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General gaming discussion

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    #3242
    Benzino
    Registered Users Posts: 3,803 ✭✭✭Benzino


    If we don't want Steam to have a monopoly on the market, I think we need to accept this as a necessary evil. There would be little to no incentive to use the Epic launcher over Steam without these exclusives.

    And as mentioned above, this money is huge for most of these developers, they'd be foolish to turn it down.

    It has also highlighted how toxic the gaming community can be, really shocking to see some of the comments directed to developers over this (I dunno why I'm shocked after gamer gate tbh).


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    #3243
    nix
    Registered Users Posts: 4,909 ✭✭✭nix


    Benzino wrote: »
    There would be little to no incentive to use the Epic launcher over Steam without these exclusives.

    Lower prices? Thats what most would want, healthy competitive prices.. Having exclusives is taking the monopoly and making us pay the top dolla :(


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    #3244
    Benzino
    Registered Users Posts: 3,803 ✭✭✭Benzino


    nix wrote: »
    Lower prices? Thats what most would want, healthy competitive prices.. Having exclusives is taking the monopoly and making us pay the top dolla :(

    Ultimately it's the publisher who set the prices, Epic incentivize them by giving them a larger cut vs Steam.

    I'm sure it's possible for Epic to come up with some sort of arrangement with publishers to have it cheaper and they cover the difference, but I don't think that's as attractive or lucrative to the publisher compared to the current approach.


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    #3245
    Varik
    Registered Users Posts: 12,503 ✭✭✭✭Varik


    Benzino wrote: »
    Ultimately it's the publisher who set the prices, Epic incentivize them by giving them a larger cut vs Steam.

    I'm sure it's possible for Epic to come up with some sort of arrangement with publishers to have it cheaper and they cover the difference, but I don't think that's as attractive or lucrative to the publisher compared to the current approach.

    If a game was 50 on steam with their cut it could be 40 on EGS for the same profit less the stores cut. Steam require price parity for non sale prices. Same as with MS when they had their release parity restriction, which ended during the Xbox Ones first year (for obv reasons).

    Considering how people are they'd probably complain that it isn't the same price on Steam.


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    #3246
    johnny_ultimate
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 29,174 CMod ✭✭✭✭johnny_ultimate


    The only online stores that offer lower prices are shady grey market ones. As mentioned, developers and publishers set the price on most legitimate stores. To start cutting prices would take away the one major advantage they get from the Epic Store over others. Games in general are actually still pretty affordable anyway all things considered, especially when compared to the drastic increases in development costs.

    Even with that in mind, Epic *have* offered some really good deals. The sale where they subsidised a tenner off games on the Store was pretty ludicrous. I got Outer Wilds - my favourite game of the year and possibly the last few years - on release for like a tenner. That’s pretty ****ing good value in my book. So they have gone out of their way to compete on price in that circumstance. Add to that the steady stream of free games too. It’s not like Steam give away games of the calibre of Hyper Light Drifter, Mutant Year Zero, Slime Rancher, The Witness, Transistor, Oxenfree, What Remains of Edith Finch, Overcooked, Torchlight, This War of Mine... I have an increasingly impressive library of free games from Epic.


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    #3247
    Robert ninja
    Registered Users Posts: 3,878 ✭✭✭Robert ninja


    megaten wrote: »
    This is extremely unlikely and bordering on paranoia.
    Following the money isn't paranoia. Polygon is owned by Vox Media which was invested in by Ted Leonsis, executive of Axiomatic which invests in EGS. Suspicion with these snakes isn't unwarranted after Game Journos Pros. In fact it ought to be the default.
    Benzino wrote: »
    I think we need to accept this as a necessary evil
    Accept it how? I accept it exists; I'm simply never spending money on EGS and I'm very much inclined to never do so with any game that makes exclusivity deals with em'. No hate to them or anything... they've just decided they want Epic gravy train money rather than mine and that's fair enough. They're happy with Epic funding, I'm happy with playing other games.
    Benzino wrote: »
    It has also highlighted how toxic the gaming community can be
    Not nearly as bad as the games journalism community. But you won't hear that from them.


