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Knife Attack London

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    #182
    Maximus Alexander
    Registered Users Posts: 13,080 ✭✭✭✭Maximus Alexander


    The_Valeyard wrote: »
    I often found that about London, you might not see many police, but when anything happens (fights, etc) police show up very quickly. Probably all the CCTV in operation.

    A friend and I got attacked by a gang of louts in Manchester years back. A security guard in a nearby Tesco called the police and they were there in minutes. They took us to hospital, arrested 8 guys and even spoke to our hotel for us and arranged a late checkout on our behalf. They took statements the following morning and then a couple of months later we were informed that they'd been successfully prosecuted and 8 jail sentences handed down. The police over there are excellent.


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    #183
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Maximus Alexander wrote: »
    A friend and I got attacked by a gang of louts in Manchester years back. A security guard in a nearby Tesco called the police and they were there in minutes. They took us to hospital, arrested 8 guys and even spoke to our hotel for us and arranged a late checkout on our behalf. They took statements the following morning and then a couple of months later we were informed that they'd been successfully prosecuted and 8 jail sentences handed down. The police over there are excellent.

    They really are.

    Their system over there is superb and, as someone mentioned, while you might not see a visible police presence somewhere, they'll always be there somewhere.

    It's especially why people should try not to worry about terrorist attacks in London - after the 7/7 attacks on the underground and buses, they have worked hard on being prepared, with holding yearly drills in such an eventuality.

    I'd be more worried about an ISIS Paris style attack in Ireland, because I really don't know how our police are prepared for that situation. Sure, they have a lot of experience with the IRA, but that's a whole different league to what ISIS is capable of ..


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    #184
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,456 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    silverharp wrote: »
    but why does the second generation afghan overly care about what is happening in Syria? Britain or France isn't doing anything to Pakistan as far as I am aware so "logically" second generation kids from Pakistan should not be showing up in terrorist statistics which I am sure they are.

    They care about what's happening in the countries the same as 2nd Gen Americans cares about what was happening in Ireland. Haven't seen any Pakistani terror statistics but feel free to pop up a link. Then again there have been numerous drone strikes in Pakistan that have killed scores of innocent civilians.


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    #185
    LuckyRoche
    Registered Users Posts: 86 ✭✭LuckyRoche


    Little CuChulainn wrote: »
    How does that solve the current problem? Surely it's best to address the issue now instead of ban immigrants and hope terrorism stops in 20 years through attrition.

    Letting millions more come in unchecked from the region certainly isn't the solution.


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    #186
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,456 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    HamsterFace wrote: »
    I didn't say there was?
    Just said it was there religion that was linking them

    Sure all those ira men were catholics does that mean religion was a link?


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    #187
    HamsterFace
    Closed Accounts Posts: 832 ✭✭✭HamsterFace


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote:
    Sure all those ira men were catholics does that mean religion was a link?

    You're going out of your way to find an argument where there is none and if you read over the comments you will see you even agreed with the, very basic, comment I made.

    Get your back down man, it's early :-)


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    #188
    silverharp
    Registered Users Posts: 17,849 ✭✭✭✭silverharp


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    They care about what's happening in the countries the same as 2nd Gen Americans cares about what was happening in Ireland. Haven't seen any Pakistani terror statistics but feel free to pop up a link. Then again there have been numerous drone strikes in Pakistan that have killed scores of innocent civilians.

    look at in in reverse though , French or Spanish catholics didn't rush money to the IRA because they were Catholic or that Catholics might have been treated badly. Islam seems to do far better of job of if you offend one muslim you have offended a billion of them

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



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    #189
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,456 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    silverharp wrote: »
    look at in in reverse though , French or Spanish catholics didn't rush money to the IRA because they were Catholic or that Catholics might have been treated badly.

    But the Irish did head off to Spain to fight and protect the Catholic Church there.
    Islam seems to do far better of job of if you offend one muslim you have offended a billion of them

    Again lumping all in with one sweep of the brush, I work with a Muslim woman who has a wicked sense of humour and live couple of doors away from a Muslim doctor who chats with me on a regular basis. Neither has tried to behead me yet but I'll get back to you if they ever try :rolleyes:


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    #190
    Widdershins
    Registered Users Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Anyone still insisting Islamic Extremism has nothing to do with religion and anything to do with drones need to catch up . Do a bit of reading , listen to the Muslim reformists You should start by reading IS's latest announcement affirming that they hate ''you '' because you're not Muslim . They hate everything about Western culture and even if you become their slaves and pay their protection money they will hate you . IF YOU CONVERT to Islam they will ''stop fighting you but still hate you ''.


