Leinster V Rugby's Biggest Bandwagon; 28/5/2016 17:30 Murrayfield: SS3 & TG4

Billysays no

former total wrote: »

I'm sorry but weren't you viciously critical of Lam and the majority of the players for long periods prior to this season?

very true. i said what i felt. marmion broke my heart with slow rubbish. robbie henshaw was an RK lookalike. i dont think i was wrong. marmion whips stuff out these days, robbie is not a good fullback but is an incredible inside centre.

jm08

typhoony wrote: »

so the fanbase hasnt grown or did you just pick low attendances for your examples, i wonder what the yearly average home match attendances was for the period 2005 to 2009?

I'd say that Munster only had the big crowds at Heineken Cup games. The fanbase has grown for the league.

05/06 Home Games
14/15 Home Games

3500 (TP)

13,428 Edinburgh
6700

12,488 Zebre
5000
13,547 Ospreys
7500 (Leinster)
13,851
13,500 (Castres HC)
26,000 (Saracens)
6,000 (Ulster)
17,101 (Ulster)
13,200 (Dragons HC)
25,600 (Clermont)
8,000 (Connacht 27 Dec TP)
25,600 Leinster
5000
17,685 (Sale Sharks)
48,500 (Perp QF – Lansdowne)
7,361*
9,000
18,762 (Connacht)
13,200 (TP – week after winning HC).
7,644*

I picked those two years 05/06 because this is when Munster won their first Heineken Cup and it was prior to the redevelopment of Thomond Park and it wasn't a World Cup Year which messed up some games.

14/15 is the other year I chose as the most recent which would not have been affected by world cup.

*Games in Musgrave Park with lower capacity.

Sorry, that didn't work out right. Dark shade is 05/06.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

Billysays no wrote: »

very true. i said what i felt. marmion broke my heart with slow rubbish. robbie henshaw was an RK lookalike. i dont think i was wrong. marmion whips stuff out these days, robbie is not a good fullback but is an incredible inside centre.

Does he not play outside centre for Connacht?

The Lost Sheep

MarinersBlues wrote: »

Plenty of room for a decent sized stand where the Clan is.
They just need to clear some space behind it.

I did note that the stands are farther away from the sideline in Murrayfield than in the SG.
The greyhound track is no impediment to stands along the sideline.

What IYO would be a decent sized stand? How would you clear space behind the clan?

wp_rathead wrote: »

This is map of the ground, dunno how much they have to work with tbh unless they demolish the car park

You cant really remove the car park though...

MarinersBlues wrote: »

Love this and hope it's true.
This is exactly what I want to hear.
If we want to be taken seriously we have to stop the poor-mouth and playing the victim.

Everything is in Connacht's control now. They have the infrastructure, players and the supporters time to take things into their own hands.
A stadium for Connacht is not a responsibility for the IRFU, GAA, IGB, County Council or even Galway Utd. It is only Connacht's and Connacht alone.
If they can get other people on board well and good but they shouldn't have to rely on it

They have loads of prime space in the Sportsground that they use as a training pitch. Transforming that into something more valuable would be a good start.

Stadium for Connacht is partly responsibility of IRFU. You need the back pitch as there is Boys Club, training pitch for all teams etc etc. Everything is not at all in Connachts control

Billysays no

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

Does he not play outside centre for Connacht?

No

irishbucsfan

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

Does he not play outside centre for Connacht?

Yes, he does

jm08

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

None of that goes against the point I was making. If the IRFU don't give Connacht the exact same money they Munster it shouldn't be seen as another slight at Connacht. Munster had a swell of support much like Connacht are having now but they struggle to fill their stadium. Not everyone who got on the Munster bandwagon stayed on it. The same thing will happen with Connacht. I know they will have to get into some debt to build or redevelop, my point is simply that if the IRFU don't help them build something the size of Thomand it shouldn't be used as another sick to beat them with.

I'll just make the point that the IRFU will not invest any money in any project even if they did own the ground. They only loaned Munster 15m and Munster had to raise the rest themselves (approx. €35m).

Munster never had a huge attendances at PRO12 games. That maybe because there are probably more Munster fans living in the Dublin area than there are in Munster itself and only travel back occasionally.

Bazzo

Billysays no wrote: »

No

Yes he does Billy. Aki plays 12 and Henshaw 13 for Connacht, it's been that way for 2 years now. In fact, I think Henshaw wore the 12 jersey for Ireland before Connacht, and over all his senior caps he's only started at inside centre a couple of times.

Teferi

What have Munster got to do with a final between Leinster V Connacht?

Answer: Nothing.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

jm08 wrote: »

I'll just make the point that the IRFU will not invest any money in any project even if they did own the ground. They only loaned Munster 15K and Munster had to raise the rest themselves (approx. €35m).

Munster never had a huge attendances at PRO12 games. That maybe because there are probably more Munster fans living in the Dublin area than there are in Munster itself and only travel back occasionally.

