All households must be registered with a licensed waste collector by July 1

Allinall

HensVassal wrote: »

What on Earth made you come to that conclusion?

Your post that I quoted.

Allinall

HensVassal wrote: »

These assholes charge us for a plastic bag at the supermarket in some "altruistic" bid to save the environment and at the same time demand that we put our fcuking toothpaste in a plastic bag at the airport in some dismal attempt to convince us it's all in the interests of the "war on terra".

Here.

I wear socks

Apparently Eircode is going to be used to ensure this Law is enforced, I guess they had to find some use for it.

seamus

HensVassal wrote: »

There's a big difference between inflation and price-gouging. Once the consumer is on the hook to a private corporation for a service that corporation can jack up the price in the interests of the bottom line

Yeah, sure they can. That's how free markets work.

Which re-reg are you? We have no end of conspiracy theorist "stick it to do man" types around here.

Graham

HensVassal wrote: »

There's a big difference between inflation and price-gouging. Once the consumer is on the hook to a private corporation for a service that corporation can jack up the price in the interests of the bottom line and it's got fcuk all to do with inflation although they'll always tell you it is because if they were honest with you and admitted they were fleecing you you might get ever so miffed. Better to let you think it's all for your own good.

If only someone could invent a process whereby the services provided by private corporations could be compared against each other and they could battle for your business, a competition if you will :rolleyes:

BattleCorp

Graham wrote: »

If only someone could invent a process whereby the services provided by private corporations could be compared against each other and they could battle for your business, a competition if you will :rolleyes:

That might work in Dublin but the options down in rural Ireland aren't as good.

lazza14

Where you getting this info from anyway ?

New rules in 2016
New rules will come into effect throughout the State from 1 July 2016. They include:

An obligation on all householders (with some exceptions) to segregate food waste from other household waste
An obligation on waste collectors to provide separate receptacles (such as wheelie bins) for food waste, and collect them at least once a fortnight
A 'pay by weight' charging system for all types of waste

Thats all I see here

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/environment/waste_management_and_recycling/domestic_refuse.html

HensVassal

Allinall wrote: »

Why don't you re-use bags for your shopping?

Are you really saying the people that brought in the plastic bag levy are the same ones that regulate security at airports? Really, like?

Mate,

The plastic bag charge is just another scam to make the consumer pay for everything. You think the "drop in the ocean" gesture of plastic bag reduction has the slightest impact on environmental improvement when everything you're putting in your little cloth "bag for life" is in a damn plastic container anyway? Your bottle of Fairy liquid? You jumbo family pack of 12 packs of Tayto, all themselves packaged into another plastic bag? Your plastic bottle of ketchup? Your 6-pack of half litre bottles of Coca-Cola, again themselves snuggly packaged into a plastic jacket? Your frozen peas? Your slab of smoked salmon? Your litre carton of milk? Your 6 yoghurts? Your plastic tub of olives? Your plastic pack of rigatoni? etc., etc?

In the US 35 BILLION plastic bottles are thrown away each year. Big impact your reusing a carrier bag is going to have on that.
If companies can package their shit in plastic yet you have to pay to use plastic then they should be charged too and should buy it back off you.

Speedwell

lazza14 wrote: »

Where you getting this info from anyway ?[/url]

News reports, waste collector sites, county council sites, and the waste collection bill I received last week. My most productive Google string was "pay by weight" cost requirements July 2016.

Speedwell

HensVassal wrote: »

Mate,

In the US 35 BILLION plastic bottles are thrown away each year. Big impact your reusing a carrier bag is going to have on that.

"Every little bit helps" just as not doing it hurts.

If companies can package their shit in plastic yet you have to pay to use plastic then they should be charged too and should buy it back off you.

Not a bad idea. As someone who has done a certain amount of graphic design work and has had friends in the industry for a long time, I can tell you we've all wondered why there are no "green packaging" incentives.

HensVassal

seamus wrote: »

Because in general governments tend to be really bad at public service provision.

Your choice is to pay for a waste service that aims to be profitable, and therefore must be competitive. Or you can pay higher taxes for a service that has no incentive to be efficient and improve itself.

It's a balancing act. There are some services for which complete privatisation does more harm than good - defence, education, health, infrastructure. But plenty of other services for which it allows the service to be more effective - waste, electricity, public transport, etc.

Provided the state sets out a USO for these services and fills in the gaps where private operators won't, society benefits from for-profits activity in these services.

Profits aren't always measured in cash terms. Holland "profits" through improved public health, reduced emissions and tourism.

Exactly my point. Wouldn't a rail network provide the same "profits"? Village police provide a heightened sense of community and security?

It's easy to say that if you provide something for free then people won't value it, but that's just another cliche churned out by profit mongers

Allinall

HensVassal wrote: »

Mate,

The plastic bag charge is just another scam to make the consumer pay for everything. You think the "drop in the ocean" gesture of plastic bag reduction has the slightest impact on environmental improvement when everything you're putting in your little cloth "bag for life" is in a damn plastic container anyway? Your bottle of Fairy liquid? You jumbo family pack of 12 packs of Tayto, all themselves packaged into another plastic bag? Your plastic bottle of ketchup? Your 6-pack of half litre bottles of Coca-Cola, again themselves snuggly packaged into a plastic jacket? Your frozen peas? Your slab of smoked salmon? Your litre carton of milk? Your 6 yoghurts? Your plastic tub of olives? Your plastic pack of rigatoni? etc., etc?

