Upcoming Marvel Cinematic Universe (MCU) Movies **Use Spoiler Tags**

pixelburp

That's not what macho means. Foster's run works, because like many good superhero stories, it's about coping with the life outside of the cape as it is the world within it.

When you look at the franchise, very few of the MCU actually deal with the human lives outside of the heroics. The cost, vulnerability, problems and weaknesses. Ant Man was as far as it has got, even Spider-Man became operatic in Far From Home.

I quite like Portmans comments, and suspect it might put her at ideological odds with Brie Larsen, who seems more into "macho" feminism.

Slydice

Loughc wrote: »

What makes you think that?

it's a way too wierd and horror filled idea to be how they'll probably generate Dr Doom but I was watching some youtube video discussing possible new characters.

I can't remember which one but either she was made of metal or had metal armour and the idea jumped into my head which involved him having a living suit of armour... yeah way to horror filled.

pjohnson

Slydice wrote: »

it's a way too wierd and horror filled idea to be how they'll probably generate Dr Doom but I was watching some youtube video discussing possible new characters.

I can't remember which one but either she was made of metal or had metal armour and the idea jumped into my head which involved him having a living suit of armour... yeah way to horror filled.

Magik has magical armor

The White Wolf

Emmeline Bald Griddle wrote: »

Natalie Portman quote: "I want [female characters] to be allowed to be weak and strong and happy and sad – human, basically. The fallacy in Hollywood is that if you’re making a ‘feminist’ story, the woman kicks ass and wins. That’s not feminist, that’s macho. A movie about a weak, vulnerable woman can be feminist if it shows a real person that we can empathize with."

I dunno if brandishing a war hammer counts as feminist then.

That sounds like a fair comment to me. She's right. She's actually criticising the lip service Hollywood is paying feminism lately so that's welcome. I'm excited for what she's going to do now.

Slydice

pjohnson wrote: »

Magik has magical armor

Now best I can remember is I think it was Iron Maiden cos it's likely she'll show up in Black Widow.

Just her artwork looks so Doom-like..






Although.. it probably depends on what her suit is made of. I don't think Doom is gonna want just Iron.. saying that.. I don't think Stark was using Iron anymore


Also the more I think of it, the less likely I think they'll go living-suit.. maybe coerce her (or her techie) to make a suit

Agent Coulson

The only issue I have with Portman is she has pretty much made it known she had no interest with being involved in the MCU and that came across on screen where is was obvious she was putting in no effort just saying her lines and going by the numbers.



You would have to ask why the change of heart and how much money are Disney throwing at her.

kerplun k

Me: Well done Natalie Portman for sticking up for what you believe in and walking away from the MCU.

Natalie Portman: Oh, I’m sorry, I can’t hear you over all that money.

Doctor DooM

Slydice wrote: »

it's a way too wierd and horror filled idea to be how they'll probably generate Dr Doom but I was watching some youtube video discussing possible new characters.

I can't remember which one but either she was made of metal or had metal armour and the idea jumped into my head which involved him having a living suit of armour... yeah way to horror filled.

You're sleeping on Victor there.
His mother's soul is literally being tortured by Marvels's version of Satan, and he vows to travel to the hell dimension to take her back- with the help of Strange, in the comics.

He later let himself fall in love with someone, just so he could kill her in a ritual and then wear her skin as a suit of supernatural armour.

If they want horror Doom, he's got plenty in that tank.

Slydice

Doctor DooM wrote: »

You're sleeping on Victor there.
His mother's soul is literally being tortured by Marvels's version of Satan, and he vows to travel to the hell dimension to take her back- with the help of Strange, in the comics.

He later let himself fall in love with someone, just so he could kill her in a ritual and then wear her skin as a suit of supernatural armour.

If they want horror Doom, he's got plenty in that tank.

:eek:

Penn

Agent Coulson wrote: »

The only issue I have with Portman is she has pretty much made it known she had no interest with being involved in the MCU and that came across on screen where is was obvious she was putting in no effort just saying her lines and going by the numbers.



You would have to ask why the change of heart and how much money are Disney throwing at her.

I think a big part in her walking away from the MCU was the change in director on Thor TDW (where Portman wanted to work with Patty Jenkins, who ended up leaving the project and they brought in someone else), and by most accounts everyone felt the movie was bland and had a horrible time filming it. Anthony Hopkins was the same, bar one or two scenes (Frigga's funeral for example) Hopkins was just... there. Not putting in much effort. Hemsworth didn't seem all that interested in it either.

