you should just "GET OVER" ever owning a home says PP boss

riclad

We need skilled builders if we want to build 30k units per year i did not say they would be low wage workers but we are competing with EU countrys where rents are low cost of living is low compared with Ireland if I was in power I would form a new unit whose single purpose is to provide free land sites to any charity who will allow self build units and give land to habitat for humanity eg you spend 2 to 3 days a week building your own house for working people on say 20 to 30k there's a grand designs program about this houses designed to be made of basic materials easy to build for non experts in middle Eastern country's they can just import 10000 workers from Asia to build skyscrapers we don't have that option

Mr. teddywinkles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118843966#Comment_118843966

So you want more immigrants to build houses for immigrants?. Isnt this the whole problem?

riclad

The point I'm making is we need 30k housing units built every year to keep up with the demand I doubt if the building industry we have now is ready to take on that task otherwise we face the future of rising rents rising house prices

It has happened in Japan inflation rising house prices equals low birth rate young people are not having children or getting married because housing is very expensive builders move around the EU depending on where the work is and where the wage rates are high

BattleCorp1

Guy on the radio reckons we need to continually hit 50k new builds for about a decade to catch up on demand. We won't even see half of that being built. Building is actually going to slow down due to the astronomical increase in the price of building materials.

jolivmmx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/100066755#Comment_100066755

Here is the issue. Irish pensions are based on the assumption that you will no longer have to pay for your accommodation or dependents. Hence, a 1/3 reduction in disposable income is not an issue. However, if you factor in that the person may still have to pay rent when they receive a pension, it is catastrophic. In the absence of rent-controls, there is the untenable situation of people struggling to pay rent and also not having certainty of where they will live. Our inability to buy today contributes to the old age poverty of tomorrow. We are kicking a major problem down the road. We will start to see it germinate in about 20-25 years

Feisar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845330#Comment_118845330

Was just chatting about this at the weekend. What the feck is going to happen when all our people can't afford their rent anymore?

jolivmmx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845374#Comment_118845374

It is a terrifying prospect. Presumably, they will have to offer a rent subsidy. But given the current pension situation, if you take say a person on the median income (40k), when they retire, they will get 1,800 p/m. They will probably have little savings, given the extortionate price of living and their contribution towards rent. With this 1,800, they will have to pay electricity, internet, food, health and rent. If they lived all their lives in Dublin, they will probably no longer be able to afford it. So, in their 70s, they will be forced to move elsewhere. And then, it will probably be untenable to live alone. This brewing problem is going to be our generation’s nightmare!!!

Also, whether or not you agree with the Fair Deal scheme, there will be a lot of people from our generation who won’t have a cent to our name when it comes to nursing home time. What will the state do with us?

Ultimately, it is actually in the state’s benefit for people to own homes.

BattleCorp1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845374#Comment_118845374

Back in the 90's I was working in construction near San Francisco. One day a cement truck pulled up and an auld lad struggled to get down out of it. I went over to him and helped him down. While the lorry was doing its thing pumping cement, we got to chatting. Turns out he was almost 80 years of age. Me being young and stupid was pretty blunt and asked him what was he doing working at that age? Why wasn't he retired? His answer "If I retire, I can't pay my rent".

That's what is ahead of many of us.

jolivmmx

These figures are from the end of 2021. This is likely to be worse now.

The national average house price was €290,998and prices in the last three months of this year were 7.7% higher than the same period in 2020, according to the website's House Price Report. The average price for a house in Dublin in 2021 increased by 3.4% on last year to €405,259.

The average annual earnings for employees in Ireland is €40,283 per year or €3,356 per month (gross salary).

——————————————————

If you have 2 people (with no dependents) who earn the median salary, they can take out a mortgage of 280,000 max.

So bottom line, 2 ordinary people on the average wage cannot afford the average house in Ireland.

And for somebody alone, buying a houe is just not going to happen

We need to make house prices within the reach of people. Otherwise, who are the houses for?

jolivmmx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845421#Comment_118845421

We need to fight to make sure that this does not become a reality?

If we cannot buy the houses, then who is buying the houses and more importantly, who is benefiting from the extortionate rents?

BattleCorp1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845554#Comment_118845554

No easy fix unfortunately.

jolivmmx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845804#Comment_118845804

No. But we have to try. It will become an even worse problem if we leave it be.

