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What would you like the next referendum to legalise abortion or euthanasia?

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    #32
    eviltwin
    Registered Users Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    No Voter And Proud wrote: »
    That's the problem.
    We've lost our way as a society. Too many civil freedoms and liberties.

    I think if the UK leave the EU we should aswell.

    Some would say we've finally found the society we want to be. You can't argue with the will of the people. I'm sure if your side had won you'd be saying that to the Yes side.


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    #33
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,611 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Sleepy wrote: »
    I'm with /\/ollog, I think we should have a whole heap of them at the same time. If Americans are able to vote on multiple issues at the same time as voting for the myriad different offices they elect, I'm sure we could manage to have referendums on Abortion, Assisted Suicide, Removal of Religion from the Constitution, Gender Neutrality, Ammendments to Divorce Law and removal of the Blasphemy clause in a single trip to the ballot.
    I know more than one person who voted Yes for both the other day because they went blank on while ballot was which and didn't have their glasses. :pac:

    I'd probably go with an assisted suicide referendum first. That is, if there's actually something in the constitution than necessitates it. There's a better chance of it passing than abortion passing.


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    #34
    pq0n1ct4ve8zf5
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,070 ✭✭✭✭pq0n1ct4ve8zf5


    Sleepy wrote: »
    I think it'll be repealed in our lifetimes but I think were it to go to the polls tomorrow you might be pleasantly surprised.

    The Referendum on Human Life in Pregnancy (2002) was a close run contest and there have been many more Irish ladies who've had to take a boat/flight to the UK to have an abortion there since.

    I'd love to think so, and maybe you're right. In ten or even five years I'd have a lot more confidence. But even in my peer group (mid twenties, educated, liberal), it's a fairly divisive issue; by contrast there'd be almost total consensus on things like euthanasia and SSM and nearly every other social issue. Some of that, I think, is down to people going to Catholic schools. I know one woman not much older than me who was taken on a school trip to a YD march for life in 2002.

    Even people who are pro-choice in Ireland, a lot of them would be against "abortion on demand/"lifestyle abortions", and the whole "opening the floodgates" angle on the debate might lead a lot of people to vote against repealing.

    I do think that one of the most important factors for changing this, even though it's a big ask, is that women are going to have to start talking about having had abortions. Probably every vehement pro-lifer who goes on about "well they should have just kept their knickers on" knows someone who's had one.


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    #35
    FouxDaFaFa
    Registered Users Posts: 6,850 ✭✭✭FouxDaFaFa


    No Voter And Proud wrote: »
    That's the problem.
    We've lost our way as a society. Too many civil freedoms and liberties.
    You're right. I feel too free.

    Good thing the constitution explicitly states that my place is in the home and I can't get an abortion until I'm about to die because my 3-week old, non-sentient foetus has the same rights as me.

    It's good to feel grounded every now and again.

    On the assisted suicide thing, is it actually necessary to have a referendum about it? I was under the impression it could be legislated for without.


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    #36
    No Voter And Proud
    Closed Accounts Posts: 282 ✭✭No Voter And Proud


    eviltwin wrote: »
    Some would say we've finally found the society we want to be. You can't argue with the will of the people. I'm sure if your side had won you'd be saying that to the Yes side.

    Hitler was voted in by a majority too remember. Democracy sometimes fails.

    Oh and, for what it matters, at least where I'm from we respected the institution of marriage. Roscommon - holding the line till the end!


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    #37
    eviltwin
    Registered Users Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    No Voter And Proud wrote: »
    Hitler was voted in by a majority too remember. Democracy sometimes fails.

    We didn't vote a Nazi into power. We just legalised same sex marriage. Its no big deal.


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    #38
    LDN_Irish
    Registered Users Posts: 1,188 ✭✭✭LDN_Irish


    No Voter And Proud wrote: »
    Hitler was voted in by a majority too remember. Democracy sometimes fails.

    Oh and, for what it matters, at least where I'm from we respected the institution of marriage. Roscommon - holding the line till the end!

    Are you Jamie Bryson?


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    #39
    Un Croissant
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,052 ✭✭✭Un Croissant


    No Voter And Proud wrote: »
    That's the problem.
    We've lost our way as a society. Too many civil freedoms and liberties.

    I think if the UK leave the EU we should aswell.


    Bloody Europe and it's gayness.

    Freedom isn't free, it costs folks like you and me. Murica.


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    #40
    frostyjacks
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,951 ✭✭✭frostyjacks


    Gay marriage and euthanasia I can live with. Abortion-on-demand would be a line in the sand for me, I don't think I could ever accept it as ethical.


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    #41
    No Voter And Proud
    Closed Accounts Posts: 282 ✭✭No Voter And Proud


    eviltwin wrote: »
    We didn't vote a Nazi into power. We just legalised same sex marriage. Its no big deal.

    We didn't but democratic process did. The same process that legalized non procreating unions.
    LDN_Irish wrote: »
    Are you Jamie Bryson?

    I'll admit I had to look that one up, no indeed I am not. He's not from our republic anyway so I dont see a connection.


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    #42
    No Voter And Proud
    Closed Accounts Posts: 282 ✭✭No Voter And Proud


    Un Croissant wrote: »
    Bloody Europe and it's gayness.

    Freedom isn't free, it costs folks like you and me. Murica.

    This isn't America though this is Ireland.
    Land of saints and scholars no more!


