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Milk Price III

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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 787 ✭✭✭ArKl0w


    There's a piece on the webpage about a rebate for feed and fert for January to October and November December would be paid later,is today's that one?


    Of course if they've finally come to their senses and decided to pay us a few hundred a day every day in supply management fees,I won't complain except insist it's net of paye,prsi and USC :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭Keepgrowing


    whelan2 wrote: »
    Don't want to spend it until I know what it's for

    It's your €7/tonne payment on your meal and fert purchased


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,633 ✭✭✭✭Buford T. Justice XIX


    Kerry rise price by 1c.

    http://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/kerry-group-increases-milk-price-for-november/#

    Woohoo, break out the Ferrero Rocher, they are really spoiling us:rolleyes:


  • Registered Users Posts: 126 ✭✭Fixture


    It's your €7/tonne payment on your meal and fert purchased



    https://www.glanbiaconnect.com/news/feed-and-fertilizer-bonuses-paid


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,860 ✭✭✭alps


    Are we going to have a year of fixed milk price schemes? Who is brave enough to roll the dice at current offerings?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭Keepgrowing


    alps wrote: »
    Are we going to have a year of fixed milk price schemes? Who is brave enough to roll the dice at current offerings?

    Announcement: Two new Fixed Milk Price Schemes are available to GII milk suppliers. Application forms available in early Jan. Details: http://bit.ly/FMPS8and9


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,590 ✭✭✭Mooooo


    You'd have to think aabout it anyway. Fixing a margin or chancing that it will rise above it. Not sure if I would at those prices. Would have to think a bit about it


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 787 ✭✭✭ArKl0w


    You couldn't really at those prices as you'd be losing on year one and who knows after that
    As well as that Shur,the 5.2c in 2016 above market price Henry Corbally mentioned must be the Gii market price which as we all know was 2 to 4c BELOW the best of the rest without counting the co op subsidy which Gii or the plc didn't fund at all,we did FARCICALLY out of our own pocket

    No I think anyway,the only one making money out of these schemes medium term is the corporate end of our CoOp
    Every scheme they seem to come up with whether it be Gap,milk flex or whatever is designed for least impact on the plc
    If you really want price certainty,you halve your capital spend on the farm,zero out off farm investments,pay your 30% average tax (or 12.5 in a company) and keep the 70% you've left for the 2 out of 5 lean years

    It goes against the grain to give that kind of business advice but that's the peculiar business we're in (because we love what we do mainly)
    We're the fcukee sadly with our processor being the fcuker because it is slave to the markets
    That's why ,all the good will in the world amongst some board members,their hands are tied

    If our forebears' who created Avonmore and Waterford had a crystal ball things might be different


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭Keepgrowing


    ArKl0w wrote: »
    You couldn't really at those prices as you'd be losing on year one and who knows after that
    As well as that Shur,the 5.2c in 2016 above market price Henry Corbally mentioned must be the Gii market price which as we all know was 2 to 4c BELOW the best of the rest without counting the co op subsidy which Gii or the plc didn't fund at all,we did FARCICALLY out of our own pocket

    No I think anyway,the only one making money out of these schemes medium term is the corporate end of our CoOp
    Every scheme they seem to come up with whether it be Gap,milk flex or whatever is designed for least impact on the plc
    If you really want price certainty,you halve your capital spend on the farm,zero out off farm investments,pay your 30% average tax (or 12.5 in a company) and keep the 70% you've left for the 2 out of 5 lean years

    It goes against the grain to give that kind of business advice but that's the peculiar business we're in (because we love what we do mainly)
    We're the fcukee sadly with our processor being the fcuker because it is slave to the markets
    That's why ,all the good will in the world amongst some board members,their hands are tied

    If our forebears' who created Avonmore and Waterford had a crystal ball things might be different

    I take it you're not interested;)

    You cannot deny the people in fixed schemes beat the market hands down in the last 2 years.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 787 ✭✭✭ArKl0w


    I take it you're not interested;)

    You cannot deny the people in fixed schemes beat the market hands down in the last 2 years.

