Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 3 ***Updated Mod Note Post 1***

ShamoBuc

TyrionPower wrote: »

For Cork U21s this is the biggest game of the year - their sole focus as a group.

For Waterford a lot of our guys are thinking of July 12th - we run the risk of not having the same hunger...

Cork going into this ideally, playing the poor mouth, but salivating at the prospect of an ambush

Cork are playing the poor mouth with very good reason, they are clearly a poorer team than Waterford, that's just a fact.

deiseach

TGV

Deise_2012 wrote: »

Waterford U21 Team to play Cork on Wednesday night at 7.30pm in Pairc Ui Rinn.
Best of luck lads
1 Billy Nolan Roanmore
2 Shane Mc Nulty De La Salle
3 Kieran Bennett Ballysaggart
4 Conor Gleeson Fourmilewater
5 Michéal Harney Bonmahon
6 Tadhg De Búrca Clashmore/Kinsalebeg
7 Shane Bennett Ballysaggart
8 Austin Gleeson Mount Sion
9 Tom Devine Modeligo
10 Colin Dunford Colligan
11 Stephen Bennett Ballysaggart
12 D.J. Foran Portlaw
13 Ryan Donnelly Dungarvan
14 Cormac Curran Brickey Rangers
15 Patrick Curran Dungarvan

It really is all Waterford team. I met an old guy who believed Waterford would never win an all Ireland with a team dominated by the city. We are too small a county to have half the population not represented. Anyway hope he was right, looking forward to the match, but of luck to the players

skaface

Best of luck to our management & team tomorrow night
Up The Deise

stumblingblock

A lot of silly people on here writing Cork off on their home patch. People saying its one of Cork’s poorest ever u21 sides but make no bones about it there are no poor players on that Cork team. Yes we have a talented group of players, but all the talk has been about Waterford so the pressure is on to deliver. This Cork side did nothing at minor. Coming in under the radar but will be waiting in the long grass. If ever we were set up for an ambush this is it. They did it last year on our home patch and while people have argued how this year is different weve been down that road before. You would hope the senior lads can carry the momentum of their senior form across but you just don’t know at this level. I would have questions marks about our full back line and throwing a 16 year old in goals at this level is a big gamble. Were far from being a proven outfit. I agree we definitely have a better side on paper but I expect very VERY little to be in this at the end of the 60 mins.

Orizio

You've reached deep into your cliche handbook there Stumlingblock.

logbox

DiscoStew wrote: »

I would expect a number of positional changes to the team named. One change in personnel also possibly.
Think Aussie and Shane Bennett will both be in half forwards with Donnelly. Stephen Bennett surely be inside for goal threat. Dunford midfield. Can't see both Foran and Cormac Curran starting.

Think you are probably right. Cormac Curran will not be playing. He picked up a nasty injury at work last week.

TyrionPower

stumblingblock wrote: »

A lot of silly people on here writing Cork off on their home patch. People saying its one of Cork’s poorest ever u21 sides but make no bones about it there are no poor players on that Cork team. Yes we have a talented group of players, but all the talk has been about Waterford so the pressure is on to deliver. This Cork side did nothing at minor. Coming in under the radar but will be waiting in the long grass. If ever we were set up for an ambush this is it. They did it last year on our home patch and while people have argued how this year is different weve been down that road before. You would hope the senior lads can carry the momentum of their senior form across but you just don’t know at this level. I would have questions marks about our full back line and throwing a 16 year old in goals at this level is a big gamble. Were far from being a proven outfit. I agree we definitely have a better side on paper but I expect very VERY little to be in this at the end of the 60 mins.

i have been saying it the last few days, you are dead right..
It's amazing how so many people here are experts on cork U21 hurling - they must have seen them play heaps of games... I will have to reserve judgement and my opinion on them until I see them in the flesh tonight

Brad1234

We'll win by at least 5 points.. Not being arrogant but these players are on a role and I'd expect a good performance out of us and win it with a bit to spare.

You base it on players on both sides and what you have seen.. None of this Cork wont role over and tradition stuff.. They may not role over but they'll still be bet..

KevIRL

Roll...

(Sorry Brad.)

Prefer a blaa meself mind...

deisedude

I know this Cork team haven't many household names but haven't they been performing very well in challenge matches?

Given our record at this level we can not afford to be cocky playing anyone. Last year we had a much superior team on paper and we got walloped

Deise_2012

deisedude wrote: »

I know this Cork team haven't many household names but haven't they been performing very well in challenge matches?

Given our record at this level we can not afford to be cocky playing anyone. Last year we had a much superior team on paper and we got walloped

Their keeper made 2 outstanding saves in the first 5 minutes last year from Donie Breathnach and Mikey Kearney I think. If they went in, it would have been a totally different game, after that Kevin Daly got a bit exposedplaying corner back, and they should really have put Tadhg Bourke marking Cadogan for the game

deiseach

I'm no expert on anything the Cork Under-21 scene, but if they have better players than that Waterford 15, why didn't they play them in the Senior team? I still think the smart money will be on Cork thanks to home advantage and the weight of history - I know 'history' doesn't hit the ball, but you couldn't blame any Waterford player who suddenly started to tighten up and lose their focus if they found themselves a couple of points up with a couple of minutes to go; I know I'd be absolutely crapping myself watching it at home - but we are entitled to be optimistic.

