MORE crap on the way.

OzCam

United Kingdom Airsoft Players Union shared Vicky Ford MEP's video.


Really excellent summary of the EU firearms situation from Vicky Ford MEP https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=978089762280122


Matt

Vicky Ford MEP
3 February at 17:48 ·
The review of EU ‪#‎firearms‬ law is under way. The parliament can now amend and change the EU commission proposals on the firearms directive before any change to current law is introduced. The current draft text is very unclear and unless changed would have serious consequences for many legal stakeholders. I am often asked about what we are doing why we need it and when it will be complete. I spoke at length (6 mins) on camera today about the whole process and I hope it clarifies all the issues that have been raised. Thank you.

Grizzly 45

http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?qid=1452176160698&uri=CELEX%3A32015R2403
It seems our EU betters dont even know what legislation they are dealing with.

BattleCorp

How in the name of fcuk could anybody be expected to follow all that sh1te. Bureaucracy gone mad.

gunny123

It'll be a case of "Don't read it, just sign it, stoopid". A bit like biffo trying to explain the Lisbon treaty on RTE news, he couldn't.

yubabill1

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?qid=1452176160698&uri=CELEX%3A32015R2403
It seems our EU betters dont even know what legislation they are dealing with.

That's the deact proposals they have rushed through separately - mainly to do with the existing directive, which was poorly enacted in some countries.

Semi auto ban etc is separate new proposed directive.

OzCam

I'd guess the Museum and antiquities people are pretty upset with that. Making historical artefects inoperable and unrepairable is one thing, but welding up the triggers and magazines seems like vandalism to me. I mean, how often are museum pieces stolen for criminal use? Really?

Surely plugging or drilling the barrel, making it un-replaceable, messing up the chamber and the firing pin and whatever other gubbins internally should be enough?

barnaman

OzCam wrote: »

I'd guess the Museum and antiquities people are pretty upset with that. Making historical artefects inoperable and unrepairable is one thing, but welding up the triggers and magazines seems like vandalism to me. I mean, how often are museum pieces stolen for criminal use? Really?

Surely plugging or drilling the barrel, making it un-replaceable, messing up the chamber and the firing pin and whatever other gubbins internally should be enough?

That deactivation overkill is around a while. Last gun amnesty relation handed in a revolver that used in 1916 etc given to family member by McDonagh. Explained history of item to Guards ended up in National Museum who bored it etc (not sure if guards or museum did). wrecked a historical gun for no purpose.

Grizzly 45

Going to be intresting to see will this directive apply to R&D or police forensic museums?The latter needs live firearms to be able to prove the ballistics of type of a firearm,and R&D need live firearms for development.
Whats the betting now old Decats are going to skyrocket in value and old spec deacts will disapper or be traded at black market prices?

barnaman

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Going to be intresting to see will this directive apply to R&D or police forensic museums?The latter needs live firearms to be able to prove the ballistics of type of a firearm,and R&D need live firearms for development.
Whats the betting now old Decats are going to skyrocket in value and old spec deacts will disapper or be traded at black market prices?

Or will they collapse in value? If they say any firearm manufactured after 1900 must be ...... The problem is for a thing to be valuable it has to be tradable.

By way thanks lads on here pushing against this on national level I signed local gunclub petitions etc but thats it.

OzCam

I'd guess that R&D or forensic pieces would be covered by whatever bulk license already applies to the organisation.

Now that you mention it, I didn't see any exemption clauses in that Deac standard. Pretty typical of the slipshod way those directives are written. And if I'm reading it correctly, any piece deativated to old standards will have to be butchered again (and registered, and stamped) if they change hands.

OzCam

I'd guess that R&D or forensic pieces would be covered by whatever bulk license already applies to the organisation.

Now that you mention it, I didn't see any exemption clauses in that Deac standard. Pretty typical of the slipshod way those directives are written. And if I'm reading it correctly, any piece deativated to old standards will have to be butchered again (and registered, and stamped) if they change hands.