    It's debatable
    The fixed schemes started off bad putting lots off them so anyone who bit later got bitten back by only getting small allowances
    It's not very co operative to be allocating in such a fashion
    Animal farm comes to mind some co op members are more equal than others and say what one likes, in a co operative,that's not fair
    Opening a new one at 30c in a rising market looks exploitary to me
    You would have to either have a very negative view on the recovery or be someone in from the start who is happy with income capping as much as income flooring to accept one at 30c


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  • Registered Users Posts: 20,950 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    A fairly quick measure on Phase 9 is how soon the West Cork boys pass 31.75 cent.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭Keepgrowing


    ArKl0w wrote: »
    It's debatable
    The fixed schemes started off bad putting lots off them so anyone who bit later got bitten back by only getting small allowances
    It's not very co operative to be allocating in such a fashion
    Animal farm comes to mind some co op members are more equal than others and say what one likes, in a co operative,that's not fair
    Opening a new one at 30c in a rising market looks exploitary to me
    You would have to either have a very negative view on the recovery or be someone in from the start who is happy with income capping as much as income flooring to accept one at 30c

    So people with fixed price "did not" beat the market for the last 2 years, is that your contention?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,837 ✭✭✭mf240


    Now is not the time to fix imo.

    Things can only really go one way.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,979 ✭✭✭✭mahoney_j


    I take it you're not interested;)

    You cannot deny the people in fixed schemes beat the market hands down in the last 2 years.

    I'd fix a portion in 3 year scheme ,no question


  • Registered Users Posts: 126 ✭✭Fixture


    mf240 wrote: »
    Now is not the time to fix imo.

    Things can only really go one way.

    That will make interesting reading in 3 years! Reality is no one knows. How many predicted the pace of recovery since Summer?

    Brexit? Trump?

    I certainly don't see point in fixing in the one year scheme price as first half looks pretty certain to be decent market price anyway


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,979 ✭✭✭✭mahoney_j


    Fixture wrote: »
    That will make interesting reading in 3 years! Reality is no one knows. How many predicted the pace of recovery since Summer?

    Brexit? Trump?

    I certainly don't see point in fixing in the one year scheme price as first half looks pretty certain to be decent market price anyway

    All lads in fixed schemesfrom glanbia all along sat fairly happy this year all things considered .fixed schemes u win u loose but your protecting from the extremes .


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 787 ✭✭✭ArKl0w


    So people with fixed price "did not" beat the market for the last 2 years, is that your contention?

    As I said it's debatable,you'd need to peel back the layers of what portions everybody got over the years to answer that and as everyone is different in the divide and conquer style approach to these schemes ,there's no answer
    My point is made simple by suggesting a base of 34 for a year neuters the effect of the bad base price year we've just endured but still leaves us looking longingly at the higher price paid by small groups in Cork and of course Strathroy

    One thing is very certain ,taking this fix now at 30c would be stupid


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,303 ✭✭✭jaymla627


    ArKl0w wrote: »
    As I said it's debatable,you'd need to peel back the layers of what portions everybody got over the years to answer that and as everyone is different in the divide and conquer style approach to these schemes ,there's no answer
    My point is made simple by suggesting a base of 34 for a year neuters the effect of the bad base price year we've just endured but still leaves us looking longingly at the higher price paid by small groups in Cork and of course Strathroy

    One thing is very certain ,taking this fix now at 30c would be stupid

    It's noting to get to caught up in to be fair, the amounts available will be maybe 5-10% of your supply, if you could hedge 30% plus then it would be something as theirs genuine gains/losses to be made, but the last few schemes have been noting but paper exercises given the miniscule amounts allocated


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,590 ✭✭✭Mooooo


    Dairygold up a cent to 28.5 c incl vat. Txt says 29 incl 0.5c quality bonus. Said already that annoys the fcuk out of me.