Is that a typo or are you saying thr IRFU only contributed 15,000 to Thomand Park?

jm08

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

Is that a typo or are you saying thr IRFU only contributed 15,000 to Thomand Park?

Oops. It should be €15m (and they have paid back about 5.5m).

jm08

Teferi wrote: »

What have Munster got to do with a final between Leinster V Connacht?

Answer: Nothing.

What has building a new stadium in Connacht got to do with a final between Leinster v Connacht?

The Lost Sheep

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

Is that a typo or are you saying thr IRFU only contributed 15,000 to Thomand Park?

He's wrong they gave much more for thomond....

Billysays no

Bazzo wrote: »

Yes he does Billy. Aki plays 12 and Henshaw 13 for Connacht, it's been that way for 2 years now. In fact, I think Henshaw wore the 12 jersey for Ireland before Connacht, and over all his senior caps he's only started at inside centre a couple of times.

I'm wrong.

WarZ

Jaysus Billy dont know how a fanatic Connacht supporter such as yourself made that mistake

Yeah_Right

Billysays no wrote: »

i do love to be right marinersblues but was i right about last weekend. i always believed. over the years i cribbed about henshaw and marmion. i said marmion needed to play faster. and now he does. i said henshaw would be a crap fullback because he lives within the RK mold. No longer. Henshaw was running around players for fun this weekend but it took time. Pat Lam has taught him well.

I am so thrilled for these players. they have developed to be the players i wanted them to be. My bitching is concluded. I saw the potential but finally it was delivered. Robbie Henshaw will be a great player because Pat Lam has taught him to play something other than crash bang rugby, kieran will be a great player because pat lam has shown him how to play quick rugby.

It is simply lovely to see

Didn't you recently say that Connacht would always stick to their game plan and run the ball, never kick for goal and always go for the try? How did they win their semi-final? Can you break down the scoring?

Shurimgreat

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Kingspan wasn't the IRFU, nor is the RDS redevelopment.

Aviva is the national stadium, a bit different to any of the others. Thomond has turned out to be much harder to fund than anticipated.

I'm completely in favour of Connacht getting assistance by the way, but it's not like everyone has been getting handouts left, right and center as you seem to suggest.

Ok fair enough. However, they did receive huge funding from the Northern Executive.

http://www.irishrugby.ie/news/31967.php#.V04NH032brc

In 2012, Ulster Rugby secured £16.5 million of funding from the Northern Ireland Executive for the redevelopment of the ground. Three new stands were built raising capacity from 11,400 to 18,000.

The stadium hosts the Ulster Rugby squad's professional training base, consisting of a 7,000 square foot gym, meeting rooms and medical facilities.

Regards the Aviva, Leinster have use of it for big Champions Cup games. They mightn't make any money from the games but at least it allows more fans attend the games.

Its not really a level playing field across the board.

irishbucsfan

Shurimgreat wrote: »

Ok fair enough. However, they did receive huge funding from the Northern Executive.

http://www.irishrugby.ie/news/31967.php#.V04NH032brc



Regards the Aviva, Leinster have use of it for big Champions Cup games. They mightn't make any money from the games but at least it allows more fans attend the games.

Its not really a level playing field across the board.

And Connacht can request a government grant for development of a new ground in Galway. The RDS got the same for redevelopment of their stadium. That has nothing to do with your claims that Connacht are under-supported by the IRFU.

Leinster use the Aviva because it's profitable for the IRFU. If it wasn't they wouldn't be playing there. That benefits everyone in Irish rugby, so I really don't see why you're complaining about that. Connacht would be unlikely to break even in there but it would be great if they could find a temporary larger ground for European games closer to home in conjuction with their own 10k seater stadium.

MarinersBlues

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

What IYO would be a decent sized stand? How would you clear space behind the clan?

You cant really remove the car park though...

Stadium for Connacht is partly responsibility of IRFU. You need the back pitch as there is Boys Club, training pitch for all teams etc etc. Everything is not at all in Connachts control

4500 seater west stand in Sale is a decent template.
That would bring capacity up to 10,000 and sort out the seating issue.
http://www.rugbygroundguide.com/sale.html

If they can't find an alternative location for a training pitch and a junior team to free up a prime location, then why would you expect any other body to put themselves out to satisfy Connacht?

Billysays no

WarZ wrote: »

Jaysus Billy dont know how a fanatic Connacht supporter such as yourself made that mistake

what it says to me is I know bollix. how about u warz? i try to think I know things but I get it wrong consistently. what I did say is Connacht would win this weekend. I have supported them year in and year out (negative comments included). I have always believed in them. Always.

its_phil

Shurimgreat wrote: »

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Kingspan wasn't the IRFU, nor is the RDS redevelopment.

Aviva is the national stadium, a bit different to any of the others. Thomond has turned out to be much harder to fund than anticipated.

I'm completely in favour of Connacht getting assistance by the way, but it's not like everyone has been getting handouts left, right and center as you seem to suggest.

