Prime Time 10th March 2015

OzCam

I'm an AUG guy. Buffer tubes wouldn't be something I'd naturally think of

grassroot1

If we apply Fenian's logic do we have to take the guns off the army? you know just incase they go on a rampage

outdoors247

How come the gaurd didn't mention that's a straight pull bolt action instead he made it seem like it was semi auto like the m14 that anders brevic fella used misinformation to suit there needs

patsat

outdoors247 wrote: »

How come the gaurd didn't mention that's a straight pull bolt action instead he made it seem like it was semi auto like the m14 that anders brevic fella used misinformation to suit there needs

Is it a straight pull??

outdoors247

Well if it was legal in Ireland it was or am I wrong in thinking semi auto 223s are illegal ?

outdoors247

Just read back through the thread I wasn't aware semi 223s are legal how long has that been around ?

patsat

outdoors247 wrote: »

Just read back through the thread I wasn't aware semi 223s are legal how long has that been around ?

For as long as I can remember but sher I'm only a young fella!

Legal, but restricted and usually take a court case to get.

outdoors247

Aright I haven't shot in about 7 or8 years the last time I seen a 223 m16 style was a straight pull with a 10 round mag so I thought it was still the same

outdoors247

And ither way if they are that worried about gun crime why aren't all guards armed in fairness a lot of guarda stations couldn't stop a fella on a rampage with a black widow and a few hundred ball bearings ha ha ha And maybe closing down rural stations gave an increase in legal guns being stolen

Nekarsulm

Closing local rural stations may actually have caused a drop in reported crimes. If so, the strategy would be seen to be working !

outdoors247

Who wouldent report there gun being robbed ?

crusier

outdoors247 wrote: »

And ither way if they are that worried about gun crime why aren't all guards armed in fairness a lot of guarda stations couldn't stop a fella on a rampage with a black widow and a few hundred ball bearings ha ha ha And maybe closing down rural stations gave an increase in legal guns being stolen

That was soooooo funny!

Nekarsulm

outdoors247 wrote: »

Who wouldent report there gun being robbed ?

Not talking about something as serious as that. Smaller stuff. When you go twice a d find the station shut, and the Green Man connects you to someplace 15 miles away the first game, a d some ere 10 miles away in the opposite direction the next time, you shrug and say "feck it" I have the price off it spent running looking for a Guard"

Grizzly 45

crusier wrote: »

He dosent need to, big gun, loads bullets, all the accessories and linked to a massacre! Joe has enough info!

And thats why he sounded like an utter Mong on Primetime....:rolleyes:
Made his constituency sound like east LA with teen gang bangers stealin guns to pop a cap in thier oppos asses down in da "hood!:rolleyes::rolleyes: If i was in his constituency and I heard my Rep talking about it as a high crime gun ridden area,i'd be questioning has this guy really got my best intrests and his constituency at heart,if he is slagging it that much???

Aright I haven't shot in about 7 or8 years the last time I seen a 223 m16 style was a straight pull with a 10 round mag so I thought it was still the same

It is and you can get either versions,but just be prepared to fight for them!!Proably less fpr the straight pull,because the "Idonlikedelookodat now " clause is and has been proven to be very weak and defeatable as there is no definition in the Irish firearms law as to what a definition of an "assault rifle " actually is...Could say a bolt action is an assault rifle because 100 years ago today German and British troops were "assaulting " each other with them in the trenches.

outdoors247

Very good point if they get rid of 1 they won't stop until all legal guns are gone

alfr

outdoors247 wrote: »

Very good point if they get rid of 1 they won't stop until all legal guns are gone

If the working report between the DOJ/AGS went into law unquestioned then it gives supers the power to restrict the number of firearms in an area based on the crime rate of said area, ie. a townsland which had no crimes last year but has had one crime committed in the area this year has a increase of 100% (can be any criminal offense once a person is charged( can be nothing related to firearms).

But it goes beyond that and allows a Super to decide how many firearms are allowed in his/her jurisdiction so when it comes to renewal (considered a new application) he/she can say no sorry limit of firearms has been reached and refuse your application based on "proliferation" of firearms in the his/her district.