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    #3248
    johnny_ultimate
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 29,174 CMod ✭✭✭✭johnny_ultimate


    Folks: if you ever find a partner who likes you the way Robert hates games journalists, you’ve truly got a keeper on your hands.


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    #3249
    Dyr
    Registered Users Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    johnny_ultimate wrote: »
    Folks: if you ever find a partner who likes you the way Robert hates games journalists, you’ve truly got a keeper on your hands.

    Im grand, herself bends over backwards to excuse my many awful traits like you do with the hacks that infest the ruins of game journalism :)


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    #3250
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I like that the Epic store is basic. It's very slick and smooth and I'm perplexed that the overly unintuitve bloated mess of steam is used as a benchmark for stores.

    EGS is a store, everything else belongs elewhere imo. Want reviews? Go to a reputable gaming journalist website or even better check out some gameplay and come to your own conclusion rather than relying on biased fanboy opinion or vitriolic hater bull****.

    Epic provide multiplatform chat and online play through unreal engine/platform which is where it belongs, not in a store.


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    #3251
    Benzino
    Registered Users Posts: 3,803 ✭✭✭Benzino


    Robert ninja wrote: »
    Accept it how? I accept it exists; I'm simply never spending money on EGS and I'm very much inclined to never do so with any game that makes exclusivity deals with em'. No hate to them or anything... they've just decided they want Epic gravy train money rather than mine and that's fair enough. They're happy with Epic funding, I'm happy with playing other games.

    That's good, you have accepted their decision and decide not to support them. They probably accept they will lose some customers but the Epic money will most likely keep them a float a lot longer. We all move on with our lives.
    Robert ninja wrote: »
    Not nearly as bad as the games journalism community. But you won't hear that from them.

    I don't have my finger on the pulse of games journalist, but I'm skeptical if they are as bad as this https://medium.com/@perplamps/regarding-whats-been-happening-3af0f27d863c


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    #3252
    megaten
    Registered Users Posts: 1,886 ✭✭✭megaten


    Benzino wrote: »
    If we don't want Steam to have a monopoly on the market, I think we need to accept this as a necessary evil. There would be little to no incentive to use the Epic launcher over Steam without these exclusives.

    Steam isn't a monopoly, most of the most popular games on PC aren't on Steam. Epic entering the market isn't offering anything to consumers that they weren't already getting.


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    #3253
    Retr0gamer
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 50,884 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    The Epic games store needs to offer me more as a customer before I even consider it. So far all it offers is free games I either already own or have no intention of playing. It has less features than Steam and is floating on money generated by the flash in the pan success of Fortnite. If they can demonstrate the store has some lasting power and my purchases are safe and sort out their security issues I'll consider it.

    Cheaper games will make me consider the store but so far this hasn't been passed on to the customer. As for exclusives, I'm older and more mature and can wait a year to play games.

    The exclusivity I find it mildly annoying but I the reaction people are having to it is ridiculous. I don't blame any developers going for the money, I'd do the same myself but I kind of draw the line at kickstarted games which is where it becomes a total dick move. Not enough of a dick move to flip the table.

    It's just another case of the anonymity of the internet bringing out the bellend in people.
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    #3254
    AlmightyCushion
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 35,057 Mod ✭✭✭✭AlmightyCushion


    Retr0gamer wrote: »
    If they can demonstrate the store has some lasting power and my purchases are safe and sort out their security issues I'll consider it.

    They can fix the security issues but how can they demonstrate it has lasting power?

    For me, I just like having everything in the one place. It's less hassle. So I prefer to have my games on Steam because that's where most of my games are now.


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    #3255
    Retr0gamer
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 50,884 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    AlmightyCushion wrote: »
    They can fix the security issues but how can they demonstrate it has lasting power?

    For me, I just like having everything in the one place. It's less hassle. So I prefer to have my games on Steam because that's where most of my games are now.

