radio nova

Avatar MIA

FanadMan wrote: »

There is so much they can choose from. Even the regular artists they play have plenty of music. Metallica for instance, all Nova plays is Nothing Else Matters or Enter Sandman. They have tons of stuff.

Nova is a niche station as it is. Most people only dip in and out of any radio station they listen to.

The vast majority of people didn't want what TXFM/Phantom produced, so the JNLR's suggested anyway.

The people posting on the Boards.ie radio forum are not going to be representative of the general radio listening audience.

nice_guy80

jvan wrote: »

I think you've hit the nail on the head, it's a station to dip in and out of. You'd go mad if you listened all day every day

Oh, and I realised I'd forgotten Phil Collins. Lots of Phil Collins.

its funny that they also play lesser hits from the likes of the Men Down Under -
its like they know they don't get any royalties from their biggest song but give them some for the lesser songs!

I also think they have a special deal done with certain record companies or something.
eg if we play this song 20 times this week we only have to pay for half of the plays.

J Mysterio

Radio Nova was brilliant up to about 5 years ago. Its a pain in the hole now. Whats with all the ****ing traffic updates? Who wants to hear that ****? I want music! Too many ads now also. Over and under? Fack off!

TXFM was the last decent station.

Avatar MIA

J Mysterio wrote: »

Radio Nova was brilliant up to about 5 years ago. Its a pain in the hole now. Whats with all the ****ing traffic updates? Who wants to hear that ****? I want music! Too many ads now also. Over and under? Fack off!

TXFM was the last decent station.

When it had just started up

You do know that's how Radio Stations work, even RTÉ have ads on their stations.

TXFM was great, as it didn't get many ads on air - it's also why it's been consigned to history.

But, by all means apply to the BAI when a licence comes up if you can afford to finance an ad free station as a philanthropist.

Fuzzy Clam

Avatar MIA wrote:

Nova is a niche station as it is. Most people only dip in and out of any radio station they listen to.

Increasing the choice of music won't affect those who only dip in out.
It may encourage those who do want to listen longer to do so.;-)

Fuzzy Clam

Phantom had plenty of ads in the earlier years.

Edited. I meant Phantom, not Txfm.

Avatar MIA

Fuzzy Clam wrote: »

Increasing the choice of music won't affect those who only dip in out.
It may encourage those who do want to listen longer to do so.;-)

You might think that, but what commercially successful station has that worked for? Most, if not all stations play the most cuttent/popular songs - Creedon on Radio 1 is one I can think of off hand, but while a very good presenter it's not prime time.

Fuzzy Clam wrote: »

Txfm had plenty of ads in the earlier years.

Phantom? Anyway, neither phantom or TXFM were ever close to profitability.

Fuzzy Clam

Avatar MIA wrote:

You might think that, but what commercially successful station has that worked for? Most, if not all stations play the most cuttent/popular songs .

Thats because that is what most stations are aiming at. Current songs on high rotation.
Nova are still operating at a loss.

Fuzzy Clam

Avatar MIA wrote:

Phantom? Anyway, neither phantom or TXFM were ever close to profitability.

Yes Phantom.

Avatar MIA

Fuzzy Clam wrote: »

Thats because that is what most stations are aiming at. Current songs on high rotation.
Nova are still operating at a loss.

Going even more niche won't help them to break even.

salmocab

J Mysterio wrote: »

Over and under?

I actually do be embarrassed hearing that, its like something your knob of an uncle said once and you gave him a pity laugh and the ****er keeps doing it.

SimonMaher

Avatar MIA wrote: »

You might think that, but what commercially successful station has that worked for? Most, if not all stations play the most cuttent/popular songs - Creedon on Radio 1 is one I can think of off hand, but while a very good presenter it's not prime time.


Phantom? Anyway, neither phantom or TXFM were ever close to profitability.

I'm staying out of the Nova debate, but just for factual accuracy, Phantom 105.2 came within a whisker of profitability in 2008 - just as the world fell asunder. The rest is a long and ultimately sad story but lessons have been learned

Simon

Declan A Walsh

SimonMaher wrote: »

I'm staying out of the Nova debate, but just for factual accuracy, Phantom 105.2 came within a whisker of profitability in 2008 - just as the world fell asunder. The rest is a long and ultimately sad story but lessons have been learned

Simon

Fair play to you Simon for setting the record straight.

The following is my set of theories.

First, you had the downturn in the economy, i.e. the recession. I imagine this affected fledgling niche stations (like Phantom) relatively speaking more than the big ones because their audience was already more specific and, without sufficient advertisers, there was going to be an issue.