Cake Man

It won't be anyway easy, there's no such thing as a bad Cork side given the pick and resources they have, let alone the history they have and playing in their own back yard. I'd expect a huge effort from them and hoping our star performers can pull another performance out of the hat.
We had our arses handed to us last year and also in 2010/11 I think it was (I remember Tommy Ryan was on the team for whatever reason) when we went down there with another serious team (on paper) and were bet out the gate after putting up a paltry 1-03. Corks recent form in challenge games surely means they have something about them.

Just hope Tony and Mullane have them well prepped. Any sort of a win and I'd be delighted.
The very best of luck to all the lads this evening, Up the Déise

TyrionPower

Deise_2012 wrote: »

Their keeper made 2 outstanding saves in the first 5 minutes last year from Donie Breathnach and Mikey Kearney I think. If they went in, it would have been a totally different game, after that Kevin Daly got a bit exposedplaying corner back, and they should really have put Tadhg Bourke marking Cadogan for the game

The same could happen tonight - same keeper - he could make 5 great saves and it would be all ifs and buts..
Last year we didn't take our chances, in Cork they said last year it was a very poor team with none of the players standing out in senior club with the exception of Spilane and Cadogan... They walloped is at home

TyrionPower

deiseach wrote: »

I'm no expert on anything the Cork Under-21 scene, but if they have better players than that Waterford 15, why didn't they play them in the Senior team? I still think the smart money will be on Cork thanks to home advantage and the weight of history - I know 'history' doesn't hit the ball, but you couldn't blame any Waterford player who suddenly started to tighten up and lose their focus if they found themselves a couple of points up with a couple of minutes to go; I know I'd be absolutely crapping myself watching it at home - but we are entitled to be optimistic.

There could be a whole host of reasons that they weren't on the senior team other then ability,
- JBM too loyal to current crop
- yet to be given an opportunity to make a name for themselves (that could be tonight)
- college exam ties
Patrick curran could be the best player on show tonight and he only came on the senior panel a few weeks ago, who is to say they don't have more like that?

We are basing everything we know on what we know about Waterford..

As I said already this group are very talented but are they that fair ahead of everyone else..
They lost twice and drew twice at minor level (beating cork after extra time)

deiseach

TyrionPower wrote: »

Patrick curran could be the best player on show tonight and he only came on the senior panel a few weeks ago, who is to say they don't have more like that?

FAO any Cork people reading this. Do ye have any players of the quality of Patrick Curran bubbling under?

Mountainlad

TyrionPower wrote: »

There could be a whole host of reasons that they weren't on the senior team other then ability,
- JBM too loyal to current crop
- yet to be given an opportunity to make a name for themselves (that could be tonight)
- college exam ties
Patrick curran could be the best player on show tonight and he only came on the senior panel a few weeks ago, who is to say they don't have more like that?

We are basing everything we know on what we know about Waterford..

As I said already this group are very talented but are they that fair ahead of everyone else..
They lost twice and drew twice at minor level (beating cork after extra time)

That was 2013, this 2012 minor team.

TyrionPower

Mountainlad wrote: »

That was 2013, this 2012 minor team.

I know but our stand out players are from the 2013 side - the point I am making is that talented and all as they are they far from had it there own way when claiming the minor title

TyrionPower

deiseach wrote: »

FAO any Cork people reading this. Do ye have any players of the quality of Patrick Curran bubbling under?

They would rank the goalie up there as a guy who will be hanging onto the senior jersey and winning allstars for years to come - there are good young hurlers everywhere.

TyrionPower

deiseach wrote: »

FAO any Cork people reading this. Do ye have any players of the quality of Patrick Curran bubbling under?

Just out of interest what is your view on the quality on young players bubbling under in Cork and what do you base that view on?

deiseach

TyrionPower wrote: »

Just out of interest what is your view on the quality on young players bubbling under in Cork and what do you base that view on?

I have already said that I have no insight into the quality of players available to Cork. Given a hurling match is a series of battles, I find it unlikely on the balance of probability that they can match a team with five players who have swept all before them this year at Senior level and another two who looked the part in their brief appearance this year. There are variables other than individual quality, which is why I still fancy Cork, but I think it's a more reasonable position than assuming Cork must have better players because they're Cork. I'm sure there were plenty in Clare issuing the same kind of Jermiads before the Munster final last year when they walloped Cork out the gate.

TyrionPower

deiseach wrote: »

I have already said that I have no insight into the quality of players available to Cork. Given a hurling match is a series of battles, I find it unlikely on the balance of probability that they can match a team with five players who have swept all before them this year at Senior level and another two who looked the part in their brief appearance this year. There are variables other than individual quality, which is why I still fancy Cork, but I think it's a more reasonable position than assuming Cork must have better players because they're Cork. I'm sure there were plenty in Clare issuing the same kind of Jermiads before the Munster final last year when they walloped Cork out the gate.