If im wrong about this can someone please correct me as this is how i see the proposed changes and id rather be told im wrong than believe im right

Grizzly 45

That bird will have a very big problem getting off the ground...Firearms notwithstanding,can you imagine what a pronouncement on a district like that will do for your house and car insurance premiums?? Or your, or your kids prospect of getting a job??Or trying to sell your house to get out of the "high crime area"?
"The cheif comissioner of the district said it is so ,so he must know mustnt he??Slap another 2 grand on everyones premiums there to cover any losses."

Again this shows the utter shoddiness and shallow investigation work ornon research done by Prime Time in the fact they seem to have never even read the proposals in the first place by AGS.Any competant investigative reporter would have been asking questions on that point alone!Not lapping up the bilge being fed and spewing it out again from another orfice.No wonder I quit watching TV years ago!

yubabill1

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

It is and you can get either versions,but just be prepared to fight for them!!Proably less fpr the straight pull,because the "Idonlikedelookodat now " clause is and has been proven to be very weak and defeatable as there is no definition in the Irish firearms law as to what a definition of an "assault rifle " actually is...Could say a bolt action is an assault rifle because 100 years ago today German and British troops were "assaulting " each other with them in the trenches.

So where are we now?

Anyone with C/F pistols, C/F S/A rifles, pump SG's, .22/air pistols get to keep what they have.

New applicants for the above face serious obstacles (C/F pistols not allowed), except for "Approved Olympic" firearms, whatever they are (seems Fergus Healy will decide).

Academics and international experts recommended by Justice Committee to examine the way forward (read: kick can down the road past the election).

5 mill in court fees due to shooters.

The trenches analogy is very apt, Griz.

Possibly the best thing is that if you go to court to get say C/F S/A rifle and win, you get your costs now, most likely (but not definitely).

knockon

yubabill1 wrote: »

So where are we now?

Anyone with C/F pistols, C/F S/A rifles, pump SG's, .22/air pistols get to keep what they have.

New applicants for the above face serious obstacles (C/F pistols not allowed), except for "Approved Olympic" firearms, whatever they are (seems Fergus Healy will decide).

Academics and international experts recommended by Justice Committee to examine the way forward (read: kick can down the road past the election).

5 mill in court fees due to shooters.

The trenches analogy is very apt, Griz.

Possibly the best thing is that if you go to court to get say C/F S/A rifle and win, you get your costs now, most likely (but not definitely).

I think you are correct Yubabill - this looks like death by Committee. Most important thing though is if the Minister asks the Garda Inspectorate to examine the proposals that the Gardai spearheaded and the whole licensing system they will find a whole heap of sh$t. Better again they will write that report like these ones....http://www.gsinsp.ie/news-and-reports.php and put on paper what we have been saying for years.


Well Grizzly45 and I were discussing that over lunch during the week and he might be better placed than I to give you a better "where we are at".
For me I see whatever happens next regarding applying for a firearm will be coming from the Phoenix Park. i.e. "Do not refuse any centrefire pistol/rifle/.22 pistol etc renewals as they (us) are going to appeal and the Garda Accountant says we can not afford to". This of course is providing that noting about the applicant has changed and we tick all the box's.

I had a notion that I would arrive in the CS's office as usual and he would say "I'll be refusing you" and I would answer "Work away as you'll be paying all the costs" but things are never that simple. What this whole thing in the last few months though has garnished a bunch of us together albeit loosely where we have demonstrated to politicians that we are a force to be reckoned with. In particular the group that represented us at the Justice Committee were excellent. A lot of people have been educated on the sport of shooting if nothing else.

I'am not sure how they (AGS) are going to deal with new applications. What happens if I apply to Henry St tomorrow morning for say a Sig Mosqioto .22 and mag capacity of 5....will I be refused? If I apply for a new pump shotgun? I would be real interested though if anyone is in the DC on an appeal soon?

B412

Is there any one out there who can tell me if, I was to convert my semi auto 308 to straight pull would this firearm now be in the non-restricted category and easier to re-licence. Or am i thinking these pricks are reasonable people

crusier

What's needed is someone to win a gold medal in target shooting at the Olympics, the Irish are known to hop on any sporting bandwagon and you would likely find Finan McGrath on the welcome home stage hogging the microphone. Pity we don't have anyone with a steady hand!