We need to support further houses to be built. We need to make sure that these go to people who plan to live in them. We need to support people to save. I don’t have the answers. But we need to fix it

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845554#Comment_118845554

Institutional money. Financial corporations. Private equity firms.

BattleCorp1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845826#Comment_118845826

One part of the solution is to get the councils back building social housing. And do it as cheap as possible. Simple rectangle buildings that are easy to build will help keep the building costs down. This will stop the councils/other state supported housing agencies from outbidding private buyers.

But the above idea isn't paletable to many people as the view is that social housing estates aren't a good idea from an anti-social/stigma point of view.

jolivmmx

I was reading about the court case of the barrister who shot the man. He has 180 acres of land in Tallaght. There is so much land in this country that could be put to good use. We should try to build houses left, right and centre, as cheaply as possible

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845847#Comment_118845847

....again, this all leads back to financialisation of markets, it has catastrophically failed, but we havent truly accepted this yet, and our political institutions are still stuck in these beliefs and ideologies.....

jolivmmx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845892#Comment_118845892

The problem is that there is no incentive to create. The incentive is to buy up what is there, live off the rent generated and retain the capital investment when you sell it

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845891#Comment_118845891

It's not a coincidence that certain people are sitting on the landbanks that surround key areas of the city

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845904#Comment_118845904

this is exactly what this process is about, but our political institutions are stuck into thinking this is the best way of getting the job done, its clearly not, it just ultimately leads to monopolisation of markets, serious supply issues, and hyper inflated prices, this has happened in most parts of the world that have engaged in these approaches

jolivmmx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845924#Comment_118845924

Imagine how many houses could be built on 180 acres of land in Tallaght?

jolivmmx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845926#Comment_118845926

Who will deal with all the homeless old people who cannot pay their rent with their paltry pensions from my generation and those in need of nursing homes? It will haunt us all sooner or later

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845924#Comment_118845924

evidence of land hoarding can be clearly seen in many parts of the country, including my own, polices or lack of, are maintaining this situation....

jolivmmx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845945#Comment_118845945

We need to disincentivise land-hoarding. It causes damage to our society

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845998#Comment_118845998

The Kenny Report around 1976 set out the policy to achieve this, so that landowners would not benefit from windfall profits from rezoning. No government has actioned this.

jolivmmx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118846028#Comment_118846028

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/plans-to-sell-rezoned-dublin-jam-factory-site-for-25m-leave-sour-taste-1.4704012

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118845943#Comment_118845943

everybody can see whats potentially going to happen in the future, and everybody is running from it, including governments, but we all can clearly see, our current approach is catastrophically failing right now, i suspect we re on the cusp of radical changes to try prevent this potential future, we have to succeed, as failure truly isnt an option, there are some really interesting ideas out there, and i think some will be implemented soon, as we ll simply have no option, and some might just work....

jolivmmx

Ironically enough, we will not be able to retain people to build the houses. The problem is that people who are earning an average wage will not be inclined to waste their income on extortionate rent

canuckle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118846450#Comment_118846450

You're probably right.

But all that highlights is that building more is not going to fix the housing crisis.

If your country can only operate on a pyramid-scheme level, then it's time to change tack while there's still time. Sustainability.

Demand needs to be addressed first. A good start would be a mere acknowledgement of it's existence.

Supply comes second.

Turn off the taps in the flooding house before trying to mop up. A logical problem needs logical thinking, not ignorance.

Ray Palmer

Reality is everything has a cost and people often do not understand the cost of progression.

If you ignore the good outcomes and focus on the costs alone you can make yourself very miserable.

Women being encouraged to work outside the home meant house prices would rise as dual income became more normal

Less women doing the social caring meant somebody would need to be paid to do this work. Professional care needs to be to a standard

There is loads of other examples of how progressive developments cause issues. One people give out about is free housing and and single mothers benefits. I think it is better than how unmarried women with babies were treated and ultimately that is the argument people are making but don't consider it that way.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118847514#Comment_118847514

encouraging women into the workplace has been of great benefit, women have an enormous amount to bring to the table, as they re generally far more caring and compassionate than us males, us males also tend to be far more dichotomous in our thinking and decision making, whereby many women tend to be able to see the bigger picture far easier, and whats required for a fairer society, traits from both males and females together, tend to lead to far better outcomes for most. you ll probably find most damage done to society has come from male dominant sectors, in particular from the political and economic fields.....