Ok fair enough. However, they did receive huge funding from the Northern Executive.

http://www.irishrugby.ie/news/31967.php#.V04NH032brc

In 2012, Ulster Rugby secured 16.5 million of funding from the Northern Ireland Executive for the redevelopment of the ground. Three new stands were built raising capacity from 11,400 to 18,000.

The stadium hosts the Ulster Rugby squad's professional training base, consisting of a 7,000 square foot gym, meeting rooms and medical facilities.

Regards the Aviva, Leinster have use of it for big Champions Cup games. They mightn't make any money from the games but at least it allows more fans attend the games.

Its not really a level playing field across the board.

Both arguments against Leinster and Ulster have nothing to do with the IRFU.

Leinster can sell out the Aviva, no other province can do that maybe Munster aside. I'm sure the option is there for Connacht but are they seriously going to ask?

What the Northern Irish government does with their money is not at all relevant? If it's not a fair playing field then all those French teams better cough up the cash to even Northern Hemisphere rugby.

Also a grant was given by government to build Clan stand IIRC.

Billysays no

Yeah_Right wrote: »

Didn't you recently say that Connacht would always stick to their game plan and run the ball, never kick for goal and always go for the try? How did they win their semi-final? Can you break down the scoring?

at some point in life, and I was a critic beyond critics, you have to kinda admit what was put in front of you is the feckin bees knees. no criticism just quality. accept it. what we saw this weekend was simply stunning.

nice_guy80

thing about the dog track is that it is so close to the town centre
people can just walk down

any other location would suffer from less atmosphere and less of a walk up crowd

Shelflife

Lads and Lassies it doesnt matter what the others got or didnt get.

The fact remains that the IRFU have increased the funding to Connacht over the years and both sides are happy with the returns.

As regards a stadium, well thats up to Connacht to sort out and get up and running and thats what they are in the middle of doing, its going to be a slow process but at least a start has been made and the win at the weekend will be a great boost.

Will the IRFU help out with the stadium ? I cant see any reason why they wouldnt but they will be sensible about it and will expect the Connacht branch to do most of the heavy lifting,which Connacht are happy to do.

dtpc191991

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

irishbucsfan wrote: »

So then you see that Connacht fans aren't asking for the exact same money as Munster?

I think it would be terrific for Irish rugby if Connacht were to own their own stadium. Make hay while the sun is shining etc

The post I originally replied to was one suggesting Connacht would be fobbed off and fans told to be happy with what they have. It also mentioned Munster getting money to build Thomand.

All I said was that Munster have a giant stadium they can't currently fill and that if the IRFU decide to take a more cautious/realistic approach with helping Connacht build or redevelop it doesn't mean Connacht are being fobbed off and treated as the lesser province.

I know Connacht fans and the powers that be in Connacht aren't looking to build Thomand II. I know that the plans laid out by Connacht the other week are reasonable and realistic.

Part of me has always believed that the IRFU only fronted the cash to build Thomand that big to assist with the various Rugby World Cup bids in discussion at the time. Of course this is conjecture, there is no actual evidence to suggest it but it may explain why the IRFU took a risk on Munster maintaining such a huge fan base.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

Listening to Shane Horgan on Monday's Second Captains podcast and he was pretty scathing about Leinster's entire set up for this match. He gave Connacht their dues but he thought Leinster's defence, their constantly trying to slow the pace down, being completely unwilling to counterattack and not "resourcing the rucks" was all very basic stuff and that anybody who watched Connacht play at all this season should have known better.

WarZ

Shelflife wrote: »

As regards a stadium, well thats up to Connacht to sort out and get up and running and thats what they are in the middle of doing, its going to be a slow process but at least a start has been made and the win at the weekend will be a great boost.

Will the IRFU help out with the stadium ? I cant see any reason why they wouldnt but they will be sensible about it and will expect the Connacht branch to do most of the heavy lifting,which Connacht are happy to do.

The IRFU are going to be extremely cautious about any upgrades to stadiums after having to bank roll Munster for the Thomond redevelopment. Connacht should see how things go next season and if there is still the projected demand then apply for redevelopment.

I would love to see Connacht become a powerhouse in Irish rugby. Who would have thought a few years ago that we would be seeing the province standings in this order:
Connacht
Leinster
Ulster
Munster

Amazing year.

Billysays no

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

Listening to Shane Horgan on Monday's Second Captains podcast and he was pretty scathing about Leinster's entire set up for this match. He gave Connacht their dues but he thought Leinster's defence, their constantly trying to slow the pace down, being completely unwilling to counterattack and not "resourcing the rucks" was all very basic stuff and that anybody who watched Connacht play at all this season should have known better.

on a serious note, is that what we are to witness in sa. and if so how can it be changed?

Podge_irl

Billysays no wrote: »

on a serious note, is that what we are to witness in sa

Why would it be?

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

Billysays no wrote: »

on a serious note, is that what we are to witness in sa. and if so how can it be changed?

Well unless Leinster or Connacht are planning on heading down to South Africa in the summer your question is irrelevant.