Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 3 ***Updated Mod Note Post 1***

stumblingblock

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

Genuinely not playing any poor mouth but Cork are missing pa Callaghan cahalane Stephen Murphy and horgan from the minor set up so they would be certain starters with cormack who was asked to play senior earlier this year but declined
However this Waterford team has exceptional players like Foran who I always rated Devine Gleeson etc so even with fully fit Cork team Waterford would probably be slightly favourite

This is a well coached Cork team but the youngest in years so slow start could be a difficult night but if cork stay in the game as long as possible it could be close
Cork half back line is strong with all three senior club players in top form with a good full back from the all Ireland winning intermediate team and with the brilliant Spillane and good ball winner in o Neill a good player who played senior in meade and cahalane at midfield and the very promising sean o donughe played senior Cork have good players
Waterford you would expect to win and they have more experience than the youngest side in cork history probably but Cork I would hope don't role over
Liam Hayes manager from last year intermediate team all Ireland championship is involved and irwin meant be okay so hopefully Cork be competitive

Welcome back... youve been conspicuous by your absence lately... wonder why😉
a more modest assessment of your counties chances in this one at least. should be a good game all the same

TheScoringGoal

I've been reading a lot about this Cork team being young etc. Am I correct in saying only mcnulty, kieran Bennett and donnelly are overage next year?

Cornerstoner

TheScoringGoal wrote: »

I've been reading a lot about this Cork team being young etc. Am I correct in saying only mcnulty, kieran Bennett and donnelly are overage next year?

Dunford and De Burca too I'm pretty sure

johnkieran1

TyrionPower wrote: »

Patrick curran could be the best player on show tonight and he only came on the senior panel a few weeks ago, who is to say they don't have more like that?

deiseach wrote: »

FAO any Cork people reading this. Do ye have any players of the quality of Patrick Curran bubbling under?

I saw Patrick Curran in action a few times earlier this year and while he was decent most days, he wasn't particularly stand out. Has a tenddancy to go AWOL and drift out of games. Has undoubted potential but has a bit to travel in terms of his development.

johnkieran1

TyrionPower wrote: »

Patrick curran could be the best player on show tonight and he only came on the senior panel a few weeks ago, who is to say they don't have more like that?

deiseach wrote: »

FAO any Cork people reading this. Do ye have any players of the quality of Patrick Curran bubbling under?

I saw Patrick Curran in action a few times earlier this year and while he was decent most days, he wasn't particularly stand out. Has a tendancy to go AWOL and drift out of games. Has undoubted potential but has a bit to travel in terms of his development.

deiseach

johnkieran1 wrote: »

I saw Patrick Curran in action a few times earlier this year and while he was decent most days, he wasn't particularly stand out. Has a tendancy to go AWOL and drift out of games. Has undoubted potential but has a bit to travel in terms of his development.

Sounds like an underage player to me.

Seriously, who would you rate down Leeside?

TyrionPower

johnkieran1 wrote: »

I saw Patrick Curran in action a few times earlier this year and while he was decent most days, he wasn't particularly stand out. Has a tendancy to go AWOL and drift out of games. Has undoubted potential but has a bit to travel in terms of his development.

Ya look they are no gaurentees with anyone and I am only going on performances that I have seen at underage at club, college and county as well as senior club.
He has a lot of hurling played already and you never know what the next few years hold for him, he may not even be suited to senior inter county.
On a clean bill of health (he has had numerous concussions and a fracture and a back injury in the last 12 months) I have never seen him go awol, I have seen him a few times where it is clear something is not right.
But for the main his stick work, attitude, tackling, ability to make space for himself and accuracy from placed balls and play would make me think that he has a great chance to make it. But time will tell.
I do know that I have left many games after the last two years thinking that he was gifted

Figsy32

deiseach wrote: »

Sounds like an underage player to me.

Seriously, who would you rate down Leeside?

