Leaving Dogs outside all day

The Backwards Man

borderlinemeath wrote: »

If you are in the house then it's highly likely that your dog will want to be as well. Yes there's certain dogs that prefer to be outside, guarding breeds etc but even within those breeds there dogs that want to be with their humans. It's more cruel to keep your dog apart if it wants to be with you.

The dog doesn't want to be in the house, the dog wants to be with you. Big difference.

Bongalongherb

LadyFenghuang wrote: »

Mount Venus rescued a Vietnamese pot bellied pig a few years ago from woman who fed it nothing but cheese. It doesn't like humans because they are very very shy. He has a friend not (another pig). There are regulations in licensing on what pigs can be fed etc.

Some animals don't actually like humans. Pigs are intelligent and social but they don't like people only other pigs.

And yes apparently she fed it nothing but cheese and it was MASSIVELY over weight ..even for a pig.

Jezz, I thought you were talking about me there for a minute, I'm a pig for cheese of all kinds, love cheese on toast - cheese on a bacon sandwich melted in hotly. Damn munchies again.

tipparetops

The Backwards Man wrote: »

The dog doesn't want to be in the house, the dog wants to be with you. Big difference.

maybe the owner should sleep outside every second night. :pac:

borderlinemeath

LadyFenghuang wrote: »

They need a mix of both. It does depend on the breed though. Ideally people should consult a vet instead of assuming they know. Dietary habits of dogs differ from breed to breed too. Mongrels can eat a wider variety of foods usually.

Vets don't necessarily have the behavioural know how about dogs, the majority of their training is anatomy and surgical, behavioural and nutrition barely get a mention in their studies. A good vet will recommend a qualified behaviourist if your dog has any issues. As for nutrition - they get most of their info from the sales reps of the foods they stock in their surgeries. There's way better foods available than the likes of Hills or RC. Better again feed raw or fresh. Vets don't recommend it as they don't profit from it.

lulu1

The Backwards Man wrote: »

There's no way in hell I'd keep a dog if it didn't have piles of space and human interaction, but I wouldn't keep one in the house either, to me that's just cruel. Dogs are companions, not furniture.

Would you make your companion sleep outside.

The Backwards Man

lulu1 wrote: »

Would you make your companion sleep outside.

In the open air, not a hope. In a bed that is warm and dry and snug and more comfortable than my own, without hesitation.

LadyFenghuang

maggiepip wrote: »

Cattle are herd animals and get their social interaction from the rest of the herd. As far as Im aware you're not actually legally allowed to keep a lone cow for welfare reasons.

Under the law the term 'Bull' is for any cow Bullock or Bull. They all need to be registered. Bulls , Bullocks and cows are regulated differently though. It's rare they are pets. You need things like herd numbers,tags papers etc. Even if they are not to be eaten.

They are complicated to get. There is criteria for a herd number. You need to have a piece of land etc. It's over one acre per cow or something.

It's more flexible with pigs and goats which is why animals services see more pigs and goats and almost never cows.

borderlinemeath

The Backwards Man wrote: »

The dog doesn't want to be in the house, the dog wants to be with you. Big difference.

So you're going to spend all your time outside with the dog? If you don't want to be cruel then you'll be outside a lot.

but I wouldn't keep one in the house either,

Bongalongherb

Eduardo Fierce Salt wrote: »

You are still missing the point. Being inside does not automatically equate to comfort for a dog.
And I know all about rescue dogs, thanks.

You might be missing the larger point... having a dog in the house doesn't mean the dog is Always in the house. For instance, a collie dog is a working dog and it needs a lot of exercise, 5 hours a day in intervals this dog is let loose in the valley with streams and forest all over the place. It's what you do, and the responsibility to make sure this is the case.

No-one said a house dog is kept 24/7 in the house.

Here's an environment below that is suitable. And many dog owners will make sure they get the exercise they need in a good environment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUxr642SO6w

LadyFenghuang

borderlinemeath wrote: »

Vets don't necessarily have the behavioural know how about dogs, the majority of their training is anatomy and surgical, behavioural and nutrition barely get a mention in their studies. A good vet will recommend a qualified behaviourist if your dog has any issues. As for nutrition - they get most of their info from the sales reps of the foods they stock in their surgeries. There's way better foods available than the likes of Hills or RC. Better again feed raw or fresh. Vets don't recommend it as they don't profit from it.

