2700s return

Jamie2k9

This is evertying they are looking for in the 2700:

This engineering intervention will involve a number of core requirements such as (but not limited to);

* - Undertaking heavy maintenance activities on key systems (i.e. Bogies, Final Drives, Exhausts, Cooling System, Gangways, Couplers, Pneumatic Systems etc.)
* - Undertaking system integrity and refurbishment to existing sub-systems (i.e. Fire Suppression, Toilet Modules, Passenger Doors, Lighting, Glazing etc.)
* - Supply and installation of replacement components and assemblies (i.e. Passenger seating, flooring systems, underframe equipment cabinets, interior panels, luggage racks etc.)
* - Undertake modification works (electrical, mechanical and body) to bring the refurbished fleet in line with the remainder of the IÉ fleets)

In addition to the core requirement, IÉ will be seeking upgrade proposals as costed options which may be selected to form part of the overall contract award. The costed options will cover (but not limited to) the following;

* - Overhaul of Traction and Generator engines;
* - Overhaul of Transmissions and/or Transmission replacement;
* - Overhaul of Vacuum Toilets;
* - Installation of new Fire Suppression System;
* - Supply and installation of LED saloon lighting;
* - Supply and installation of Passenger Information System;
* - Supply and installation of CCTV system

The journal is reporting they are bringing by all 28 (i.e 14 sets) not 10 as rumoured but they re not exactly always accurate with the news.

GM228

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

This is evertying they are looking for in the 2700:



The journal is reporting they are bringing by all 28 (i.e 14 sets) not 10 as rumoured but they re not exactly always accurate with the news.

The tender does not state how many sets are to return, just that there are 28 vehicles in the class which is wrong as there are 27 (unless they are counting 2609 as a 28th 2700) - but I have not heard of any plan to reintroduce the entire fleet or the hybrid.

The original plan was for 10 sets to return which was increased to 11 sets (by adding 2751 and 2753 to the plan) as confirmed by the NTA last August.

goingnowhere

Might as well go for the full fleet, if the NTA is funding it, thats 8 more coaches, a full extra rush hour train basically

The 41 ICR cars are a long way away if they ever happen

end of the road

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

This is evertying they are looking for in the 2700:



The journal is reporting they are bringing by all 28 (i.e 14 sets) not 10 as rumoured but they re not exactly always accurate with the news.

i see gangways are mentioned. they are hardly going to reinstall the front gangways to the units? unless they are talking about the internal gangways?

goingnowhere wrote: »

Might as well go for the full fleet, if the NTA is funding it, thats 8 more coaches, a full extra rush hour train basically

completely agree. get them all back and utilise.

goingnowhere wrote: »

The 41 ICR cars are a long way away if they ever happen

and as we know they will solve little in terms of the suburban routes.

thomasj

http://www.thejournal.ie/irish-rail-28-carriage-refurbishment-3515635-Jul2017/

The move will free up other trains for use in the Greater Dublin Area. It is envisaged that they will re-enter service next year and 2019.

However, with passenger demand now increasing once more, the company wants to get the carriages back on tracks around Limerick.

So, looking like the 2800s will be returning to Dublin

GM228

end of the road wrote: »

i see gangways are mentioned. they are hardly going to reinstall the front gangways to the units? unless they are talking about the internal gangways?

It's the internal gangways.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

GM228

thomasj wrote: »

http://www.thejournal.ie/irish-rail-28-carriage-refurbishment-3515635-Jul2017/



So, looking like the 2800s will be returning to Dublin

The actual tender simply indicates the (incorrect) fleet size, not how many are to return which is I'm told (and previously confirmed by the NTA) 11 sets.

Plan was to have the 2700s in Dublin which has indeed now changed to have the 2800s in Dublin which could change again due to the 2600s remaining in Cork as the 2600s and 2800s are regarded as a common fleet. That said I'm told that the 2700s will be initially fully compatible with the 2600 and 2800s and 29000 compatability is on the long finger.

GM228

Fred Swanson wrote: »

Are the 2 bubble cars going back into service? I did read somewhere they cannot be operated singularly.

Yes, they can and did operate singularly.

tabbey

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Even so once they are 40-45 years

No.
They are 33 years in service.

Modern solidly built stock should last at least 40 years. Only vehicles problematical in some way, should be withdrawn early and many sound trains last much longer.

Melbourne still has vehicles built as EMUs in 1956, which were converted in late 1980s to hauled coaches for outer suburban services.

Jamie2k9

tabbey wrote: »

No.
They are 33 years in service.

Modern solidly built stock should last at least 40 years. Only vehicles problematical in some way, should be withdrawn early and many sound trains last much longer.

Melbourne still has vehicles built as EMUs in 1956, which were converted in late 1980s to hauled coaches for outer suburban services.

33 years now fair enough but I did say over the next 10 years and that would take them above 40. They will likely start leaving the fleet mid 2020's.

GM228

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

33 years now fair enough but I did say over the next 10 years and that would take them above 40. They will likely start leaving the fleet mid 2020's.

When the refurbished LHBs returned they were given 18 month conditional fit for service certificates to operate by the then RSC (one of the first roles the commission undertook). Following full acceptance (which involved structural and bogie lifespan predictions) the RSC issued a 40 year fit for service certificate - this was issued in 2008!

Jamie2k9

GM228 wrote: »

When the refurbished LHBs returned they were given 18 month conditional fit for service certificates to operate by the then RSC (one of the first roles the commission undertook). Following full acceptance (which involved structural and bogie lifespan predictions) the RSC issued a 40 year fit for service certificate - this was issued in 2008!

