**ALL THINGS IRISH WATER/WATER RELATED** Part 2 - MOD WARNING IN OP

Phoebas

tayto lover wrote: »

Maybe if IW was not owned by DOB and the charges were lower things might not have seemed so bad but he's like a red rag to a bull and is a FG favourite so the people are not having it, cronyism and jobs for the boys and all that.

This is the thread that keeps on giving. Denis O'Brien now owns Irish Water!!!!! :pac:

Little CuChulainn

I would like to see IW to cease trading and water to remain controlled by government/local auth

Tinkersbell wrote: »

If a shove in the back is classed as assault, the courts would be full from now 'till the end of time.

Shoving seemed to be enough to rile up the people in Coolock that day. Wasn't that what all the fuss was about? so let me get this straight. In your view, it's not ok for Gardaí to shove people trying to get at the Taoiseachs car but it is ok for people in a mob to shove Gardaí. Well I'm glad that's been sorted. Would you like to try defend the threats of violence a bit more? Tell us how they are just venting their anger and it's all in good fun because at least Facebook doesn't allow anonymity.

Tinkersbell

I would like to see IW to cease trading and water to remain controlled by government/local auth

Tinkersbell wrote: »

And that is a serious assault on a Garda?
FFS!
Actually, show us that video there, will you?

They must have taken down the video because it showed their true colours! If I came up behind you and gave you a hefty shove in the back, wouldn't you consider it assault?

Little CuChulainn

I would like to see IW to cease trading and water to remain controlled by government/local auth

tayto lover wrote: »

Maybe if IW was not owned by DOBthat.

That's just an outright lie. There is literally no evidence to support that claim.

Tinkersbell

I do not want to pay for water in any way

Deleted User wrote: »

They must have taken down the video because it showed their true colours!

Ah, right so.....:rolleyes:

Tinkersbell

I do not want to pay for water in any way

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

That's just an outright lie. There is literally no evidence to support that claim.

Sure who needs evidence around here?

tayto lover

Phoebas wrote: »

This is the thread that keeps on giving. Denis O'Brien now owns Irish Water!!!!! :pac:

Sorry I wasn't supposed to post that until next year :pac:

ROCKMAN

I do not want to pay for water in any way

Deleted User wrote: »

They must have taken down the video because it showed their true colours! If I came up behind you and gave you a hefty shove in the back, wouldn't you consider it assault?

So the many videos showing the Garda shoving people out off the way (from behind in a lot of cases) you would also class as assault . Yes/No

Little CuChulainn

I would like to see IW to cease trading and water to remain controlled by government/local auth

Tinkersbell wrote: »

Sure who needs evidence around here?

I'd settle for a theory on that one. At least it would be entertaining.

moxin

I do not want to pay for water in any way

High lead levels found in water in Kerry and it took IW a very long time to act on it. This is a scandal.
http://www.thejournal.ie/lead-levels-drinking-water-st-brendans-park-1766116-Nov2014/?utm_source=facebook_short

Ghost Buster

Perhaps if The Gardai, IW Meter installers et al read this:

So, lets see – Irish Water: a synopsis so far.

Ireland goes bankrupt and the Troika calls for more taxes.
Water meters are decided upon and a plan to build Irish Water are hatched.
Siemens, a company with massive resources and know-how in this area – and also with a massive installed base in the UK – offer to install the meters for free.

Phil Hogan declines Siemens’ offer – no answer as to why he decided this was ever forthcoming – “just, no – we have an Irish solution to this”
Both Siemens and industry analysts are baffled as to why a state would go for a far more expensive solution.

Denis O Brien, the man accused by a High Court Judge to have “beyond all doubt” bribed a FG government to gain control of a a state asset (Esat)- and to have subsequently made hundreds of millions by selling same – “purchases” a company called Siteserv which specialises in the installation of water meters.

This is about a year before the water meter tender.

Now, numerous European companies also wanted to buy Siteserv and offered way more money for the company (which then owed €100 million to Anglo Irish Bank and was completely insolvent).

The Irish Government (weirdly again FG) – (or actually you, Mr(s). Irish Taxpayer) gave the company to Denis O Brien with the €100 million owed to Anglo (now state owned – i.e. by you) written off. It’s not written off for you, the taxpayer – you still pay it – it’s just that Denis doesn’t, got it?

