Hyundai Ioniq 28kWh

KCross

unkel wrote: »

It would not be impossible to only have one fuel power station left over, working 24/7, as micro generation mostly works only during the day. That would mean the end of night meters though

Cheap solution for the government, moving responsibility and maintenance away off to the home owner and drastically reducing CO2 without it costing much at all...

Day/Night meters are likely to be on the way out anyway in the very near future. The CER is at an advanced stage in making a decision on that.

The probable plan is to go with smart meters (half hourly rates) and they will go for an en-masse refit of every meter in the country(2.2million of them). They expect that to happen in 2018+ according to their timetable. They have already completed pilot projects.

http://www.cer.ie/document-detail/Smart-Metering-Project-Phase-3/1021


The EV's will need a way to maximise the tariffs provided by the energy suppliers. Not sure about other EV's but the Leaf only allows you to specify two timed charges per day. Maybe that will be enough... it depends on what the energy providers come up with.

Does the Ioiniq have a more sophisticated charge timer/smart-meter capability?

cros13

unkel wrote: »

the government here will let people feed back into the grid, not paying them but just reversing the meter. That's what happens in many countries on the continent.

I'm afraid that's not the case in Ireland. That would be net metering. The current regulations require your meter to be replaced (at your expense) with a specifically certified (Irish additions to the european standard) Import/Export meter that costs as much as 10 times what a UK-certified Import/Export meter costs. This counts export separately and you receive no credit whatsoever for the electricity you export. Electric Ireland just sells the power (that incurred no cost to them in generation or transmission) to your neighbour at retail price and you get nothing. It's a situation unique among EU countries.

KCross wrote: »

.The probable plan is to go with smart meters (half hourly rates) and they will go for an en-masse refit of every meter in the country(2.2million of them). They expect that to happen in 2018+ according to their timetable. They have already completed pilot projects.

I was told ESB were pushing for 15 minute increments on the smart meters. But that was about a year ago.

KCross wrote: »

Does the Ioiniq have a more sophisticated charge timer/smart-meter capability?

It has a reasonable API and Hyundai themselves have implemented integration with IFTTT, Amazon Alexa and Google Assistant. BMW has no public API but has IFTTT and Alexa support through BMW Labs which is not available outside of the US, Germany and UK.

Soarer

positron wrote: »

And this from James & Kate:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3yu37Bqk3s

Any chance we could stick to the topic?

That review is very interesting.

You can see it's raining and dull, so the wipers/lights are probably on. And yet, they done 57 miles for 18%!

highdef

Anyone know if there will be more than one offering of trim level? Currently have a Leaf with leather and any new purchase will also require leather. This does not seem to be an option at the moment, which is a bit disappointing.

cros13

highdef wrote: »

Anyone know if there will be more than one offering of trim level? Currently have a Leaf with leather and any new purchase will also require leather. This does not seem to be an option at the moment, which is a bit disappointing.

I was told by Hyundai that one trim level will be imported. I had understood that this meant the top trim with leather would be the only one offered.

Soarer

Here's a "real world" driving video. Interesting distance covered!

Ioniq

Bigus

Soarer wrote: »

Here's a "real world" driving video. Interesting distance covered!

Ioniq

Wow 351.1 km on a single charge in an Ioniq

KCross

Soarer wrote: »

Here's a "real world" driving video. Interesting distance covered!

Ioniq

Am I right in saying they did all of that drive under 55km/h?
Hardly "real world" and a bit misleading.

grogi

KCross wrote: »

Am I right in saying they did all of that drive under 55km/h?
Hardly "real world" and a bit misleading.

At least they kept to the inside lane on the motorway

Soarer

KCross wrote: »

Am I right in saying they did all of that drive under 55km/h?
Hardly "real world" and a bit misleading.

You obviously didn't understand what I meant by the quote marks!

That's the average speed I think.

Here a screen grab from near the start.

KCross

If they could do the same drive at the same average in a 30kWh Leaf then we could compare.

Regardless, its a good distance on one charge.

All the talk is that the Ioniq is a good bit more efficient than a Leaf. Anyone know how they achieved that? Presumably its not aerodynamics to any great degree. A kWh is a kWh so it must be something in the build or electronics.

Is it motor efficiency? Is it better regen? Better build around centre of gravity or something else in the build that makes rolling resistance better?

Anyone know?

Soarer

Couldn't tell ya.

But I'd imagine, for most people's day-to-day driving, an average of 55km/h wouldn't be too far off the mark.

Plus, it kinda ties in with the James and Kate review, where they did 57 miles for 18%.

grogi

KCross wrote: »

If they could do the same drive at the same average in a 30kWh Leaf then we could compare.

Regardless, its a good distance on one charge.

All the talk is that the Ioniq is a good bit more efficient than a Leaf. Anyone know how they achieved that? Presumably its not aerodynamics to any great degree. A kWh is a kWh so it must be something in the build or electronics.

Is it motor efficiency? Is it better regen? Better build around centre of gravity or something else in the build that makes rolling resistance better?

Anyone know?

I think all together. But I think most can be gained by improving the efficiency of the regenerative breaking and associated with it charging.

grogi

Soarer wrote: »

Couldn't tell ya.

But I'd imagine, for most people's day-to-day driving, an average of 55km/h wouldn't be too far off the mark.

Plus, it kinda ties in with the James and Kate review, where they did 57 miles for 18%.

Average of 55 km/h sounds life-like, but not going above 60-65 km/h - not really. Unless you want to get a dedicated thread in "slow EV drivers blocking the road" section of boards.

Soarer

grogi wrote: »

Average of 55 km/h sounds life-like, but not going above 60-65 km/h - not really. Unless you want to get a dedicated thread in "slow EV drivers blocking the road" section of boards.