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    #191
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Widdershins wrote: »
    Anyone still insisting Islamic Extremism has nothing to do with religion and anything to do with drones need to catch up . Do a bit of reading , listen to the Muslim reformists You should start by reading IS's latest announcement affirming that they hate ''you '' because you're not Muslim . They hate everything about Western culture and even if you become their slaves and pay their protection money they will hate you . IF YOU CONVERT to Islam they will ''stop fighting you but still hate you ''.

    ... just sounds like bogstandard propaganda, which isn't unique to their situation.


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    #192
    Widdershins
    Registered Users Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Deleted User wrote: »
    ... just sounds like bogstandard propaganda, which isn't unique to their situation.

    Are you saying they can't be believed because , what , they don't really mean it?

    From the horses mouth and some people can't accept it. That is classic denial.


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    #193
    silverharp
    Registered Users Posts: 17,849 ✭✭✭✭silverharp


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    But the Irish did head off to Spain to fight and protect the Catholic Church there.

    not in my life time they havnt , also how many Irish Americans actually fought for the IRA in NI? , I'm guessing near zero if not actually zero. If at most European or American Muslims were fund raising for terrorists in their particular homeland it wouldn't be great but you might get it to a certain point but its magnitudes worse.



    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    Again lumping all in with one sweep of the brush, I work with a Muslim woman who has a wicked sense of humour and live couple of doors away from a Muslim doctor who chats with me on a regular basis. Neither has tried to behead me yet but I'll get back to you if they ever try :rolleyes:

    its a % thing , for every molenbeek or Luton there is going to be active promotion of extremism and hatred of the host country and its values.

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



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    #194
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,456 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Widdershins wrote: »
    Are you saying they can't be believed because , what , they don't really mean it?

    From the horses mouth and some people can't accept it. That is classic denial.
    Widdershins wrote: »
    Anyone still insisting Islamic Extremism has nothing to do with religion and anything to do with drones need to catch up . Do a bit of reading , listen to the Muslim reformists You should start by reading IS's latest announcement affirming that they hate ''you '' because you're not Muslim . They hate everything about Western culture and even if you become their slaves and pay their protection money they will hate you . IF YOU CONVERT to Islam they will ''stop fighting you but still hate you ''.

    But when they post video saying g they are committing an act because of the bombing of civilians by drones you refuse to accept that even when it's from the proverbial horses mouth?


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    #195
    Widdershins
    Registered Users Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    I work with a Muslim woman who has a wicked sense of humour and live couple of doors away from a Muslim doctor who chats with me on a regular basis. Neither has tried to behead me yet but I'll get back to you if they ever try :rolleyes:

    The fact that Muslims are capable of decency was not questioned (that I'm aware of )


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    #196
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Widdershins wrote: »
    Are you saying they can't be believed because , what , they don't really mean it?

    From the horses mouth and some people can't accept it. That is classic denial.

    As someone pointed out, you're in denial about the fact that numerous ISIS propaganda have made mention of bombings of their homes.

    It's the point of propaganda - you use as many things as possible ways to reach as many as possible. The one you quoted was obviously targeted at the disenfranchised youth, of which there is many, and which normally makes up the ranks of their forces.


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    #197
    Widdershins
    Registered Users Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Deleted User wrote: »
    As someone pointed out, you're in denial about the fact that numerous ISIS propaganda have made mention of bombings of their homes.

    It's the point of propaganda - you use as many things as possible ways to reach as many as possible. The one you quoted was obviously targeted at the disenfranchised youth, of which there is many, and which normally makes up the ranks of their forces.

    As who pointed out? Nobody mentioned me .No I am not , I'm aware of the theme of their announcements and if I am wrong then so are the experts, the whole community of reformists and academics . I don't know why you insist on divorcing religion from extremism , it's regressive and obstructs reform.


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    #198
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Widdershins wrote: »
    As who pointed out? Nobody mentioned me .No I am not , I'm aware of the theme of their announcements and if I am wrong then so are the experts, the whole community of reformists and academics . I don't know why you insist on divorcing religion from extremism , it's regressive and obstructs reform.

    Where is the proof by the experts and academics that you mention?

    Also --
    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    But when they post video saying g they are committing an act because of the bombing of civilians by drones you refuse to accept that even when it's from the proverbial horses mouth?

    There you go.