Stephen Murphy, who is injured, would probably be the pick of the lads not on the Cork senior panel (i.e. Spillane and Collins in goal)

In terms of lads who are playing, Twomey centre back, Cahalane in midfield and Dayne Lee off the bench could be noteworthy!

liogairmhordain

Next under-21 game - against Clare in Ennis on the 15th of July (this day four weeks)

ShamoBuc

stumblingblock wrote: »

A lot of silly people on here writing Cork off on their home patch. People saying its one of Cork’s poorest ever u21 sides but make no bones about it there are no poor players on that Cork team. Yes we have a talented group of players, but all the talk has been about Waterford so the pressure is on to deliver. This Cork side did nothing at minor. Coming in under the radar but will be waiting in the long grass. If ever we were set up for an ambush this is it. They did it last year on our home patch and while people have argued how this year is different weve been down that road before. You would hope the senior lads can carry the momentum of their senior form across but you just don’t know at this level. I would have questions marks about our full back line and throwing a 16 year old in goals at this level is a big gamble. Were far from being a proven outfit. I agree we definitely have a better side on paper but I expect very VERY little to be in this at the end of the 60 mins.

I was 'one of the silly people' writing off Cork. We were well aware of the state of the Cork team and how good Waterford were, we were not playing the poor mouth at all.
Cork had a good start but the difference between the teams was clearly evident both skill wise and physically .
Although ye won by 10 points, I thought ye left a lot of scores behind ye, particularly in the last 20 minutes. But I am confident ye will play a lot better in the future. Waterford loom like a well balanced team.
Comhghairdeachas and the best of luck!

Dick phelan

Totally dominate display didn't look like they were even in 3rd gear at times. Certainly in with a great chance of going all the way this year.

deiseach

deiseach wrote: »

You have to go back to 1938 in the Munster semi-final to find the only other time we beat Cork by a double digit figure in the Championship, NHL, Minor or Under-21. Maybe we did it in the Oireachtas one time...

Snap!

archieknox

As I said it was going to be comfortable. How poor were Cork? Paddy Curran, Tadgh, Shane Bennett all exceptional. Won't be as easy in Ennis though I still think we'll be victorious there aswell.

Orizio

deiseach wrote: »

FAO any Cork people reading this. Do ye have any players of the quality of Patrick Curran bubbling under?

No. In saying that there are a few lads on that Waterford team that are superior to Curran.

Deskjockey

liogairmhordain wrote: »

Next under-21 game - against Clare in Ennis on the 15th of July (this day four weeks)

Pity it's so close to the Senior Munster final on 12 July. Has to be an advantage to Clare that their senior contingent are not playing a few days before this. As if home advantage wasn't enough.

Enough quibbling though- great win tonight. Beating Cork in Cork is no mean feat, and for those bemoaning the downturn in Cork hurling, don't think they will ever be down too long with the pick they have.

Have to say I winced a bit reading John Mullane's column the other day advising how Cork can come back as a force. Not the cutest thing to be writing a few days before a team he is involved in are playing Cork in the U-21. Then again maybe I'm working on the incorrect assumption that he's actually writing the column, perhaps he is literally "phoning it in" like a heritage rock act on a filthy lucre tour.

skaface

Great result tonight
Well done to team & management.

TyrionPower

Some win, won handy enough by ten points with a lot left in the tank, left a heap of scores - including goals after us - this really is an unbelievable time to be a Waterford supporter.

Shane Bennett, my god we have had some great days out of this 18 year old already...

Kieran Bennett also worth a mention, he is an excellent player too, my first time seeing him play

archieknox

Waterford won 17 of their 19 puckouts. Most of these were short to both corners where Cork were happy to leave us gain possession there and try to defend us from deep. But Cork were so poor even in the basic skills and not great either at defending from deep that we found space at will and really didn't look like we didn't come out of 2nd gear. Big ask to go to Ennis 3 days after the senior final and try to win there but I believe we can up the intensity to another level and come away from there victorious.

windy shepard henderson

TyrionPower wrote: »

Some win, won handy enough by ten points with a lot left in the tank, left a heap of scores - including goals after us - this really is an unbelievable time to be a Waterford supporter.

Shane Bennett, my god we have had some great days out of this 18 year old already...

Kieran Bennett also worth a mention, he is an excellent player too, my first time seeing him play

very good waterford team coming through reminds me alot like our 2012 under21 team 8 or 9 really top notch players most have already seemed to have cracked the senior code

munster u21 will be very open again this year with the winners likely going on to win the all ireland ye will defenitly have better individual payers on show while our 21s have been fairing well against inter county senior teams in challange games , we used the munster intermeidate championship as a prep for this competition although in the defeat to limerick e were muscled out of it psychically , cant see us doing a 5 in row ye probably look like the best team in the country at the moment to win this competition so i would make ye favorites the next day for sure

KevIRL

Waterford 3/1 second favs to win the under 21 AI. Only Galway who have a bye to the AI semi final are shorter.

