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Milk Price III

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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,135 ✭✭✭kowtow


    Water John wrote: »
    Well its going from Wexford to NI and back down again. The processor collecting it is the processors issue. Distance is overrated as an issue.

    When processors move milk a long distance it is adding value.
    If farmers did it, it would be inefficiency.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,944 ✭✭✭alps


    VAT rate increase to 5.4% on Jan 1st.

    If a supplier holds their vat inclusive milk price, does it mean in effect that they in fact dropped...small....but miserable..

    Could be that old vat rate is paid on December milk...


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭Keepgrowing


    mahoney_j wrote: »
    From what I can gather we or any other processor may like to take in more suppliers but there maby an unofficial gentlemans agreement back again .dosnt make sense for us to be trucking milk from Carlow Wexford ,Kilkenny et all to Nenagh and reverse applies to glanbia .once decembers cheque cashed next week price for 16 will be good side of 28.5 cent ,no winter bonus ,fixed scheme

    30c here without winter bonus. I thought reading your posts each month that Ye'd surely beat GII ;)

    Natural gas and all ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,611 ✭✭✭Mooooo


    30c here without winter bonus. I thought reading your posts each month that Ye'd surely beat GII ;)

    Natural gas and all ;)

    Would your winter bonus add much to the overall figure,? adds about 1.15c here over last year's supply. Another reason to scratch my head


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,171 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    Not sure of this 90 day notice lark by ICOS, between Coops, to protect their big friends. That's the only Gentlemans Agreement that might be hanging around.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 29,216 ✭✭✭✭whelan2


    Water John wrote: »
    Not sure of this 90 day notice lark by ICOS, between Coops, to protect their big friends. That's the only Gentlemans Agreement that might be hanging around.

    2years notice should cover that


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭Keepgrowing


    Mooooo wrote: »
    Would your winter bonus add much to the overall figure,? adds about 1.15c here over last year's supply. Another reason to scratch my head

    Adds 2c but as numbers grow it will become less significant. Within 4--5 years we will be out of winter unless we are allowed and then decide to buy liquid contract


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,944 ✭✭✭alps


    Adds 2c but as numbers grow it will become less significant. Within 4--5 years we will be out of winter unless we are allowed and then decide to buy liquid contract

    What percentage of your herd calving in autumn would you consider optimum if you had freedom to produce liquid milk? How much better profit wise could you see yourselves than all spring milk?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,633 ✭✭✭✭Buford T. Justice XIX


    whelan2 wrote: »
    Will Brexit affect the northern lads buying milk in the south? If you hand in your notice do you have to follow through and do you have to tell glanbia where you are going
    I was involved in a discussion on that this week. NI simply won't have enough processing capacity to process even half their milk. So if a hard Brexit happens, last year will look like a feast for milk suppliers in the north. There is one decommissioned plant in NI (owned by Lakeland, iirc) that could be opened with little cost but then you have low solids milk being dried as the vast majority of cows in NI are bred for volume.

    Then the issue of ROI milk going to Strathroy and coming back will have to be dealt with and Natural Dairies milk supply to Dunnes own-brand milk coming under pressure as well.

    As one lad put it, it took 3 years discussion for Greenland to leave the EU and there was only fisheries policy at stake there. With many thousands of issues to be agreed between the UK and EU, the discussions will probably take years to be agreed.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,110 ✭✭✭✭mahoney_j


    30c here without winter bonus. I thought reading your posts each month that Ye'd surely beat GII ;)

    Natural gas and all ;)

    Aghh but sure you've super duper x breds !!,take off coop top ups and fixed price scheme how do things look ,id of took 28.5 and an average price last January


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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,135 ✭✭✭kowtow



    As one lad put it, it took 3 years discussion for Greenland to leave the EU and there was only fisheries policy at stake there. With many thousands of issues to be agreed between the UK and EU, the discussions will probably take years to be agreed.

    The customs union between the UK & Ireland predates the EU by centuries, if you count the years of British rule & / or union.

    Irish politicians would do well to remember that, and to make Irish voices heard rather than singing a little tune for the big boys in Brussels.

