2018 Leaf

KCross

Mike9832 wrote: »

Should be no prob @ 100km/h or below

Bjorn got 200km in - 2c @ 90km/h

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sQansDFt-GM&feature=share

He even said it beat the Ioniq for range under the same conditions, which was a surprise.

Old diesel

KCross wrote: »

He even said it beat the Ioniq for range under the same conditions, which was a surprise.

Especially when he alluded on facebook to the battery SOH on his test car been 96 percent

Mike9832

KCross wrote: »

He even said it beat the Ioniq for range under the same conditions, which was a surprise.

Surprised at that too

Ioniq at higher speed like 120 would probably beat it but at slower speeds like 90 the much larger battery Leaf has the advantage

With rapidgate looking fixed Leaf40 looks a good car

Haven't drove the Ioniq but Leaf40 was good fun, great acceleration

Have a test drive of a Tesla next month at Sandford, cant wait to see how that drives

Shefwedfan

DrPhilG wrote: »

40kWh, do I hear 40kWh???

Give it long enough and we will be down to 30KWh :P

Mike9832

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Give it long enough and we will be down to 30KWh :P

For the right price of course

unkel

Gile_na_gile wrote: »

Lads/Laddesses - More of a how challenge question than a "will it?" question I hope. L40 driving from Kildare Meath border area to South Tipp. 180km

I'm not sure if you'll make it at 105km/h GPS speed on the motorway (80% of your trip)

grudgehugger

Gile_na_gile wrote: »

Lads/Laddesses - More of a how challenge question than a "will it?" question I hope. L40 driving from Kildare Meath border area to South Tipp. 180km

25km on regional road
145km motorway
10k on regional roads

What sort of driving, if any, gets a Leaf to a destination charger (overnight granny cable) without stopping for a single charge with four passengers? It is within effective range of Leaf, but my guess is that it is possible if driving 105km/h on motorway, and/or taking the old road for part of the journey.
I.e. Follow M7 to N77 in Laois. Take exit 17 from M7
29 min (49.1 km)
Get on M8 from R433

Conditions: SW headwind of 20km, cold and wet, heating on low.

Based on my recent trips, you’ll prob need to go slightly slower, say 100.

McGiver

grudgehugger wrote:

Based on my recent trips, you’ll prob need to go slightly slower, say 100.

What difference in range does the 100 vs 105 kmh make?

Gile_na_gile

McGiver wrote: »

What difference in range does the 100 vs 105 kmh make?

I wonder that too. Seems that the journey would be feasible (with enough buffer so as not to be stranded with kids on the road) only with 100 on motorway, and regular speed on regional roads. I am hoping that means arriving with >8% battery.... Would probably necessitate very prudish driving indeed, maybe basking in the slipstream of Bus Éireann.



Looks sort of like it would be better to top up en route, if there is some sort of place where we can buy a few things on the way while charging for ~20 min.

optimal

Gile_na_gile wrote: »

I wonder that too. Seems that the journey would be feasible (with enough buffer so as not to be stranded with kids on the road) only with 100 on motorway, and regular speed on regional roads. I am hoping that means arriving with >8% battery.... Would probably necessitate very prudish driving indeed, maybe basking in the slipstream of Bus Éireann.

Looks sort of like it would be better to top up en route, if there is some sort of place where we can buy a few things on the way while charging for ~20 min.

You’re making it hard on yourself. Pull up at midway Portlaoise or Cashel. Cahir is very dodgy. You won’t notice the few minutes passing and it’s a good break for kids. Both have good facilities. Fermoy or Urlingford also an option. Don’t leave it to last charger in your range. It may not be available. Reliability is not great. Yesterday for example was a really bad day for anyone trying to fast charge in Dublin with only three chargers available in the city and one of these not physically connecting to Leaf (Dublin port).