You would never come across a vet not used to being around dogs. Most common animals around. That is nonsense. It would only be rare animals some newer vets are not used to.

But there are vets who are known to have experience with these and you bring them to those after inquiring.

I know someone who has Degu for example one was extremely ill and unfortunately had to be put down. She was told to go to a particular female vet who had experience in handling them.

LadyFenghuang

Bongalongherb wrote: »

You might be missing the larger point... having a dog in the house doesn't mean the dog is Always in the house. For instance, a collie dog is a working dog and it needs a lot of exercise, 5 hours a day in intervals this dog is let loose in the valley with streams and forest all over the place. It's what you do, and the responsibility to make sure this is the case.

No-one said a house dog is kept 24/7 in the house.

Here's an environment below that is suitable. And many dog owners will make sure they get the exercise they need in a good environment.

Some dogs breeds need a lot of space.

I think the main point is though. If you are thinking of getting one ask the vet and the DSPCA or an expert what the right thing to do is. It's ok to admit to you don't know everything and even to decide it's not the right type of pet for you.

Andy From Sligo

Pretzill wrote: »

I'm not totally against leaving dogs outside once they get the company, warmth, attention and their needs are met. Dogs are social animals and many breeds like to be in on the action.

Walks, human interaction and a warm place to sleep of an evening is the least a pet deserves.

My two dogs are house dogs but they love the outdoors, however, it's not quite the same for them if we don't come along. This weather they'd sit outside all day until it's walk or play time or follow us around the garden looking for fun.

However they wouldn't entertain going out in the lashing rain or staying out on a stormy day and they like their home comforts.

We made the decision if we had dogs they would be part of the home. I know a neighbour who keeps little dogs (toy breeds) outside in all weathers even the minus ones and their constant barking and howling is disturbing. But some breeds don't mind the outdoors as I said once they have somewhere warm and comfortable to retreat to.

our dogs must feel really domesticated, they like to go out for their walkies but if its cold or raining they do their business and then lead the walker back home and then its straight in by the fire or curl up on the settee - they love their home comforts lol :-)

LadyFenghuang

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

our dogs must feel really domesticated, they like to go out for their walkies but if its cold or raining they do their business and then lead the walker back home and then its straight in by the fire or curl up on the settee - they love their home comforts lol :-)

Awh! Our little guy doesn't like rain either!

maggiepip

LadyFenghuang wrote: »

You would never come across a vet not used to being around dogs. Most common animals around. That is nonsense. It would only be rare animals some newer vets are not used to.

But there are vets who are known to have experience with these and you bring them to those after inquiring.

I know someone who has Degu for example one was extremely ill and unfortunately had to be put down. She was told to go to a particular female vet who had experience in handling them.

I can assure you I have encountered Vets who really don't have a clue about dog behaviour. Vets are trained to diagnose and cure illness, but many vets dont know a whole lot about behavioural issues.

LadyFenghuang

Our guy sleeps inside in the kitchen. He spends most time inside. Except when it's sunny and he likes to sunbathe. He will get one walk a day and maybe an hour or two outside. We let him out when he wants to go out ....and then back in again and out again and in again and out again and in again!

LadyFenghuang

maggiepip wrote: »

I can assure you I have encountered Vets who really don't have a clue about dog behaviour. Vets are trained to diagnose and cure illness, but many vets dont know a whole lot about behavioural issues.

I have never encountered one thankfully.

Bongalongherb

My own one here loves the rain for some reason. He seems to enjoy the fresh wet weather, rolling around in puddles I can't understand it myself.

piperh

My personal opinion is there is no point in having dogs and keeping them outside interacting for only an hour or so a day. I do get that some dogs prefer being outdoors but unless you get an older dog you can't know that when you get a new dog so you need to be flexible and open to adapting. Take each dog as an individual and adjust as necessary.