Grizzly 45

barnaman wrote: »

Or will they collapse in value? If they say any firearm manufactured after 1900 must be ...... The problem is for a thing to be valuable it has to be tradable.

By way thanks lads on here pushing against this on national level I signed local gunclub petitions etc but thats it.

Now that you mention it, I didn't see any exemption clauses in that Deac standard. Pretty typical of the slipshod way those directives are written. And if I'm reading it correctly, any piece deativated to old standards will have to be butchered again (and registered, and stamped) if they change hands.
Yesterday 19:33
OzCam I'd guess that R&D or forensic pieces would be covered by whatever bulk license already applies to the organisation.

So congrats EU on creating ANOTHER black market for undergound dealers and collectors. There are already X 100 thousands of theses deacts flying around the EU.Mostly sitting harmlessly over peoples fireplaces etc .Bar Ireland and Sweden there is no register of these lumps of metal.

So how will the EU register them first off??Do they expect everyone to be a good little sheeple and go and register them to be destroyed even further? This means that an old spec deact wil increase in value to anyone who wants one on the black market. It becomes even more farsical that their reasoning to prevent terrorists and criminals getting them and reactivating...blah,blah, bS, B,S BS.If you are reacting totally dead guns,you can just as easily go and build an "Ulster special" out of a metal table leg and some iron monger fittings and have a much cheaper ,as effective, mass produceable and disposable SMG with little or no ballistic fingerprint.

In short .This is another EU anti gun fantasy,that wont stop terrorism ,will create another balck market,as it is unenforceable and[bar here,maybe] people will continue to keep their old spec deacts and not bother eregistering them or trade underground with them at high profit .

Grizzly 45

From sports colation website

http://www.sportscoalition.org/minutes-from-fcp-directive-updates-28th-january-2016/

Still pushing to waste more taxpayers money with a centralised restricted firearms data base and ballistic databases.
Finally the great Des has woken up to the threat of the EU and is asking you all now to contact your MEPS and TDs...Firearms united Ireland has been requesting you do this since December! Still,better late than never.:rolleyes:

Grizzly 45

Lying politicans,seems France is the big pusher now of this legislation. Lying and phoney statistics.UK and Aussie style gun "buybacks" IE we pay you SFA and you'll like it or not! Politicans threatning pro gun advocates with arrest as they might be stalking them.EU govt depts wasting EU taxpayers monies on reports that cost appx 660 THOUSAND to produce. And "If they[EU gunowners] are getting upset at this legislation,they must be all crazy!"

Your dictatorship of the EUSSR at work folks...Working hard to waste your money and ban your guns.:mad:

/www.all4shooters.com/en/Shooting/law/Firearms-United-EU-Gun-Ban-ongoing/

yubabill1

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Lying politicans,seems France is the big pusher now of this legislation. Lying and phoney statistics.UK and Aussie style gun "buybacks" IE we pay you SFA and you'll like it or not! Politicans threatning pro gun advocates with arrest as they might be stalking them.EU govt depts wasting EU taxpayers monies on reports that cost appx 660 THOUSAND to produce. And "If they[EU gunowners] are getting upset at this legislation,they must be all crazy!"

Your dictatorship of the EUSSR at work folks...Working hard to waste your money and ban your guns.:mad:

/www.all4shooters.com/en/Shooting/law/Firearms-United-EU-Gun-Ban-ongoing/

Funny how shotguns have sold out on the continent while EU parliament wants to restrict gun ownership.

What no-one is telling us is that EU Progressive Left open borders types want to protect themselves with this. ISIS is a Trojan horse for their policy.

They would rather see the population spaced out on drugs, that keeps them quiet, you see.

Btw, it's called Victim Blaming - they say we are nuts if we don't submit, then we become the bad guys.

What they fail to see is that they are going to crystallise out a gun lobby in the EU with this. They don't understand shooters, so they fear them. I mean, how many hunters you know abuse drugs? How many Lefties you know smoke weed? Answers on a postcard, please.