    Had the Irish people been asked, at the time of the Lisbon vote, whether they were prepared to sacrifice their largest trading partner on the altar of European Union I suspect they would have needed a few more referenda to get a Yes.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,633 ✭✭✭✭Buford T. Justice XIX


    kowtow wrote: »
    The customs union between the UK & Ireland predates the EU by centuries, if you count the years of British rule & / or union.

    Irish politicians would do well to remember that, and to make Irish voices heard rather than singing a little tune for the big boys in Brussels.

    Had the Irish people been asked, at the time of the Lisbon vote, whether they were prepared to sacrifice their largest trading partner on the altar of European Union I suspect they would have needed a few more referenda to get a Yes.
    That has no bearing on the discussions, though. What matters is that the UK is our biggest trading partner, taking some 40% of Ag production and some 30% of our total production and they can replace us easier than we can replace them by importing whatever from wherever and we can go swing for all they care.

    Very little of the discussions will center on our historic trading partnership but will concentrate on the EU getting a hard Brexit to prevent any further members from leaving.

    Imo, it is probably in our best interest to stay in the EU even as our nearest neighbour leaves and Ag being most strongly affected. Saying that, in an Irexit situation, I would probably vote leave.


  • Registered Users Posts: 29,216 ✭✭✭✭whelan2


    30c here without winter bonus. I thought reading your posts each month that Ye'd surely beat GII ;)

    Natural gas and all ;)

    Does that include gap scheme?


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,394 ✭✭✭✭Timmaay


    Adds 2c but as numbers grow it will become less significant. Within 4--5 years we will be out of winter unless we are allowed and then decide to buy liquid contract

    If this protein cap on liquid milk happens I would assume that will take the economics of it away from most lads who use late spring calvers to fill the liquid quota.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,057 ✭✭✭stretch film


    Timmaay wrote: »
    If this protein cap on liquid milk happens I would assume that will take the economics of it away from most lads who use late spring calvers to fill the liquid quota.

    If that proposal passes then it really is time to fold up the tent Tim.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,057 ✭✭✭stretch film


    Adds 2c but as numbers grow it will become less significant. Within 4--5 years we will be out of winter unless we are allowed and then decide to buy liquid contract

    You could satisfy your needs as a dual supplier within that time frame one would expect.

    have you glanbia liquid quota. you could supply liquid milk outside glanbia within the current MSA but never return as a liquid supplier.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭Keepgrowing


    whelan2 wrote: »
    Does that include gap scheme?

    No, that's capital introduced so isn't counted


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭Keepgrowing


    You could satisfy your needs as a dual supplier within that time frame one would expect.

    have you glanbia liquid quota. you could supply liquid milk outside glanbia within the current MSA but never return as a liquid supplier.

    No I don't have any liquid contract. I'm not entirely sure I want it either. I attended a liquid milk meeting in Portlaoise some months ago and the leadership of that group didn't inspire me.

    If the attitude displayed that night is a measure of the people involved I'd be very fearful for its future. Listening to nonsensical stuff about yield, breeding, being specialist farmers bla bla bla.

    There was even one guy stood up saying that no young lad is prepared to calve cows Christmas Day, this was the only reality discussed that night.

    Anoth brain surgeon proposing that we dump milk till the processors came to their senses.

    Not one person took responsibility for the state of affairs at farm level i.e. Too many cows being calved, too much expensive feed being used and bull****e about cow yield. They preferred instead to focus on price rather than the fact that they supply more than what's contracted and therefore diluting their bonus


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭Keepgrowing


    alps wrote: »
    What percentage of your herd calving in autumn would you consider optimum if you had freedom to produce liquid milk? How much better profit wise could you see yourselves than all spring milk?

    24% of our supply is bonused. There's no doubt that winter milk is profitable but one must pay great attention to costs and never supply 1 litre more than what's contracted.

    Feed here is top notch bales with 4 kg 16% p nuts.


  • Registered Users Posts: 29,216 ✭✭✭✭whelan2


    No I don't have any liquid contract. I'm not entirely sure I want it either. I attended a liquid milk meeting in Portlaoise some months ago and the leadership of that group didn't inspire me.

    If the attitude displayed that night is a measure of the people involved I'd be very fearful for its future. Listening to nonsensical stuff about yield, breeding, being specialist farmers bla bla bla.

    There was even one guy stood up saying that no young lad is prepared to calve cows Christmas Day, this was the only reality discussed that night.

