Why do you hate Irish?

Shep_Dog

XR3i wrote: »

window= fuinneog [fwin-yogue]

Only in the mind of a Gaelic Revivalist.

To ordinary people: a window is just a window.

Caoimhgh1n

Shep_Dog wrote: »

Only in the mind of a Gaelic Revivalist.

To ordinary people: a window is just a window.

Who are ordinary people? To a French person, a window is une fenetre.

Shep_Dog

Caoimhgh1n wrote: »

Who are ordinary people? To a French person, a window is une fenetre.

But, we're Irish, and we say 'window', or maybe 'winda', but rarely would anyone ever say: 'fuinneog'.

Why don't the Irish haters here get together to stand in this election, if they really think their views are representative of anything but an embittered minority looking for a scapegoat for their own failings?

Where's the politician in this election who is uttering the hatred for the language that they are doing anonymously here? Well? Just a single politician? Hatred of the language, Irish culture generally and hatred of Irish independence all go hand-in-hand here. The academic term for what these people have is cultural cringe. Every ignorant peasant in Ireland thought like them in the 19th century. They are relics of that inferiority complex of a conquered people to all things English.

The latest addition to their desperate pleas for Ireland to become more culturally English/culturally intolerant is singularly impressive: compulsory Irish is the cause of Ireland's high emigration. Wow, just wow. The hatred is deep here.

PS: Why is the standard of English of the Irish haters so abysmal (see above)? Maybe their inability to master their own English language explains why they hate Irish so much.

Caoimhgh1n

Shep_Dog wrote: »

But, we're Irish, and we say 'window', or maybe 'winda', but rarely would anyone ever say: 'fuinneog'.

I say fuinneog, but maybe that's just me.. I usually name things around the house in Irish, even if I'm speaking English.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Deleted User wrote: »

Why don't the Irish haters here get together to stand in this election, if they really think their views are representative of anything but an embittered minority looking for a scapegoat for their own failings?

Where's the politician in this election who is uttering the hatred for the language that they are doing anonymously here? Well? Just a single politician? Hatred of the language, Irish culture generally and hatred of Irish independence all go hand-in-hand here. The academic term for what these people have is cultural cringe. Every ignorant peasant in Ireland thought like them in the 19th century. They are relics of that inferiority complex of a conquered people to all things English.

The latest addition to their desperate pleas for Ireland to become more culturally English/culturally intolerant is singularly impressive: compulsory Irish is the cause of Ireland's high emigration. Wow, just wow. The hatred is deep here.

PS: Why is the standard of English of the Irish haters so abysmal (see above)? Maybe their inability to master their own English language explains why they hate Irish so much.

Can you elaborate as to which specific posters you are referring to here and highlight the above stated opinions of said posters? "Irish-hater" has become a brush with which to tar many people who have expressed indifference to the language as opposed to actual full-on hatred for it that you claim in the above, so a more specific brief will be required.

Shep_Dog

Caoimhgh1n wrote: »

I say fuinneog, but maybe that's just me.. I usually name things around the house in Irish, even if I'm speaking English.

That's a bit odd, especially if English is your native language and you've no native-Irish speaking relatives or neighbours, but it's perfectly harmless unless you're a member of a radical group trying to impose Irish on the whole country.

Caoimhgh1n

Shep_Dog wrote: »

That's a bit odd, especially if English is your native language and you've no native-Irish speaking relatives or neighbours, but it's perfectly harmless unless you're a member of a radical group trying to impose Irish on the whole country.

My mother always spoke like that to me, and I have kept it up. I have a lot more conversations with her in Irish now that I can practise it with Irish speaking friends.

PopePalpatine

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Why don't the Irish haters here get together to stand in this election, if they really think their views are representative of anything but an embittered minority looking for a scapegoat for their own failings?

Where's the politician in this election who is uttering the hatred for the language that they are doing anonymously here? Well? Just a single politician? Hatred of the language, Irish culture generally and hatred of Irish independence all go hand-in-hand here. The academic term for what these people have is cultural cringe. Every ignorant peasant in Ireland thought like them in the 19th century. They are relics of that inferiority complex of a conquered people to all things English.

The latest addition to their desperate pleas for Ireland to become more culturally English/culturally intolerant is singularly impressive: compulsory Irish is the cause of Ireland's high emigration. Wow, just wow. The hatred is deep here.

PS: Why is the standard of English of the Irish haters so abysmal (see above)? Maybe their inability to master their own English language explains why they hate Irish so much.