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    #43
    pq0n1ct4ve8zf5
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,070 ✭✭✭✭pq0n1ct4ve8zf5


    eviltwin wrote: »
    We didn't vote a Nazi into power. We just legalised same sex marriage. Its no big deal.

    Oh come on now that's just nitpicking :mad: we're basically Nazis :pac:


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    #44
    Un Croissant
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,052 ✭✭✭Un Croissant


    No Voter And Proud wrote: »
    Hitler was voted in by a majority too remember. Democracy sometimes fails.

    Oh and, for what it matters, at least where I'm from we respected the institution of marriage. Roscommon - holding the line till the end!

    The proud Roscommon folk, like the last defenders of Helms Deep as the army of Uruk Gay smash down the back door.


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    #45
    No Voter And Proud
    Closed Accounts Posts: 282 ✭✭No Voter And Proud


    Sydney Chilly Magnate wrote: »
    Oh come on now that's just nitpicking :mad: we're basically Nazis :pac:

    riight.....


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    #46
    Witcher
    Registered Users Posts: 14,472 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    Can we have a break from referendums, referendum campaigns and referendum threads for a year at least in the name of fcuk? :pac:


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    #47
    Un Croissant
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,052 ✭✭✭Un Croissant


    No Voter And Proud wrote: »
    This isn't America though this is Ireland.
    Land of saints and scholars no more!

    Scholars we ain't. I go to college. Some of my class mates are dumb ****s.


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    #48
    LDN_Irish
    Registered Users Posts: 1,188 ✭✭✭LDN_Irish


    No Voter And Proud wrote: »
    I'll admit I had to look that one up, no indeed I am not. He's not from our republic anyway so I dont see a connection.

    He tweeted the same thing about Hitler the other week. I'll take your word though.


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    #49
    eviltwin
    Registered Users Posts: 17,495 ✭✭✭✭eviltwin


    Sydney Chilly Magnate wrote: »
    Oh come on now that's just nitpicking :mad: we're basically Nazis :pac:

    Gay weddings today, concentration camps tomorrow. Its a slippery slope I tell ya.


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    #50
    Aglomerado
    Registered Users Posts: 5,761 ✭✭✭Aglomerado


    neil_ wrote: »
    Euthanasia. Futurama-style suicide booths.

    Die-pods. (patent pending)


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    #51
    No Voter And Proud
    Closed Accounts Posts: 282 ✭✭No Voter And Proud


    LDN_Irish wrote: »
    He tweeted the same thing about Hitler the other week. I'll take your word though.

    I'm sure many people have mentioned it at some point to be fair


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    #52
    Nollog
    Registered Users Posts: 5,408 ✭✭✭Nollog


    We could have a referendum on making a whole new constitution.


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    #53
    Pherekydes
    Registered Users Posts: 16,114 ✭✭✭✭Pherekydes


    No Voter And Proud wrote: »
    We didn't but democratic process did. The same process that legalized non procreating unions.

    Non-procreating unions have been legal since men and women have been infertile. Which is forever.


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    #54
    No Voter And Proud
    Closed Accounts Posts: 282 ✭✭No Voter And Proud


    Pherekydes wrote: »
    Non-procreating unions have been legal since men and women have been infertile. Which is forever.

    Now whose nitpicking!


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    #55
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    I would rather our constitution said nothing about abortion. It doesn't need to either legalise or illegalise it.

    I don't believe euthanasia is specifically barred by the constitution, it could be legislated for.


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    #56
    daheff
    Registered Users Posts: 5,835 ✭✭✭daheff


    next referendum about not having any more referendums? or limiting to 2 every term of government???


    Have a pain in my a$$ with the number of referendums we've since maastricht...most mean nothing...why not keep them to a minimum so we only vote on meaningful referendums? It might focus the governments minds a bit more


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    #57
    Madd Finn
    Registered Users Posts: 515 ✭✭✭Madd Finn


    Don't care which one comes first. I'll look forward to voting No in either or both.

    And good way to bring the Church storming back into relevance. ;)


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    #58
    jessiejam
    Registered Users Posts: 778 ✭✭✭jessiejam


    smash wrote: »
    I think everyone should have the choice disregarding the circumstances.

    Yes thats what I said.

    Some hospitals now will only do the first scan at 22 weeks (Holles St for example). Maybe it's a catholic thing to stop people aborting a disabled foetus, I don't know. But taking that into consideration I would say that 12 weeks is too early for a cut off.

    In nearly all pregnancies if not all (the odd "I didn't know I was pregnant" women) are detected after about 8-12 weeks (some before and some after that time). Fair enough push it out a little but 22/24 weeks in my book is way too late.


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    #59
    whatismyname
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,707 ✭✭✭whatismyname


    If you have a 'neither' option on the poll, would a 'both' option not be a good idea too?


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    #60
    fattymuatty
    Registered Users Posts: 295 ✭✭fattymuatty


    I would really like to see a referendum on abortion. There has been signs all the over place saying vote yes to equality yet the women of this country are routinely denied this status. We deserve the right to body autonomy. Everyday there are women suffering because of the eighth amendment, no progressive liberal country as Ireland has patted itself on the back for being over the past few days would allow this to continue.


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    #61
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    jessiejam wrote: »
    In nearly all pregnancies if not all (the odd "I didn't know I was pregnant" women) are detected after about 8-12 weeks (some before and some after that time). Fair enough push it out a little but 22/24 weeks in my book is way too late.

    Then the hospitals need to get their act in gear so they can detect abnormalities at an earlier stage.


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