ELM327

Old diesel wrote: »

Especially when he alluded on facebook to the battery SOH on his test car been 96 percent

Wasn't that the leafspy SOC though? It will never show 100% as it doesnt let you access the top of the battery. I think the highest I ever saw in my L24 was 98.3% and that was after balancing and a slow AC charge.

KCross wrote: »

He even said it beat the Ioniq for range under the same conditions, which was a surprise.

At leafspeed.
See, the leaf got what, 15kWh/100km? (from memory)
An Ioniq would get 13kWh-13.5kWh/100km in the same conditions. Even though the ioniq is more efficient, the leaf "wins" because it has a bigger battery pack.
The same test at real speeds (ie 110-120 GPS) and the leaf would not beat the Ioniq.

Zenith74

optimal wrote: »

You’re making it hard on yourself. Pull up at midway Portlaoise or Cashel. You won’t notice the few minutes passing and it’s a good break for kids.

I haven't arrived at either of those chargers and not queued recently, so personally I'd just be setting the cruise control to 95-100km/h, sit back and enjoy the safer and more relaxing drive.

Since moving to EV I've realised that queuing anxiety is much more real than range anxiety (which you overcome in the first week or two).

Zenith74

McGiver wrote: »

What difference in range does the 100 vs 105 kmh make?

Looking at the chart this guy has done (who knows how accurate it is) https://simonselectriccar.com/2017/12/21/leaf-vs-ioniq-energy-efficiency-real-world-test/ - it looks like going from 100km/h up to 105km/h makes about an 8% difference in energy use.

ELM327

Zenith74 wrote: »

I haven't arrived at either of those chargers and not queued recently, so personally I'd just be setting the cruise control to 95-100km/h, sit back and enjoy the safer and more relaxing drive.

Since moving to EV I've realised that queuing anxiety is much more real than range anxiety (which you overcome in the first week or two).

+10000000000000000000000^1000


Could not agree with this more.
it's going to be a thing of the past soon, have spoken to (or seen comments from) multiple motorway services stations that are all expecting 3 more fast chargers at their sites to be fitted beginning in Feb '19.
Combine that with Ionity and I don't think we will have queueing anxiety this time next year.


But for now, yes that is absolutely the worst with a capital WORST thing about driving EVs

Mike9832

Zenith74 wrote: »

Looking at the chart this guy has done (who knows how accurate it is) https://simonselectriccar.com/2017/12/21/leaf-vs-ioniq-energy-efficiency-real-world-test/ - it looks like going from 100km/h up to 105km/h makes about an 8% difference in energy use.

Looks pretty accurate to me

Good reading

Hyundai need to release the 40kWh Ioniq

What a motorway car that will be

Almost 250km range @ 120km/h

Thats not far off the Kona with 50% less battery capacity

Speculating here

https://www.goingelectric.de/forum/hyundai-ioniq-elektro-allgemeines/ioniq-mit-akku-40-kw-t32151-90.html

That Ioniq40 will be launching in July, pre orders in May

Poor man's Tesla would suit me

150bhp would be nice upgrade too

niall_eidw

Mike9832 wrote: »

Looks pretty accurate to me

Good reading

Hyundai need to release the 40kWh Ioniq

What a motorway car that will be

Almost 250km range @ 120km/h

Thats not far off the Kona with 50% less battery capacity

Speculating here

https://www.goingelectric.de/forum/hyundai-ioniq-elektro-allgemeines/ioniq-mit-akku-40-kw-t32151-90.html

That Ioniq40 will be launching in July, pre orders in May

Poor man's Tesla would suit me

150bhp would be nice upgrade too

Guys,

Just watched Bjørn Nyland video, on noise levels in the 2018 LEAF using 17" wheels. The car scored very well, in the top 5. He is going to repeat it again using 16" wheels, results may be even better... Ioniq not so well, not Ionic bashing in any way shape or form I only raise Ioniq as its mentioned in LEAF thread.