And the Gaeliban wonder why this country isn't "purified" of English yet...:rolleyes:

My grasp of English is perfectly fine BTW, I'm on course for a BSc in CSSE (despite the efforts of the aforementioned Gaeliban :rolleyes:) I'm not ashamed that this country isn't part of the UK - far from it, in fact - more that we proved Unionists' fears of "Home Rule would be Rome Rule" correct.

sryanbruen

I always say common phrases such as "See you later" or "Thank you" in Irish or French to everybody. This is just because I enjoy speaking these languages with Irish in particular.

À bientôt mes amis ici
Slán go fóill mo chairde anseo
See you soon my friends here

Shep_Dog

Caoimhgh1n wrote: »

My mother always spoke like that to me, and I have kept it up. I have a lot more conversations with her in Irish now that I can practise it with Irish speaking friends.

Sounds quite innocent, just watch out for the radical groups that groom harmless enthusiasts. Before you know it, they'll have you believing that compuslory Irish for English-speaking kids is a good thing.

XR3i

rith mé síos an bothar

XR3i

what did the farmer say when he lost his welger baler?

an bhfaca tú mo hay-machine?

Greentopia

I don't hate Irish now. I did when I had to learn it in school because of how it was taught-badly. I loathed and detested being forced to learn it. I also don't think it's the most attractive language to listen to tbh.

It would have been nice if I'd been able to learn it in a Gaelscoil primary when I started school if we must learn it, would have saved a lot of angst and stress trying to learn it for exams. 13 years of Irish and all I can say are a handful of words and most people I know are the same so teaching it in English speaking schools here has been an abject failure and only serves to put people off the language.

Easca Peasca

Greentopia wrote: »

It would have been nice if I'd been able to learn it in a Gaelscoil primary when I started school if we must learn it, would have saved a lot of angst and stress trying to learn it for exams.

I'd agree there. The Gaelscoil's are doing great stuff for the language. The idea of immersion and learning Irish through Irish is far easier than learning Irish through English!

banquo

I don't hate Irish, but from a young age it was apparent that it was designed more to keep the Irish teacher in a job more than anything else.

Teacher: We need to spend time teaching you Irish because it's culturally important and all the usual reasons.
Student: Hasn't the current method been an overwhelming failure?
Teacher: Yes.
Student: Shouldn't we change it then?
Teacher: No.
Student: But if it's an important use of everyone's time, but we also admit that it's not working, shouldn't we either give up or change tack?
Teacher: Stand in the corner.

banquo

I don't hate Irish, but from a young age it was apparent that it was designed more to keep the Irish teacher in a job more than anything else.

Teacher: We need to spend time teaching you Irish because it's culturally important and all the usual reasons.
Student: Hasn't the current method been an overwhelming failure?
Teacher: Yes.
Student: Shouldn't we change it then?
Teacher: No.
Student: But if it's an important use of everyone's time, but we also admit that it's not working, shouldn't we either give up or change tack?
Teacher: Stand in the corner.

sryanbruen

Easca Peasca wrote: »

I'd agree there. The Gaelscoil's are doing great stuff for the language. The idea of immersion and learning Irish through Irish is far easier than learning Irish through English!

Yep. I wish I was in a gaelscoil so I could learn a far more lot about the language.

sryanbruen

I meant to say this:

I complained to the Minister for Education once about the way Irish is taught in schools. Here is the reply from her

Ireland’s constitution has enshrined Irish as the first official language of the State and it is therefore the duty of the government to uphold and protect the status of the Irish language. This has been the position of successive governments since 1937. Irish is also an official language of the European Union and is a living spoken community language in parts of Ireland.

This Government is committed to supporting the overall thrust of the 20 Year Strategy for the Irish Language 2010-2030, and to the delivery of the goals and targets proposed. As part of this, a thorough reform of the Irish curriculum and the way Irish is taught at primary and second level is being undertaken. The priority is to take steps to improve the quality and effectiveness of the teaching of Irish.

A revised Leaving Certificate curriculum in Irish began in all schools in September 2010, and was examined for the first time in 2012. The revised programme provides for an increase in the proportion of marks available for oral assessment to 40%, and is aimed at promoting a significant shift in emphasis towards Irish as a spoken language, where students can communicate and interact in a spontaneous way, and where Irish is spoken every day in schools. A review is currently underway of the oral component of Irish in the Leaving Certificate, and it is expected that a report will be published on this in early 2016.

My reply was:

Thank you very much. Remember: "Beatha teanga í a labhairt, ní bheatha teanga í ag foghlaim litríocht"

Badly Drunk Boy

Shep_Dog wrote: »

That's a bit odd, especially if English is your native language and you've no native-Irish speaking relatives or neighbours, but it's perfectly harmless unless you're a member of a radical group trying to impose Irish on the whole country.