Some gamble for Denis to buy a company with €100 million written off and with no guarantee of a lucrative water meter contract.

A business in an area where he has no previous experience or competence.
Siteserv subsequently bids in the EU tendering process and, lo and behold, wins. The contract is for hundreds of millions of Euros.

Now, enter Irish Water.

The CEO of which used to be the financial officer of an organisation which spent €100 million of Irish taxpayer’s money on the, according to the EU, illegal process to build an incinerator in Dublin.

No incinerator was ever built or will ever be built but €100 million, again of your money, is gone – and John is now the CEO of Irish Water.

No minutes of meetings – which spent €100 million of your money were ever recorded – the money is just gone.

John then installs his homeboys and homegirls from the Poolbeg project to Irish Water – citing the abysmal salaries at Irish Water as the reason why nobody else would apply for these jobs.

People who were direct beneficiaries of the illegal Poolbegl scam are now newly fledged semi-state employees.

Paid for by you, the taxpayer – again.

Okay?
The biggest langer in this solar system is the Irish taxpayer.

This is just the latest episode of the calamity that is Ireland Inc.

We haven’t a fcuking chance – no matter who we vote for.

But, we’re great craic.

Heh heh heh

They could kinda see where the anger is coming from and perhaps reconsider their actions.... maybe

Tinkersbell

I do not want to pay for water in any way

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Perhaps if The Gardai, IW Meter installers et al read this:

So, lets see – Irish Water: a synopsis so far.

Ireland goes bankrupt and the Troika calls for more taxes.
Water meters are decided upon and a plan to build Irish Water are hatched.
Siemens, a company with massive resources and know-how in this area – and also with a massive installed base in the UK – offer to install the meters for free.

Phil Hogan declines Siemens’ offer – no answer as to why he decided this was ever forthcoming – “just, no – we have an Irish solution to this”
Both Siemens and industry analysts are baffled as to why a state would go for a far more expensive solution.

Denis O Brien, the man accused by a High Court Judge to have “beyond all doubt” bribed a FG government to gain control of a a state asset (Esat)- and to have subsequently made hundreds of millions by selling same – “purchases” a company called Siteserv which specialises in the installation of water meters.

This is about a year before the water meter tender.

Now, numerous European companies also wanted to buy Siteserv and offered way more money for the company (which then owed €100 million to Anglo Irish Bank and was completely insolvent).

The Irish Government (weirdly again FG) – (or actually you, Mr(s). Irish Taxpayer) gave the company to Denis O Brien with the €100 million owed to Anglo (now state owned – i.e. by you) written off. It’s not written off for you, the taxpayer – you still pay it – it’s just that Denis doesn’t, got it?

Some gamble for Denis to buy a company with €100 million written off and with no guarantee of a lucrative water meter contract.

A business in an area where he has no previous experience or competence.
Siteserv subsequently bids in the EU tendering process and, lo and behold, wins. The contract is for hundreds of millions of Euros.

Now, enter Irish Water.

The CEO of which used to be the financial officer of an organisation which spent €100 million of Irish taxpayer’s money on the, according to the EU, illegal process to build an incinerator in Dublin.

No incinerator was ever built or will ever be built but €100 million, again of your money, is gone – and John is now the CEO of Irish Water.

No minutes of meetings – which spent €100 million of your money were ever recorded – the money is just gone.

John then installs his homeboys and homegirls from the Poolbeg project to Irish Water – citing the abysmal salaries at Irish Water as the reason why nobody else would apply for these jobs.

People who were direct beneficiaries of the illegal Poolbegl scam are now newly fledged semi-state employees.

Paid for by you, the taxpayer – again.

Okay?
The biggest langer in this solar system is the Irish taxpayer.

This is just the latest episode of the calamity that is Ireland Inc.

We haven’t a fcuking chance – no matter who we vote for.

But, we’re great craic.

Heh heh heh

They could kinda see where the anger is coming from and perhaps reconsider their actions.... maybe

Anger isn't a policy.
Refusing to engage and not paying, while all the time lobbying our elected reps is a policy
That's mine.

dxhound2005

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Perhaps if The Gardai, IW Meter installers et al read this:

So, lets see – Irish Water: a synopsis so far.


They could kinda see where the anger is coming from and perhaps reconsider their actions.... maybe

Your "synopsis so far" is from January. Any chance of an update?