Sparks

crusier wrote: »

What's needed is someone to win a gold medal in target shooting at the Olympics, the Irish are known to hop on any sporting bandwagon and you would likely find Finan McGrath on the welcome home stage hogging the microphone. Pity we don't have anyone with a steady hand!

Four world championship gold and silver medals in the last ten years in Olympic shotgun.
Don't think it's helped that much in this area.
Did bring in some good things, but the licencing laws seem unaffected.

Grizzly 45

B412 wrote: »

Is there any one out there who can tell me if, I was to convert my semi auto 308 to straight pull would this firearm now be in the non-restricted category and easier to re-licence. Or am i thinking these pricks are reasonable people

Nope stays restricted because of the features and mag capacity.But easier to fight about because looks don't determine function.

Grizzly 45

knockon wrote: »

I think you are correct Yubabill - this looks like death by Committee. Most important thing though is if the Minister asks the Garda Inspectorate to examine the proposals that the Gardai spearheaded and the whole licensing system they will find a whole heap of sh$t. Better again they will write that report like these ones....http://www.gsinsp.ie/news-and-reports.php and put on paper what we have been saying for years.


Well Grizzly45 and I were discussing that over lunch during the week and he might be better placed than I to give you a better "where we are at".
For me I see whatever happens next regarding applying for a firearm will be coming from the Phoenix Park. i.e. "Do not refuse any centrefire pistol/rifle/.22 pistol etc renewals as they (us) are going to appeal and the Garda Accountant says we can not afford to". This of course is providing that noting about the applicant has changed and we tick all the box's.

I had a notion that I would arrive in the CS's office as usual and he would say "I'll be refusing you" and I would answer "Work away as you'll be paying all the costs" but things are never that simple. What this whole thing in the last few months though has garnished a bunch of us together albeit loosely where we have demonstrated to politicians that we are a force to be reckoned with. In particular the group that represented us at the Justice Committee were excellent. A lot of people have been educated on the sport of shooting if nothing else.

I'am not sure how they (AGS) are going to deal with new applications. What happens if I apply to Henry St tomorrow morning for say a Sig Mosqioto .22 and mag capacity of 5....will I be refused? If I apply for a new pump shotgun? I would be real interested though if anyone is in the DC on an appeal soon?

Probieren geht uber studieren as the Germans say (try it out rather than study).As I and 250 other appellants on the .22 pistols won in the high court recently in 25 test cases by William Egan.I'll be re applying for my gsg 1911 .22 under a new super in the coming weeks so we will soon find out ifAGS will beholden to HC rulings or will we still do the DC shuffle.

Had a look at the Garda inspectorates qualifications.....WOW! There are two Ex Chicago PD officers on there who have some serious LE experiance behind them in various US states and countries[Notwithstanding appaling record on gun crime and gun bans in that city]
The head is an EX London Met officer who was involved with operation TRIDENT,which the AGS operation ANVIL is based on .TRIDENT has had its own controversies ,namly the fitting up of Mick Shepard,a rather eccentric looking gun dealer,but a sound guy.So all three of them shouldnt be newbies to firearms.

B412

Grizzly you say a new super on less you are moving districts my understand is our old friend is staying , I like you hope to see the back of him

Grizzly 45

Nope his most highest Cheif Poobah in Henry St is staying put for another eight years or so .Its his understudy who is being replaced.[The last lad left under a bit of a cloud and a hurry too it seems?].The new replacement Super is a local and supposedly a good egg,as much as you can belive I guess.

Shure you dont want to be changing them that often either..All the hassle of having to retrain a new one is a bother.:)

knockon

He was overheard a few years ago calling the new Commissioner something unsavory. As his penance he was told he has to stay in Limerick or retire. Norin does not like him either.

B412

It's not just Norin it's 99% off the members in there, is there any hope of retaining the S/F pistols and semi auto rifles at this stage

Grizzly 45

B412 wrote: »

, is there any hope of retaining the S/F pistols and semi auto rifles at this stage

Plenty of hope and law there my good fellow.:D Just need the WILL to stand your ground.

knockon

B412 wrote: »

It's not just Norin it's 99% off the members in there, is there any hope of retaining the S/F pistols and semi auto rifles at this stage

Of course there is. There has been no change in the law. To be fair I cannot be critical of anyone other than management in Henry St and he is doing exactly what he was told to do by his superiors. The snag with him was, he is so damn sneaky about it.