A chance to scrap the Angelus - Nutella, Croissants and Pineapples.

realdanbreen

Pherekydes wrote: »

Without looking, around 7% identify as having no religion, being atheist or agnostic. This isn't even counting those who identify (on the census) as being catholic but don't believe in god.

The true figure for atheists in Ireland is likely closer to 30%.

Reallly,for a groouping that make up 30% of the population ye don't seem to get ye're message accross very well, why is that?

Kidchameleon

I've seen people meditating to slow repeated bells as a way to control breathing and focus the mind. Bells don't have to be religious

Lucena

realdanbreen wrote: »

Reallly,for a groouping that make up 30% of the population ye don't seem to get ye're message accross very well, why is that?

Because atheism is the absence of a message.

Atheists don't go to a church or anything equivalent, and are a fairly diverse bunch, I'd imagine. The only thing atheists have in common is a lack of belief in a deity, regardless of whether it has 8 arms, allows its prophet to have sex with underage girls, or thinks that gays/****/mixing fibres are bad.

Cabaal

realdanbreen wrote: »

Reallly,for a groouping that make up 30% of the population ye don't seem to get ye're message accross very well, why is that?

what message exactly?
Unlike a religion atheists don't indoctrinate people,

Anyway, looks go back to stats, we can add approx 10% of catholics into then non religious grouping

A 2010 Bishops Conference survey found that 10.1% of Irish Roman Catholics did not believe in God. (source)

and all we expect is for no specific faith to be pushed upon anyone in this country using tax payer money and to ensure that equality exists for all regardless of race, colour, sex etc.

Religion or lack of, sex, colour etc should never ever be used as an excuse to exclude a person in this country, yet we have the catholic church happy to use it as an excuse everyday.

Thats not really a big expectation is it?

We don't have a message, we merely have a expectation as human beings. Its a perfectly reasonable one.

Pherekydes

realdanbreen wrote: »

Reallly,for a groouping that make up 30% of the population ye don't seem to get ye're message accross very well, why is that?

Well, about 75% of those won't admit out loud (or even to themselves) that they are atheist.

Cabaal

Kidchameleon wrote: »

I've seen people meditating to slow repeated bells as a way to control breathing and focus the mind. Bells don't have to be religious

But the bong, bong, bong is very clearly linked to the catholic church. Meditation bells are not the same at all

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGFog-OuFDM

silverharp

maybe its just boring images , seeing R2D2 look up does make me think :pac:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=poyEmiIp6U8

Kidchameleon

Cabaal wrote: »

But the bong, bong, bong is very clearly linked to the catholic church. Meditation bells are not the same at all

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGFog-OuFDM

Which is why I said bells don't have to be religious

Lucena

Totally tubular, man!

realdanbreen

shruikan2553 wrote: »

I love when this line gets pulled out. It's as if the Catholics are just sitting their minding their business and all of a sudden the big mean atheists break down the door to attack them. Catholics never expect people to follow the rules.

Does nobody wonder why Sikhs or Buddhists are rarely talked about?

Probably because you won't bump into too many Sikhs or Buddhists up around Mohill or down around Borrisokane. Anyway the point is that you atheists seem to want us to become like countries that don't allow religious freedom like China or N.Korea whereas the majority of us say forget about that pal.

galljga1

Lucena wrote: »

Because atheism is the absence of a message.

Atheists don't go to a church or anything equivalent, and are a fairly diverse bunch, I'd imagine. The only thing atheists have in common is a lack of belief in a deity, regardless of whether it has 8 arms, allows its prophet to have sex with underage girls, or thinks that gays/****/mixing fibres are bad.

Mixing fibres? I had to look that one up. It all came back to me. We are all doomed. Goddamned Canaanites, ruining everything. You forget to mention shellfish.

This is why I put so much faith in the old book.

pauldla

realdanbreen wrote: »

Probably because you won't bump into too many Sikhs or Buddhists up around Mohill or down around Borrisokane. Anyway the point is that you atheists seem to want us to become like countries that don't allow religious freedom like China or N.Korea whereas the majority of us say forget about that pal.

Atheists do not want to make Ireland like China or North Korea. You can trust me on this.

Unless you want to talk about the rise of Christianity in China; then you may want Ireland to be more like China. They don't have any messing with that 'right to choose' on the abortion issue, either. Grand bunch of lads.

galljga1

realdanbreen wrote: »

Probably because you won't bump into too many Sikhs or Buddhists up around Mohill or down around Borrisokane. Anyway the point is that you atheists seem to want us to become like countries that don't allow religious freedom like China or N.Korea whereas the majority of us say forget about that pal.

Do you actually believe religious freedom exists in Ireland. It is closer to religious imposition. My daughter has decided that after Easter break she is not going to attend 'religious' class nor is she going to make her confirmation next year because of 'religious' instruction. The principal recently instructed her teacher in front of the class not to be 'discussing other religions'. That is religious freedom in Ireland. This is not her only reason for opting out: the churches exclusion of women from ministry, its opinion on homosexuality, gay marriage, etc. She reads newspapers listens to the news etc and makes up her own mind about issues that effect us all.

