General gaming discussion

Retr0gamer

Retr0gamer wrote: »

Few recommendations for games I bought on Steam:

Ion Fury/Maiden

Not much else to be said here. It's the new build engine game and I decided to pick it up before the price increase. the preview levels are a lot of fun and it's great to play a shooter that is so fast and all about movement instead of a chest high wall inspection simulator. Looking like the final game will be amazing.

Doing my best to wait next month for full release but tempted to cave this evening.
How many levels in the fist episode?

kunst nugget

If companies want to continually make money from a game as a live service, let them bring in a subscription service - at least then there's a cap on the amount of money a person can waste on a game. I'd say gaming companies at the moment can't believe their luck that they can get away with monetising loot boxes the way they have and they are making hay while the sun shines. Any game that has a loot box mechanic with monetisation should be automatically 18s - no questions asked.

Sonics2k

Grumpypants wrote: »

If it's not random it is just pay to win. Whoever can afford to buy the best weapon gets it.

Loot distribution mechanics have been around for yonks too. Look at WOW, kill a boss, get loot. Some will be Rare, some will be common. That's a gambling mechanic with a random number generator. Players hand over real money month after months to play the same thing over and over again to kill the same boss over and over in the chance they get the Rare item.

I'm all on for limiting access to games with spending in them to an appropriate adult level in the same way games are limited for underage kids today so they can't go online and talk with strangers.

The problem is most of the stories you read are from kids who bypass their parents, bypass the online restrictions, bypass banking security and buy stuff with a credit card that you can't own until you are 18.

hmm, no.

I'm a very active WoW player, currently doing Heroic content on Eternal Palace and pretty active throughout the last 14 years. Here's the mistake you're making.

When I kill a boss, I'm actively involved and playing the game. I can get lucky and get loot from a boss, or I can use an in-game currency (earned entirely in game) to go and buy some gear.

Should I choose to use the in-game shop, then I know exactly what I'm getting. There is no gambling. I pay my €10 and get a mount or something.

But, I open up Overwatch and see a new skin that I really want. I can't buy it, there is no way of buying it. I can play a few games and get a loot box and maybe I'll get the skin I want. This is fine, and I can keep playing.

However, I can also purchase a loot box with -random- items in there.

Spending real money on a loot box, containing items that you can't predict is quite literally real gambling. There's no two ways about it. You're spending money on a game of chance.

nix

Sonics2k wrote: »

But, I open up Overwatch and see a new skin that I really want. I can't buy it, there is no way of buying it. I can play a few games and get a loot box and maybe I'll get the skin I want. This is fine, and I can keep playing.

You can, you earn coins/gold from loot boxes, when you have enough, you can flat out buy whatever skin you want (provided its not locked out seasonally).

With regards to Wow, you're not paying a monthly fee just so you can get a chance to get an item from killing a boss. You're paying for the servers access and upkeep, content patches and in game support.

The items are there to earn so you can "progress" through the game at a steady rate, instead of just any idiot skipping to the end and making the game harder for everybody around them :rolleyes:

I'm all for getting rid of loot crates and just implementing actual reward systems that dont cost money, or at the very least an assload of money.

The battlepasses in the likes of fortnite/apex are the way forward in my opinion, you pay €10 every 3 months (if you want) and you can unlock a load of cosmetics as you play away.

But yeah the buying loot boxes where you spend an obscene amount of money, thats the only issue really.

Retr0gamer

Deleted User wrote: »

Doing my best to wait next month for full release but tempted to cave this evening.
How many levels in the fist episode?

Not sure, you have access to 3 levels in the early access build.

You're a day late though, the game has gone up by 5 euro.

TitianGerm

Sonics2k wrote: »

hmm, no.

I'm a very active WoW player, currently doing Heroic content on Eternal Palace and pretty active throughout the last 14 years. Here's the mistake you're making.

When I kill a boss, I'm actively involved and playing the game. I can get lucky and get loot from a boss, or I can use an in-game currency (earned entirely in game) to go and buy some gear.