My door is literally open for the dogs from 9am to 9pm during the summer and until dark in the winter. The rain has to be really bad for it to be shut. Even if we are working outside one of the dogs takes herself inside after a couple of minutes, the other loves nothing better than being outside and the wetter colder and windier the better. As i said differing needs need differing approaches.

S.O

A dog in the house right next door to me is always outside in the backyard- I never see any of homeowners bringing it out for a walk: view from one of Windows the dog isn't tied up or anything; one thing is noticeable is whenever I open either the backdoor or the front door the dog always bark's; guess it must a sign that the dog is bored.

borderlinemeath

LadyFenghuang wrote: »

You would never come across a vet not used to being around dogs. Most common animals around. That is nonsense. It would only be rare animals some newer vets are not used to.

But there are vets who are known to have experience with these and you bring them to those after inquiring.

I know someone who has Degu for example one was extremely ill and unfortunately had to be put down. She was told to go to a particular female vet who had experience in handling them.

You're misunderstanding my post, and why you are talking about degus when the topic is dogs is a bit puzzling

To put it metaphorically - if you're ill or need surgery you go to a gp or a surgeon. If you're suffering from a mental illness you go to a psychiatrist, usually referred to by your gp because they are not specifically qualified to diagnose or treat mental illness. Same with a vet and a behaviourist. Dogs do suffer from behavioural problems that vets cannot fix with medication. Behaviour Adjustment Therapy or a training programme specifically designed for your pet by a canine behaviourist.

lulu1

Talking about dogs who have behavioural issues. My friend had a jack russel who was terrible. They would be sitting eating their dinner and maybe someone would a chicken bone or something else into the turf bucket.

Well dare my friend or any of the kids touch that bucket or the dog would have taken the hand of them.

The only one that could touch it was the husband because he never bothered about the dog at any time,

They took the dog everywhere to try and help him but had to get him put down at the end up

Andy From Sligo

The Backwards Man wrote: »

There's no way in hell I'd keep a dog if it didn't have piles of space and human interaction, but I wouldn't keep one in the house either, to me that's just cruel. Dogs are companions, not furniture.

you dont need piles of space at your gaff - you take the dogs out for regular excercise called Walkies throughout the day - of course there are those that prefer to open a back door, let their dogs roam estates , poop everywhere and hope they come back (or maybe hope they dont come back) later on in the evening/week - not cruel to let them inside once in a while and especially at night .

sure if I was the authorities I would clamp down real hard on all these dogs outside barking all day and nights and upsetting the piece for one issue. And wouldnt be turning a blind eye to all these ones without proper shelter outside even if they have a bowl of water and food with them - and Id put an end to them being outside in zero temperatures unless they had some kid of dry/free of draughts heated kennel with proper bedding ... yes Im not crazy I said heated!

Andy From Sligo

lulu1 wrote: »

Talking about dogs who have behavioural issues. My friend had a jack russel who was terrible. They would be sitting eating their dinner and maybe someone would a chicken bone or something else into the turf bucket.

Well dare my friend or any of the kids touch that bucket or the dog would have taken the hand of them.

The only one that could touch it was the husband because he never bothered about the dog at any time,

They took the dog everywhere to try and help him but had to get him put down at the end up

bloody hell what do you expect - tossing a bone into a turf bucket - of course a dog would get vicious over that 'protecting its bone' - fancy getting it put down!

buried

S.O wrote: »

A dog in the house right next door to me is always outside in the backyard- I never see any of homeowners bringing it out for a walk: view from one of Windows the dog isn't tied up or anything; one thing is noticeable is whenever I open either the backdoor or the front door the dog always bark's; guess it must a sign that the dog is bored.

That's the height of thick ignorance on the part of those owners and downright cruelty and abuse to a innocent animal. I'll never understand why people like that want to own a dog in the first place. The bowzies in prison get better treated than that

michellie

My dog is a house dog, when I'm working my mam minds her :-) it wouldn't be fair to leave her in the house all day, she loves company and I would be terrified she would be stolen from the garden.

thegreatgonzo

borderlinemeath wrote: »

Better again feed raw or fresh. Vets don't recommend it as they don't profit from it.