TyrionPower

windy shepard henderson wrote: »

very good waterford team coming through reminds me alot like our 2012 under21 team 8 or 9 really top notch players most have already seemed to have cracked the senior code

munster u21 will be very open again this year with the winners likely going on to win the all ireland ye will defenitly have better individual payers on show while our 21s have been fairing well against inter county senior teams in challange games , we used the munster intermeidate championship as a prep for this competition although in the defeat to limerick e were muscled out of it psychically , cant see us doing a 5 in row ye probably look like the best team in the country at the moment to win this competition so i would make ye favorites the next day for sure

I suppose a lot depends on the senior Munster final and also if Clare have a hectic run in the qualifiers - but looks like two serious teams will be going at it up in cusack park.
Some of the Waterford lads, like Tom Devine are huge - these guys have put a hell of a lot of work into it - very powerful players

PTH2009

Following a match on twitter is worse than watching it live lol.

Congrats to the lads and it will be a tough game against clare on the 15 july.

Waterford supporters could possibly have to travel to Limerick on the 12th July for the senior match and then to ennis 3 days later for the u21.

We want Clare to win there 1st round senior qualifer because that means they will be playing the 2nd round on the 11th july

It's a good time for hurling in Waterford so far

U never know with the footballers they could win Saturday against offaly but they mite be better off being knocked out by offaly than possibly winning and then being hammered by someone in round 2 eg kildare, fermanagh etc

Dick phelan

I must admit i wouldn't know many players outside of the senior setup but one that really caught the eye was Lyons, still playing minor as well so should be years ahead of him.

DiscoStew

Good win without ever having to hit top gear which is always nice to be able to say! Was very impressed with the work rate of the players, some of the bigger names especially sacrificed themselves at times to allow others to shine. Stephen Bennett worked tirelessly around the middle of the field in the second half especially and laid on a few scores. Tom Devine had a spell at full back in the first half before thundering into it in the second with strong running and tackling, also laying on scores. Thought Kieran Bennett went very well in the full back line also. Another top class performance from TdB! Dunford and Gleeson probably not as effective as would have hoped. Gleeson had a lot of wasted possessions but to be fair to him he is only readjusting to the forwards again. Had a cracker of a goal which should have stood also. Patrick Curran played very well, from frees and play and showed good willingness to take on the full back line once or twice. Shane Bennett outstanding once again. Some achievement to go straight from his last leaving cert exam to play and score 1-4! Kearney and Phelan both laid on scores well upon their introductions which was another positive.
We definitely have more in the tank, however, I would be fearful of the quick turnaround from the Munster final. We had a 10 day run to prepare for this game, that will be 2 days realistically the next day. The players will also either be coming off a high or disappointed going into it. Can make it difficult to refocus. I remember how we shocked a tipp team that were fancied for the u21 all ireland in fraher field 3 days after they had won the senior Munster title. Clare might not be as strong as previous years, but with home advantage and Waterfords quick turnaround I wouldn't be getting carried away just yet. Even if Clare progress in the qualifiers I don't think they have too many u21s involved this year so their preparation will be a lot better than our own.

DiscoStew

Dick phelan wrote: »

I must admit i wouldn't know many players outside of the senior setup but one that really caught the eye was Lyons, still playing minor as well so should be years ahead of him.

Agreed, played very well for a lad playing minor this year. Didn't look a bit out of place.

lim4ev

congrats on a serious display tonight notwithstanding the obvious that cork were poor it still was a serious performance considering 4th gear wasn't used.I'd expect ye'll beat clare with the other semi of Limk and tipp should be close too.

coopdog85

Lads, good and all as he is, what is Gleeson at with the potshots from 70 and 80 yards out? How many wides did he have on his own tonight? He's undoubtedly a very serious hurler with as much skill as anyone playing the game at the minute but the management would want to have a talk with him. He does it for Mt. Sion & he does it for the county seniors & he did it tonight as well. I'm not sure is it poor decision making or over confidence that's making him do it but at one stage he was facing his own goal and tried a blind shot over his shoulder about 40 yards out and at an angle. It's just shocking decision making from a player who's confidence is obviously sky high but he cost Waterford a few points tonight with his rash attempts.

