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Three convicted murderers working in Belfast shopping center.

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    #212
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    Laois6556 wrote: »
    So you admit you were lying then. Where's the apology?

    I wasn't though, you were repeatedly asked what you wanted to see happen with them now and you never once said you wanted them to have a chance to work. You did however repeatedly state that they could not have been reformed (strongly implying having them in any job is a bad idea) and explicitly stated you did not want them on the dole or committing crimes.

    Thus is what happens when you avoid answering straightforward questions, people connect the dots. So stop trying to paint yourself as a victim.


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    #213
    Laois6556
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 624 ✭✭✭Laois6556


    Mal-Adjusted wrote: »
    It's a bit of a tricky subject. In theory, once you're free, you're free. That means free to go and work as you please. I know for registered pedophiles there's something about them not going within a certain distance of schools and such. That's an option but i can't see how it would be implemented in a case like murderers or violent criminals getting out. It's not as if the key cutters was across the road from the victims family's house and it's not practical to ban them from the largest city in the north on the off-chance that they might run into someone.

    The off chance? Belfast isn't that big. First of all they get a very light punishment, the least that should happen when they're out is that they should be banned from the place where they murdered their victims, no matter how big or small that place is. If they're reformed characters they would understand this.


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    #214
    Laois6556
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 624 ✭✭✭Laois6556


    Billy86 wrote: »
    I wasn't though, you were repeatedly asked what you wanted to see happen with them now and you never once said you wanted them to have a chance to work. You did however repeatedly state that they could not have been reformed (strongly implying having them in any job is a bad idea) and explicitly stated you did not want them on the dole or committing crimes.

    Thus is what happens when you avoid answering straightforward questions, people connect the dots. So stop trying to paint yourself as a victim.

    By connect the dots you mean making up stuff. Lying in other words.


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    #215
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    Laois6556 wrote: »
    By connect the dots you mean making up stuff. Lying in other words.

    So you do agree they should be able to work and earn a living?


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    #216
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 18,234 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    Laois6556 wrote: »
    The off chance? Belfast isn't that big. First of all they get a very light punishment, the least that should happen when they're out is that they should be banned from the place where they murdered their victims, no matter how big or small that place is. If they're reformed characters they would understand this.

    Why won't you answer his very simple question?


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    #217
    Laois6556
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 624 ✭✭✭Laois6556


    Billy86 wrote: »
    So you do agree they should be able to work and earn a living?

    Still no apology.


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    #218
    Laois6556
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 624 ✭✭✭Laois6556


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    Why won't you answer his very simple question?

    He didn't ask me a question.


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    #219
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    Laois6556 wrote: »
    Still no apology.

    Still no answer. How many times do you need to be asked the same extremely basic question?


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    #220
    Mr. CooL ICE
    Registered Users Posts: 17,518 ✭✭✭✭Mr. CooL ICE


    Laois6556 wrote: »
    Well what did you mean by there's more than one key cutters in Belfast then?

    You tried insinuating that I have sympathy for the men. I don't. As employees (or former employees, whatever), they cannot choose what customers come into the shop. Customers can choose to use this shop, or bring their business elsewhere, as is their right.


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    #221
    Laois6556
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 624 ✭✭✭Laois6556


    Billy86 wrote: »
    Still no answer. How many times do you need to be asked the same extremely basic question?

    I've answered every question I've been asked except from a self confessed liar.


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    #222
    Laois6556
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 624 ✭✭✭Laois6556


    Nicolas Cage wrote: »
    You tried insinuating that I have sympathy for the men. I don't. As employees (or former employees, whatever), they cannot choose what customers come into the shop. Customers can choose to use this shop, or bring their business elsewhere, as is their right.

    That means the victims families can either choose to be served by their relatives killer or go somewhere else. How can you think that's right?


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    #223
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 18,234 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    Laois6556 wrote: »
    He didn't ask me a question.

    Of course he did, as you know full well.
    Billy86 wrote: »
    You were repeatedly asked what you would like to see now that they are out. You were told repeatedly that "I want them still in prison" was an irrelevant position to take and to start your own thread on it if you wanted to discuss prison sentences. Your only answers were "I hope they have unhappy lives" about if they should have jobs of not and "neither" when asked if the above example meant you wanted them on the dole or unable to make any money at all.

    So... once again... do you want them a) able to get jobs, b) unable to and thus stuck on the dole for their lives, or c) to not be allowed to work or claim the dole?
    Billy86 wrote: »
    You had said you would prefer neither. And now you refuse to answer. So since they are free now and prison sentencws/death penalty arguments are completely irrelevant to this thread, which would you prefer for them - A, B or C? Jobs, dole, or neither?
    Billy86 wrote: »
    So let's revert back to title question then. They are now out of jail, so any opinion you have on their sentences are irrelevant. Would you:

    A) Prefer to see them be allowed get jobs to earn their own living legally for basic necessities like food and shelter.
    B) Prefer that they were not allowed jobs, but were instead placed on welfare for the rest of their lives to have a legal means for basic necessities like food and shelter.
    C) Prefer they were not allow to get jobs or claim welfare at all, and be a major risk of resorting to crimes such as fraud, theft and burglary for basic necessities such as food and shelter due to not being able to do so legally.