Should I choose to use the in-game shop, then I know exactly what I'm getting. There is no gambling. I pay my €10 and get a mount or something.

But, I open up Overwatch and see a new skin that I really want. I can't buy it, there is no way of buying it. I can play a few games and get a loot box and maybe I'll get the skin I want. This is fine, and I can keep playing.

However, I can also purchase a loot box with -random- items in there.

Spending real money on a loot box, containing items that you can't predict is quite literally real gambling. There's no two ways about it. You're spending money on a game of chance.

You can use the gold you earned by playing to buy the skin you want in Overwatch.

Sonics2k

Aha, you're all quite right. I'm not a big Overwatch player and totally spaced on that. The core concept still stands for other games though.

pixelburp

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

I liked The Messenger quite a bit. It does have a pretty significant gameplay shift after a few hours - doesn’t completely nail the balancing act it tries but it comes very close. It’s not the very top tier of recent 2D platformers - I’d recommend Celeste or Hollow Knight over it - but it’s plenty fun and is nicely focused.

So bumping this cos kinda in two minds about continuing. I'm at the lava level boss after the big

16 bit switch

, and still waiting for the game to take off. Just seems like the same main loop but with a different lick of paint; is that gimmick all these is? Bit done with the precision platforming too so wondering if I've experienced all there is...

johnny_ultimate

pixelburp wrote: »

So bumping this cos kinda in two minds about continuing. I'm at the lava level boss after the big

16 bit switch

, and still waiting for the game to take off. Just seems like the same main loop but with a different lick of paint; is that gimmick all these is? Bit done with the precision platforming too so wondering if I've experienced all there is...

The switch is more than a lick of paint - also

transforms the game into a more open, Metroidvania style game

. Obviously the basic mechanics remain similar, so if you haven't warmed to them the new structure mightn't add a whole lot. I don't think the change is handled perfectly -

I feel a few of the areas don't translate ideally between linearity and open-ended exploration

- but it does shake things up more than just an extra visual coat of paint. There are some really superb bosses and setpieces, mind, in the back half of the game

pixelburp

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

The switch is more than a lick of paint - also

transforms the game into a more open, Metroidvania style game

. Obviously the basic mechanics remain similar, so if you haven't warmed to them the new structure mightn't add a whole lot. I don't think the change is handled perfectly -

I feel a few of the areas don't translate ideally between linearity and open-ended exploration

- but it does shake things up more than just an extra visual coat of paint. There are some really superb bosses and setpieces, mind, in the back half of the game

Fair enough; I've sunk about 4 hours into the game and just wasn't clicking with me - that I haven't even got to a key pillar of the game makes me think I've probably had my fill. Not a mad fan of the Celeste style precision platforming it sometimes throws at you - I just don't have the patience or controller dexterity - so methinks this might be one to pass on...

Mr Crispy

Two Point Hospital is coming to consoles (Switch, PS and XB). Hurrah!

pixelburp

Thank you for reminding me of a game I've kept meaning to play with; sunk manys an hour into its 'predecessor'.

johnny_ultimate

Played through two cases in Night Call over the last few days. Rarely have I been so frustrated with a game: not because its hard or anything, because it's a good game that makes so many avoidable errors that really drag it down.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NeNfS5qkflE

The basic premise is simple: you're a taxi driver on the night shift in Paris. You pick up customers and chat with them. Some are reluctant to engage, others open up before you can say a word. The writing's inevitably a mixed bag, but generally pretty good. Many of the stories are interesting, weird or enjoyable. It's has a nice chill atmosphere, with the noir aesthetics and understated soundtrack helping things along nicely. The Paris setting is well-realised and captures the essence of a modern, multicultural city extremely well without shying away from some of the real-life issues the city has experienced.

