Who will succeed Johnny Sexton

Teferi

Pink Fairy wrote: »

I think that's the point of the thread

The very first line of the thread reads to me as if OP expects him not to be here due to form/favour etc.

phog

Teferi wrote: »

The very first line of the thread reads to me as if OP expects him not to be here due to form/favour etc.

Whether he's around or not we can't go into another world cup where a player like Madigan is our outhalf in a QF.

Edit to add. The OP also mentions injuries in the very first line.

phog

Tomtom364 wrote: »

Louie ludik? Did he play for the boks?

I don't know but I think I've seen him mentioned as a possible IQ player.

The Pheasant2

I've not managed to see JJ lining out for Northhampton yet - how's he been getting on?

Neil3030

The Pheasant2 wrote: »

I've not managed to see JJ lining out for Northhampton yet - how's he been getting on?

Riding the pine with sub appearances at 12.

Pink Fairy

Teferi wrote: »

The very first line of the thread reads to me as if OP expects him not to be here due to form/favour etc.

IMO, Sexton is one major concussion injury away from retirement, he's the best NH 10 and replacing him isn't going to be easy

Richard Hillman

I remember watching Ross Byrne in the Schools Cup and thinking he was a real contender for the future. When he first started to play for U 20s he performed pretty much the same way he did with Leinster for that solo appearance.

His performances for Ireland improved immensely. I reckon he just needs to feel comfortable around his team before he can shine. Unfortunately in terms of Senior International and Provincial, you don't get much time to settle in.

phog

The Pheasant2 wrote: »

I've not managed to see JJ lining out for Northhampton yet - how's he been getting on?

Neil3030 wrote: »

Riding the pine with sub appearances at 12.

He started a European game at outhalf and is listed as outhalf for their Premiership game v Bath tomorrow. I think he's been named as a sub for their other games.

molloyjh

Richard Hillman wrote: »

I remember watching Ross Byrne in the Schools Cup and thinking he was a real contender for the future. When he first started to play for U 20s he performed pretty much the same way he did with Leinster for that solo appearance.

His performances for Ireland improved immensely. I reckon he just needs to feel comfortable around his team before he can shine. Unfortunately in terms of Senior International and Provincial, you don't get much time to settle in.

I think that's why he was given that start away to Scarlets tbh. Get him in and involved. I'm sure over the next year or two he'll start getting more and more time off the bench. There's no mad rush on him. We have Sexton, Madigan and Marsh so we can take our time with Byrne. Will he be ready by 2019? Maybe, maybe not. But I do think Johnny will still be around. He's been managing games fairly well and his own form has been on the up the last few weeks too.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

techdiver wrote: »

"If", Jackson is the best 10 from a game management and tactical kicking point of view, then he should be the guy.

There are plenty of other players that can take over the place kicking duties. We have a serious obsession in Ireland that the 10 has to be the goal kicker. It doesn't matter a flying **** who kicks (1 - 15) as long as they go over.

It's the obvious solution but the problem is who else do we have, who isn't a 10, that can kick? McCloskey did a bit of kicking at Ulster during the WC but it was very much a no other option thing. Of the players who are regulars in the Irish set up at the moment we're looking at the 10 doing it or having Madigan on the pitch at 12/15 while Jackson is on at 10.

Podge_irl wrote: »

Of the current options, Jackson is the best fly half. He's not kicked on quite like I hoped he would though.

Jackson's had quite a few spells out with injuries. A couple of full seasons at Ulster without any serious knocks and more game time in green and he might start to live up to what people were expecting from him.

Tomtom364 wrote: »

Louie ludik? Did he play for the boks?

Ludik hasn't played for anyone internationally but he's 29, only arrived in Ulster in 2014(?) so you're looking at him being 31-ish before he even qualifies so he's not a viable long term option, if he was an option at all.

Pink Fairy wrote: »

IMO, Sexton is one major concussion injury away from retirement, he's the best NH 10 and replacing him isn't going to be easy

If you could put a bubble around him and guarantee he didn't get injured again there's no doubt he'd be in the squad in 2019 but he's almost constantly carrying some sort of injury these days. His groin was still at him from the WC until recently, Cullen said last week he's carrying something in his back and that's not even mentioning the concussions.

