Carlow Kilkenny General Election 2016

RobertKK

We would eventually have gotten independence without 1916, it just led to partition of the island and so many dead between civil war and the troubles.
The IRA were not a solution to a problem, but were part of the problem, The SDLP were able to exist in a peaceful manner and make their points.

I don't think Kathleen Funchion is a convincing public speaker. I don't see what she would do for the constituency. I don't believe their tax policy is good for the country. She will get no votes from me.

I will be voting for people I normally wouldn't so when it gets down to whatever count I have someone who isn't SF.

I don't like Bobby Aylward, don't think he is convincing either as a politician for the constituency, but will have to give him a tactical vote.

Like/dislike John McGuinness, he is our most experienced politician and most high profile, and is good for the constituency. He doesn't make us look stupid like some do. He gets a vote.
I don't know David Fitzgerald, but I know someone who had to deal with him over a non political issue, said he was very genuine a sound person. I will give him a tactical vote
John Paul Phelan will be elected given Phil is gone. A tactical vote for me.
Patrick McKee, seems a nice person, decent speaker, gets a vote from me.
Pat Deering - tactical vote.
The FF woman from Carlow, gets a vote too
Malcolm Noonan, get a tactical vote

That gets me to count 8, just have to decide on which order, so will need to research, if it is a long count I want my vote to be still counting.

catbear

RobertKK wrote: »

We would eventually have gotten independence without 1916, it just led to partition of the island and so many dead between civil war and the troubles.
The IRA were not a solution to a problem, but were part of the problem, The SDLP were able to exist in a peaceful manner and make their points.

It was the Larne gun run from Germany by the UVF that put the gun back into Irish politics, the Irish Volunteers were armed in reaction at a later stage. The UVF spurned Home Rule, you can't rewrite history to say that the IRA were the obstacle to Home Rule for the whole Island.
BTW, the SDLP were a around during partition, they did not come into existence until 1970.

Anyway have a go off this: http://www.whichcandidate.ie/

When I choose the issues that I believe need changing soon like abortion and school patronage I get SF, however when I go through all the issues SF move way down mid range which is where I had them pegged on my ballot.

RobertKK

catbear wrote: »

It was the Larne gun run from Germany by the UVF that put the gun back into Irish politics, the Irish Volunteers were armed in reaction at a later stage. The UVF spurned Home Rule, you can't rewrite history to say that the IRA were the obstacle to Home Rule for the whole Island.
BTW, the SDLP were a around during partition, they did not come into existence until 1970.

Anyway have a go off this: http://www.whichcandidate.ie/

When I choose the issues that I believe need changing soon like abortion and school patronage I get SF, however when I go through all the issues SF move way down mid range which is where I had them pegged on my ballot.

Back in the 1960's it was attacks on nationalists that started it off. But two wrongs never made a right.
I was referring to the SDLP in regards to the troubles.

Duiske

road_high wrote: »

It will be a sad day for our democracy if the likes of SF ever get into power.

I don't know about it being described as a sad day. If Sinn Fein ever do get into power won't that be a perfect example of a functioning democracy ?. One person one vote, the people have spoken, democracy in action and all that stuff ? Just reading back on your posts its obvious that you'll be sad if Sinn Fein ever get into power, but a sad day for our democracy ? I don't think so.

road_high

Duiske wrote: »

I don't know about it being described as a sad day. If Sinn Fein ever do get into power won't that be a perfect example of a functioning democracy ?. One person one vote, the people have spoken, democracy in action and all that stuff ? Just reading back on your posts its obvious that you'll be sad if Sinn Fein ever get into power, but a sad day for our democracy ? I don't think so.

I see the insidious manner they operate, particularly online. They absolutely manipulate the working classes and not so intelligent with false promises of an even bigger handout culture. That makes me very sad indeed as I always grew up with the mentality of people creating and achieving own goals in life to better oneself.
If they got in, it mightn't be such a bad thing politically as we'd soon what they're really made of with the prosperous Irish economy quickly regressing backwards towards a Greek style disaster. I wouldn't want that for the country but it least it would illustrate clearly to people what Greek style policies deliver. Because Greece doesn't seem big enough warning for some.
By the way I do think their support is somewhat overstated and I don't think they're going to poll as well as they seem to think.

catbear

RobertKK wrote: »

Back in the 1960's it was attacks on nationalists that started it off. But two wrongs never made a right.
I was referring to the SDLP in regards to the troubles.

Do you consider Irelands fight for independence from Britain as a wrong?

Duiske

road_high wrote: »

They absolutely manipulate the working classes and not so intelligent with false promises.

I'm sure the 3rd level students of this country may have an opinion on false promises based on their interactions with Ruairi Quinn just prior to him becoming Minister for Education in 2011. And does the Labour "Tesco style" poster from 2011, with the slogan "Fine Gael. Every Little Hurts" ring any bells ? I can put the poster up here if you like ?
Political parties make promises in election campaigns that they know will be very hard, if not impossible, to keep once they get into power. But it's more than a little disingenuous to accuse Sinn Fein of making false promises when they have never been in a position to follow through on those promises, while at the same time overlooking all the false promises made by the party you are bigging up in this thread.