Some day, this country may have religious freedom but that will only happen when religion and state are truly separated.

realdanbreen

galljga1 wrote: »

Do you actually believe religious freedom exists in Ireland. It is closer to religious imposition. My daughter has decided that after Easter break she is not going to attend 'religious' class nor is she going to make her confirmation next year because of 'religious' instruction. The principal recently instructed her teacher in front of the class not to be 'discussing other religions'. That is religious freedom in Ireland. This is not her only reason for opting out: the churches exclusion of women from ministry, its opinion on homosexuality, gay marriage, etc. She reads newspapers listens to the news etc and makes up her own mind about issues that effect us all.

Some day, this country may have religious freedom but that will only happen when religion and state are truly separated.

Apart from announcing that your daughter won't be making her confirmation, what point are you trying to make?

lazygal

realdanbreen wrote: »

Apart from announcing that your daughter won't be making her confirmation, what point are you trying to make?

Maybe that it's virtually impossible to go through the school system without being indoctrinated by a faith one doesn't follow?

Delirium

realdanbreen wrote: »

Probably because you won't bump into too many Sikhs or Buddhists up around Mohill or down around Borrisokane. Anyway the point is that you atheists seem to want us to become like countries that don't allow religious freedom like China or N.Korea whereas the majority of us say forget about that pal.

galljga1

realdanbreen wrote: »

Apart from announcing that your daughter won't be making her confirmation, what point are you trying to make?

I made the assumption that you could read and comprehend simple English. Was I wrong?

I was profferring the opinion that true religious freedom does not exist in this country and will not do so until church and state are separated.

haveringchick

PopePalpatine wrote: »

I take it you don't mind RTE being interrupted five more times a day for the Islamic call to prayer, then? After all, you can just change the channel.

Actually when I was travelling in the middle East I always used the call to prayer to pause and thank Jesus for all his blessings

magicbastarder

don't cross the streams!

robindch

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Why scrap it though? Would it not be more fair on everyone to modernise it? Midfulness minute perhaps?

Something that's equally accessible to all religious and non-religious points of view is fine with me. Though, in reality, if they open the door to all, then they should perhaps expect the unexpected:

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/progressivesecularhumanist/2015/03/first-church-of-cannabis-takes-advantage-of-indianas-new-religious-freedom-law/

Frankly, for this reason, it's easier just to drop it. Though again, something that's equal-access is fine too.

Kidchameleon

Ha ha, first church of cannabis can come here too

shruikan2553

realdanbreen wrote: »

Probably because you won't bump into too many Sikhs or Buddhists up around Mohill or down around Borrisokane. Anyway the point is that you atheists seem to want us to become like countries that don't allow religious freedom like China or N.Korea whereas the majority of us say forget about that pal.

Surely your god would protect you from that? We wont put you all in camps, just a few. The rest of you lot will fall in line and stop beheading people.

Hotblack Desiato

realdanbreen wrote: »

Probably because you won't bump into too many Sikhs or Buddhists up around Mohill or down around Borrisokane. Anyway the point is that you atheists seem to want us to become like countries that don't allow religious freedom like China or N.Korea whereas the majority of us say forget about that pal.

You don't appear to know what religious freedom is. It's not the right to impose a religion on everyone else, especially using a taxpayer funded service to do so.

Why do you feel the need to impose your religion on everyone?

PopePalpatine

What's the chances realdanbreen will ignore everyone's posts dissecting his BS comparison of us to the likes of China and North Korea? I'd say odds-on.

K4t

PopePalpatine wrote: »

What's the chances realdanbreen will ignore everyone's posts dissecting his BS comparison of us to the likes of China and North Korea? I'd say odds-on.

I think he might not have fully understand the argument being made about religious freedom only truly existing in complete separation of church and state, which is understandable considering the discussion was concerning the angelus which is kind of harmless; though of course it still should be scrapped.

Shrap

silverharp wrote: »

maybe its just boring images , seeing R2D2 look up does make me think :pac:

The only time I ever watched the Angelus purposefully and howled laughing was when a dread-locked biker friend of mine and his daughter were filmed for it, looking rather introspective and peaceful. Highly amusing.


The only time I haven't cringed sitting through it in 40 years approx.

Qualitymark

I like the Angelus. A minute of calm and meditation, in the middle of screechy car crashes, squealy romcoms and horrifying news programmes.

Shrap

Qualitymark wrote: »

I like the Angelus. A minute of calm and meditation, in the middle of screechy car crashes, squealy romcoms and horrifying news programmes.

Would you agree though that the minute of reflection would be better if it wasn't a call to prayer for one religion? What's wrong with a non-religious call to reflect? I get the minute of calm and meditation thing, but it has the opposite effect on people not of the particular religion that is being promoted.

Qualitymark

Shrap wrote: »

Would you agree though that the minute of reflection would be better if it wasn't a call to prayer for one religion? What's wrong with a non-religious call to reflect? I get the minute of calm and meditation thing, but it has the opposite effect on people not of the particular religion that is being promoted.

I would; but I don't really see the Angelus as it's presented on TV as particularly Catholic.

Shrap

Qualitymark wrote: »

I would; but I don't really see the Angelus as it's presented on TV as particularly Catholic.

Oh but I'm afraid it is! And as it's a call to prayer, which is basically asking everyone to reflect on the deity that is being promoted, it completely turns me off the meditative aspect which I would welcome. There's no need for the bongs at all. It leaves out so many people and insults quite a few, by demonstrating that their taxes and licenses are being used by RTE to promote a religion.

It's a shame really. An opportunity to be inclusive that is missed drastically.

Edit: in case anyone isn't aware that this is a Catholic call to prayer - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angelus