Portman's role was mostly just "the girlfriend" again, and I don't think she had much interest in doing it again or being part of the MCU if that's all she was going to be. Given how great the new change in direction Ragnarok was, how much fun it must be to work with Taika Waititi, and now that she gets to properly play a more fleshed-out character with a proper story to tell, I'm not all that surprised she came back. Yes, they likely reversed a truckload of dollah-dollah-bills up to her house, but Portman hasn't always been one to just follow the money either. She does take on a lot of interesting roles, and a lot of comedic ones too. I think the opportunity to play the Jane Foster version of Thor, with the story that goes with it (if they follow the comics), but also with the new direction Waititi and Hemsworth have taken the Thor films, I think it was a no-brainer for her to come back regardless of money (but at the same time, for loads of money).

Agent Coulson

Kevin Feige won’t produce and is finished with Spiderman as they cannot come to an arrangement with Sony.


https://deadline.com/2019/08/kevin-feige-spider-man-franchise-exit-disney-sony-dispute-avengers-endgame-captain-america-winter-soldier-tom-rothman-bob-iger-1202672545/

Penn

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Kevin Feige won’t produce and is finished with Spiderman as they cannot come to an arrangement with Sony.


https://deadline.com/2019/08/kevin-feige-spider-man-franchise-exit-disney-sony-dispute-avengers-endgame-captain-america-winter-soldier-tom-rothman-bob-iger-1202672545/

It'd obviously be disappointing if they couldn't still work something out, but at the same time, I'd be kinda okay with it. Both solo Spider-Man movies were good, but not fantastic. They went with great villains and cast them perfectly, and had a big reliance on connection to the MCU for their storylines. I think a third Spidey film without a connection to the MCU could still be good building off what they've already done, and it'd be hard to see how they'd connect to the MCU in any big way over the next few years considering how off-Earth Phase 4 of the MCU is.

They've also left it in a way that the MCU isn't reliant on Spidey for their story, and vice-versa. I guess they both knew they had to leave it that way in case a deal couldn't be reached.

Plus Marvel aren't exactly stuck now that they also have all the X-Men and Fantastic Four (and all associated rights) back.

So it's definitely disappointing, and they could do great things if they can come together and make a revised deal (particularly linking Spider-Man with F4, new mentorship with Reed Richards and becoming best friends with Johnny Storm), but if it doesn't happen and that's the end of Spidey in the MCU, it was great while it lasted.

The White Wolf

The MCU isn't reliant on Peter but this news certainly makes Far From Home a wasted venture. Tony's protégé has just exited the universe which is going to cause narrative problems, then again based on the slate for Phase 4 it looks like they're going to avoid the issue by completely ignoring it.

I wonder how long the big wigs at both Sony and Disney have known that this was heading no where good.

Foxtrol

The White Wolf wrote: »

The MCU isn't reliant on Peter but this news certainly makes Far From Home a wasted venture. Tony's protégé has just exited the universe which is going to cause narrative problems, then again based on the slate for Phase 4 it looks like they're going to avoid the issue by completely ignoring it.

I wonder how long the big wigs at both Sony and Disney have known that this was heading no where good.

Far From Home was really a wasted venture either way if you look from it from a wider MCU perspective. The main impact it had was EDITH and showing that Fury was offworld and Skrulls were onworld. EDITH can be taken out in 10 seconds in a later movie and the narrative of Peter's growth into the heir to Stark doesn't really impact things, as we never see him taking over the Stark business or embedding himself as a leader of the new Avengers. Spiderman isn't powerful enough to be a must call for 'an Avengers level threat', especially anywhere outside of NYC.

If anything, Feige/Disney have completely screwed Sony by how deep the latest 2 Spiderman movies have relied on MCU properties. It is going to be incredibly clunky however they try to move forward, they even point to it in Far from Home when Peter starts asking about going to other Avengers. I'd say Disney knew exactly what they were doing with how they built the narrative and that they were going to take ask for more in their next negotiations, rightfully so in my point of view.

The White Wolf

I think Sony will brass neck their way straight through it and throw Peter straight into the Venom universe.

It will result in more horrible films, but I'd say the last thing on their brain right now is that they've been screwed.

I mentioned my disdain for Venom in this thread before and my bemusement at just how much money it made and this where it has left us, with a Sony which thinks it knows what it's doing now. God help us.

Agent Coulson

Sony's response
https://twitter.com/SonyPictures/status/1164036827667238912?s=20
https://twitter.com/SonyPictures/status/1164036829428850688?s=20
https://twitter.com/SonyPictures/status/1164036830573953024?s=20

Lithium93_

Hopefully some kind of new deal can be reached, yanking Spidey out of the MCU especially with the story arc set up for him, like that was disappointing news.

Doctor DooM

Sony are saying Feige is too busy, everyone else reporting on it is saying Sony didn't like the deal Disney wanted.