In the US 35 BILLION plastic bottles are thrown away each year. Big impact your reusing a carrier bag is going to have on that.
If companies can package their shit in plastic yet you have to pay to use plastic then they should be charged too and should buy it back off you.

The plastic bag levy has had a huge impact on people's attitude towards recycling and re-use, as well as a positive impact on the visual appearance of our countryside.

As long as there are naysayers, it will be very difficult to change attitudes.

Companies do pay for plastic they generate.

HensVassal

Allinall wrote: »

Your post that I quoted.

Well I'm sorry for you then if that's what you took from it.

HensVassal

Why aren't there glass an plastic redemption machines in supermarkets like there are in Germany?

So many apologists for every single charge are real glass-half-empty people. Their first instinct when faced with any problem is to punish rather than incentivise to the point that everyone suffers....even the ones making the greatest effort.
If you got 15c back for every plastic bottle you put into the cruncher and 10c for every can and 5c for evey glass bottle/jar, the garbage cans around the city would be virtually empty and there'd be fcuk all being put on the street except maybe the odd bag of chicken bones, potato skins, teabags and eggshells.

mansize

HensVassal wrote: »

Why aren't there glass an plastic redemption machines in supermarkets like there are in Germany?

So many apologists for every single charge are real glass-half-empty people. Their first instinct when faced with any problem is to punish rather than incentivise to the point that everyone suffers....even the ones making the greatest effort.
If you got 15c back for every plastic bottle you put into the cruncher and 10c for every can and 5c for evey glass bottle/jar, the garbage cans around the city would be virtually empty and there'd be fcuk all being put on the street except maybe the odd bag of chicken bones, potato skins, teabags and eggshells.

You would have up add the charge at point of purchase like they do in Germany also

Allinall

HensVassal wrote: »

Well I'm sorry for you then if that's what you took from it.

Which "assholes" were you referring to?

Speedwell

HensVassal wrote: »

Why aren't there glass an plastic redemption machines in supermarkets like there are in Germany?<snip>
If you got 15c back for every plastic bottle you put into the cruncher and 10c for every can and 5c for evey glass bottle/jar, the garbage cans around the city would be virtually empty and there'd be fcuk all being put on the street except maybe the odd bag of chicken bones, potato skins, teabags and eggshells.

They do work. They really do. The problems with them in practice seem to be people putting things in that aren't the types of plastic or glass that can be recycled, and that the money back has to be charged as an extra up-front fee on each purchase. By the time you pay 15 cents for every plastic bottle etc., your grocery costs could be badly affected. I remember years ago when they tried this in America, my mother used to gripe that she could afford an extra gallon of milk or a chicken every week if she didn't have to pay for the recycling fee on each container and then take time to wash, sort, and return the items, and collect the rebate.

Graham

BattleCorp wrote: »

That might work in Dublin but the options down in rural Ireland aren't as good.

Naturally where the level of demand isn't sufficient to support multiple (any) operators, there should be alternatives and/or regulation to protect the services and cost of those services.

seamus

HensVassal wrote: »

If you got 15c back for every plastic bottle you put into the cruncher and 10c for every can and 5c for evey glass bottle/jar, the garbage cans around the city would be virtually empty and there'd be fcuk all being put on the street except maybe the odd bag of chicken bones, potato skins, teabags and eggshells.

Plastic and glass bottles don't go into my waste bin. And there's still plenty of rubbish in it. Not everything is recyclable.

If there was a rebate for returning glass and plastic, you're right, people would do it more often.

But you'd also pay at the point of sale for it, those 15c and 5c have to come from somewhere - if it's not from taxation then you'll have to pay it upfront before you buy.

So why not just pay to dispose of it instead? Rather than having a convoluted process where money is taken from you and then given back to you at a later stage and accounted for twenty times in between.

Plus you'd still have recycle bins full of cardboard and non-bottle plastics. So you haven't made anything simpler, in fact all you've done is made it even more complicated to recycle, which in turn will result in people not bothering.

HensVassal

mansize wrote: »

You would have up add the charge at point of purchase like they do in Germany also

I know.....but you've got your carrot and stick option right there. Put it in the cruncher you get your money back, throw it in a public bin and you've forfeited your dime. But you know what, a homeless person will gladly do a bit of recycling for the deposits that someone was too lazy to redeem.

screamer

Graham wrote: »

Naturally where the level of demand isn't sufficient to support multiple (any) operators, there should be alternatives and/or regulation to protect the services and cost of those services.

Just shows how far removed from rural Ireland Alan Kelly really is. Ironic given he's from tipp.. ....

Anyways they should just be done with it add water house and waste charges together provide the services and charge us in one bill. Sick of these sneaky charges bit like death by a thousand cuts....

mansize

But that doesn't encourage reducing waste and increasing recycling

Bebo stunnah

I'm in a house with 2 people and a dog.