    Now I think you should answer the question because everybody else can see how badly you are trying to avoid doing so, you are looking quite foolish in my opinion.


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    #224
    Mr. CooL ICE
    Registered Users Posts: 17,518 ✭✭✭✭Mr. CooL ICE


    Laois6556 wrote: »
    That means the victims families can either choose to be served by their relatives killer or go somewhere else. How can you think that's right?

    I don't see where the confusion is :confused:


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    #225
    Laois6556
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 624 ✭✭✭Laois6556


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    Of course he did, as you know full well.






    Now I think you should answer the question because everybody else can see how badly you are trying to avoid doing so, you are looking quite foolish in my opinion.

    You quoted my reply to mal-adjusted. He didn't ask me a question.


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    #226
    Laois6556
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 624 ✭✭✭Laois6556


    Nicolas Cage wrote: »
    I don't see where the confusion is :confused:

    No confusion. You see that the murderers rights should be put ahead of the victims families. I don't.


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    #227
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 18,234 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    Laois6556 wrote: »
    You quoted my reply to mal-adjusted. He didn't ask me a question.

    Why won't you answer the simple question put to you?


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    #228
    Mr. CooL ICE
    Registered Users Posts: 17,518 ✭✭✭✭Mr. CooL ICE


    Laois6556 wrote: »
    No confusion. You see that the murderers rights should be put ahead of the victims families. I don't.

    They aren't. It's the other way around.

    Either you are completely misreading my posts, or you are just full of faux outrage.


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    #229
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    Laois6556 wrote: »
    I've answered every question I've been asked except from a self confessed liar.
    You have done nothing but dodge the question... Now that they are out of prison would you prefer to see them working, on the dole, or not allowed either?


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    #230
    Laois6556
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 624 ✭✭✭Laois6556


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    Why won't you answer the simple question put to you?

    If you read my replies to mal=adjusted and others then my position is very clear, I don't answer to liars.


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    #231
    Laois6556
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 624 ✭✭✭Laois6556


    Nicolas Cage wrote: »
    They aren't. It's the other way around.

    Either you are completely misreading my posts, or you are just full of faux outrage.

    How is it the other way around?


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    #232
    Laois6556
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 624 ✭✭✭Laois6556


    Billy86 wrote: »
    You have done nothing but dodge the question... Now that they are out of prison would you prefer to see them working, on the dole, or not allowed either?

    I don't answer to liars.


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    #233
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    Ok, so Laois6556 DOES want these people in work. I must have been mistaken earlier.


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    #234
    Laois6556
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 624 ✭✭✭Laois6556


    Billy86 wrote: »
    I must have been lying earlier.

    That's true.


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    #235
    Qualitymark
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,824 ✭✭✭Qualitymark


    Used to be a ginormous guy doing security in a shopping centre in Dublin; he had a soft Deep South accent and a courteous, gentle manner. What a shock to read that he was on the run from the FBI or American police or something…


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    #236
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 18,234 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    Laois6556 wrote: »
    If you read my replies to mal=adjusted and others then my position is very clear, I don't answer to liars.

    Maybe you think everybody else is stupid, but we know full well that your stance on "liars" is a fabrication to avoid having to answer a very simple question.

    So I'll ask the question. Accepting the simple fact that the justice system released these men from prison, would you now prefer to see them working, on the dole, or not allowed either?


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    #237
    Ralf and Florian
    Site Banned Posts: 1,489 ✭✭✭Ralf and Florian


    I remember years back there was an English guy working in an arts center in Cork who had been convicted of three seperate killings and was on the run from the authorities over the most recent one.


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    #238
    osarusan
    Registered Users Posts: 16,577 ✭✭✭✭osarusan


    Billy86 wrote: »
    You have done nothing but dodge the question... Now that they are out of prison would you prefer to see them working, on the dole, or not allowed either?

    He's already answered it really.
    osarusan wrote: »
    The question is, now that they are out, what do you want to happen next?

    do you want them to try and get some kind of job and leave some kind of normal life? Or are you happy for newspapers to harass them, 'out' them, and make it much less likely that they can get any kind of employment?
    Laois6556 wrote: »
    Neither of those 2 options are great but the second one is preferable to the first.

    He'd rather they were hounded out of jobs than be allowed to have a job.


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    #239
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    osarusan wrote: »
    He's already answered it really.

    He's rather they were hounded out of jobs than be allowed to have a job.
    Cheers, had a feeling I had come across something to that effect but wasn't bothered going the whole way through the thread AGAIN. So what was that about liars? ;)


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    #240
    Laois6556
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 624 ✭✭✭Laois6556


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    Maybe you think everybody else is stupid, but we know full well that your stance on "liars" is a fabrication to avoid having to answer a very simple question.

    So I'll ask the question. Accepting the simple fact that the justice system released these men from prison, would you now prefer to see them working, on the dole, or not allowed either?

    Why would I avoid such a simple question? I've actually already stated my view, within the last page infact!


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    #241
    Billy86
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,495 ✭✭✭✭Billy86


    Laois6556 wrote: »
    Why would I avoid such a simple question? I've actually already stated my view, within the last page infact!

    Yes, that you would like them hounded out of any potential jobs, and would prefer "neither" seeing them on the dole or stuck without employment or welfare.

    Get yourself and your victim complex out of here, you liar.


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