Ghost Buster

Tinkersbell wrote: »

Anger isn't a policy.
Refusing to engage and not paying, while all the time lobbying our elected reps is a policy
That's mine.

Mine too but as i said in another post, Im overloaded with principle and a sense of fair play to a degree which isnt always to my benefit.
If I were a cop or a meter installer and then read this and all of the other crap which is part and parcel of the Irish water fiasco Id be seriously having a crisis of conscience:eek:

Ghost Buster

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Your "synopsis so far" is from January. Any chance of an update?

Theres been lots since but i think that example (from The Journal but the link is broken) stands unless someone with a time machine has caused a paradox.

But for now lets add:
Hubert Kearns - There as a reward for leaving Sligo 80m in debt
Coleman Shanley - There cos his family donate to Fg but no qualifications besides.
Under performance bonuses
IW worker being given an unadvertised position as a ministerial driver.

Will that do for now?

dxhound2005

Tinkersbell wrote: »

Anger isn't a policy.
Refusing to engage and not paying, while all the time lobbying our elected reps is a policy
That's mine.

How can you be not paying for something when there are no bills due out for months?

Bongalongherb

What a watery/rainy night, I'm soaked to the bone. Actually, I squeezed my jacket there and filled a pint-bottle of water for conservation while my house is half flooded in water. Over and under ?.

John Tierney, you are gone as well, like the rest of the cronies . Big news a-coming. We will be waving hands high in 4 weeks. But we will be waving hands a million in 2016.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJdJBNH6r44

Ghost Buster

dxhound2005 wrote: »

How can you be not paying for something when there are no bills due out for months?

Weird that they have had to extend the deadline after spending millions on advisory so as to get everything just right.

cajonlardo

dxhound2005 wrote: »

How can you be not paying for something when there are no bills due out for months?

The roar of Lions becomes the bleating of lambs

Some change in tone in the pro charges crowd's posts since the start of October

Reminds of that "Underdog" Claims advertisement and the shadow is getting smaller by the day.

Tinkersbell

I do not want to pay for water in any way

dxhound2005 wrote: »

How can you be not paying for something when there are no bills due out for months?

I said,

"Refusing to engage and not paying, while all the time lobbying our elected reps is a policy"

Is that hard for you to understand or something?

dxhound2005

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Weird that they have had to extend the deadline after spending millions on advisory so as to get everything just right.

Not in the least bit surprising to me. No other country abandoned it's property tax meaning there was no need to maintain a database of properties. This meant that when property tax was reintroduced they had to start from scratch and the deadline was extended a few times. All the dire predictions about mass homelessness doesn't seem to have ensued. And all the protestors lining themselves up to go to jail must have had a change of mind.

Same with water, complete new database being set up. Some politicians have said that the timeline was too ambitious. The metering programme was always due to run into 2016. It will take as long as it takes but everyone will be on board through time.

ROCKMAN

I do not want to pay for water in any way

Tinkersbell wrote: »

Anger isn't a policy.
Refusing to engage and not paying, while all the time lobbying our elected reps is a policy
That's mine.

[QUOTE=dxhound2005;92951292]How can you be not paying for something when there are no bills due out for months?[/QUOTE]

And the Anti-water side has been accused of stupidity by some :rolleyes::rolleyes:

gladrags

I do not want to pay for water in any way

"The civil servant who provided a dossier to the Public Accounts Committee (PAC) alleging tax evasion by a number of former politicians was originally appointed by former tánaiste Mary Harney to investigate offshore bank accounts – known as the Ansbacher accounts.
Gerry Ryan, who still works in the Department of Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation, was asked in 1998 to investigate tax evasion schemes by Ms Harney, who was then the senior minister in what was known as the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment. Mr Ryan was appointed an authorised officer under company law.
Mr Ryan – who declined to comment earlier this week and did not return calls yesterday – says in the covering letter of his dossier that he was “asked to terminate my investigations” by Ms Harney in June 2004.
Numerous political sources involved in the Fianna Fáil-Progressive Democrats coalition say the claims, which mainly focus on former Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael TDs, were fully investigated.
Gardaí also said the claims had been “fully investigated”."

Irish Times

Should the above not be dealt with,as a matter of urgency,by Kenny.?

As his party is quick to smear descent citizens.