Grizzly 45

Well you learn somthing new every day "victim blaming." Another bit of PC speak:rolleyes: Heres another one from the female sexual enlightner magazine[So described by Lyod Coyle in his song Perfect skin"] Cosmopoliton.aka the "Demand an orgasam a day news."
We are "gun splainers":eek: As we are perpetually explaining our position on firearms to all and sundry...Amazing how the politically correct can come up new terms at the drop of a hat.:rolleyes:

yubabill1

This is really going to play out on the continent, more so than here. Several countries already raising questions.

Pity there's no veto on this, or it would be dead.

Presume it needs a majority of mep's to pass.

I suppose they will go down the divide and conquer route, coupled with sensational news pieces about scary gun enthusiasts. Now, where did I see that before?

Grizzly 45

ASFIK it needs 18 countries to bury it.Got about 10 sofar.Mostly former east bolcker's who actually remember what its like to live in dictatorships where hunting and gun ownership wad a privildge reserved for the Party bosses or occupying army.Our problem in the West ,we have gone too soft in our lives.

long range shooter

Its hard for people who doesnt understand what shooting really is about.

Grizzly 45

More guff from the EU ,a report from the most expensive and incompetant branch of the EU legislature.The European Economic and Social comittee.They have a budget of somthing like a million euros PA for 20 people and most of it is gone on salaries ,perks and pensions.These are the people responsible for finding out things like bent banannas for EU norms, how strong your wifes dish washing rubber gloves must be and how strong your hoover can be in the EU to prevent climate change...:rolleyes:
The report you are about to read has cost [all 8 pages] has cost 65 THOUSAND euros to put together:mad::mad: Whats it say? Well ban all semi autos,in a UK or Aussie buyback because they have reduced guncrime in both countries and its only "afew thousand" in the European Union.[166 thousand .22 SA in the UK alone,estimated bill 65 million euros ]No mention of a buy back of deacts however.
Oh yeah and somehow micro stamp the bullet and shell casing as this will aid in police detection of gun crimes..NOTE Police your brass in that case if this comes thru ,as there is a good chance of frame up potential aplenty for obvious reasons.I can see the development of caseless ammo coming along in leaps&bounds soon then..:eek:

The KICKER is for those who think "this doent concern me as I dont have a semi auto or deact" is...LISTEN UP!! MEDICAL TESTS EU wide!!! This wont be our AGS asking your Doc are you alright if you were in abit of a funk for a month or so. It will be a physical exam to see if you are competant to use the gun and your eyesight is ok and that you have no "disabilities" that might preclude you from owning a gun.
As well as no doubt lying on Dr Nutters state approved head shrinker office couch discussing why you want to own a gun and the Doc looking for some excuse to preclude you from owning one.

Happy times ahead ...IF we dont get up off our asses along with our organisations here and say NO WAY. We have politicans of all hues at our doors at the moment.you can doorstep this lot of political job seekers and ask what will their MEPS do about this issue.?

Sofar we have had only TWO MEPS from Ireland take note of this issue and respond;
Marian Harkin and Brian Cowley.

SHAME on the rest of the Irish MEPs Especially those of major political parties like Maried Mc Guinness FG,Deirdre Clune FG,Brian Hayes FG, Lynn Boylan SF,Nessa Childers IND,Matt CarthyIND,and Ming Flannagan IND.
You going to ask why they arenot responding to the people they repersent in Europe on this issue??

goz83

What a ridiculous report. The author can't even decide whether to use the "weapon", or "firearm", even when clearly referring to sports shooting. Here's one sentence where both get used interchangeably.

(3.2 One can not also forget the accidents with firearms, caused either by poor handling of weapons, or the lack of security in storage, that every year con nue to kill or injure seriously.)

