Ireland or the captain of the Irish cricket team; but almost everyone will know Gooch or Bernard or Henry or Katie Taylor or Brian O'Driscoll.

Having people like that in your ad sells stuff.

Well the danger of having the Irish cricket captain is that he will probably come out and say that he would rather play for England and then feck off.

BrianBoru00

partyguinness wrote: »

Make no mistake.

GAA players are using the status/profile within the game to make money. Fine.

So this amateur rule is now a load of bollocks and redundant.

They always have but they have not been paid to play so the amateur rule is not a load of bollocks or redundant but the GAA as a whole needs to guard against it.

Getting a few bob for appearance at an commercial event is one thing and to be fair a lot of personalities - DJ Carey & Joe Brolly I know never requested or got money to appear at GAA or fundraising event.


The GAA had an operating profit of about 3million last year after paying out for all staff including coaches and also grants/finance for development etc.

That 3 million could basically sustain 2 and a half teams paying an average of €30 000 for each players and coach if it were to go professional.

A2LUE42

We’re hoping to have an auction on the night as well. Give some GAA and sports memorabilia away . . . We’ve no idea what we’ll raise. Hopefully they’ll benefit in some small way.â€

Sounds like that's what the charities will be getting.

partyguinness

BrianBoru00 wrote: »

They always have but they have not been paid to play so the amateur rule is not a load of bollocks or redundant but the GAA as a whole needs to guard against it.

Getting a few bob for appearance at an commercial event is one thing and to be fair a lot of personalities - DJ Carey & Joe Brolly I know never requested or got money to appear at GAA or fundraising event.


The GAA had an operating profit of about 3million last year after paying out for all staff including coaches and also grants/finance for development etc.

That 3 million could basically sustain 2 and a half teams paying an average of €30 000 for each players and coach if it were to go professional.

Certain players are making money on the back of their GAA career anyway then it reality the amateur rule is just tokenism at this stage.

If the GAA decided to get rid of the amateur rule in the morning, IMO it's not likely that County Boards or Clubs would burst out of the traps drawing up contracts and paying players- nothing would change.

There are two levels. The marketable 'stars' who will attract sponsors and then everyone else.

Dirty Dingus McGee

partyguinness wrote: »

Certain players are making money on the back of their GAA career anyway then it reality the amateur rule is just tokenism at this stage.

If the GAA decided to get rid of the amateur rule in the morning, IMO it's not likely that County Boards or Clubs would burst out of the traps drawing up contracts and paying players- nothing would change.

There are two levels. The marketable 'stars' who will attract sponsors and then everyone else.

Amateurism is around the payment for playing the games.

Nobody is being paid to play football and hurling.

If some small amount of them can use their profile to make monye for themselves then best of luck to them but it doesn't mean that the amateur ethos has bene broken.

BrianBoru00

partyguinness wrote: »

Certain players are making money on the back of their GAA career anyway then it reality the amateur rule is just tokenism at this stage.

If the GAA decided to get ride of the amateur rule in the morning, it's not likely that County Boards or Clubs would burst out of the traps drawing up contracts and paying players- nothing would change.

There are two levels. The marketable 'stars' who will attract sponsors and then everyone else.

Its not tokenism - they are not paid for playing.
Look at the top earning sports people and the vast majority of their earnings tend to be from endorsements. Michael Jordan was earning 3 million a year for playing basketball but 30million in sponsorship.

Once the first part time contract is signed the GAA changes fundamentally. The next Michael Murphy will move to Dublin or Kerry or Mayo or another one of what would essentially be 5-6 counties which have larger earning potential. Transfers WILL come in as labour laws will then apply.

I know some people tire or disagree with the romantic notion of the amateur sport (and sometimes I cringe myself at the harping on about it) but it is what makes the sport different and we have to guard against moves towards professionalism to protect it

partyguinness

Dirty Dingus McGee wrote: »

Amateurism is around the payment for playing the games.

Nobody is being paid to play football and hurling.

If some small amount of them can use their profile to make monye for themselves then best of luck to them but it doesn't mean that the amateur ethos has bene broken.

Oh no- I get that. They are not under contract to 'play' football or hurling. It's like the analogy with athletics earlier.

So really it is- you can make all the money you want on the back of your GAA profile/career just as long as you are not paying paid to play. It's a little disingenuous TBH because you are only attracting sponsorship because you are playing and to keep sponsorship you must keep playing- does that not damage the amateur ethos?

That suits the powers that be because if players are free to go off and attract sponsors etc then it takes the pressure off any talks of professionalism.

As far as I can see the amateur ethos doesn't actually exist as it is a bit of a cod because IMO if the official rule was scrapped tomorrow I really see nothing changing.

Bonniedog

Even with the vastly higher attendances and sponsorship that the GAA has in comparison to domestic soccer, for example, professionalism would not be sustainable.

People will point to rugby as an example of why it might be but it is completely different scenario. There are only four "clubs" which are tied to the IRFU and benefit from the international revenue, and they are part of European competitions that brings in significant finances through attendances and TV.

Professionalism would also as others have said, inevitably mean transfers, and only a tiny number of counties would be able to afford it. Breaking the link between where you are born and who you play for would also diminish the interest people have. I certainly wouldn't be interested in watching a Dublin team that had 7/8 non Dubs on it.

oppenheimer1

Some people here are missing the point as to why this has been widely criticised. Unlike punditry and individual corporate sponsorship, a testimonial dinner like this competes for the same money that funds the GAA generally.

Some people think that the corporate sponsorship opportunities and media work should be enough.