But that's half the game (more than half in practice, thankfully, but your night is actually split into driving and mystery-solving sections, with some crossover). The other half is a murder mystery framing device and it's infuriating. The setup of why you're a cab driver solving a serial killer case is contrived enough. But it's all half-baked in execution. Rather than piecing together a mystery in an organic way you just get automatically given random notes when you carry out rudimentary detective work. Spend a few in-game hours perusing an autopsy report? You don't actually engage with it in any meaningful way, and just end up with a few extra notes on a massive board full of random clues. You don't come to any meaningful understanding of what transpired - it's throwing **** at a notice board and finding what sticks, with the game doing the hard work of linking things together with literal virtual string. It's hard to describe in practice, but eminently underwhelming to experience. In both cases I ultimately guessed right simply because there were ludicrously obvious clues that ruled out all but one suspect. Obra Dinn this is not, and it's a shame the developers opted to dilute the really good core concept with the detective guff (would be sad but understandable if they felt they needed to for commercial reasons).

Add to that a series of odd annoyances. The game has three cases, but they're treated as standalone campaigns. So you choose a case at the start and the game is shaped around that. The story does not carry over from one case to the next, so you start a brand new game which is the same basic thing with just a different killer. This is repetitious, but also hurts the core game of picking up passengers - basically each new case means you're back to square one, which is maddening when you keep finding the same characters and regulars' stories are reset back to square one. You do get dealt out random encounters each time out of dozens available, but even on playthrough two it was a lot of the same faces again and again.

Then there's the in-game economy which is bizarre and where you're constantly struggling to make any money: this is maybe partly a commentary on the gig economy (referenced explicitly in a few sidestories) but not handled well enough to pull it off. So instead the 'make a living as a taxi driver' aspect becomes this low level annoyance where even playing the game super-efficiently means you'll barely make it over the line money-wise without any great gameplay benefit to such struggles. Spend too much time looking for clues or on no-fare jobs (which you can't always predict) and you're basically screwed.

Plus there are minor polish issues, such as a GPS that often makes no sense in relation to what is actually unfolding in the current journey, or conversations that skip entirely.

I only say all this because it's so close to being a really cool game. And there's enough good to easily justify the four or five hours I put into to it. But it's so maddening to play a game that does so much good only to shoot itself with confusing or misguided design decisions. On the plus side, it's included with Game Pass so is at least worth playing through one case just to get a feel for it and appreciate some of those chill Paris taxi driver vibes :pac:

J. Marston

Playing Gwent. It's pretty good for a F2P game, no egregious "BUY THIS!" crap or mechanics so far.

_Godot_

Pretty annoyed right now, as I ordered one game from cex and they sent me the wrong one. Now I've to go down to the nearby store and return it. And here I was hoping to have a fun night of playing it (I had ordered Naruto Shippuden Ultimate Ninja Storm Collection but got Naruto Shippuden Ninja Storm Generations instead.)

pixelburp

A total rant on my part but ... jaysus, what is with this craze where every second indie game's primary loop is about "deck building"? To be fair it seems mostly limited to roguelikes and RPGs, but dear lord it feels everywhere.

I was looking forward to Klei's (Mark of the Ninja, Invisible Inc, Don't Starve) next game - Griftlands, a RPG built around negotiating and haggling - then recently they changed the main loop into ... ... a flippin' deck building game. Terry Cavanagh's latest is also apparently to involve digital card shuffling.

What's the appeal here? For dev and player; I guess it's the randomisation that's "easier" to code for devs, but since when have card games become "such" an appeal?

Retr0gamer

Since Hearthstone and Gwent went crazy and made big bucks I guess.

Honestly though, there's some amazing deck based games out there, physical and digital. It might be a trend but you can make some very compelling games around deck building which aren't just about luck.

Makes me want another Baten Kaitos game...

J. Marston

Retr0gamer wrote: »

Since Hearthstone and Gwent went crazy and made big bucks I guess.

Honestly though, there's some amazing deck based games out there, physical and digital. It might be a trend but you can make some very compelling games around deck building which aren't just about luck.

Makes me want another Baten Kaitos game...

Can't imagine how Gwent makes big bucks. Within 12 levels and under a week of play I have premium (the animated cards) versions of Geralt, Ciri and Triss and have what already feels like a strong deck.