Nonsense.

long range shooter

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

More guff from the EU ,a report from the most expensive and incompetant branch of the EU legislature.The European Economic and Social comittee.They have a budget of somthing like a million euros PA for 20 people and most of it is gone on salaries ,perks and pensions.These are the people responsible for finding out things like bent banannas for EU norms, how strong your wifes dish washing rubber gloves must be and how strong your hoover can be in the EU to prevent climate change...:rolleyes:
The report you are about to read has cost [all 8 pages] has cost 65 THOUSAND euros to put together:mad::mad: Whats it say? Well ban all semi autos,in a UK or Aussie buyback because they have reduced guncrime in both countries and its only "afew thousand" in the European Union.[166 thousand .22 SA in the UK alone,estimated bill 65 million euros ]No mention of a buy back of deacts however.
Oh yeah and somehow micro stamp the bullet and shell casing as this will aid in police detection of gun crimes..NOTE Police your brass in that case if this comes thru ,as there is a good chance of frame up potential aplenty for obvious reasons.I can see the development of caseless ammo coming along in leaps&bounds soon then..:eek:

The KICKER is for those who think "this doent concern me as I dont have a semi auto or deact" is...LISTEN UP!! MEDICAL TESTS EU wide!!! This wont be our AGS asking your Doc are you alright if you were in abit of a funk for a month or so. It will be a physical exam to see if you are competant to use the gun and your eyesight is ok and that you have no "disabilities" that might preclude you from owning a gun.
As well as no doubt lying on Dr Nutters state approved head shrinker office couch discussing why you want to own a gun and the Doc looking for some excuse to preclude you from owning one.

Happy times ahead ...IF we dont get up off our asses along with our organisations here and say NO WAY. We have politicans of all hues at our doors at the moment.you can doorstep this lot of political job seekers and ask what will their MEPS do about this issue.?

Sofar we have had only TWO MEPS from Ireland take note of this issue and respond;
Marian Harkin and Brian Cowley.

SHAME on the rest of the Irish MEPs Especially those of major political parties like Maried Mc Guinness FG,Deirdre Clune FG,Brian Hayes FG, Lynn Boylan SF,Nessa Childers IND,Matt CarthyIND,and Ming Flannagan IND.
You going to ask why they arenot responding to the people they repersent in Europe on this issue??

Medical and physical examination?
When are politicians going to have to get an iq test for being one?
They think a medical examination and shrink is going to stop guncrime and terrorism?
I am pretty sure the doctors will have their hands full with criminals and terrorists in the future looking to get a semi auto.

Grizzly 45

long range shooter wrote: »

Medical and physical examination?
When are politicians going to have to get an iq test for being one?
They think a medical examination and shrink is going to stop guncrime and terrorism?
I am pretty sure the doctors will have their hands full with criminals and terrorists in the future looking to get a semi auto.

Nope they admitted it themselves ,as have Irish and UK and other politicans over the years.It is simply Gun control with the philosophy of" as few guns in civillian hands as possible ."IOW disarmed herds are easier to control .Next up is currency control on gun sales.You may or may not have heard that the EU will be doing away with 500 euro notes?A pretty rare thing for most of us agreed.But did you know that cash transactions on gunand ammo sales wiill be prohibited too??And that transactions of over 5000 euros cash will be athing of the past too?
All to keep us safer from "crime and terrorism"..Makes you feel all warm and fuzzy doesnt it?

Grizzly 45

www.facebook.com/FirearmsUnitedIreland/

Latest video from the EU

The German Federal Police, head of the ballistics dept, M Bernstein adresses the EU comission on the proposed firearms laws.I've had the privilidge of speaking to him personally in relation to my previous firearms court cases and whether my modern sporting rifle was an"assault rifle " or not.

This is the man and whose dept decides whether ANY new gun model in Germany is capable of being converted illegally to a full auto or not.Or whether deacts can be reacted or not,or whether blank firiers can fire live shells,or whether air cartridge guns could fire live rounds again.If they cant do it with normal tools or whatever,within time periods of 6months to a year it cant be done.Also,this is kind of the unoffical marker for EU standards on firearms legality.If it passes Bundes Kriminal Amt testing,oesnt fall foul of the German war weapons act ,its good to go,or should be ,EU wide.