I don't know that we have a long term successor for Sexton at the moment. If I had to put money on someone it'd be Jackson but it may be a case that we knock a few more seasons out of Sexton, Jackson gets the job done for a few years while some young guy is coming up through the ranks.

Utah_Saint

Rem Jackson is 23. I don't believe sexton had as many league caps as Jackson by 23. I certainly rem a very erratic, none to impressive sexton at 23. If he stays injury free then Jackson will be a quality 10.

Pink Fairy

Hanrahan had a good game today, distribution was good kicked well and nailed a pressure penalty to win the game, good outing in an otherwise poor game

hype101

I don't think Byrne has a real break in him.. Has everything else but he's a big lad and not the quickest.. Hanrahan for me has it all but just needs to bring it together and mature with regular gametime.. More outings like today would be no harm.. Solid throughout and showed glimpses.. Still gutted Munster let him go (by 'let him go' I mean not starting him over Keatley consistently).. But that's for another forum.

case885

hype101 wrote:

I don't think Byrne has a real break in him.. Has everything else but he's a big lad and not the quickest.. Hanrahan for me has it all but just needs to bring it together and mature with regular gametime.. More outings like today would be no harm.. Solid throughout and showed glimpses.. Still gutted Munster let him go (by 'let him go' I mean not starting him over Keatley consistently).. But that's for another forum.

I think he could really push on there and it looks like mallinder isn't afraid to start him in big games, Munster will be doing well to get him back when his contract is up.

CatFromHue

I dunno about that, today was only his second start

case885

CatFromHue wrote:

I dunno about that, today was only his second start

Would you expect more? Meyler is obviously still first choice but starting against Scarlets in Europe and against bath are big games. He should be settled into Northampton's system now so that will stand to him.

hype101

case885 wrote: »

Would you expect more? Meyler is obviously still first choice but starting against Scarlets in Europe and against bath are big games. He should be settled into Northampton's system now so that will stand to him.

I could see him overtaking Meyler over the course of the season.. They play him at 12 as well.

I remember a few seasons ago Ford and Hanrahan came up against each other at under 20 so it was quite interesting to watch today.. Ford had an off day for sure but JJ looked very comfortable.. Can't recall a mistake.. All aspects of his kicking game were rock solid.. Nothing too flashy with ball in hand but he looked lively.

Basically, I think he could be Madigan without the drawbacks.

TICKLE_ME_ELMO

I didn't realise Hanrahan was so young. Makes sense now the annoyance at him leaving Munster. I thought he was nearer the end of his career than the start.

Is there an actual rule about playing abroad for Irish players? I've read/heard various things about Sexton's time in France but some imply rules were bent a little for him while others imply he's the only player the situation ever arose with but don't make it clear if there was a rule bent a little or if a rule never existed.

Utah_Saint

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

I didn't realise Hanrahan was so young. Makes sense now the annoyance at him leaving Munster. I thought he was nearer the end of his career than the start.

Is there an actual rule about playing abroad for Irish players? I've read/heard various things about Sexton's time in France but some imply rules were bent a little for him while others imply he's the only player the situation ever arose with but don't make it clear if there was a rule bent a little or if a rule never existed.

He's the same age as Jackson.

I believe an exception was made for sexton as he was critical to the Int team

Pink Fairy

TICKLE_ME_ELMO wrote: »

I didn't realise Hanrahan was so young. Makes sense now the annoyance at him leaving Munster. I thought he was nearer the end of his career than the start.

Is there an actual rule about playing abroad for Irish players? I've read/heard various things about Sexton's time in France but some imply rules were bent a little for him while others imply he's the only player the situation ever arose with but don't make it clear if there was a rule bent a little or if a rule never existed.