I'm not knocking the chap for a second, I'm just frustrated by him because it's the only weak part of his game.

stumblingblock

DiscoStew wrote: »

Good win without ever having to hit top gear which is always nice to be able to say! Was very impressed with the work rate of the players, some of the bigger names especially sacrificed themselves at times to allow others to shine. Stephen Bennett worked tirelessly around the middle of the field in the second half especially and laid on a few scores. Tom Devine had a spell at full back in the first half before thundering into it in the second with strong running and tackling, also laying on scores. Thought Kieran Bennett went very well in the full back line also. Another top class performance from TdB! Dunford and Gleeson probably not as effective as would have hoped. Gleeson had a lot of wasted possessions but to be fair to him he is only readjusting to the forwards again. Had a cracker of a goal which should have stood also. Patrick Curran played very well, from frees and play and showed good willingness to take on the full back line once or twice. Shane Bennett outstanding once again. Some achievement to go straight from his last leaving cert exam to play and score 1-4! Kearney and Phelan both laid on scores well upon their introductions which was another positive.
We definitely have more in the tank, however, I would be fearful of the quick turnaround from the Munster final. We had a 10 day run to prepare for this game, that will be 2 days realistically the next day. The players will also either be coming off a high or disappointed going into it. Can make it difficult to refocus. I remember how we shocked a tipp team that were fancied for the u21 all ireland in fraher field 3 days after they had won the senior Munster title. Clare might not be as strong as previous years, but with home advantage and Waterfords quick turnaround I wouldn't be getting carried away just yet. Even if Clare progress in the qualifiers I don't think they have too many u21s involved this year so their preparation will be a lot better than our own.

Will be difficult but at least this team now has a competitive game behind them. They know they can do it as a unit and will bring a lot of confidence into the Clare game. If we win the senior final it will only increase the adrenalin and if we lose, well this could be just the tonic these lads need to bounce back. I can't believe its 6 years since we last won a game at this level. A shocking record really and about time we made some sort of a breakthrough.

stumblingblock

coopdog85 wrote: »

Lads, good and all as he is, what is Gleeson at with the potshots from 70 and 80 yards out? How many wides did he have on his own tonight? He's undoubtedly a very serious hurler with as much skill as anyone playing the game at the minute but the management would want to have a talk with him. He does it for Mt. Sion & he does it for the county seniors & he did it tonight as well. I'm not sure is it poor decision making or over confidence that's making him do it but at one stage he was facing his own goal and tried a blind shot over his shoulder about 40 yards out and at an angle. It's just shocking decision making from a player who's confidence is obviously sky high but he cost Waterford a few points tonight with his rash attempts.

I'm not knocking the chap for a second, I'm just frustrated by him because it's the only weak part of his game.

Look, I think it's common knowledge that this has been a major flaw in his game since a young age. 2 years ago his over-exuberance cost Waterford a Munster minor title against Limerick in the Gaelic Grounds. He went on one of his solo runs in the closing stages and ended up losing possession instead of laying it off to someone in a better position or simply putting it over the bar which would have had Waterford home and hosed. Limerick subsequently went down the field and scored a goal and ended up drawing the match (and winning the replay). Hes probably been getting away with it because hes generally played on winning teams up through his career and he is as we know, a precocious talent. Everyone has always put it down to youthful exuberance and that ah ‘he’ll learn’ but it’s a bit worrying that were this far down the line and still talking about it. No manager seems to have knocked it out of him yet. It’s a difficult one as his self-confidence and fearlessness is part of what makes him such an exciting talent but he needs to be thought how to manage and control that aswell. It could be the difference between him being a top player and not. Its hard to pin-point where it comes from but if you look at many of the great Waterford hurlers of the past 15/20 years the likes of Flynn, Kelly, Mullane, Shanahan etc, all instinctive hurlers and maybe its what our young players have grown up watching and aspiring to. and even in generations before that the 'off the cuff' style hurling has always been a part of our natural game in Waterford. Much to our detriment at times.

TyrionPower

What a difference a year makes in sport, I was never as low leaving a match after the U21 game against Cork last year, some of our best up and coming players in years - hammered... Remembering the comments here it hit a lot of people hard... Hard to believe the progress we have made