I don't think this story is done yet...

kerplun k

Yeah. This is all part and parcel of negotiations.i do think they’ll come to an agreement.

While I feel Sony are in a tricky situation, I do think that they are playing this right.

To put it bluntly, I think Disney high balled them, and Sony told them to f**k off, and so they should.

They are in a strong position, Spidey exciting to the MCU would be a bigger blow to Disney than it would Sony.

And if it doesn’t work out, that’s probably not a bad thing. While Venom was only okay, it was refreshingly different to wants currently being released, and SpiderVerse is arguably one of the finest comic book movies ever made.

Tefral

kerplun k wrote: »

SpiderVerse is arguably one of the finest comic book movies ever made.

Good alright hard to argue with that, not as good as the DC animated films though. Worth a watch if you havent watched them yet.

kerplun k

Tefral wrote: »

Good alright hard to argue with that, not as good as the DC animated films though. Worth a watch if you havent watched them yet.

Only one I watched was The Killing Joke and wasn’t that impressed. I actually thought it was a huge letdown.

Foxtrol

kerplun k wrote: »

Yeah. This is all part and parcel of negotiations.i do think they’ll come to an agreement.

While I feel Sony are in a tricky situation, I do think that they are playing this right.

To put it bluntly, I think Disney high balled them, and Sony told them to f**k off, and so they should.

They are in a strong position, Spidey exciting to the MCU would be a bigger blow to Disney than it would Sony.

And if it doesn’t work out, that’s probably not a bad thing. While Venom was only okay, it was refreshingly different to wants currently being released, and SpiderVerse is arguably one of the finest comic book movies ever made.

New reports are that Disney wanted 30% co-financing arrangement, which is hardly high-balling given the work and IP they've provided to help fix the mess that Sony made of the franchise for only a 5% return previously.

Can you please explain this logic in bold? I've seen this numerous times in different threads and no one has actually been able to back it up with any examples. Yes, fans like having Spiderman in the MCU but he could be written out pretty easily, given his powers are limited compared to most other heroes and he is just a kid in Queens. On the otherside the Holland Spiderman is completely intertwined with MCU characters. It will be completely jarring to the story for them to ignore this without a hard reboot.

Doctor DooM

kerplun k wrote: »

To put it bluntly, I think Disney high balled them, and Sony told them to f**k off, and so they should.

They are in a strong position, Spidey exciting to the MCU would be a bigger blow to Disney than it would Sony.

And if it doesn’t work out, that’s probably not a bad thing. While Venom was only okay, it was refreshingly different to wants currently being released, and SpiderVerse is arguably one of the finest comic book movies ever made.

Can't agree with you here- Sony only entered the deal because they were desperate. They needed a successful franchise, especially with the mess Ghostbusters was turning into. Marvel gave them their biggest return on a film they've ever had in Far From Home, and you better believe Venom got a huge boost from vaguely being associated with Marvel. Spider-Verse, while great, is a glaring exception in terms of quality for a Sony scifi/superhero pic. Spider-Verse was only made AFTER Marvel rehabilitated Spider-Man for them too.

There's not much evidence a detached Spider-Man will succeed, given the people in charge at Sony are currently Tom "Deadpool will never make money, sow his mouth up" Rothman and Amy "the fans don't want a Reitman directed Ghostbuster" Pascal.

Whereas Disney/Marvel can move on to the X-Men and the FF or go back to the well with Avengers. Or simply, they can wait.

kerplun k wrote: »

Only one I watched was The Killing Joke and wasn’t that impressed. I actually thought it was a huge letdown.

You got very unlucky, that's the one most people dislike greatly!

Tefral

kerplun k wrote: »

Only one I watched was The Killing Joke and wasn’t that impressed. I actually thought it was a huge letdown.

Watch the dark knight returns part 1 and 2!

Anyway back to marvel, I hope they do something with Spiderman, im assuming its some form of brinksmanship like you alluded to in your post above.

kerplun k

Foxtrol wrote: »

New reports are that Disney wanted 30% co-financing arrangement, which is hardly high-balling given the work and IP they've provided to help fix the mess that Sony made of the franchise for only a 5% return previously.

Can you please explain this logic in bold? I've seen this numerous times in different threads and no one has actually been able to back it up with any examples. Yes, fans like having Spiderman in the MCU but he could be written out pretty easily, given his powers are limited compared to most other heroes and he is just a kid in Queens. On the otherside the Holland Spiderman is completely intertwined with MCU characters. It will be completely jarring to the story for them to ignore this without a hard reboot.