Suppose it depends where you're living really.

But I agree. Most would spend as much time over 60km/h as they would under 50km/h.

liamog

cros13 wrote: »

I was told by Hyundai that one trim level will be imported. I had understood that this meant the top trim with leather would be the only one offered.

From comparing the UK and Ireland offering, I think we're only getting the Premium trim

Villain

Drive it on a motorway at 120kmh for a while and see how it long it lasts.

I find this comes up a lot with EV talk, oh they are so quick off the power, instant awesome power. But few mention divining it to the speed limit on Motorways drains the battery so quick it would depress you!

KCross

Soarer wrote: »

Couldn't tell ya.

But I'd imagine, for most people's day-to-day driving, an average of 55km/h wouldn't be too far off the mark.

Plus, it kinda ties in with the James and Kate review, where they did 57 miles for 18%.

I havent watched that video but that would work out at 500km's for a charge! Thats even more misleading, thats Tesla territory.

The percentages must be telling lies there. A bit like how the Leaf doesnt reduce its percentages in a linear fashion either. I bet there is some of that going on here.

Ultimately its a 28kWh car and it cant be THAT much better than the 30kWh Leaf.... better, because its newer tech under the hood, but just not that much better.


Half of my journey is on motorway so 55km/h would be nowhere near normal for me. A city driver, yes. I suppose it might be.

positron

There is another video on YouTube where they drove Ioniq at 40-60 kmph purely city streets and they got something like 400km to a charge. Perhaps someone here who knows EV technology can better explain how this is possible.

grogi

positron wrote: »

There is another video on YouTube where they drove Ioniq at 40-60 kmph purely city streets and they got something like 400km to a charge. Perhaps someone here who knows EV technology can better explain how this is possible.

The drag increases with the square of the velocity, while the power required to overcome it goes with the velocity cubed (sic/!) .

In other words - the energy requirement is very small in the city speed range, but explodes once you get onto the motorway.

positron

Sorry, didn't realise that video was posted and discussed already.

liamog

KCross wrote: »

Ultimately its a 28kWh car and it cant be THAT much better than the 30kWh Leaf.... better, because its newer tech under the hood, but just not that much better.

It has a much lower drag coefficient than the leaf which is probably making the difference (0.24 vs the 0.32)

The leaf number is from here

KCross

I had a quick look at the stats for the 30kWh leaf and the Ioniq and there is a substantial weight difference as well.

The max kerb weight of the 30kWh Leaf SVE is 1570kg vs 1475kg for the Ioniq.

100kg is a good bit of extra weight to be hauling. I'd say that and a more efficient motor are the primary gains for the Ioniq

Fiery mutant

Spoke with my dealer today, expecting to collect my Ioniq on Monday. I'll speak with eCars tomorrow and see when it would be possible to get the charger installed, if it won't be too long, I might wait to collect the car, if it's gonna be a few weeks, I'll collect when it's ready.

KCross

Fiery mutant wrote: »

Spoke with my dealer today, expecting to collect my Ioniq on Monday. I'll speak with eCars tomorrow and see when it would be possible to get the charger installed, if it won't be too long, I might wait to collect the car, if it's gonna be a few weeks, I'll collect when it's ready.

Why wait?
Does it have a granny cable that you can plugin to a 3 pin socket while you wait for the proper charge point?

unkel

liamog wrote: »

It has a much lower drag coefficient than the leaf which is probably making the difference (0.24 vs the 0.32)
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+1

And this makes a very significant difference, and exponentially so in speeds over 80km/h. I would love to see range for 30kWh Leaf vs 28kWh Ioniq at a constant 140km/h

Wouldn't be surprised if the Ioniq gets 40-50% further.

unkel

cros13 wrote: »

I'm afraid that's not the case in Ireland. That would be net metering. The current regulations require your meter to be replaced (at your expense) with a specifically certified

Yeah I know all that. Would have PV on the roof already if it would work like it does in continental Europe

Fair enough if you have to have your PV installation done by (or signed off by) a registered and qualified sparky but what a load of bull to need a different (and extremely expensive) meter :mad:

The one in my parents house (not in Ireland) coped fine and it is nearly 50 years old...

And then to add insult to injury you don't get paid for feeding the grid, saving the government billions and making the transition to lower CO2 easy peasy for them :rolleyes:

Are the ministers / senior civil servants just ignorant or what's the story here?

phoenix49

positron wrote: »

There is another video on YouTube where they drove Ioniq at 40-60 kmph purely city streets and they got something like 400km to a charge. Perhaps someone here who knows EV technology can better explain how this is possible.

I think they used level 3 regenerative braking thus almost avoided hitting the brake pedal. I guess regen braking on Ioniq is much more efficient than that on Leaf.

unkel

Fiery mutant wrote: »

Spoke with my dealer today, expecting to collect my Ioniq on Monday. I'll speak with eCars tomorrow and see when it would be possible to get the charger installed, if it won't be too long, I might wait to collect the car, if it's gonna be a few weeks, I'll collect when it's ready.

Just use a granny cable until the charger is installed?

unkel

Villain wrote: »

I find this comes up a lot with EV talk, oh they are so quick off the power, instant awesome power. But few mention divining it to the speed limit on Motorways drains the battery so quick it would depress you!

Yep. Here's a simple depressing sum:

a 24 kWh EV that has 72 kWh max power uses 100% of it's battery capacity in 20 minutes when it is using full power. Let's say it uses full power at its maximum speed of 150km/h*

That means range is 30 miles / 50 km


*even if there is a speed limiter and the car isn't quite using all it's power at that speed just yet, the range won't be a lot more than this...