Do you honestly believe they will be in service until 2048??

GM228

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Do you honestly believe they will be in service until 2048??

Probably not, but I think they will be still here mid 2020s.

The_Wanderer

Just to correct earlier postings.

The tender is for 28 vehicles. i.e. it includes 2609 + 2716 (the hybrid set),

Limerick is intended to be the main base, but I could foresee some sets being outbased in Cork to send the 2800's and some 2600's to Dublin Commuter work.

tabbey

GM228 wrote: »

When the refurbished LHBs returned they were given 18 month conditional fit for service certificates to operate by the then RSC (one of the first roles the commission undertook). Following full acceptance (which involved structural and bogie lifespan predictions) the RSC issued a 40 year fit for service certificate - this was issued in 2008!

Does this mean 40 years from 2008, or merely 40 years from originally entering service in 1984?

tabbey

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Do you honestly believe they will be in service until 2048??

On the Berlin S-Bahn, some trains built in the 1930s survived in service into the 21st century, notably class ET 125. Some others built 1920s lasted until 1997.

If it works well,why dump it?

Unfortunately this country has more than it's share of people who know the price of everything and the value of nothing. This is why we have a lower standard of living than other Europeans, in spite of being nominally wealthier on paper.It is why so many Irish people are homeless and spending long periods on emergency trolleys.

Only when we begin to value our assets, railway or any other, will we mature into a self-respecting and respected country.

GM228

tabbey wrote: »

Does this mean 40 years from 2008, or merely 40 years from originally entering service in 1984?

It is a 40 year cert commencing 2008 - so valid until 2048.

devnull

In Hamburg:
The DT3s are approaching 50 years old and new stock is being procured
The DT4s are approx 30 years old with no plans to withdraw.
The 472s will hit approx 44 years before being withdrawn

These are the brothers and sisters of the 8100 class and as you can see they are having good and long lives and the DT4s have only just came out of a refurbishment in the last couple of years and they will get many more years out of them I suspect.

I'm all for replacing life expired stock with stock that is modern, but at the end of the day the 8100 stock life to date without any serious problems and the fact that there are siblings of the units running around Germany with little problems suggests they're fine to go on a bit longer.

The thing which will probably finish these units off won't likely be life expiry, it'll probably be an issue with getting the spare parts, that is what has saw off even older versions of it's siblings that are operating in Germany and beyond.

What we should all be thankful for is that the contract for the refurbishment went to a company that did a damn fine job on them and didn't cut corners. Whatever about the refurbishment being late and Siemens doing more work than they needed to under the contract, best to have a delay and a well built product than an on-time job riddled with issues.

(Alstom take note)

tabbey

GM228 wrote: »

It is a 40 year cert commencing 2008 - so valid until 2048.

Excellent.

GM228

devnull wrote: »

What we should all be thankful for is that the contract for the refurbishment went to a company that did a damn fine job on them and didn't cut corners. Whatever about the refurbishment being late and Siemens doing more work than they needed to under the contract, best to have a delay and a well built product than an on-time job riddled with issues.

(Alstom take note)

The one mistake Siemens made was to not evaluate the traction package requirement of the tender - a very costly mistake on their part.

GM228

And so it begins:-

2715/2724 has been split in two with 2715 making it's way into the old carriage shops in Inchicore where it is currently being stripped down as part of a scoping exercise.

Windows, seats, doors, floors and electrical components are currently in the process of being removed/examined on the unit probably to establish the finer details of the refurbishment plan.

The_Wanderer

GM228 wrote: »

And so it begins:-

2715/2724 has been split in two with 2715 making it's way into the old carriage shops in Inchicore where it is currently being stripped down as part of a scoping exercise.

Windows, seats, doors, floors and electrical components are currently in the process of being removed/examined on the unit probably to establish the finer details of the refurbishment plan.

That happened several weeks ago and as far as I know the examination is complete. This was done before the tender was issued to assess the condition of one of the worst vehicles.

GM228

The_Wanderer wrote: »

That happened several weeks ago and as far as I know the examination is complete. This was done before the tender was issued to assess the condition of one of the worst vehicles.

Yes there was an initial exam late June/early July I, but a new/further scoping exercise has begun again on the unit I'm told to finalise a few things apparently - wiring, electrical items, under the floor and behind wall panels being the subject this time.

Basically everything between the frames and internal fittings is being looked at again.

Cravens

Is there much progress behind the scenes to get the 2700's back into service?

Ireland trains

Are they going to be painted in the silver or green commuter livery

Shn99

Hopefully the green livery, would look nice

Rashers72

Cravens wrote: »

Is there much progress behind the scenes to get the 2700's back into service?

They are now mentioned every day on IE twitter as the solution to the extreme crush loads being experienced on the Maynooth, Drogheda and M3 Parkway services. Interestingly it is now also being mentioned as the solution for peak time overcrowding issues on the Heuston intercity services.
IE twitter is advising customers these refurbished trains will be back in service next year. But despite being asked no indication has been given as to the number of 8 carriage trains that will actually be added. I have a feeling customers will ultimately be disappointed.

Shn99

Thought the 2700s were for Limerick?

end of the road

Shn99 wrote: »

Thought the 2700s were for Limerick?

i think that was more an assumption based on the fact that they were based out of there before being put into storage. nothing has been confirmed about where they will go from what i understand, all though that may have changed. i'd imagine the 2800s will stay in limerick given they are effectively an update of the 2600s and i think they inter-work with each other between services based out of cork and services based out of limerick. time will tell i guess.