Happy New Year to all

https://youtu.be/mMxhab0OK5A

KCross

ELM327 wrote: »

At leafspeed.
See, the leaf got what, 15kWh/100km? (from memory)
An Ioniq would get 13kWh-13.5kWh/100km in the same conditions. Even though the ioniq is more efficient, the leaf "wins" because it has a bigger battery pack.
The same test at real speeds (ie 110-120 GPS) and the leaf would not beat the Ioniq.

I knew you or unkel couldn’t let that slide and would come back with the motorway example!!

Range is king, not efficiency.

I guess what it shows, if you believe Bjorn’s data, is that it’s not all about what the Ioniq can do on the motorway. You have to assess an EV based on your own needs and decide which one is better for you. It’s not that one is better than the other.

We need to see more data on the rapidgate fix now. A repeat of Jonathan Porterfields test would be good.

ELM327

KCross wrote: »

I knew you or unkel couldn’t let that slide and would come back with the motorway example!!

Range is king, not efficiency.

I guess what it shows, if you believe Bjorn’s data, is that it’s not all about what the Ioniq can do on the motorway. You have to assess an EV based on your own needs and decide which one is better for you. It’s not that one is better than the other.

We need to see more data on the rapidgate fix now. A repeat of Jonathan Porterfields test would be good.

It's getting too predictable. Sorry. :pac:


But the relevance of range is that very few people drive long distances at 90km/h. Maybe an average speed of 90km/h but that includes maybe the first 10% and last 10% on slow R roads and the rest on the motorway at 120. Range is absolutely king, but real world range at real world speed is the true king. Range at 90km/h is like the emperor with no clothes on but everyone pretends he's well dressed.

I'm curious about the supposed fix for rapidgate. Considering there is not going to be any new hardware fitted, they are likely going to dial back the throttling, Which is great in the short term but the question is will it increase degradation?

KCross

ELM327 wrote: »

It's getting too predictable. Sorry. :pac:


But the relevance of range is that very few people drive long distances at 90km/h. Maybe an average speed of 90km/h but that includes maybe the first 10% and last 10% on slow R roads and the rest on the motorway at 120. Range is absolutely king, but real world range at real world speed is the true king. Range at 90km/h is like the emperor with no clothes on but everyone pretends he's well dressed.

I'm curious about the supposed fix for rapidgate. Considering there is not going to be any new hardware fitted, they are likely going to dial back the throttling, Which is great in the short term but the question is will it increase degradation?

I suggest his test is applicable to more people than those who regularly do long motorway commutes at 120km/h. He explained before that that is why he does the test the way he does. He thinks, agree or disagree, that it is a more useful test for the majority.

Obviously if you are driving the motorway at 120km/h everyday then it’s not applicable to you. He has a point tbf. Most people would average <100kmh and he drove at 90kmh (GPS) so it’s a good test.

Rapidgate - yea, that’s the worry but it shouldn’t affect the majority but someone in a hot climate or a taxi could have issues but someone doing an occasional long trip and getting up to 50C on the battery temp isn’t going to matter. Only time will tell though.

ELM327

KCross wrote: »

I suggest his test is applicable to more people than those who regularly do long motorway commutes at 120km/h. He explained before that that is why he does the test the way he does. He thinks, agree or disagree, that it is a more useful test for the majority.

Obviously if you are driving the motorway at 120km/h everyday then it’s not applicable to you. He has a point tbf. Most people would average <100kmh and he drove at 90kmh (GPS) so it’s a good test.

I'm not gonna sit here and disagree with Bjorn, we're both watching his videos amongst thousands of other people so he clearly knows what he's doing.


I have an inherent bias due to my use case and my dislike for the leaf. But as I always say, Nissan are the only ones bringing volume to the EV market and any EV sold is better than another fossil car.

KCross wrote: »

Rapidgate - yea, that’s the worry but it shouldn’t affect the majority but someone in a hot climate or a taxi could have issues but someone doing an occasional long trip and getting up to 50C on the battery temp isn’t going to matter. Only time will tell though.