Putting money into this seems pointless compared to say Fifa, where you desperately play the pack lottery.

Robert ninja

It's not a golden goose for them but it brings in enough to keep them consistently investing into it and have pretty decent cash prize tournaments with international players. From what I can tell there's 2 kinds of spenders that keep them afloat.
1. New players looking to jump start their collection with the starter pack and kegs
2. Vets & collectors who pre order every major update bundle in order to get exclusive, time-limited non-returning cosmetics. Many streamers do this too to keep up appearances of having everything.

Their biggest hurdle right now imo is accessibility and marketing. Needing the galaxy client is a pain hole and the game is very heavy on resources for a TCG. Compare it to others that can often run on integrated graphics and non-gaming laptops easily. I wish it could also be runnable standalone like Warframe instead of needing the client (which can't even run on my OS).

They're going to launch on iOS this year which will be a great move for them financially and hopefully funds android and other platforms. I'd like to get back to it but I deleted the W10 VM I had for it and 5fps was a pretty bad experience even in a turn based game.

Mickeroo

J. Marston wrote: »

Can't imagine how Gwent makes big bucks. Within 12 levels and under a week of play I have premium (the animated cards) versions of Geralt, Ciri and Triss and have what already feels like a strong deck.

Putting money into this seems pointless compared to say Fifa, where you desperately play the pack lottery.

It's crazy generous with crasfting materials compared to other card games.

Haven't played it in ages but played a lot in the beta, looks like a different game now.

pixelburp

Retr0gamer wrote: »

Since Hearthstone and Gwent went crazy and made big bucks I guess.

Honestly though, there's some amazing deck based games out there, physical and digital. It might be a trend but you can make some very compelling games around deck building which aren't just about luck.

Makes me want another Baten Kaitos game...

Hmmm true, I forgot about those two games; never let it be said the Games Industry wasn't itself an adherent of the Race to be Second.

I think I'm just a bit bummed Griftlands was rebuilt from the ground up as a Deck Building game, the original version sounded unique and had promise as something different. Hopping onto the latest indie trend was a disappointment. Then to read Terry Cavanagh was up to the same and I was 'ah, FFS'

Not a fan of physical card games to begin with - poker n' all - so digital versions are a bit of a hard sell.

Retr0gamer

Well it's not really something like Poker, it's closer to something like Magic: The Gathering, Battletech and Netrunner which are all excellent deck games. There's awful ones as well like Yu Gi Oh but it's a genre that can be very creative and fun.

Since these are indie games I doubt they will have the monetization of the big deck building games

Give slay the spire a go to see how good deck building games can be. Or if you want to try something... emulated... give SNK vs Capcom Card Fighters Clash on the Neo Geo Pocket a go or even Pokn card game.

pixelburp

Yeah I've seen Slay The Spire mentioned a fair bit, usually by outlets or personas I'd have time for. Might give it a plunge if it's not too expensive...

Mickeroo

pixelburp wrote: »

Yeah I've seen Slay The Spire mentioned a fair bit, usually by outlets or personas I'd have time for. Might give it a plunge if it's not too expensive...

Are you on PC? It's on game pass.

pixelburp

Mickeroo wrote: »

Are you on PC? It's on game pass.

Yup, am on PC; watched the trailer and ... oof. Yeah I'm still not sure that genre is for me

Robert ninja

pixelburp wrote: »

Anyone been using the Steam Labs Machine-Learning suggestion tool? Finding some really interesting games that just passed me by

I just tried it. Umm, wat.




I mean it's not like I don't have these kinds of titles but 90% of my library and playtime is action/adventure.

dreamers75

I have every single on my steam labs recomendations, every single one of them

Just not on steam.

Robert ninja

Add them to ignore? Or wishlist them and then filter out wishlisted items.

Skerries

looks like an interesting puzzle game

Azza

Robert ninja wrote: »

I just tried it. Umm, wat.




I mean it's not like I don't have these kinds of titles but 90% of my library and playtime is action/adventure.

By any chance did you accidentally happen to log on to Retr0gamers account?