To be fair that's not the whole story. Sure vets like making a profit, but they also recommend the brands they sell because they'll know exactly what the client is feeding the dog with and how much of it. They can't be sure that every client who reckons they can feed the dog a healthy balanced diet prepared by themselves is going to actually do it. I'm not for a minute saying the diets themselves are better than raw or fresh, but from the point of view of the vet or the nurse, it's simpler to deal with.

LadyFenghuang

lulu1 wrote: »

Talking about dogs who have behavioural issues. My friend had a jack russel who was terrible. They would be sitting eating their dinner and maybe someone would a chicken bone or something else into the turf bucket.

Well dare my friend or any of the kids touch that bucket or the dog would have taken the hand of them.

The only one that could touch it was the husband because he never bothered about the dog at any time,

They took the dog everywhere to try and help him but had to get him put down at the end up

That was the owners. The dog was not socialized and neglected from lack of care love and interaction. Also if a dog is THAT panicky about food it usually means it is not fed on time. It's clear the husband was seen as 'pack'.

Why put the dog down simply because it growled if people touched his bucket? Or where there other issues?

I am not saying the dog was not dangerous. But I see a lot of problems with the way it was cared for from what you say.

You have MAKE dogs accept their place in the 'pack'. Particularly with kids.

It's a sad situation otherwise.

lulu1

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

bloody hell what do you expect - tossing a bone into a turf bucket - of course a dog would get vicious over that 'protecting its bone' - fancy getting it put down!

No not every dog would our dog wouldn't
Would you think it would be safe to keep this dog where there are kids of 2 and 3 in the house.

As I said in my post they did everything in their power to help the dog even getting an expert to travel from Dublin

LadyFenghuang

borderlinemeath wrote: »

You're misunderstanding my post, and why you are talking about degus when the topic is dogs is a bit puzzling

To put it metaphorically - if you're ill or need surgery you go to a gp or a surgeon. If you're suffering from a mental illness you go to a psychiatrist, usually referred to by your gp because they are not specifically qualified to diagnose or treat mental illness. Same with a vet and a behaviourist. Dogs do suffer from behavioural problems that vets cannot fix with medication. Behaviour Adjustment Therapy or a training programme specifically designed for your pet by a canine behaviourist.

Dogs are very common I have never encountered a vet not used to them. With some animals I would have expected what you say to be true.

In the real world I have never encountered a vet not used to dogs. That's not to say trainers are not better with behavior. But i have never encountered a vet in the real world who was not used to dogs and how they need to be treated at least somewhat in my personal experience.

Perhaps with very particular individual dogs that are difficult maybe. But in general. But then very difficult dogs are not for everyday owners they need very experienced hands.

borderlinemeath

thegreatgonzo wrote: »

To be fair that's not the whole story. Sure vets like making a profit, but they also recommend the brands they sell because they'll know exactly what the client is feeding the dog with and how much of it. They can't be sure that every client who reckons they can feed the dog a healthy balanced diet prepared by themselves is going to actually do it. I'm not for a minute saying the diets themselves are better than raw or fresh, but from the point of view of the vet or the nurse, it's simpler to deal with.

Actually if you go back to veterinarians when they are studying, the majority of the vet studies are sponsored by the likes of Hills. Dog food is a big business and where better to indoctrine the student vets than in college. It's a multi million euro industry and because vets are the "professionals" consumers will trust their judgement when it comes to what to feed their dog.

The majority of dogs that attend vets with skin or intestinal complaints are routinely put on a course of steroids to suppress the symptoms of the dog and they are recommended to go on X or Y food, that the surgery just happens to sell. The symptoms disappear for a while so of course the dog owner is convinced it's the food, but it's the steroids suppressing the symptoms, but not treating the actual problem. The majority of dogs are gluten or wheat intolerant yet pretty much all the foods available in a vets surgery contain wheat or gluten or some type of grain.

The pet business is a marketers dream. For years we have been told to eat fresh foods and avoid processed foods, get enough protein, carbs and vitamins and minerals, yet somehow we've been hoodwinked to think it's perfectly ok to feed nothing but a processed diet to our pets.