    Anoth brain surgeon proposing that we dump milk till the processors came to their senses.

    Not one person took responsibility for the state of affairs at farm level i.e. Too many cows being calved, too much expensive feed being used and bull****e about cow yield. They preferred instead to focus on price rather than the fact that they supply more than what's contracted and therefore diluting their bonus

    Are there many herds calving all year round now? I know of 1. It's a long time since there was a liquid milk meeting locally.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 787 ✭✭✭ArKl0w


    Doesn't giving the 2 yrs notice mean people in the gap have to immediately pay back what they got in that?
    Assuming some is paid before January 2018,2c on say 500,000 litres is what ten grand?
    I remember reading that clause in the gap but is it in the small print for the fixed price aswell?
    I presume no one who took the milk flex loan can give in notice or leave


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭Keepgrowing


    ArKl0w wrote: »
    Doesn't giving the 2 yrs notice mean people in the gap have to immediately pay back what they got in that?
    Assuming some is paid before January 2018,2c on say 500,000 litres is what ten grand?
    I remember reading that clause in the gap but is it in the small print for the fixed price aswell?
    I presume no one who took the milk flex loan can give in notice or leave

    If one was taking milk flex they had to sign an amended contract. Quiete understandable really


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 787 ✭✭✭ArKl0w


    Yeah I'd assumed that
    Any idea how the milk flex is secured in the event of a company where land is leased from a director?
    I'm just curious,a personal guarantee I presume?
    Getting back to the 2 years notice,is there a clause in fixed price agreements that cancels them like there is in the gap?
    If there is it would be sweet wouldn't it because you might end up being paid more for that milk in the 2 years prior to leaving?


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭Keepgrowing


    ArKl0w wrote: »
    Yeah I'd assumed that
    Any idea how the milk flex is secured in the event of a company where land is leased from a director?
    I'm just curious,a personal guarantee I presume?
    Getting back to the 2 years notice,is there a clause in fixed price agreements that cancels them like there is in the gap?
    If there is it would be sweet wouldn't it because you might end up being paid more for that milk in the 2 years prior to leaving?

    I'm not familiar enough with the detail to post. Some of the people considering handing in their notice must surely know


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,633 ✭✭✭✭Buford T. Justice XIX


    Brexit barriers would ruin Northern Ireland dairy farms, MPs told

    A bit more on Brexit and the NI milk supply.


    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jan/11/brexit-barriers-would-ruin-northern-ireland-dairy-farms-mps-told?CMP=twt_a-environment_b-gdneco


  • Registered Users Posts: 306 ✭✭Coolfresian


    It's a good idea to hand in notice and at least open that option. Where would you consider going?

    Exactly and for that reason my notice will be going in. Luckily both strathroy and arrawbawn pass my gate. However arrawbawn will mean giving up supplying liquid, where as with strathroy i could increace.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,110 ✭✭✭✭mahoney_j


    Exactly and for that reason my notice will be going in. Luckily both strathroy and arrawbawn pass my gate. However arrawbawn will mean giving up supplying liquid, where as with strathroy i could increace.

    I'd double check that ,we've a big Tesco contract and an Aldi contract to fill .lots of new liquid contracts given out this year


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭Keepgrowing


    Exactly and for that reason my notice will be going in. Luckily both strathroy and arrawbawn pass my gate. However arrawbawn will mean giving up supplying liquid, where as with strathroy i could increace.

    Arrabawn might want liquid suppliers for the milk they need for Tesco contract.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭Keepgrowing


    mahoney_j wrote: »
    I'd double check that ,we've a big Tesco contract and an Aldi contract to fill .lots of new liquid contracts given out this year

    Unfortunately for all farmers in all coops that contract will be elsewhere by the time to leave arrives. Processors scalping each other only serves to supermarkets as opposed to the farmers or coops. The Musgrave contract is up for renewal, just watch how cheap they will get their milk.

    This is exactly why I've changed my mind about buying liquid contract.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭Keepgrowing


    mahoney_j wrote: »
    I'd double check that ,we've a big Tesco contract and an Aldi contract to fill .lots of new liquid contracts given out this year

    MJ, have enough guys taken up contracts to fill the Tesco contract?


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