If someone has a leaf40 and a home charger, indeed the odd fast charge may not damage too much but someone using the car a lot and fast charging 2-4+ times a week may experience degradation like the first gen leaf.


As you say, only time will tell, and I'd like to see the specifics of what the "fix" includes

Orebro

ELM327 wrote: »

+10000000000000000000000^1000


Could not agree with this more.
it's going to be a thing of the past soon, have spoken to (or seen comments from) multiple motorway services stations that are all expecting 3 more fast chargers at their sites to be fitted beginning in Feb '19.
Combine that with Ionity and I don't think we will have queueing anxiety this time next year.


But for now, yes that is absolutely the worst with a capital WORST thing about driving EVs

Is that 3 more per site, or just 3 new FCPs, one per site?

ELM327

Orebro wrote: »

Is that 3 more per site, or just 3 new FCPs, one per site?

The two sites I heard specifics on (M11 Coynes cross and J14 M7) said 3 new ecars chargers per site. Not sure if they meant 3 is the new total (ie two new) or 3 new ones (meaning 4 total). But definitely not one per site.


A total of 4 FCP per site would line up with what ESB showed at the recent EV summit

unkel

ELM327 wrote: »

At leafspeed.

Ioniq owners prefer to drive at Ioniqspeed

I've been doing a lot of motorway driving the past week, a lot of it at Ioniqspeed (125km/h GPS speed - 130km/h indicated) with active cruise on and I've been getting about 16kWh/100km. Range 175km. Not bad for winter motorway driving. The weather has been very mild though and no rain and not much wind.

Mike9832

Is it just me or does any positive stuff on the Leaf40 get taken over by Ioniq posts?

McGiver

Mike9832 wrote: »

Is it just me or does any positive stuff on the Leaf40 get taken over by Ioniq posts?

Yeah, Ioniq thread is that way --> reminder Wait, is there any Ioniq thread at all? Would be just three people talking there...

EDIT - Should this one be renamed to "2018 Leaf-bashing-by-Ioniq-owners thread"?

Zenith74

On the subject of threads; is there a historical reason this sub has gone with the mega-thread model? This thread has 5500 replies :eek:, surely this makes no sense.

I'd love to be able to come onto the forum and see the new topics being discussed, but maybe ignore the ones that went off on something I'm not interested in, rather than have all these conversations interleaved as they are now? Maybe there's something in the 3253rd post here that I'd like to reply to, but hardly makes sense in this setup.

irishgrover

McGiver wrote:

Yeah, Ioniq thread is that way --> reminder Wait, is there any Ioniq thread at all? Would be just three people talking there...

McGiver wrote:

EDIT - Should this one be renamed to "2018 Leaf-bashing-by-Ioniq-owners thread"?

I don't post much if anything in this thread because of attitudes like this... .yes, I'm an ioniq driver, but was also almost a leaf driver and may yet be..

Shefwedfan

12 months everyone and you will all be or want to be VW drivers so this thread will die a natural death

unkel

C'mon lads, a bit of banter. I for one am delighted with this weeks news that #rapidgate seems to be sorted. All you owners out here must be relieved.

grudgehugger

unkel wrote: »

C'mon lads, a bit of banter. I for one am delighted with this weeks news that #rapidgate seems to be sorted. All you owners out here must be relieved.

I agree with the basic sentiments in this post. Let’s all keep things in perspective... it’s been a reasonable while (I think!) since anyone’s gotten very aggrieved over perceived bias between owners of different cars on this thread. This place is a fantastic source of info - we should just stick to telling it how it is with our own experience of our own cars - and then speculate wildly about the future cos there has to be room for some fun somewhere

One of my own huge pluses from 2018 is buying my first EV - the L40 has its issues but it’s the best car I’ve ever owned all the same...

Happy New Year everyone!!!