    Really depends on whether this store takes off. Their only source of income is Fortnite and Unreal and Fortnite will be replaced soon due to the fickle nature of online games while game engines come and go. So far with the money they are throwing around the epic store is making a huge loss (no figures but it's very obvious). If they give me confidence that the Epic store isn't going anywhere... or do enough to differentiate itself like GoG do, then I'll consider it.
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    #3256
    johnny_ultimate
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 29,174 CMod ✭✭✭✭johnny_ultimate


    One thing to remember is that the money paid out by Epic (except on free games) seems to be a minimum guarantee, at least for the indie and mid-tier developers. So that would suggest to me that Epic would make that money back if the game sells as expected, and then both sides are into profit if it exceeds that (or Epic takes the hit if not).

    The question is how well games are selling on there. The only reliable data point (outside of Epic’s own vague announcement about Metro which I’m discounting due to ambiguity) I’ve seen is from the Satisfactory developers, who in June said they’d sold 500,000+ copies on Epic since launch. That’s AFAIK the only developer who’ve gone public with their sales figures (although most developers and publishers never go public with sales figures) so it’s interesting but only gives us a single bit of evidence suggesting that EGS games can be hits.

    As for reasons to install EGS? Hades and Outer Wilds have proven more than good enough reasons for me :)


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    #3257
    Retr0gamer
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 50,884 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    johnny_ultimate wrote: »
    As for reasons to install EGS? Hades and Outer Wilds have proven more than good enough reasons for me :)

    I'll pick them up, but I'll wait a year to do so. Timed exclusivity isn't exclusivity to my mind and as someone with a PC user I'm used to waiting up to a year or more for games to come from console to PC so see no difference.

    …. I just hope Tim Sweeney isn't reading my posts because if they start with true exclusivity I might have to swallow my pride.
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    #3258
    Robert ninja
    Registered Users Posts: 3,878 ✭✭✭Robert ninja


    Benzino wrote: »
    I don't have my finger on the pulse of games journalist, but I'm skeptical if they are as bad as this https://medium.com/@perplamps/regarding-whats-been-happening-3af0f27d863c
    You'd be surprised. Edit: Bonus link


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    #3259
    megaten
    Registered Users Posts: 1,886 ✭✭✭megaten


    The money is clearly too good to pass up. Its seems to be a years projected revenue up front. Despite thinking EGS is useless and unlikely to see much progress in terms of features I think any indie developer would be mad to pass up that kind of money. Especially since most indie developers don't really have an audience that follows them from game to game meaning taking the exclusivity deal is unlikely to impact the success of their next game.


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    #3260
    EoinHef
    Registered Users Posts: 5,572 ✭✭✭EoinHef


    Whats funny to me is the people who supposedly dont mind the Epic store are the ones with all the hyperbole on here.

    On here most people have stated their reasons why they dont like the epic store,its the people who claim to have no problem jump all over that and the the accusations of table flipping,OTT accusations,fanboyism etc

    So maybe the people pulling so hard for epic need to maybe take a look at what they are posting....


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    #3261
    Star Lord
    Registered Users Posts: 30,123 ✭✭✭✭Star Lord


    I've had the Epic launcher installed, with a complex password and 2FA on my account.
    I am not a fan of their money-hatting, but can see why developers go for it, it makes sense to do so, particularly if it's for timed exclusivity.
    I've got a few of the free games on it, and have only paid for one (as yet unreleased) game on there, simply because of the huge discount that was on it, which was the John Wick game.

    I'm not a fan of their practices, but for me, as with Steam, to all intents and purposes, it's a game launcher and nothing more. I don't use it for chat or matchmaking or any of those things, they're kinda bloat for my use case, but happy to swallow that slightly bitter pill for the sake of some of the games, and the free games.

    Taking a game that was a Kickstarter one with promised Steam Keys and making it EGS exclusive is a scummy thing to do though IMHO.