Then, of course, as Phantom is still struggling, Nova arrives in 2010. This, undoubtedly, would have taken some of Phantom's audience - possibly the older more general rock fans. Again I'm surmising, but I am sure advertisers would have considered Nova a better bet than Phantom.

Also, the increasing use of (and improvement in) technology meant that much of Phantom/TXFM's target audience were listening to alternative music by other non-traditional means.

Finally, you could argue that certain changes made by Communicorp possibly did not really help Phantom /TXFM gain traction, and the new management of Today FM were not very sympathetic to the ideals of TXFM.

As I say, these are all suppositions on my part but I think they sound plausible.

Back to Radio Nova:I really don't see an issue with it being a bit more adventurous with its playlist, such as playing more tracks by more artistes, and reducing the frequency with which it plays certain songs. Is this really going to put off its audience - I don't think so. It might even encourage the serious music fans to listen longer.

Avatar MIA

SimonMaher wrote: »

I'm staying out of the Nova debate, but just for factual accuracy, Phantom 105.2 came within a whisker of profitability in 2008 - just as the world fell asunder. The rest is a long and ultimately sad story but lessons have been learned

Simon

I was interested in a young radio station being close to profitability so early in its life cycle. Looking at the filed accounts Dublin Rock Radio Limited made a loss of €660K for year ending 31-10-08 bringing total accumulated losses to approx €1.6m. For the following year Phantom made losses of approx €780k, bringing total losses to approx €2.4m.

It's possible the CEO or FC said they were close to breaking even for a particular month in 2008, but it's hard to see how Phantom were within a whisker of breaking even in 2008.

Fuzzy Clam

Avatar MIA wrote:

Going even more niche won't help them to break even.

I'm not sure you know what "niche" means.
Broadening the playlist has nothing to do with niche.
The station will still be a niche station. Just one with more appeal.

Avatar MIA

Fuzzy Clam wrote: »

I'm not sure you know what "niche" means.
Broadening the playlist has nothing to do with niche.
The station will still be a niche station. Just one with more appeal.

A station that moves away from the most popular/well known to a broader playlist catering for a more discerning audience is the very definition of niche.

Declan A Walsh

Avatar MIA wrote: »

A station that moves away from the most popular/well known to a broader playlist catering for a more discerning audience is the very definition of niche.

That's not quite how The Oxford English Dictionary defines it:
A specialized segment of the market for a particular kind of product or service

With all due respect, if you are broadening the playlist, how can you at the same time cater exclusively for "a specialized segment of the market".

Avatar MIA

Declan A Walsh wrote: »

That's not quite how The Oxford English Dictionary defines it:
A specialized segment of the market for a particular kind of product or service

With all due respect, if you are broadening the playlist, how can you at the same time cater exclusively for "a specialized segment of the market".

Would you consider an audience that prefers a broader playlist to be a larger or smaller audience than to one that prefers the bigger hits of particular bands/musicians?

Fuzzy Clam

Avatar MIA wrote: »

A station that moves away from the most popular/well known to a broader playlist catering for a more discerning audience is the very definition of niche.

No. A broader playlist does not have to mean less well known songs, just more songs in the mix.
I've said this a long time ago and several people have uttered the same thing since. Nova is a station that you need to take a break from to avoid the repetitiveness. And I'm not talking about a break of a few hours but at least a week:) They do change the playlist from time to time. Adding songs and removing others. They could broaden the playlist by decreasing the regularity of which some songs and artistes are repeated without affecting the "regular" listeners who dip in for 20 minutes while at the same time attracting those who would like to listen longer.

Avatar MIA

Fuzzy Clam wrote: »

No. A broader playlist does not have to mean less well known songs, just more songs in the mix.
I've said this a long time ago and several people have uttered the same thing since. Nova is a station that you need to take a break from to avoid the repetitiveness. And I'm not talking about a break of a few hours but at least a week:) They do change the playlist from time to time. Adding songs and removing others. They could broaden the playlist by decreasing the regularity of which some songs and artistes are repeated without affecting the "regular" listeners who dip in for 20 minutes while at the same time attracting those who would like to listen longer.

That I'd agree with, I was picking up on comments where less well known songs were being suggested to broaden the playlist. It would be better to broaden the sources - there's a lot of bands/musicians out there.

SimonMaher

Avatar MIA wrote: »

I was interested in a young radio station being close to profitability so early in its life cycle. Looking at the filed accounts Dublin Rock Radio Limited made a loss of €660K for year ending 31-10-08 bringing total accumulated losses to approx €1.6m. For the following year Phantom made losses of approx €780k, bringing total losses to approx €2.4m.