RobertKK

catbear wrote: »

Do you consider Irelands fight for independence from Britain as a wrong?

No, but the timing was not good.

cameramonkey

Captain Havoc wrote: »

I think attacking a posters knowledge like that and not backing your own position is bullying and lowest common denominator tactics.

Fair enough, maybe I went a bit far but to call it bullying is in my opinion going a bit far.

I have given chapter and verse on who and why i think they will be elected. I have given % and breakdowns and coherent reason why I think people will be or not be elected.

I am just a bit frustrated by his constant what I would call trolling of his own thread.

Owryan

My own opinion on sf is that they may have laid down the armalite but they are still too repugnant to vote for.

Linked to fuel laundering along the border, slab murphy, supporting/hiding child rapists, supporting garda murderers, Gerry and his whole "never in the ira" thing is a few years he could ve said yes I was and it probably would ve helped him. Now it's a story he has to stick with.

Also their idea to tax everyone on high wages and cut other taxes. My ignorant take is they expect a small group in the country to support everyone else. If someone is able to earn over 100,000 through work why do we have to punish them.

I'm probably in the minority who think FG/lab have done an OK job, they ve made screw ups but show me one government that hasn't

DerryRed

Owryan wrote: »

Linked to fuel laundering along the border, slab murphy, supporting/hiding child rapists, supporting garda murderers

So I take it you'll never vote for FG given their links to one if the country's biggest crooks, Denis O'Brien

Owryan

What was he convicted of?

DerryRed

Owryan wrote: »

What was he convicted of?

So you're saying Denis O'Brien is completely clean?

Owryan

DerryRed wrote: »

So you're saying Denis O'Brien is completely clean?

No. You said he was a crook I asked was he convicted of something. That's pretty straightforward .

As for supporting him can you tell me no member of sf has never bought anything from any of his businesses or listened to any of the radio stations that he owns.

Wonder how many people have disappeared after a kangaroo court because of him and his private army.

DerryRed

Owryan wrote: »

No. You said he was a crook I asked was he convicted of something. That's pretty straightforward

There are plenty of crooks who've never been convicted of anything. Too much mud sticking to O'Brien for him to be completely clean.

Cabaal

DerryRed wrote: »

So you're saying Denis O'Brien is completely clean?

Not sure what way you read his post because he never suggested that in anyway. Odd how you've come to this conclusion.

If we bring this back to Adams and SF we know that they see a convicted criminal and person who directed murders to take place as a good person "good republican" .

SF also have called for the special criminal court to be gotten rid of, the same type of court that needs to exist to deal with the utter scumbags such as the ones who shot up the hotel yesterday and gerrys good friend . Not having it means that those scumbags and the likes of slab Murphy can intimidate the jury and avoid conviction.

Owryan

DerryRed wrote: »

There are plenty of crooks who've never been convicted of anything. Too much mud sticking to O'Brien for him to be completely clean.

You can apply that t some in sf in that case.

Every party has skeletons in the closet. It comes down to the individual deciding who to least despise. For me that's voting for murderers and crooks. The best thing about being a democracy is we get to vote for our preferred candidates.

My 2 cents is every party lies to the electorate. But at least we get to decide which pack of lies is least likely to ruin the country.

DerryRed

Cabaal wrote: »

Not sure what way you read his post because he never suggested that in anyway. Odd how you've come to this conclusion.

All I'm trying to say is that people (not necessarily Owryan) can't have their cake and eat it. They are happy to cite various reasons not to vote SF due to links with criminality. However they seem happy to overlook FG links with a crook such as O'Brien.

boardsuser1

Is Peter O'Loughlin any relation to an Anthony O'Loughlin who was a school principal in Carlow before taking over the North Monastery in Cork in 1997?same surname/profession/area. Coincidence???

Cabaal

DerryRed wrote: »

All I'm trying to say is that people (not necessarily Owryan) can't have their cake and eat it. They are happy to cite various reasons not to vote SF due to links with criminality. However they seem happy to overlook FG links with a crook such as O'Brien.

I suppose it's the lesser of two evils,

Many people would likely rather vote for those linked with people who have dodgy financial dealings then those who are linked with people who are actual murderers or who ordered others to carry out those murders.

Calling such people good later on beggars belief,

Cabaal

Owryan wrote: »

You can apply that t some in sf in that case.

Every party has skeletons in the closet. It comes down to the individual deciding who to least despise. For me that's voting for murderers and crooks. The best thing about being a democracy is we get to vote for our preferred candidates.

My 2 cents is every party lies to the electorate. But at least we get to decide which pack of lies is least likely to ruin the country.

Indeed, every party and candidate lies or makes promises they can't keep, only a complete fool believes otherwise,

Many people still feel uneasy with SF due to their links to people with literal skeletons in their closets. Slab Murphy is a dangerous man and having the leader of any plotical party support him is deeply unsettling.

DerryRed

Cabaal wrote: »

I suppose it's the lesser of two evils,

Many people would likely rather vote for those linked with people who have dodgy financial dealings then those who are linked with people who are actual murderers or who ordered others to carry out those murders.