IOW you listen up when this guy speaks on weapons and firearms.I dont think the anti gun politicns liked what he had to say about the legislation.:P

Its not just firearms they test.Its also anything that looks like a weapon that could be illegal.Right down to a grip that looked like a knuckle duster on a line of fashion handbags being imported to Germany:eek:.[They passed BTW as not being intended as a forbidden weapon from conception]

Grizzly 45

http://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/en/news-room/20160222IPR15334/Firearms-proposal-impact-on-law-abiding-citizens-dominates-EP-committee-debate
Well its now moving into the political ring .March 15 there is a big debate in the EU parliment about this,all intrested parties are invited to attend.The comission knows it is a fuk up on many points,there is no EU impact study on this proposal and its admittedly badly written and put together...Whats the betting they will still make an allo out effort to impliment a ban?
BTW idf you want to see some exellent EU counter arguements to these proposals. Goto Facebook Firearmsunited Ireland.

Grizzly 45

Article on the sneakniess of the EU and Brit govts on the EU gun ban.Dont be surprised if and when we have an Irish govt ,that thry the same stunt at the French Italians and Belgians...Push an "but its EU law,nothing we can do about it. stance. Tomrrow the debate from the EU is live and streaming for those who want to watch it.

https://www.all4shooters.com/en/Shooting/law/EU-Gun-Ban-update-March-2016/

Grizzly 45

Well I got half of this debate.My take is on it the EU comission wants a ban on semi autos no matter what and without paying compensation.Its being egged on by the UK and France ,Italy and Belguim,who conviently have a shooting in Brussells this afternoon from the "religion of peace"crowd again.If I was a beliver in false flag operations,I would say it was well timed to be coincidental.
The rest of the EU members made points on this as being an utter mess and with no impact study it is hard to over see how many people will be affected.The FACE rep made a good defence of semi autos in hunting,but was weak on not knowing how many hunters could be affectred by it.
Alot of it is still about deact standards and could live firing guns be nicked from museuems...Like how many times has the imperial war museuem been cleared out by villans?
The head of the EU comission was utterly ignorant on the subject,claiming Dunblane was done with a semi auto rifle and that there were shootings in Germany in schools with Semi autos[All of them have been handguns sofar] He objects to privte collectors having the same rights as museuems...Total and utter gobdaw and present arguements that could have almost come from AGS manual of play from our hearings last year!!
The Swedish peace institute another bunch of clowns. Converted airsofts to fire live ammo and we support a magazine ban,as suggested by the BELGIAN PROOF HOUSE MASTER!!![With friends like these:rolleyes:]Never heard of duct tape then in Belguim?Or how well this has worked in the US?

Vicky Ford MEP the chair woman was well informed and even picked up on this mag issue stating well what about 3d printing and the fact that there are thousands out there already?"
They are utterly hampered by the fact there is NO impact study and no one has a clue how many deacts,semis or whatever is actually out there. The sensible EU reps and countries have said basically leave this alone,but the dictators in the comission want somthing to be done and have admitted that this is gun control not anything to do much with crime or terrorism in their replies and documents.
Truely the blind leading the blind out there .Next big event in June it gets debated and possibly passed into law.God help us!

TeaBagMania

It’s the foot in the door approach, first ban semi’s, then ban everything except single shot, then ban everything over .22, then ban sling shots. Just let em try to ban rocks in Ireland

IMO Ireland joining the EU was a bad decision

gunny123

If there is a brexit and the migrant crisis continues, you may not have to worry about the eu much longer. A lot of "if's" but its possible.

OzCam

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Converted airsofts to fire live ammo

I wish someone would tell these idiots once and for all that this is not possible.

I'm quite happy to meet anyone from this thread who has armory or gunsmithing experience to let them inspect my airsoft replicas. It's a modest collection, but it includes all the main propulsion technologies except High Pressure Air. If you could see the materials that they're made of and the fact that many of them are held together with tiny grub screws, you'd see how utterly ridiculous the idea that any of them could handle live ammunition is.


Anyway, now that this draft is heading to the Parliament, it's time to count the votes. And someone needs to get a count of the numbers who will be affected too. "Cold dead hands" rhetoric doesn't win friends - or votes. I don't know how many votes the Parliament needs to defeat a Commission proposal, but it's time someone looked it up.