Venom made a bucket load of money.
SpiderVerse was a hit
They’ll still be able to use Tom Holland
They don’t actually need marvel at this point.
I’d say all those points work in Sony’s favor.

Plus, Spider man is Sony’s main asset, at times it kept the whole studio going. You don’t wanna go giving away 30%, 50% or whatever it’s been reported. As far as I’m concerned, they’re absolutely right to play hardball.

Also, I think Disney have full marketing rights to the character, Sony has zilch, and Isn’t Spider man the main attraction in the newly built theme park? Not having Spider Man in the Avengers wouldn’t be bad for business.

All I’m saying is that Sony’s position is not as weak as one would think.

Foxtrol

kerplun k wrote: »

Venom made a bucket load of money. - off the back of goodwill from Spiderman/MCU and against no MCU competition. It was a poor movie and no guarantee those other factors will be replicated
SpiderVerse was a hit
They’ll still be able to use Tom Holland - For one more movie. Holland loved being part of the MCU so might not sign up again if not part of the MCU, especially if the next movie is poor
They don’t actually need marvel at this point.
I’d say all those points work in Sony’s favor. - Holland's version of Spiderman is built around MCU. It is going to be a plot hole riddled mess to try to rip him out, ignoring Stark/Happy/Avengers/Fury in the future. Spiderman, though beloved, isn't central to how the rest of the MCU is built, so they can basically ignore him if they wanted. How do you see them pulling this off?

Plus, Spider man is Sony’s main asset, at times it kept the whole studio going. You don’t wanna go giving away 30%, 50% or whatever it’s been reported. As far as I’m concerned, there absolutely right to play hardball.

Also, I think Disney have full marketing rights to the character, Sony has zilch, and Isn’t Spider man the main attraction in the newly built theme park? Not having Spider Man in the Avengers wouldn’t be bad for business.

All I’m saying is that Sony’s position is not as weak as one would think.

Don't agree with any of your points aside from SpiderVerse being a hit, which as a cartoon has little to do with the live action efforts

kerplun k

Foxtrol wrote: »

Don't agree with any of your points aside from SpiderVerse being a hit, which as a cartoon has little to do with the live action efforts

I mean MCU will have plot holes as well, the main one being where did Spidey go? And with E.D.I.T.H and all that Stark tech?

Spider Man can just go down the multiverse route. Surround Peter with new people, no need to mention any of his MCU connections. Also, it would be a perfect time to introduce Miles Morales, Sinister Six and a Venom crossover that includes Carnage.

Foxtrol

kerplun k wrote: »

I mean MCU will have plot holes as well, the main one being where did Spidey go? And with E.D.I.T.H and all that Stark tech?

Spider Man can just go down the multiverse route. Surround Peter with new people, no need to mention any of his MCU connections. Also, it would be a perfect time to introduce Miles Morales, Sinister Six and a Venom crossover that includes Carnage.

None of the Phase 4 movies look to take place where Spiderman would be expected to be, similar for what we can expect for most of Phase 5. Tony was really the only one who knew him and the others could see him as 'a kid' that has relatively weak powers and could make a throwaway comment about not including him. EDITH could be easily taken out in seconds by a space ship. They simply don't need him for their narrative to push on and make sense.

Looking at the other side even if they went the multiverse route, Peter's whole support system was Stark and now is Happy/Fury/Avengers. Even if they went the multiverse route, which could just be seen a knock off of a 2 year old movie, Peter's first move would be to look for Stark/Happy/Fury/Avengers if he was transported somewhere else. The current iteration of the character is built by and uses MCU IP as a crutch, you can't just take that away and move on pretending Peter forgets it all. Feige knew exactly what he was doing and he's really boxed Sony in.

IncognitoMan

kerplun k wrote: »

Only one I watched was The Killing Joke and wasn’t that impressed. I actually thought it was a huge letdown.

Under the red hood is brilliant imo.

Green Lantern: First Flight
Wonder Woman
Superman/Batman: Public Enemies
Justice League: Crisis on Two Earths
Superman/Batman: Apocalypse
Batman: Year One
Justice League: The Flashpoint Paradox
Justice League: War
Batman: Assault on Arkham

All good from what I remember.
The dark Knight part 1 and 2 as well as said already.

Brief_Lives

IncognitoMan wrote: »

Under the red hood is brilliant imo.

Green Lantern: First Flight
Wonder Woman
Superman/Batman: Public Enemies
Justice League: Crisis on Two Earths
Superman/Batman: Apocalypse
Batman: Year One
Justice League: The Flashpoint Paradox
Justice League: War
Batman: Assault on Arkham

All good from what I remember.
The dark Knight part 1 and 2 as well as said already.

not to derail the thread, but check this out for more info on DC animated movies.
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057635925