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    #3262
    OptimusTractor
    Registered Users Posts: 1,958 ✭✭✭OptimusTractor


    Sort of forgot about this chap https://www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/cp3xvi/years_later_and_atlas_from_the_bioshock_series_is/


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    #3263
    Star Lord
    Registered Users Posts: 30,123 ✭✭✭✭Star Lord


    OptimusTractor wrote: »
    Sort of forgot about this chap https://www.reddit.com/r/ireland/comments/cp3xvi/years_later_and_atlas_from_the_bioshock_series_is/

    He's no Jaunty...



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    #3264
    johnny_ultimate
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 29,174 CMod ✭✭✭✭johnny_ultimate


    Played through A Short Hike over the weekend, which is an expanded version of a Humble Original from a few months ago. It’s an absolute joy. Its title tells you what you need to know: a short game about a hike :pac: You play as a bird (an *actual* bird, I hasten to add ;)) called Claire who’s taking a break in a big national park sort of dealie, and as the game starts you’re basically just told Claire fancies a stroll to the top of a nearby hill to get some mobile coverage.

    All you do is stroll, glide and climb about, chatting to the locals, chasing down a bunch of subquests, and get enough ‘golden feathers’ to boost your climbing ability to get you to the peak. But it feels great to play: the controls are sharp, the map is rich with detail and characters, the mechanics are more involved than a traditional walking sim, and the script is utterly charming. Most of all it’s just a game of real good, chill vibes: a good-natured, no-nonsense game that does exactly what it sets out to do in a fun, joyful way. Probably takes around an hour to play through if you take your time an explore, with maybe another hour or two worth of extra stuff if you want to dig a bit deeper with extra races, fishing etc. Suffice to say, well recommended.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4bWwobx_LQ


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    #3265
    Retr0gamer
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 50,884 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    So weird seeing the low poly look becoming popular. It looks like a DS game.

    Will definitely check it out, the eurogamer write up has me intrigued.
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    #3266
    Retr0gamer
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 50,884 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Subnautica is a little gem isn't it.

    Not a fan of most survival and crafting games but Subnautica has the right amount of narrative hook to keep it interesting.
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    #3267
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 35,941 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Is it as achingly 'survival' though? The genre is one of those where every time I take a punt on Hype Game X, I realise I hate the core gameplay loop in many survival games. Basically: are there hunger / thirst meters in Subnautica? :D


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    #3268
    RobertFoster
    Registered Users Posts: 9,139 ✭✭✭RobertFoster


    There's hunger and thirst, but they're not particularly oppressive for a survival game. Basic food and drink are readily available. You can also play Freedom Mode which gets rid of hunger and thirst.


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    #3269
    Retr0gamer
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 50,884 CMod ✭✭✭✭Retr0gamer


    Yeah I never found them too intrusive. I'm 6 hours in and now have the means to create my own food which pretty much negates the need to hunt for food.

    I hate food and thirst meters as well but as said it's not that intrusive in this game.
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    #3270
    J. Marston
    Registered Users Posts: 23,116 ✭✭✭✭J. Marston


    Saw this on Reddit, concept art of a cancelled Arkham Knight sequel...

    https://i.imgur.com/u3s7wjMl.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/jlzkViEl.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/rQBrpufl.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/0KfbCAFl.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/5RvUwjql.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/SjQT9C2l.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/Pb4e0Stl.jpg

    Supposedly was set in a run-down Gotham, you played as Damian Wayne. Bruce is retired. Bat-Bike replaced the Batmobile. Nemesis system from the Mordor games.


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    #3271
    Spear
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Help & Feedback Category Moderators Posts: 25,106 CMod ✭✭✭✭Spear


    J. Marston wrote: »
    Saw this on Reddit, concept art of a cancelled Arkham Knight sequel...

    https://i.imgur.com/u3s7wjMl.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/jlzkViEl.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/rQBrpufl.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/0KfbCAFl.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/5RvUwjql.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/SjQT9C2l.jpg

    https://i.imgur.com/Pb4e0Stl.jpg

    Supposedly was set in a run-down Gotham, you played as Damian Wayne. Bruce is retired. Bat-Bike replaced the Batmobile. Nemesis system from the Mordor games.

    Those links are all 404, you can see the pics here:

    https://gamerant.com/canceled-batman-game-art/


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