Purple Mountain

I didn't like the way Gooch was bleating on on the LLS about his dinner being a great night for Irish sport.
Sport is all about your supporters at grass roots level.
Tell me what average Joe could afford to fork out €1,000 for themselves and an OH for a few hours fine dining, charity or no charity.
If it was €100 a pop it would be palatable but charging €500 a head is elitist and frankly disgusting.
Good luck to him and his elite dinner.

qwerty ui op

Joe Brolly who was sent to boarding school and then Trinity and Queens University and went on to rake in the cash working as a Barrister has always been very comfortable talking in public and letting us know right from wrong and how we should behave. Goodman Joe, keep up the good work!

Audioslaven

I think the whole charity idea to this is a side show to allow him push the line "I am doing this for charity". I am not sure what the ratio of this is for charity but I would expect he gets 50% and the other 50% is split between x charities or who ever he is giving it to.

He wants some easy cash and he will get easy cash. I don't think it is a particular good route to take in an "amateur sport" but he wants to make handy cash with this and his book. I just hope he reads it unlike his buddy in Oz.

liam7831

It's just typical Irish begrudgery, it's not compulsory for anyone to attend, if you can't afford a ticket just head in to the AIB in Killarney some day and have a chat with him in there.I hope more players do it, they deserve recognition for stellar inter county careers.

Bonniedog

Brolly is from Derry republican family who got nothing easy. I'm sure he is apologetic for being clever!

qwerty ui op

Bonniedog wrote: »

Brolly is from Derry republican family who got nothing easy.

Who knows! and what does it matter, right now, today he can charge crazy money for his work and never need worry about money and yet he has the gall to question how cooper makes his. Would he be so moralizing if it wasn't so easy for him to make it. I doubt it.

Fr Tod Umptious

liam7831 wrote: »

It's just typical Irish begrudgery, it's not compulsory for anyone to attend, if you can't afford a ticket just head in to the AIB in Killarney some day and have a chat with him in there.I hope more players do it, they deserve recognition for stellar inter county careers.

But the organisers of this are basically saying, by a ticket for event at this price and some of the proceeds are going to this man, who is gainfully employed and in good health.

Why does he need any of the proceeds ?

Stoner

Fr Tod Umptious wrote:

Why does he need any of the proceeds ?

TBH, that's his business. If you don't want to go then don't go.

I'm not going.

I go to a similar event for a different sports star though.

For example, Paul McGrath and he's not a GAA player.
Each to their own IMO.

Water John

Have no problem with Cooper or anyone else holding any event and making money out of it. Not a problem.
Tying charities into it, moves it very much to a different place. Their % or return on lending their name, needs to be very transparent, at least. Not good enough to say, they'll get a few bob.
The goodwill of people to charity is then being milked.

liam7831

Water John wrote:

Have no problem with Cooper or anyone else holding any event and making money out of it. Not a problem. Tying charities into it, moves it very much to a different place. Their % or return on lending their name, needs to be very transparent, at least. Not good enough to say, they'll get a few bob. The goodwill of people to charity is then being milked.

Doubt many going to this event are bothered about the charities involved

Water John

That is not the point, but also judgemental.
A charity's value is all bound up in public goodwill.
A parallel for me, are charities who are tied to aggressive chuggers on the street. Their good name is then damaged, in my eyes.

Really poor form to use charities, to dress up a commercial action. Very uncomfortable with it. Guarantee the charities a min publicly stated figure.
They deserve a good slice of the cake not the leftover crumbs, if there happens to be any.

If memory serves me correctly, Gary Kelly, Robbie Keane and Brian O'Driscoll's testemonials and dinners were generous to charities.

liam7831

Water John wrote:

That is not the point, but also judgemental. A charity's value is all bound up in public goodwill. A parallel for me, are charities who are tied to aggressive chuggers on the street. Their good name is then damaged, in my eyes.

Water John wrote:

Really poor form to use charities, to dress up a commercial action. Very uncomfortable with it. Guarantee the charities a min publicly stated figure. They deserve a good slice of the cake not the leftover crumbs, if there happens to be any.

Water John wrote:

If memory serves me correctly, Gary Kelly, Robbie Keane and Brian O'Driscoll's testemonials and dinners were generous to charities.

You need to get over it

nice_guy80

I see the PR spin has kicked into overdrive

gooch even went on RTE

what proper GAA player or official would try and make money off their involvement in the game?
I know my involvement costs me money!

jaykay74

nice_guy80 wrote: »

I see the PR spin has kicked into overdrive

gooch even went on RTE

what proper GAA player or official would try and make money off their involvement in the game?
I know my involvement costs me money!

The ex players on RTE and sky I suppose, no ?

Water John

Liam, it isn't about me, or indeed your opinion of me.

Don't mind anyone making money. Best of luck to Cooper at that. He has to be careful that he doesn't also, along with damaging the charities, that he doesn't damage 'The Gooch' which is brand with a potentially long life.

snowflaker

jaykay74 wrote: »

The ex players on RTE and sky I suppose, no ?

Or the ones ‘writing’ in the papers - hypocritical cr@p!

BrianBoru00

qwerty ui op wrote: »

Who knows! and what does it matter, right now, today he can charge crazy money for his work and never need worry about money and yet he has the gall to question how cooper makes his. Would he be so moralizing if it wasn't so easy for him to make it. I doubt it.

And Colm Cooper has been well looked after as a bank official and has done an awful lot of travelling around the country as bank ambassador so hes not tied to the desk job exactly.
Their respective careers are not at issue here.

Nobody had a go at him for doing some TV work. The issue is to have such a high profile self serving testimonial while using the names of the the charities.

Brolly is on the road constantly and travels to many different charity events associated with the GAA without asking for or receiving a penny.

Bonniedog

Brolly gets bad press but he is still involved with his club and does a lot of freebies.

I don't have anything against the Gooch - who once again today proved he is one of best footballers of all time.

But Brolly has a point. Lots of great players never got a penny. Brolly's occupation has nothing to do with that.