MORE crap on the way.

Grizzly 45

]Except that that's completely counter to what they *did* do in 91/EEC/477.

You keep going on as if this is a good thing???

Call me when the men in jackboots show up at your door at 4am to pursuade you with knuckledusters. In our lives, it's generally economic threats, if there are threats, at least in this context.

Which can be just as bad if not worse.My family on the Germans side did get to see those characters in action in the late 1930s to mid 1940s Berlin.One crowd upt o around the mid 1930s wore red stars on their caps,until the swastika crowd outed them.

It's more because anyone with any skillsets they can earn money with and the kind of mindset you want in the Dail don't want to be within an asses roar of the place because who the hell would want to work with the Healy-Raes?

Well, then you cant expect anything but gob****es to be in charge.Where another obscure kind of thought process comes in, much derided in our American friends,called patriotism.Do you want to change the system or make money?If you want to change the system,maybe you have to forget about trousering the bucks and deal with gob****es on a daily basis..Tough job I know,but someone has to do it if you want a different country..?

Which is a bloody good thing. And our lot are basically conning us when they do so because they're not the ones who fix that stuff here either.

Maybe they just have a more efficent mindset and properly run councils?Without massive wage bills?

True, but I'd much rather the big professional machine even if it means I'm a fish in a larger pond, because at least the water will be better filtered...

Jaysus, what kind of long-haired hippie are you that you want free newspapers?

More a Hunter S Thompson kind of guy in the hair dept:D

It was a story about a large amount of russian money showing up in the IFSC. Mostly at the stage right now where financial journos are hearing bad things they don't have enough on to print yet, but that's where we were with lehmann brothers as well for a while.

The shoebox and the dublin life isn't down to the French and Germans so much as it's down to our lot thinking that a financial regulator should shut up and not rock the boat, while a property bubble was something that would never burst.

OH ! It's VERY much down to them son!Where do you think all the loot came from?From Hans and Hanna Schmidt savings accounts.Where it was doing nothing much, apart from costing the German banks interest. Germans aren't big spenders,a new washing machine and a weeks holiday someplace on the tourist package is their splurge for a year.Banks are in the business of making more money, and here comes Paddy the plasterer and wannabe property tycoon.Loan him money at a low-interest rate and see what happens...Paddy goes ape!And the rest, they say is history..Remember "We are awash with money!" Brian Cowen then minister for Finance. "Anyone who is talking down the boom, should go away and commit suicide!" Bertie Aherne.Our lot didnt call halt as they were coining it too and were just as involved with the banks as any property developer.The Eu bankers werent going to stay stop either..How many were sold the get on the property ladder,and shure have a huge mortgage,that will take you 3 lifetimes to pay back?Be grand!" myths.

Again, give me the EU any day of the week; at least when they're stodgy and conservative, they don't pull fast ones that leave you in negative equity for the next thirty years if you're lucky

.

See above...No they expect you to be adults and know how to handle your money as individuals and countries.Much different attitude to debt over there..Comes from a mostly what the Irish would call"Proddie" [Actually Lutheran]work ethic.

Everyone and their dog knows what they're about. But just because you know what they are, it doesn't alleviate the problem.

Then why take them seriously?e know they are a vaudeville act.


And they'll still be the largest economic bloc around while Britain has managed to vote itself into economic destitution for some ungodly reason...

Poland's just gotten an almighty knock on the knuckles today from an Irish High Court over that - as in, their EU funding threatened, the ECHJ called in to examine their laws because of the right-wing nutters they've been electing, the whole nine yards

.

This is exactly WHY it will fall apart.What business have we telling a country we know SFA about how to regulate its borders from undesirables?What business is it of ours who they vote in,or theirs of ours?Maybe if you had lived under the happy days of Soviet occupation and the joys of standing for five hours in a que for a loaf of bread under Socialism,while waiting five years to be able to do the paperwork on changing yourTrabant,and worrying about that 3AM knock on the door because your neighbour ratted you out for watching West German TV,you might understand why they take this Democracy lark,that we take for granted ,abit more seriously than we do??

That's the idea behind the EU - avoid a war to sort out that kind of nonsense by simply funnelling money into states that don't do things like officially blaming the Jews and Immigrants in general for all their woes.
Me, I think that's a grand idea. Beats the **** out of a world war any day of the week.