I know nothing about Cork - but I think we will beat them -
Fair play to you, I wish I had your confidence.... From your posts I see we are going to these games a similar amount of time... Why am I so damaged!

deiseach

TyrionPower wrote: »

I know nothing about Cork - but I think we will beat them -
Fair play to you, I wish I had your confidence.... From your posts I see we are going to these games a similar amount of time... Why am I so damaged!

Strange, I think we'll probably lose! If you are of the same vintage as me - 38 - I'm wondering why you view it all in such an apocalyptic fashion. One thing I knew growing up was that Waterford were never win anything, ever. I've seen us win at Senior/Minor/U-21 level: two All-Ireland titles, two National Leagues and *gets out abacus* eight Munster titles. Once upon a time I'd have been happy with one All-Star! My cup runneth over as far as I'm concerned.

TyrionPower

deiseach wrote: »

Strange, I think we'll probably lose! If you are of the same vintage as me - 38 - I'm wondering why you view it all in such an apocalyptic fashion. One thing I knew growing up was that Waterford were never win anything, ever. I've seen us win at Senior/Minor/U-21 level: two All-Ireland titles, two National Leagues and *gets out abacus* eight Munster titles. Once upon a time I'd have been happy with one All-Star! My cup runneth over as far as I'm concerned.

It's a golden age alright, I am not apocalyptic about it at, I guess I have a commons sense approach to hurling.
Until I have evidence to the contrary I work of the assumption that Cork teams are well drilled, fit, highly motivated and will fight to the last whistle - they will have a good free taker and if you are close to them in the final minutes and it can go either way you are doing well.
I Hope we win in after a tight finish

KevIRL

Cork u21 are 7/2 on PP. Seems a huge price really.

deiseach

TyrionPower wrote: »

It's a golden age alright, I am not apocalyptic about it at, I guess I have a commons sense approach to hurling.
Until I have evidence to the contrary I work of the assumption that Cork teams are well drilled, fit, highly motivated and will fight to the last whistle - they will have a good free taker and if you are close to them in the final minutes and it can go either way you are doing well.
I Hope we win in after a tight finish

Aye, that's all fair enough. Although I'm sure you'd agree we'd all rather we routed them. That's what made the League final such a novel experience. Previous wins over Cork, it would always feel like we just beat them to the tape before collapsing in a heap after the finish line. I could get used to the business of winning it pulling up.



(Last year, of course, they did that to us. D'oh!)

thinkstoomuch1

TyrionPower wrote: »

There could be a whole host of reasons that they weren't on the senior team other then ability,
- JBM too loyal to current crop
- yet to be given an opportunity to make a name for themselves (that could be tonight)
- college exam ties
Patrick curran could be the best player on show tonight and he only came on the senior panel a few weeks ago, who is to say they don't have more like that?

We are basing everything we know on what we know about Waterford..

As I said already this group are very talented but are they that fair ahead of everyone else..
They lost twice and drew twice at minor level (beating cork after extra time)

Genuinely not playing any poor mouth but Cork are missing pa Callaghan cahalane Stephen Murphy and horgan from the minor set up so they would be certain starters with cormack who was asked to play senior earlier this year but declined
However this Waterford team has exceptional players like Foran who I always rated Devine Gleeson etc so even with fully fit Cork team Waterford would probably be slightly favourite

This is a well coached Cork team but the youngest in years so slow start could be a difficult night but if cork stay in the game as long as possible it could be close
Cork half back line is strong with all three senior club players in top form with a good full back from the all Ireland winning intermediate team and with the brilliant Spillane and good ball winner in o Neill a good player who played senior in meade and cahalane at midfield and the very promising sean o donughe played senior Cork have good players
Waterford you would expect to win and they have more experience than the youngest side in cork history probably but Cork I would hope don't role over
Liam Hayes manager from last year intermediate team all Ireland championship is involved and irwin meant be okay so hopefully Cork be competitive

TyrionPower

deiseach wrote: »

Aye, that's all fair enough. Although I'm sure you'd agree we'd all rather we routed them. That's what made the League final such a novel experience. Previous wins over Cork, it would always feel like we just beat them to the tape before collapsing in a heap after the finish line. I could get used to the business of winning it pulling up.



(Last year, of course, they did that to us. D'oh!)

I sat there in the league final in the closing stages, 10 points up knowing we would definitely win - it was surreal, like you say did that ever happen before?

deiseach

TyrionPower wrote: »

I sat there in the league final in the closing stages, 10 points up knowing we would definitely win - it was surreal, like you say did that ever happen before?

You have to go back to 1938 in the Munster semi-final to find the only other time we beat Cork by a double digit figure in the Championship, NHL, Minor or Under-21. Maybe we did it in the Oireachtas one time...