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    #199
    Widdershins
    Registered Users Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    But when they post video saying g they are committing an act because of the bombing of civilians by drones you refuse to accept that even when it's from the proverbial horses mouth?

    When did I do that ? They are attacking many targets most of whom had no hand in bombing anyone . They are killing civilians themselves . It is not that civilian deaths aren't an issue but isis is not about grievances for innocent people and it's naive to think they are. There are better ways to support people affected by war than to be an unwitting accessory to vicious indiscriminate terrorists .


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    #200
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,456 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Widdershins wrote: »
    When did I do that ? They are attacking many targets most of whom had no hand in bombing anyone . They are killing civilians themselves . It is not that civilian deaths aren't an issue but isis is not about grievances for innocent people and it's naive to think they are. There are better ways to support people affected by war than to be an unwitting accessory to vicious indiscriminate terrorists .

    When you said
    still insisting Islamic Extremism has nothing to do with religion and anything to do with drones


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    #201
    Widdershins
    Registered Users Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Where is the proof by the experts and academics that you mention?

    Also --


    There you go.

    Have you ever looked ? I know the pattern of Boards threads and it is more about scoring points so I don't believe you are interested . One of my favourite reformists is Aayan Hirsi Ali, I would start with her work . She explains well why it's unhelpful to try to deny the religious aspect of extremism .


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    #202
    Widdershins
    Registered Users Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    When you said

    Right change that to ''everything ''
    'Cause picking over that is the important thing


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    #203
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,456 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Widdershins wrote: »
    Right change that to ''everything ''
    'Cause picking over that is the important thing

    You'require the one denying civilian deaths by drone strike has no significance not me.

    Any sign of those statistics on Pakistani terrorist attacks in the west?


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    #204
    Widdershins
    Registered Users Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    You'require the one denying civilian deaths by drone strike has no significance not me.

    Any sign of those statistics on Pakistani terrorist attacks in the west?

    It has less significance than the toxic interpretation of islam without which isis would not be isis. But ignore that because it's uncomfortable if you like. Don't expect others to do the same .


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    #205
    rjpf1980
    Registered Users Posts: 387 ✭✭rjpf1980


    A Somali Muslim immigrant to Norway attacks Israeli and American tourists in London with a knife after a spate of lone wolf Muslim terrorist attacks.

    Nothing to see here. Move on.


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    #206
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,456 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Widdershins wrote: »
    It has less significance than the toxic interpretation of islam without which isis would not be isis. But ignore that because it's uncomfortable if you like. Don't expect others to do the same .

    I'm ignoring nothing

    I agree that there are elements of Islam who twist the words of the Koran to suit their agenda and use this to radicalise people into doing these attacks

    I also know that some doing these attacks are doing so because of drone/missile strikes by the west,

    But ignore that because it's uncomfortable if you like. Don't expect others to do the same ;)


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    #207
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,456 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    rjpf1980 wrote: »
    A Somali Muslim immigrant to Norway attacks Israeli and American tourists in London with a knife after a spate of lone wolf Muslim terrorist attacks.

    Nothing to see here. Move on.

    Any evidence to disprove the statements from the police that this is not terrorism connected and just a man with mental health issues that attacked people at random?


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    #208
    Widdershins
    Registered Users Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    I'm ignoring nothing

    I agree that there are elements of Islam who twist the words of the Koran to suit their agenda and use this to radicalise people into doing these attacks

    I also know that some doing these attacks are doing so because of drone/missile strikes by the west,

    But ignore that because it's uncomfortable if you like. Don't expect others to do the same ;)

    They -is-are hardly going to thank the west for bombing them. They are not worried about civilians .


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    #209
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,456 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Widdershins wrote: »
    They -is-are hardly going to thank the west for bombing them. They are not worried about civilians .

    And as has been proven many times the west also don't give a sh/t about civilians when unleashing hell fire missiles.


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    #210
    Little CuChulainn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,624 ✭✭✭Little CuChulainn


    LuckyRoche wrote: »
    Letting millions more come in unchecked from the region certainly isn't the solution.

    I haven't heard anyone suggest it was. Have you? In fact, many people in this thread alone have suggested the issues are unrelated. Immigration isn't contributing to these attacks so stopping it in the name of preventing attacks is wrong.


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    #211
    Widdershins
    Registered Users Posts: 10,633 ✭✭✭✭Widdershins


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    And as has been proven many times the west also don't give a sh/t about civilians when unleashing hell fire missiles.

    Are you isis's public relations person ?


This discussion has been closed.
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