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,726 ✭✭✭✭whelan2


    jaymla627 wrote: »
    It's noting to get to caught up in to be fair, the amounts available will be maybe 5-10% of your supply, if you could hedge 30% plus then it would be something as theirs genuine gains/losses to be made, but the last few schemes have been noting but paper exercises given the miniscule amounts allocated

    Would love to see the way the schemes are allocated. Seems to be some getting much bigger allocations than others.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,979 ✭✭✭✭mahoney_j


    whelan2 wrote: »
    Would love to see the way the schemes are allocated. Seems to be some getting much bigger allocations than others.

    Lads that participated in other schemes get bigger slice ????.i don't honestly know but ifcthsts case sounds fair


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,726 ✭✭✭✭whelan2


    mahoney_j wrote: »
    Lads that participated in other schemes get bigger slice ????.i don't honestly know but ifcthsts case sounds fair

    I have been in most of the schemes and the allocations I have received are very small.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,303 ✭✭✭jaymla627


    whelan2 wrote: »
    Would love to see the way the schemes are allocated. Seems to be some getting much bigger allocations than others.

    Their is/was messing going on with allocations I reckon, what I'd love to see is a continuation of the last scheme where 29 cent I think was offered plus whatever extra p/bf was at this level and that was it no if base price drops below a certain level our rises above another level they start taking/giving money, rather sneaky clause in the new scheme re solids where they are paid at the level of milk price at the time so when milk is low 20's your being paid low 20's rates for bf/pr but you win at higher prices.....
    They just seem to love complicating these schemes, the administration costs alone for all the various schemes must be eye-watering


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,837 ✭✭✭mf240


    jaymla627 wrote: »
    Their is/was messing going on with allocations I reckon, what I'd love to see is a continuation of the last scheme where 29 cent I think was offered plus whatever extra p/bf was at this level and that was it no if base price drops below a certain level our rises above another level they start taking/giving money, rather sneaky clause in the new scheme re solids where they are paid at the level of milk price at the time so when milk is low 20's your being paid low 20's rates for bf/pr but you win at higher prices.....
    They just seem to love complicating these schemes, the administration costs alone for all the various schemes must be eye-watering

    Is that 29 cent scheme the one where the volume you got is doubled mid next year.?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,837 ✭✭✭mf240


    Fixture wrote: »
    That will make interesting reading in 3 years! Reality is no one knows. How many predicted the pace of recovery since Summer?

    Brexit? Trump?

    I certainly don't see point in fixing in the one year scheme price as first half looks pretty certain to be decent market price anyway

    Absolutely nothing certain. I suppose it's up to everyone to make the best decision they can at the time.


  • Registered Users Posts: 811 ✭✭✭yewtree


    Aurivo have latest fixed scheme out at moment, 30.5c/litre Base for 3 years up to 10% of 2015 supply, apparently not huge up take. I skipped the frist one put 10% in this time


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭Keepgrowing


    whelan2 wrote: »
    I have been in most of the schemes and the allocations I have received are very small.

    "Most"
    Anyone who took the full allocation each time could have north of 50% of their milk fixed this year.

    No funny business and it's disingenuous to suggest otherwise.

    I'm not sure about this new scheme but will decide when I see the full details and what the market adjusters are. People's memories are short, this time last year some would've put 100% into a scheme. There was knashing of teeth when people got small allocations for the last scheme and it wasn't 30c.

    We need to forget Plc, GII and all these conspiracy theories just judge it on its relevance to our own business. 1c at 22 or 23c base is very valuable the same cent at 40 not as important.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,950 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Well GII have one happy customer, anyway.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,433 ✭✭✭darragh_haven


    I got a tour of the Strathroy Dairy plant today. They are gearing up to be the major player in the long term. No suits walking around either. Very impressive and lean operation


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 665 ✭✭✭OverRide


    whelan2 wrote: »
    I have been in most of the schemes and the allocations I have received are very small.

    They operate them under jehovah's witnesses rules
    Your allocation level is shunned because you didn't comply,acquiesce,lie down for all of them
    That way there's more of the better ones for those that do comply,the yes men


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