PLEEEEASSSSEEEE! Sparks! Honestly?? Did you ever hear of NATO? The Eu is nothing more than a socialist Federalist beuracy grown out of control of an economic trading bloc.It never did anything to defend itself,apart from sponge off the US where it is supposed to spend 3%PA of GDP for common defence.Most obvious reason Ireland never signed up.Now with the US saying sort yourselves out and the borders moved 400 miles closer to Moscow than London.Inexplicably "the Russians" are a great threat,that requires an EU army all of a sudden?Maybe if Angelika and Berlin could quit messing about in Russias local politics,like Crimiea,we wouldnt have a need for an EU army ??

You say that as if them failing would be a good thing.
You do remember the alternative, right?
Us stuck as buffer states between two superpowers in a cold war as we dodge being annihilated a dozen or so times from things as stupid as reflections off clouds or the wrong tape being loaded into a computer or an electrical glitch? Getting it in the neck with every trade war or actual skirmish that those two were getting into? Being constantly poor because of it to the point where a glass of orange juice was a fancy starter in a restaurant and the only herb most of us knew about was "mixed"? Most of your class and family being destined for the boat?

News for you.We are still going to be shoving our kids onto planes and boats anyway, whether we are in the EU or not.This country cant and wont support our population growth.Well,maybe not seeing the most common name now in Ireland is Mohammed for newborn kids and it seems to be the same all over the EU that name..So maybe the Imans will have a better idea about job growth in Ireland in the future?Should be plenty,as Irish women wont be working outside the home in that future.
Actually, the alternative had some good points too. Control of our own currency, that we could and did devalue to take off economic pressure.Not being micromanaged to death by unelected bureaucrats in Brussels,on how powerful our hoovers can be, how straight our bananas must be, Massive food wastage that could feed the 3rd world,but is dumped to keep prices artificially high,Whether it is a fineable offence to call a conserve a jam being sold at a village market.Not being able to sell your surplus farm produce at your gate,due to health and saftey..etc,etc, etc.Death of ten thousand micro paper cuts from Brussels.

Dunno how many kids you have to worry about Grizzly,

None...thankfully.

but I'd rather that my kid think of that stuff as weird stuff in a history book that makes as much sense to him as knocker-uppers do to us today. The EU's the best shot we have at that. Hell, last I looked, it was the _only_ shot, nobody else is really even trying.

That kind of sounds like Rev Lovejoy's missus "Won't someone please think of the childeren?" attack of the vapours. Of course any parent wnts the best for their childern,but is a Federalist Socialist micromanaging superstate with lots of internal problems really the best too??

gunny123

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Actually, the alternative had some good points too. Control of our own currency, that we could and did devalue to take off economic pressure.Not being micromanaged to death by unelected bureaucrats in Brussels,on how powerful our hoovers can be, how straight our bananas must be, Massive food wastage that could feed the 3rd world,but is dumped to keep prices artificially high,Whether it is a fineable offence to call a conserve a jam being sold at a village market.Not being able to sell your surplus farm produce at your gate,due to health and saftey..etc,etc, etc.Death of ten thousand micro paper cuts from Brussels.

I always thought of the EEC, as a good idea. A trading community where the Germans could sell their cars abroad, the French their wine, the Irish the agricultural produce etc etc,

But somewhere along the line someone decided it was going to be the united states of europe, micromanaged to stupid levels, every little thing regulated. They have something to say now on everything, from who can and cannot be in your country (the reason the brits left), what firearms you can own, the engine you can or cannot have in your car, who can fish in your sea or not etc etc. Its gone too far imho and thats why the far left and far right are bewildering the centrists in elections all over europe. Jesus we have seen the AFD in third place in the German elections, the far right reappear after 70 years in Germany, and the EU still don't get it.

Sparks

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

That kind of sounds like Rev Lovejoy's missus "Won't someone please think of the childeren?" attack of the vapours. Of course any parent wnts the best for their childern,but is a Federalist Socialist micromanaging superstate with lots of internal problems really the best too??

There's a longer answer, but it boils down to "Yes" as well.

The likes of the McGraths and Healy-Raes and Rosses and Deasys are just worse than the likes of Tusk. In every way. It's not just trivial things they're in charge of - they're able to muck about with infrastructure, healthcare, education, policing, just about every area of daily life that we rely on.

Frankly, I'll queue up for a federalist soclalist micromanaging superstate please and thank you. They work better than a who-you-know codology-based banana republic.