There is no rule in place. It's just that most Irish players don't go abroad, but when they so (Sexton, Bowe) they are picked

Triumvirate

case885 wrote: »

Would you expect more? Meyler is obviously still first choice but starting against Scarlets in Europe and against bath are big games. He should be settled into Northampton's system now so that will stand to him.

It will take a bit longer for him to settle into the system fully. He's a kid who has just emigrated, essentially, so will need lots of time to adjust. Whilst he went well against Bath, that's still only his second start in 8 games and I'd think he's firmly in second place behind Myler who is a massive favourite with the Saints and club hero.

Hanrahan should be targetting the second half of the season to really make a mark over there. Thus far, I don't think he'll be too happy with how his season has gone with only two starts and being left on the bench a couple of times with appearances at 12 when he did come on.

He left to play 10 and he left to get starts by his own admission. At this point, I don't think there's much doubt he'd have more of both thus far this season if he had stayed where he was.

RobbieRuns

JJ was more peed off than anything, which is why he left. He should be Sextons successor, he is the most talented.

pickarooney

RobbieRuns wrote: »

JJ was more peed off than anything, which is why he left. He should be Sextons successor, he is the most talented.

I thought you were going to say he was the grumpiest candidate!

Akrasia

I think one of the main lessons from the WC is that we shouldn't be relying on any one player in key positions like OH and SH

We'll need at least 2 highly capable out halves competing against each other for the top spot.

I think JJ, Tyler and Jackson will be competing for the number 10 for Japan 2019 and schmidt should be fostering healthy, strong competition amongst these guys for that position.

Players should be picked based on their club form, and not just because they're experienced or have a good international reputation.

Sexton's playing awful at the moment. if he's still playing this badly in January, Schmidt should consider dropping him for the 6 nations.

molloyjh

Akrasia wrote: »

I think one of the main lessons from the WC is that we shouldn't be relying on any one player in key positions like OH and SH

We'll need at least 2 highly capable out halves competing against each other for the top spot.

I think JJ, Tyler and Jackson will be competing for the number 10 for Japan 2019 and schmidt should be fostering healthy, strong competition amongst these guys for that position.

Players should be picked based on their club form, and not just because they're experienced or have a good international reputation.

Sexton's playing awful at the moment. if he's still playing this badly in January, Schmidt should consider dropping him for the 6 nations.

JJ is hardly playing at all so then by your logic he shouldn't be in contention. What form does Bleyendaal have? And Jackson is doing ok, but no better than ok.

On top of all of that Sextons form isn't as bad as people are making out. You can see the difference between Leinster with him and Leinster without him at the moment. He just controls everything so much better than the other options. The fact that he is in a new set-up with new people around him and has yet to actually play more than 2 games next to the same scrum-half and centre partnership have made that transition even more difficult. But for me he has been the best Irish out-half over the last few weeks even if he isn't playing his best rugby.

jm08

I don't think Tyler has any intention of declaring for Ireland. I'd imagine he will be going back to NZ/Crusaders after his stint with Munster from what he has said now that Carter has moved on and he will get more of an opportunity there.

galwaylad14

Anyone who thinks Jack Carty could succeed Johnny Sexton obviously had never seen Carty play

Stan27

galwaylad14 wrote: »

Anyone who thinks Jack Carty could succeed Johnny Sexton obviously had never seen Carty play

Not plaything that bad lately. And only young remember

case885

Another start for JJ, seems to be progressing very well for Northampton.

case885

Triumvirate wrote: »

It will take a bit longer for him to settle into the system fully. He's a kid who has just emigrated, essentially, so will need lots of time to adjust. Whilst he went well against Bath, that's still only his second start in 8 games and I'd think he's firmly in second place behind Myler who is a massive favourite with the Saints and club hero.

Hanrahan should be targetting the second half of the season to really make a mark over there. Thus far, I don't think he'll be too happy with how his season has gone with only two starts and being left on the bench a couple of times with appearances at 12 when he did come on.

He left to play 10 and he left to get starts by his own admission. At this point, I don't think there's much doubt he'd have more of both thus far this season if he had stayed where he was.

Would he have started two european games? Highly unlikely id say.