Cork 2016 Route news

man98

L1011 wrote: »

Which anyone with an Irish AOC could do if they can

However, NAX have already started doing that.

MoeJay

At the risk of repeating myself, there is nothing to stop Norwegian (NAX) from flying from Cork-USA tomorrow morning.

It is their choice to decide to set up a subsidiary (NAI) and create this situation.

From the Norwegian 2014 Annual Report (with my added emphasis):

"While we do get full access to the U.S. using the AOC issued by Norway, we do not have access to most Asian, African and South American destinations from countries other than Norway. Since we aspire to fly to those regions from multiple European countries, including the UK, we need an EU AOC which secures traffic rights from all EU countries."

It does not add up. This is not just about the right to fly to the USA.

KCAccidental

irishguy1983 wrote: »

Is it there anything else going on here? It just seems as though anytime Cork has tired to set up US flights there is always something in the way.

It's just a clever move by Norwegian to use an airport that is desperate for transatlantic flights to harness political pressure.

Van.Bosch

KCAccidental wrote: »

It's just a clever move by Norwegian to use an airport that is desperate for transatlantic flights to harness political pressure.

Yes - and in a country where aviation media doesn't really do anything in depth enough to question their motives or ask questions like "why not fly under the current permission you have"

kub

KCAccidental wrote: »

It's just a clever move by Norwegian to use an airport that is desperate for transatlantic flights to harness political pressure.

Is it fair to predict that once they have the necessary permission they will just pull out of Cork after a period of time?

roundymac

kub wrote: »

Is it fair to predict that once they have the necessary permission they will just pull out of Cork after a period of time?

Unless they are making money it's possible.

highlydebased

And the plot thickens, WW says Aer Lingus could do Cork US services when the A321LR arrives

http://m.independent.ie/business/aer-lingus-eyes-corkus-service-with-new-jets-says-iag-boss-34679697.html

Van.Bosch

highlydebased wrote: »

And the plot thickens, WW says Aer Lingus could do Cork US services when the A321LR arrives

http://m.independent.ie/business/aer-lingus-eyes-corkus-service-with-new-jets-says-iag-boss-34679697.html

Yeah, typical PR. They could hire aircraft now and operate the route if they really wanted. Any A321LRs will go to Dublin to build out the hub, transiting pax to secondary airports like Hartford.

JCX BXC

Van.Bosch wrote: »

Yeah, typical PR. They could hire aircraft now and operate the route if they really wanted. Any A321LRs will go to Dublin to build out the hub, transiting pax to secondary airports like Hartford.

Could they do it cost effectively? If so, why has absolutely no big airline had this idea yet?

kub

Van.Bosch wrote: »

Yeah, typical PR. They could hire aircraft now and operate the route if they really wanted. Any A321LRs will go to Dublin to build out the hub, transiting pax to secondary airports like Hartford.

They could, i am sure the 757's that they are operating currently could do a US run out of Cork

Irish Steve

The length at Cork could mean that a 757 can't operate with a full load, I'd need to look at the performance charts, which I don't have direct access to, from long and old memory, a full 757 needs more runway than is available at Cork, though that may not prevent operations as such, more that there could be limitations that would make it less attractive to do.

JCX BXC

Irish Steve wrote: »

The length at Cork could mean that a 757 can't operate with a full load, I'd need to look at the performance charts, which I don't have direct access to, from long and old memory, a full 757 needs more runway than is available at Cork, though that may not prevent operations as such, more that there could be limitations that would make it less attractive to do.

Anyone have more specific figures for this?

billie1b

Carnacalla wrote: »

Anyone have more specific figures for this?

757-200 at MTOW with P&W engines on a standard day needs approx 7,750ft of runway but a flight from Cork to East Coast US wouldn't need a full fuel load

JCX BXC

billie1b wrote: »

757-200 at MTOW with P&W engines on a standard day needs approx 7,750ft of runway but a flight from Cork to East Coast US wouldn't need a full fuel load

Thanks! Corks runway is 6998 ft long, so looks fine.

Found comprehensive detail on the 757 here :http://www.boeing.com/assets/pdf/commercial/airports/acaps/757_23.pdf

roundymac

One of the problems that Cork has is a crosswind. That I suspect would affect the take-off.
Also Cork can be clouded and foggy early morning, better to go with the Norweigen times than anything else.