Grizzly 45

Quite frankly Sparks,I want neither a Socialist Federal micro managing superstate ,or gobdaws in charge in the Dail.There is a happy medium in both situations,and we have an easier chance of changing the gobdaws in charge here.BUT it has to be a change in the mentality of us, the people.Thats the hardest one to change.

Grizzly 45

gunny123 wrote: »

I always thought of the EEC, as a good idea. A trading community where the Germans could sell their cars abroad, the French their wine, the Irish the agricultural produce etc etc,

But somewhere along the line someone decided it was going to be the united states of europe, micromanaged to stupid levels, every little thing regulated. They have something to say now on everything, from who can and cannot be in your country (the reason the brits left), what firearms you can own, the engine you can or cannot have in your car, who can fish in your sea or not etc etc. Its gone too far imho and thats why the far left and far right are bewildering the centrists in elections all over europe. Jesus we have seen the AFD in third place in the German elections, the far right reappear after 70 years in Germany, and the EU still don't get it.

Its what happens when you add Socialist and right wing ideals, economics and game plans and apply it to a simple tradeing block of steel manufacturers. It was all conceived on a lovely little island in the Med, about 2 miles long by a mile wide.Called Ventotene.It lends its name to the founding documents of the EU, called the Ventotene declaration.Written by mostly liberals, Communists,/socialists and others whom Mussolini didn't want knocking about.They formulated this idea of a United Europe in the late 1930s.Every EU citizen should read it.

Add onto that the Frankfurt school of economics in the interwar years and a single currency, whos espouser was a former Nazi party member, and Adolf's economic minister Walther Funk.We could say we are now living in an unpleasent mix of "commucapitalism" in the "4thReich of the EUSSR."

Sparks

We could say we are now living in an unpleasent mix of "commucapitalism" in the "4thReich of the EUSSR."

We could, but we're not quite that crazy.
The term you're looking for is "social democracy" which is related to socialism in the same way homo sapiens is related to apes (ie. same family, different generation, significant differences). Think NHS, not Politburo.

muppetshow1451

Sparks wrote: »

We could, but we're not quite that crazy.
The term you're looking for is "social democracy" which is related to socialism in the same way homo sapiens is related to apes (ie. same family, different generation, significant differences). Think NHS, not Politburo.

Are you comparing EU to social democracy that excists in the Scandinavian countries?I would say EU is a fraction more towards the old communist soviet union.

Sparks

And I wouldn't because the NHS isn't in Denmark. Isn't it great, being able to disagree without the stasi showing up? It's almost like we weren't living in a 1980s sitcom version of the USSR!

muppetshow1451

Sparks wrote: »

And I wouldn't because the NHS isn't in Denmark. Isn't it great, being able to disagree without the stasi showing up? It's almost like we weren't living in a 1980s sitcom version of the USSR!

That still doesnt get away the facts that EU is not democratic.

Grizzly 45

muppetshow1451 wrote: »

Are you comparing EU to social democracy that excists in the Scandinavian countries?I would say EU is a fraction more towards the old communist soviet union.

The PC Stasi WILL show up there these days if you critique a certain religion that is making itself quite at home up there these days.Even if you are a member of that same religion!:p

muppetshow1451

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

The PC Stasi WILL show up there these days if you critique a certain religion that is making itself quite at home up there these days.Even if you are a member of that same religion!:p

Yes ,and you become a free member of the National Socialist German Workers party automatically ,even if you didnt apply for a membership,if you critizise this religion or anything related to immigration.

Grizzly 45

Poland want s to ban hunting.Norway semi auto rifles.

https://www.all4shooters.com/en/Hunting/news/New-bans-for-hunters-in-Norway-and-Poland/

gunny123

I am very surprised at that, i always thought both countries were very pro-hunting and pro-firearms.

yubabill1

I thought that anyone who followed this thread and the manner of imposition of the new Firearms Directive might find echoes of the experience in this story: JC Juncker appointed his adviser to a very senior position "within minutes" and threatens to resign if the new appointee is sacked.

Merkel and Macron support Juncker, while MEP's are demanding an investigation into whether proper procedures were followed.