Calling such people good later on beggars belief,

So does it beggar belief that Nelson Mandela was called good? He murdered and sent people out to murder. During a war individuals are put into a position to do things that they would never do under normal circumstances.

Owryan

DerryRed wrote: »

So does it beggar belief that Nelson Mandela was called good? He murdered and sent people out to murder. During a war individuals are put into a position to do things that they would never do under normal circumstances.

But Gerry wasn't in the ira.......allegedly.

I actually respect Martin McGuinness for admitting he was in the ira.

Cabaal

DerryRed wrote: »

elson Mandela was called good? He murdered and sent people out to murder. During a war individuals are put into a position to do things that they would never do under normal circumstances.

The man was involved in ending a cease fire when he was involved in the decision to bomb Canary Wharf back in 1996. He had no real interest in peace until he had no other options but to accept it by political means.

Also, he must think he is still at war because he's still doing stuff that most people "would never do under normal circumstances". I know I wouldn't do smuggling or fuel laundering. I also wouldn't try and avoid tax and then agree to pay 1Million euro to settle it.

The man is a crook, for Gerry to say "I want to deal with what is an effort to portray Tom Murphy as a criminal, as a bandit, as a gang boss, as someone who is exploiting the republican struggle for his own ends, as a multimillionaire. There is no evidence to support any of that" is laughable.

As you said above about O'Brien, if enough mud sticks he is clearly dodgy and this man (Slab) just looks like he's taken a mud bath.

Gerry undermines his own party with such comments and he clearly embarrasses the like of Mary and other party members who has refused to agree with Gerry's comments when asked several times.

DerryRed

Cabaal wrote: »

The man was involved in ending a cease fire when he was involved in the decision to bomb Canary Wharf back in 1996. He had no real interest in peace until he had no other options but to accept it by political means.

Also, he must think he is still at war because he's still doing stuff that most people "would never do under normal circumstances". I know I wouldn't do smuggling or fuel laundering. I also wouldn't try and avoid tax and then agree to pay 1Million euro to settle it.

The man is a crook, for Gerry to say "I want to deal with what is an effort to portray Tom Murphy as a criminal, as a bandit, as a gang boss, as someone who is exploiting the republican struggle for his own ends, as a multimillionaire. There is no evidence to support any of that" is laughable.

As you said above about O'Brien, if enough mud sticks he is clearly dodgy and this man (Slab) just looks like he's taken a mud bath.

Gerry undermines his own party with such comments and he clearly embarrasses the like of Mary and other party members who has refused to agree with Gerry's comments when asked several times.

Honestly I think this will be the last election Adams stands in. Personally I think he should have stood aside for this election and given the leadership to Pearse Doherty. I think he wants to do it in his own time and not have it forced on him due to external pressures. Wouldn't be surprised to see him stand down within the next 2/3 years, in order to give the new leader a good crack at the next election.

Cabaal

On the issue of equality and separation of church and state I see Bobby (FF) is happy for things to remain the same and appears to be fine with 5 years olds being discriminated against by schools. Utterly depressing

Back in December 2015 here's who voted for & against Dáil proposal to ban school admission discrimination against non-Catholics.

https://twitter.com/emma_okelly/status/672524518485835777/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc^tfw

RobertKK

The catholic schools were founded by Catholics. I am fed of people thinking they are discriminating when they were founded for Catholics, and catholic schools accept non Catholic students once they have the space.
Also when the state asked parents in certain areas about this. A majority in most cases wanted the school to remain Catholic.
The state should build more schools rather than blaming Catholic schools who originally went out and built the schools for when there was no education or very poor education facilities.

DerryRed

Cabaal wrote: »

On the issue of equality and separation of church and state I see Bobby (FF) is happy for things to remain the same and appears to be fine with 5 years olds being discriminated against by schools. Utterly depressing

In fairness to Bobby Alyward he probably voted here in a manner that represented the people who voted him in.

For Forks Sake

Cabaal wrote: »

Gerry undermines his own party with such comments and he clearly embarrasses the like of Mary and other party members who has refused to agree with Gerry's comments when asked several times.

Mary Lou was on Newstalk earlier this morning repeating the Good Republican line re. Slab Murphy. Does't seem overly embarrassed by the dose of fleas she's acquired by lying down with the dogs

Cabaal

RobertKK wrote: »

The catholic schools were founded by Catholics. I am fed of people thinking they are discriminating when they were founded for Catholics, and catholic schools accept non Catholic students once they have the space.

The schools are state funded, the catholic church can discriminate against who they want when they pay for the school AND running costs.

Until that day its disgraceful that they will discriminate against 5 year olds based on their religion or lack of all at the tax payer expense.

If your tax money was being used to fund Muslim, Jewish etc schools and those same schools were the only choice for your family and they wouldn't allow your child into the school I don't think you'd be so accepting of the idea of discrimination at the tax payer expense.

In addition even if a school accepts a non-catholic we've seen that the school can outright refuse the parents wishes for the child to be opted out of catholic religion class (at primary level religion takes 10% of school time, thats as much time as they spend on Maths or English).