• Used to have 1 bin that got put out every 2 months and cost about 10 euro per pick up. Used to get a free bag for recycling.

• Few months later the price of the bin went to 12 per lift and started charging 7 for the recycling bag- everything went into the waste bin then.

• Then they brought in this sh1te about having to 'subscribe' to having your bins taken. Started costing me 25 per quarter (100 per year) and then cost me 8 for the bin, 4 for the recycling and whatever for the compost bin, used it for 3 months then packed it in.

The subscription alone would have cost me more than what I used to have to pay for waste. I stopped paying the company to pick it up and started bringing the 3 bins I have now to the dump myself 2 or 3 times per year for a fraction and do the same with the recycling, more frequently, as it costs less than a tenner for a car full.

This seems like a way to guarantee waste companies will be getting a guaranteed amount of money from these subscription. Sounds to me that a few ministers or their friends/family are heavily invested in the waste companies.

seamus

screamer wrote: »

Sick of these sneaky charges bit like death by a thousand cuts....

You've been paying for your bins for at least a decade, if not more.

What's "sneaky" about this change?

Graham

HensVassal wrote: »

This seems like a way to guarantee waste companies will be getting a guaranteed amount of money from these subscription.

Imagine that, maybe they should just be allowed to layoff the refuse collectors for the weeks they're not needed. Zero hours contracts maybe?

The reality is there are fixed costs to providing the service regardless of your usage. The variable costs (the amount of waste) you can cut back on.

Graham

screamer wrote: »

Just shows how far removed from rural Ireland Alan Kelly really is. Ironic given he's from tipp.. ....

Anyways they should just be done with it add water house and waste charges together provide the services and charge us in one bill. Sick of these sneaky charges bit like death by a thousand cuts....

I'd rather just pay for what I'm using/disposing thanks.

degsie

Think ppl are jumping the gun here. There NO mention of having to register with a waste collector anywhere. It just some other rules are coming into force in July '16:

New rules in 2016

New rules will come into effect throughout the State from 1 July 2016. They include:

An obligation on all householders (with some exceptions) to segregate food waste from other household waste
An obligation on waste collectors to provide separate receptacles (such as wheelie bins) for food waste, and collect them at least once a fortnight
A 'pay by weight' charging system for all types of waste

from here

gozunda

seamus wrote: »

Because in general governments tend to be really bad at public service provision.

In Ireland yes I would agree. Many other EU countries appear to do public service provision very well.

seamus wrote: »

Your choice is to pay for a waste service that aims to be profitable, and therefore must be competitive. Or you can pay higher taxes for a service that has no incentive to be efficient and improve itself.

Where I am - there is no 'choice'. Just one single operator. Re efficiency back to the first point above. Plus I also already pay significantly higher taxes across the board from 15 years ago when rubbish disposal was a 'free service'.

seamus wrote: »

It's a balancing act. There are some services for which complete privatisation does more harm than good - defence, education, health, infrastructure. But plenty of other services for which it allows the service to be more effective - waste, electricity, public transport, etc.

Ok but who gets to decide which services get fed to the carpet baggers and which are provided for? It is arguable whether the privatisation of public transport in the UK has resulted in it being any more 'effective' tbh.

seamus wrote: »

Provided the state sets out a USO for these services and fills in the gaps where private operators won't, society benefits from for-profits activity in these services.

Profits aren't always measured in cash terms. Holland "profits" through improved public health, reduced emissions and tourism.

This argument also holds true for the provision of "waste, electricity and public transport," type services

The management of waste for example provides for a host of indirect benefit including public health, the environment and pollution prevention.

Graham

gozunda wrote: »

In Ireland yes I would agree. Many other EU countries appear to do public service provision very well.

Many don't.

gozunda wrote: »

Ok but who gets to decide which services get fed to the carpet baggers and which are provided for?

Would be a more compelling point if there were actually some evidence of it happening in recent years.

HensVassal

seamus wrote: »

Plastic and glass bottles don't go into my waste bin. And there's still plenty of rubbish in it. Not everything is recyclable.

If there was a rebate for returning glass and plastic, you're right, people would do it more often.

But you'd also pay at the point of sale for it, those 15c and 5c have to come from somewhere - if it's not from taxation then you'll have to pay it upfront before you buy.

So why not just pay to dispose of it instead? Rather than having a convoluted process where money is taken from you and then given back to you at a later stage and accounted for twenty times in between.

Plus you'd still have recycle bins full of cardboard and non-bottle plastics. So you haven't made anything simpler, in fact all you've done is made it even more complicated to recycle, which in turn will result in people not bothering.

Why?
Let the companies who produce all these products that are packaged in environment-destroying containers pay for the deposit or take back their plastic. Why should the consumer who buys their product then have to pay for the disposal of the sh1tty container. It worked for milk bottles, it works for office water coolers. Breweries refill kegs. You want me to reuse my plastic bag? Make Heinz Pepsi reuse their cola bottles or pay for their disposal.
You seem very closed to the idea of alternatives. A program is floated and you just accept it as the best possible way of doing things.