Forget the references to Brexit and consider the underlying modus operandi in the EU:

https://www.independent.ie/world-news/europe/if-he-goes-i-go-juncker-fumes-in-row-over-adviser-36739178.html

garrettod

Hello,

I reckon this is always going to be a a one way street, until shooters start exerting more influence over politicans in Europe. The anti-shooting groups are quick enough to kick up a fuss, but we are not, and while I'm not saying that I want us to be the European version of the NRA (because I don't like some of their key people or policies), I am saying that we need to exert some influence while we've the numbers to be able to do same.

Grizzly 45

Have a look at Firearms United.com....:)

Grizzly 45

Guess everyone has the same problems EU wide, and it's disastrous consequences for hunting in this case or gun ownership in others.Maybe we'll learn from this, and start to realise we have to think
EU nationally on local issues...But I somehow doubt it.:rolleyes:

<<
[Editorial comment]
Call to networking by our friend from Sweden. We see here that the "old boys network" did not network but trusted in their "very good contacts to politicians" - which failed them.

We've made the same experience in Brussels with the "old boys network" for firearms. That was the reason Firearm United has been created: for networking, for awareness, for calls to action!

ACT TOGETHER, FEEL FREE AND MAKE CHANGES
We lost the battle in Poland ... did we learn?


Last week a new Polish hunting law brings lots of changes to the Polish hunting community passed through parliament. Most (if not all) of the changes are really bad news. To make a long story short: The new law is a frontal attack on Polish hunting. Our passion is now regarded as being so horrible that it is henceforth illegal to expose anybody under the age of 18 to any kind of hunting activity in Poland. This is a clear signal that hunting is considered bad and evil and it is a gross violation of every parent's right to educate their own children according to their own beliefs.

Next step in the fight against these unreasonable changes will presumably take place in the constitutional courts of Poland and the EU and quite possibly before the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg.

How did it come to this? Why did nobody react before it was way too late? Were where the organisations who are supposed to fight for us? Where were we?

I heard about the new law Saturday evening and wrote an open letter to the Polish president Sunday morning. At that point very few hunters - and nobody in my network - had heard about the disaster about to happen. It was also too late - the law had passed both chambers in the parliament and was in reality just waiting for the presidential approval.

FACE - the European organisation representing the nations hunting associations - could not go into the matter because the Polish hunting association (FACEs Polish member) had not invited FACE to intervene. The green light for FACE to go into the matter came Monday - four days before the ratification of the law.

CIC apparently didn't know that this was happening - and when they were told what was going on in the beginning of the week, they did not react (at least not in any visible way)

We - the hunters - hadn't heard a thing and thus we couldn't mobilize our networks in due time to influence anything. We can blame no one but ourselves.

IT IS TIME FOR ACTION!

I'll be perfectly frank: We dropped the ball. We f*cked it up.... and if we do not get our act together FAST this disease will spread like cancer over Europe.

We urgently need to upgrade our internal communication skills.

When problems like the Polish situation arises all active hunters in Europe must be warned a.s.a.p. so that we can mobilize our networks.

We urgently need to start cooperating more - and a lot better.

It is ridiculous that hunters had the information about the attack on Polish hunters and did not share it with everybody else. NEVER AGAIN! We - and all our organisations MUST be able to set our differences aside and coordinate our efforts when we are under attack. Otherwise, we will lose the entire war as we just lost the battle.

We urgently need a platform enabling us to call hunters all over Europe to action with a moments notice.

Imagine what an email-base of just 10.000 passionate European hunters could have done for us.

I will start to work on these matters. We need to wake up - or we will soon die in our sleep.

Nekarsulm

What role, if any, do shooters in general and the FCP in particular have in this latest process started by Minister Stanton?

http://www.justice.ie/en/JELR/Pages/PR17000093

gunny123

Airsoft ? Weren't they the ones who would not support us, when the poo hit the fan with the centrefire pistols ? Now that the worm has turned, all i have to say is tough titty.

Nekarsulm

gunny123 wrote: »

Airsoft ? Weren't they the ones who would not support us, when the poo hit the fan with the centrefire pistols ? Now that the worm has turned, all i have to say is tough titty.

Personally I would agree there, Gunny.
But it sets a dangerous precedent in allowing "I-dont-like-the-look-of-that" to be a good enough reason to change the law.

Sparks

gunny123 wrote: »

Airsoft ? Weren't they the ones who would not support us, when the poo hit the fan with the centrefire pistols ? Now that the worm has turned, all i have to say is tough titty.