It's possible the CEO or FC said they were close to breaking even for a particular month in 2008, but it's hard to see how Phantom were within a whisker of breaking even in 2008.

As you said, in trading terms, Phantom in early 2008 actually had months where income exceeded expenditure - despite the ridiculously high cost base! However, once revenue fell over the cliff it really bombed. We went from covering 60-100% of monthly costs in early 2008 to covering maybe 25% later in the year and credit control became a serious issue.

Business model for Phantom back then was nuts, but needed to be to get it past the BAI and of course, the mid-2000's (when the application was made) was generally nuts. By the time the crash came we were screwed to the wall and we made adjustments to the output as much as the model and once you're in that situation, it all gets a bit scary.

Anyway, apologies for taking this one off topic, I'll be good from now on. Sorry mods!

Simon

Big Nasty

So it's nigh on impossible to have a 'decent music' radio station under current BAI rules. I.e. if it doesn't appeal to the masses then you don't have the listenership and in turn don't have the revenue to survive. I presume that's why you didn't go after the TXFM licence Simon?

Any hope of the BAI revising / relaxing their requirements for alt stations? If not what's the plan with 8Radio, i.e. if it can never be commercially viable what's the long term hope with the current temp licence?

EDIT: posted this question in the 8Radio thread as more suited to there.

former total

The argument seems to be that if Nova played more varied or obscure tracks by well-known artists, then this would be a good thing. Fair enough.

However, it is simply NOT what your average radio listener wants. They want to turn on the radio, hear something they know and like, sing along to it in the car or kitchen, and get on with their day. If you're listening from 7 am to 7 pm, you're going to get well-known music because commercial operators have to try to cater to their audiences and that's what the audience wants. Later in the evenings, you'll get more specialised stuff because hardly anyone is listening.

There's a weird misunderstanding on this thread of what Nova is or is trying to be. It is not an alt-rock or indie station, it is not a metal or a grunge station. It most definitely is not a replacement for TXFM. It is a classic rock station. That is what they play.

Edit: the other misunderstanding is that they should, for some reason, not play recent music, that anything pre-2000 should not be on Nova. Not sure where that's coming from either.

prunudo

" It is a classic rock station. That is what they play"

On paper that's what it is, but how is Mgmt kids or bastille classic rock. I've no problem playing newer stuff but at least keep it rock orientated.

Big Nasty

If I'm not mistaken Nova's MO is 'feel good guitar music' or something like that as opposed to Classic Rock.

former total

Big Nasty wrote: »

If I'm not mistaken Nova's MO is 'feel good guitar music' or something like that as opposed to Classic Rock.

Their licence is for classic rock.

former total

jvan wrote: »

" It is a classic rock station. That is what they play"

On paper that's what it is, but how is Mgmt kids or bastille classic rock. I've no problem playing newer stuff but at least keep it rock orientated.

Those bands are at the poppier end of the spectrum alright but still basically vocals, guitar, keyboard and drums. Whether you consider them rock or pop is probably down to whether or not you like them, but it's not like they're playing David Guetta and Little Mix.

nice_guy80

I'm going to complain to the BAI

Declan A Walsh

Big Nasty wrote: »

If I'm not mistaken Nova's MO is 'feel good guitar music' or something like that as opposed to Classic Rock.

This was the announcement from the BCI in 2008:
"The Broadcasting Commission of Ireland (BCI) has today (March 28th) placed an advertisement in the national press, seeking applications to operate a classic rock service......."

" ....The service, which will be on the FM band, will be primarily music driven with a strong emphasis on classic rock music. The franchise area to be served is Dublin City and County and the commuter belt."

This was on the Radio Nova website from 2008:
A group comprising experienced radio investors has submitted an application to the Broadcasting Commission of Ireland to operate a ‘classic rock’ music radio station, aimed at Dublin city, county and the ‘commuter belt’ around the capital. Radio Nova 100 intends to provide a ‘first-rate and distinctive’ station, playing classic rock music from the 1960s to the present day, featuring some of the greatest rock artists of all time – as well as news, sport and local information.

Article from Allaccess.com:
RADIO NOVA 100, a consortium of Irish business interests backed by VIENNA INVESTMENTS, has won the license for a new Classic Rock station serving DUBLIN, IRELAND.


This all says that the BCI were looking for applications for a Classic Rock License, Radio Nova applied for same and said they were.

Big Nasty

I stand corrected. What's the cut off point for classic though I wonder, or is there one?