Cityjet are pulling the London Route from June 26th. Unsurprising as it has had very poor loads and I assume future bookings were equally terrible.

lisasimpson

3 times a day was a bit much. Most people that used it were quite happy with it

JCX BXC

They came in with too much, a 2pw service would have sufficed with 1pw at the weekends.

KCAccidental

Sad news. Can't say that they didn't try their best with marketing etc. Seems like it's going to be hard for any airline to break the ingrained dependence on EI and FR from passengers.

kevinandrew

No real surprise, they did their best and probably should have tried to last the summer but obviously forward bookings even for the peak travel months must have been very poor. It wasn't as convenient an option as you'd like to think either, recent changes to flight paths into LCY turned 55 minute flights into 90 minutes, completely wiping out the time saved arriving at a smaller airport closer to central London. Aer Lingus is now the most punctual airline at LHR, flights rarely over 60 minutes even with holding and T2 is a breeze, you'd be on the tube/Heathrow Express before CityJet even landed. That's before all the tech issues CityJet suffered are accounted for!

Worrying thing is, even with great marketing, good fares and a strong schedule a well known airline like CityJet couldn't make a popular London airport work from Cork even with their setbacks. It's no surprise Aer Lingus and Ryanair are so predictable with their routes, I wouldn't be surprised to see Dusseldorf go the same way as Brussels, demand just isn't there.

New York? Boston? Good luck.

lisasimpson

What are the bookings like on the dusseldorf route does anyone know?

JCX BXC

http://corporate.ryanair.com/news/news/160512-16-99-cork-sale-launched-after-cityjet-cancels-london-route/?market=ie

They really are quite cheeky aren't they:D

kub

Carnacalla wrote: »

http://corporate.ryanair.com/news/news/160512-16-99-cork-sale-launched-after-cityjet-cancels-london-route/?market=ie

They really are quite cheeky aren't they:D

' New Cabin Interiors ' I wonder are they going to allocate some of their recently delivered aircraft to Cork?

lisasimpson

i know some aren't running that long. any news on passenger numbers/bookings on the to other new routes at cork airport

munchkin_utd

lisasimpson wrote: »

What are the bookings like on the dusseldorf route does anyone know?

no idea, but I wouldnt be looking at it to survive from business from Cork which is a small market to be honest.

Düsseldorf is at the centre of North Rhine Westfalen (NRW), with a population of 17.6 million but in an area half the size of the 26counties. So the result is a population density 50% higher than the Netherlands and even then mostly concentrated in urban areas close to Düsseldorf (and as a consequence the semi deserted rural Irish south west is an attractive destination)
If the route is to survive it'd be from incoming German tourists rather than expecting cork people to travel to a new (non sun) destination in their droves.

Hahn to Kerry is now an established route tapping into the southern part of the NRW catchment area so I'd be reasonably hopefully that flights will be successful from a proper German airport with mainline rail connections (with an airline considered to be a proper airline, and thanks to their tricks/ percieved institutional dishonesty, Ryanair isn't in the mind of many germans) to the main city in the south west

roundymac

Ar'nt Cityjet minus an aircraft since one was damaged in a heavy landing in Florence. I wonder this have anything to help them make up their minds on Cork.

highlydebased

moloner4 wrote:

I'm not really surprised by this. Kerry goes to luton and stansted, Shannon goes to Heathrow, stansted, gatwick, and Cork went to heathrow, gatwick and stansted. Then London city came, I just see that that area of the south west was already more than covered to london with market saturation.

Indeed. There is really no benefit time wise for anyone who may be close to and ordinarily fly from Kerry or Shannon to London as the supposed time saving for LCY is lost on the road to Cork anyway

moloner4

moloner4 wrote: »

I thought they were receiving they're new order soon as they posted up in their fb page? I wouldn't of thought it would impact that much.

Sort of, the new SSJ's will be joining later this month but will only be used on charter services initially. So yes they are short of aircraft.

Lockheed

Deleted User wrote: »

Sort of, the new SSJ's will be joining later this month but will only be used on charter services initially. So yes they are short of aircraft.

They got a deal with Air France so we should see em on routes from CDG until they get their clearence, for example CDG-DUB i guess

Jamie2k9

What are the bookings like on the dusseldorf route does anyone know?

Actually think it's doing well. Some healthy numbers and it's most likely 90% inbound.