No, they were the ones that we explicitly told to not get involved with us because being thought of as having real firearms would have been directly harmful to their sport.

gunny123

Sparks wrote: »

No, they were the ones that we explicitly told to not get involved with us because being thought of as having real firearms would have been directly harmful to their sport.

Ah thats good.

Grizzly 45

A good few also said "FU Jack!" in 2014 with support for the firearms consultation.Be as it may...I think they should be supported by the firearms community,as has been done on the continent, as we need support no matter where and whom from.It mightn't be a lot of peoples cup of tea,and I'm no big fan of it, but whom am I or anyone else, to say whether it should be regulated or not? I would not like to see it being restricted or banned like in Austrailia, because of some Watermelon party[Greens. Thin green rind outside, communist red inside with black, brown pits in the middle] member decries it as glorifying war and killing or some other beauracrat decries it as "combat training".
Or because some idiot decides to misuse one in robbing an off license, and we come up with dipsht ideas like transparent guns or red-tipped muzzles.It is always a possibility that these people could move onto real firearms too one day and should we cut off potential new recruits?

gunny123

A good video from gun Jesus.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIdXAxNKRTo

Grizzly 45

Cant control your guns.We'll control your ammo instead!

The organisation where Ireland kisses more arse than in Brussels.Being just as much a democratic organisation like Brussels makes its gun laws at 4AM in the morning when everyone is tired and worn out.:mad: The UN and EU are both extremely anti-gun organisations and the sooner our local organisations could realise this fact the better too.
https://www.nraila.org/articles/20180706/anti-gun-efforts-to-expand-un-regulations-to-ammunition-continue

Grizzly 45

The land of Sigs, Rolexes, Toblerone,and cuckoo clocks,as well as a functioning democracy, of, for and by the people.Is gearing up to hold a referendum on the EU anti-gun legislation. Although not an EU member, Switzerland is a Schengen member and has to abide by these EU directives...Well, actually...NO...They can hold citizens referendums,and demand that Switzerland leaves the Schengen zone as well.as Mr Drunkner and Mrs Malestrom meddling in Swiss national defence policies and traditions of an armed citizen militia,isnt sitting well with the Swiss gun owners. So another fissure comes into the EUSSR edifice.

https://eu-diktat-nein.ch/referendum/

yubabill

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Cant control your guns.We'll control your ammo instead!

The organisation where Ireland kisses more arse than in Brussels.Being just as much a democratic organisation like Brussels makes its gun laws at 4AM in the morning when everyone is tired and worn out.:mad: The UN and EU are both extremely anti-gun organisations and the sooner our local organisations could realise this fact the better too.
https://www.nraila.org/articles/20180706/anti-gun-efforts-to-expand-un-regulations-to-ammunition-continue

That was a tough read.

Essentially it looks to me that some will claim the UN small arms policy is now expanded to cover ammunition when they call for marking/tracing -

but every time you hear that LIE, remember that this vote does not conform to the UN's own requirements.

Grizzly 45

Firearms United is now a recognised NGO and lobby group on an EU and international level. Am very proud of this organisation and how far it has come within 3 years from an online petition post-Paris Nov gun attacks site to this point..
So I guess I will have to don morning coat and top hat and present my official credentials at the DOJ or whatever one does when one is the national rep for a EU NGO in Ireland?

https://www.gunsweek.com/en/current/...S-TBqH8bWQ0pPD

Grizzly 45

As usual the Czechs are on top of it in response.Someone might forward to NARGC and possibly angling clubs?As they will be affected by this too.

https://www.gunsweek.com/en/ammunition/articles/new-echa-lead-ammunition-ban-europe?fbclid=IwAR3YGYtyv8FlcmzZcTHRQHTeF5i_DU8D9OCsUFctaK8ZnUxJVM1jm9Pl_Ko

gunny123

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

As usual the Czechs are on top of it in response.Someone might forward to NARGC and possibly angling clubs?As they will be affected by this too.

https://www.gunsweek.com/en/ammunition/articles/new-echa-lead-ammunition-ban-europe?fbclid=IwAR3YGYtyv8FlcmzZcTHRQHTeF5i_DU8D9OCsUFctaK8ZnUxJVM1jm9Pl_Ko

"An outright ban on all lead ammunition for all uses" !

So thats everything from plinking with a .22, to clays to fullbore target shooting ? Not just hunting.

If you cannot control the guns, control the ammunition.