I know people who do that, and I even do it myself sometimes. Even though she's not great at Irish, my mother used to always say stuff like "Would anyone like a cupán tae?" or similar. And a lad in work regularly says stuff like "See you in a cúpla noiméad" and other stuff like that. I regularly throw in a few Irish words when speaking to my brother but that's usually just to annoy him, as he hates Irish.

Dughorm

Fine Gael Manifesto

"Fine Gael recognises the crucial importance of the Irish language to our heritage
and culture and is committed to its reinvigoration. To this end, we are committed
to systematically implementing the 20-Year Strategy for the Irish language. This
strategy will increase the number of people using Irish in their daily lives, while
also ensuring that Irish becomes a more visible language in today’s society, both
as a spoken language and also in areas such as signage and literature."

No mention of any changes to secondary school Irish in the manifesto.

See http://www.finegael.ie/manifesto/manifesto.pdf

Dughorm

Fine Gael Manifesto

"Fine Gael recognises the crucial importance of the Irish language to our heritage
and culture and is committed to its reinvigoration. To this end, we are committed
to systematically implementing the 20-Year Strategy for the Irish language. This
strategy will increase the number of people using Irish in their daily lives, while
also ensuring that Irish becomes a more visible language in today’s society, both
as a spoken language and also in areas such as signage and literature."

No mention of any changes to secondary school Irish in the manifesto.

See http://www.finegael.ie/manifesto/manifesto.pdf

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Dughorm wrote: »

Fine Gael Manifesto

"Fine Gael recognises the crucial importance of the Irish language to our heritage
and culture and is committed to its reinvigoration. To this end, we are committed
to systematically implementing the 20-Year Strategy for the Irish language. This
strategy will increase the number of people using Irish in their daily lives, while
also ensuring that Irish becomes a more visible language in today’s society, both
as a spoken language and also in areas such as signage and literature."

No mention of any changes to secondary school Irish in the manifesto.

See http://www.finegael.ie/manifesto/manifesto.pdf

Not saying they'll support it either.

There's nothing I'd really disagree with there, to be honest: they've passed test one, where both Fianna Fail and CnaG have failed: the realise they just need to make the language more attractive to people, not force it on people and assume everyone will go along with their way of thinking.

You seem to be of the opinion that it's far more important to have everyone studying Irish all the way up to the Leaving Cert regardless of how much they use afterwards rather then to actually encourage any revival. Why is that?

Shep_Dog

Badly Drunk Boy wrote: »

I know people who do that, and I even do it myself sometimes. Even though she's not great at Irish, my mother used to always say stuff like "Would anyone like a cupán tae?" or similar. And a lad in work regularly says stuff like "See you in a cúpla noiméad" and other stuff like that. I regularly throw in a few Irish words when speaking to my brother but that's usually just to annoy him, as he hates Irish.

That's the 'cupla focal'. It qualifies in the census as 'speaking Irish'.

Interesting that one of your uses of Irish is to annoy others. That's a common theme among Irish enthuiasts.

Shinnaynay

I've much more of an appreciation for Irish now being slightly older (20), I would never have 'Hated' it per-say, but there was a time in school when I strongly disliked it. I would love for my future children to be fluent (be proud of my heritage), respect those who can speak it well. My grandad hated Irish, but they were literally bate into learning it so its possible my dislike for learning it came from him haha

gleNine

Personally I love Irish. Without learning it, there would be no way that I'd be able to use the ATM in Irish. Thankfully it also has a secondary language - English.

I'd go so far to say that I feel strongly that our hard earned money and taxation should be used to facilitate Irish at every level within the public service because its an important part of our culture. I often wake up in the middle of the night and feel anxious but then... then I remember that its okay because we are preserving our language and heritage.

Its not as if there is anything better to spend it on!

4zn76tysfajdxp

Shinnaynay wrote: »

being slightly older (20)

Haha.

ancapailldorcha

gleNine wrote: »

Its not as if there is anything better to spend it on!

Health, education, infrastructure to name just three. The national language is English by the way.

gleNine

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Health, education, infrastructure to name just three. The national language is English by the way.

Seems like you didn't get the tone of my post

Iwasfrozen

Shinnaynay wrote: »

I've much more of an appreciation for Irish now being slightly older (20), I would never have 'Hated' it per-say, but there was a time in school when I strongly disliked it. I would love for my future children to be fluent (be proud of my heritage), respect those who can speak it well. My grandad hated Irish, but they were literally bate into learning it so its possible my dislike for learning it came from him haha

Isn't your Grandad your heritage? If your great grandparents spoke English then wouldn't that make English your heritage?