Tinkersbell

I do not want to pay for water in any way

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Not in the least bit surprising to me. No other country abandoned it's property tax meaning there was no need to maintain a database of properties. This meant that when property tax was reintroduced they had to start from scratch and the deadline was extended a few times. All the dire predictions about mass homelessness doesn't seem to have ensued. And all the protestors lining themselves up to go to jail must have had a change of mind.

Same with water, complete new database being set up. Some politicians have said that the timeline was too ambitious. The metering programme was always due to run into 2016. It will take as long as it takes but everyone will be on board through time.

The only way I'll pay a water tax is when it's classed as a tax, revenue get involved and I've no choice.
Until then, they'll sing for it....

dxhound2005

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Theres been lots since but i think that example (from The Journal but the link is broken) stands unless someone with a time machine has caused a paradox.

But for now lets add:
Hubert Kearns - There as a reward for leaving Sligo 80m in debt
Coleman Shanley - There cos his family donate to Fg but no qualifications besides.
Under performance bonuses
IW worker being given an unadvertised position as a ministerial driver.

Will that do for now?

They seem to be very important issues for a lot of people all right. But I was hoping you might have something from the bigger picture. Like how many meters have been installed and how many customers do IW have signed up now?

Tinkersbell

I do not want to pay for water in any way

gladrags wrote: »

"The civil servant who provided a dossier to the Public Accounts Committee (PAC) alleging tax evasion by a number of former politicians was originally appointed by former tánaiste Mary Harney to investigate offshore bank accounts – known as the Ansbacher accounts.
Gerry Ryan, who still works in the Department of Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation, was asked in 1998 to investigate tax evasion schemes by Ms Harney, who was then the senior minister in what was known as the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment. Mr Ryan was appointed an authorised officer under company law.
Mr Ryan – who declined to comment earlier this week and did not return calls yesterday – says in the covering letter of his dossier that he was “asked to terminate my investigations” by Ms Harney in June 2004.
Numerous political sources involved in the Fianna Fáil-Progressive Democrats coalition say the claims, which mainly focus on former Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael TDs, were fully investigated.
Gardaí also said the claims had been “fully investigated”."

Irish Times

Should the above not be dealt with,as a matter of urgency,by Kenny.?

As his party is quick to smear descent citizens.

To be honest, that looks like a diversion tactic to me.
Something to take the heat off the water tax.

In saying that, if any current FG ministers or TD's were or are involved in tax evasion, it'll be bye bye FG!

Cuttlefish

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

Pretty sure this has been answered already. There are two people present at protests, protesters and Gardaí. The protesters aren't going to release footage of them assaulting people and the Gardaí cannot.



It's a clear indication of the crowd that was outside Coolock Station and a pretty solid indicator of their idea of peaceful protest.

But hey doesn't everyone have a smart phone and/ or tablet??

So video footage should be everywhere not just anti IW and Gardai but also bystanders and press.

Ghost Buster

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Not in the least bit surprising to me. No other country abandoned it's property tax meaning there was no need to maintain a database of properties. This meant that when property tax was reintroduced they had to start from scratch and the deadline was extended a few times. All the dire predictions about mass homelessness doesn't seem to have ensued. And all the protestors lining themselves up to go to jail must have had a change of mind.

Same with water, complete new database being set up. Some politicians have said that the timeline was too ambitious. The metering programme was always due to run into 2016. It will take as long as it takes but everyone will be on board through time.

So the millions spent on consultants didnt lead to anyone else realising it was too ambitious?
Or that a cash strapped public may be less than willing to come on board when the bonus culture, perks, car allowances and cronyism came to light?
Or that folk like me who, before finding out about the above actively tried to register by phone, Email and even twitter would eventually give up and change their minds on the whole thing.

Feck, i could have told em that for a fiver.

Tinkersbell

I do not want to pay for water in any way

Cuttlefish wrote: »

But hey doesn't everyone have a smart phone and/ or tablet??

So video footage should be everywhere not just anti IW and Gardai but also bystanders and press.

As far as I know, the anti water tax people took all smartphones and/or tablets etc off everyone there and deleted the offending material.
Feckers, aren't they?

Cuttlefish

Deleted User wrote: »

In one of the videos posted, you can clearly see a thug shove a Garda IN THE BACK and then turn and disappear into the crowd.

Who is the thug??

Gardai don't have a great track record either - Shell to sea protest just one example and there is footage all over youtube about that.

Some people on here need to see who the real enemy is