Ireland's "Peaceful Protestors" - Pest Control?

Fukuyama

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=usWq8uwsI0E

Here, a "scab" is bravely prevented from entering the evil corporation headquarters. This group of brave socialist rebels must be so proud. Nothing to do with IW, but posted by the same core group of "activists". I feel pretty bad for the woman here who is obviously intimidated and upset, and ultimately is prevented from going to work.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pXcJUR-21s

Here, gardaí are called thugs, cúnts, etc.. despite treating protesters with kid gloves. I didn't spot a single baton or anything that'd leave a bruise. One guard pushes a woman which is apparently some sort of holy sin.


My area and places all over the country are awash with this crap. And the core group is one merry band of protesters traveling around Dublin to whip up trouble. Whether it's Irish Water or some other issue, the cannot just protest like ordinary citizens do. Instead they have to block roads and intimidate people.

The same characters appear in multiple videos in several different housing estates.

Should the guards not just wade in with batons, make a load of arrests (50+) and be done for the day? Instead of just babysitting a bunch of idiots on a Tuesday morning only for work to proceed at a snail's pace?

The time to protest has come and gone. Nobody wants to pay water charges just the way nobody wants to pay their ESB bill. But it's happening and needs to happen. This sort of crap is costing us tens of thousands in wasted garda time, contractor resources etc...

Not to mention the fact that these peaceful protesters think they're above the law and use intimidation of workers as their main tactic.

Here, protesters march alongside the Public Order Unit (who also used extra padded kid gloves). Some adopted a goosestep march and began chanting "Seig Heil" (@ 2:28). They seem to be a high caliber bunch...

I really think the guards need to change tactics here. I understand that they don't want to make martyrs of the "protesters" and add fuel to the fire, but as it stands they're just babysitting a traveling circus.

:rolleyes:

BoJack Horseman

The Left in Ireland.
All the expenditure...none of the taxes.

Kermit.de.frog

Are they not violating a court order by harassing and intimidating that woman and preventing her from going in?

end of the road

Dean0088 wrote: »

Should the guards not just wade in with batons, make a load of arrests (50+) and be done for the day? Instead of just babysitting a bunch of idiots on a Tuesday morning only for work to proceed at a snail's pace?

no . would lead to a violent blood bath and it would be the guards coming out worse reputation wise. the current tactic is fine.

Dean0088 wrote: »

The time to protest has come and gone.

it hasn't. and it never will.

Dean0088 wrote: »

Nobody wants to pay water charges just the way nobody wants to pay their ESB bill.

ESB and water are not comparible. water is payed for via income tax where as ESB isn't and never has been.

Dean0088 wrote: »

it's happening and needs to happen.

it doesn't need to happen. why does it need to happen. to keep a few on their gravey train and a DOB company in business?

Dean0088 wrote: »

This sort of crap is costing us tens of thousands in wasted garda time, contractor resources etc...

i don't care. as the contractors are private companies i've no sympathy. any time and money lost by them is collateral damage for the greater good of making the implementation of water metres as difficult as possible.

Dean0088 wrote: »

Not to mention the fact that these peaceful protesters think they're above the law

they are. get over it

Dean0088 wrote: »

I really think the guards need to change tactics here.

they really don't

Dean0088 wrote: »

I understand that they don't want to make martyrs of the "protesters" and add fuel to the fire, but as it stands they're just babysitting a traveling circus.

yup. right way to do it. that way their reputation stays intact.

wp_rathead

I would view myself as a left-wing leaning individual.. but then I see that these are the type of muppets who you would be associated with. Is all rather disheartening..

Karl Stein

Dean0088 wrote: »

Nobody wants to pay water charges ... But it's happening and needs to happen.

It needs to happen? Irish water is ideologically driven.

They could have taken the money it took to set up Irish Water and used it to modernise the water supply infrastructure. Modernising the water supply infrastructure would have generated thousands of jobs for unemployed construction workers who'd be spending their wages in local restaurants, shops and bars which would have raised aggregate demand across the country.

Little CuChulainn

It will be interesting to see the protests going to places like Finglas and Ronanstown where the Gardaí are use to dealing with actual violence and are a lot less tolerant of being abused and pushed around. The rate of arrests might go up a little.

Kermit.de.frog

It must be intimidating for elderly residents and others seeing this rent a mob of the usual protesters suspects show up on their estates. Most if not all i'm betting probably don't even live on that estate.

Who appointed them guardians of the people?

Gatling

Watch how so called peaceful protesters attack a car .
Then claim hit and run

http://youtu.be/j3mMzMI8t8A

Celly Smunt

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Who appointed them guardians of the people?

That'd be Joe Higgins,the founder of gob****ery.

Fukuyama

Karl Stein wrote: »

It needs to happen? Irish water is ideologically driven.

They could have taken the money it took to set up Irish Water and used it to modernise the water supply infrastructure. Modernising the water supply infrastructure would have generated thousands of jobs for unemployed construction workers who'd be spending their wages in local restaurants, shops and bars which would have raised aggregate demand across the country.

I'm open to all sides on this debate and remain as such. However, I've yet to hear an argument as to how Ireland could do what you're saying. Put numbers down on a page and spell it out. Otherwise it's just wishful thinking.

Nobody wins votes installing water meters. Nobody is looking forward to their first water bill arriving. But I think the majority of people see it as a "has to be done" type affair. It's all well and good to say "spend the money elsewhere" but it doesn't add up.

I'd lean slightly center-right on my politics so I don't support the protesters here. However, their antics alienate everyone, even those who would agree with them. When I see the behavior, language and opinions being spouted in videos like these I'd disassociate myself even if I supported them.

I think the gardaí are babysitting loud children who have little support from the majority of the community. These aren't protests - they're disturbances in housing estates. And at this rate it'll carry on for months, costing hundreds of thousands of euros, for no reason.

Short of a civil war, the water meters are going in.

Drakares

I love the way these protest videos start just as a Guard is starting to get rough with someone.. Of course they weren't doing a thing before this point and were just attacked.. Poor things!

Kippure

Reading through all this threads on Irish water and related issues.

One thing that stands out, all the do Gooders saying pay up, do as your told, back in your box etc.

And it comes from Labour FF FG SF, etc none of which represent the Irish people.

Its great to see the Irish people stand up from themselves.

Proving one thing.

The elite are obsolete.

Kermit.de.frog

Kippure wrote: »

Reading through all this threads on Irish water and related issues.

One thing that stands out, all the do Gooders saying pay up, do as your told, back in your box etc.

And it comes from Labour FF FG SF, etc none of which represent the Irish people.

Its great to see the Irish people stand up from themselves.

Proving one thing.

The elite are obsolete.

I thought you didn't live in Ireland anymore?

Easy to say that from abroad when you don't have to live with it nor take the consequences.

Little CuChulainn

Kippure wrote: »

And it comes from Labour FF FG SF, etc none of which represent the Irish people.

So what was all that voting for? I thought the general election was to pick the people who represented us.

Fukuyama

Gatling wrote: »

Watch how so called peaceful protesters attack a car .
Then claim hit and run

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j3mMzMI8t8A

Here it is: Once the garda car leaves, a group of 6-8 people (from a group of 30+) close in on the car. A couple of really brave lads decide to kick the car too and one top heavy idiot falls over.

These protesters are the kind of people that ruin many areas of Dublin with anti social behavior and generally acting like idiots. And yet they're actually being cast as heros here. :eek: :mad:

Celly Smunt

Kippure wrote: »

And it comes from Labour FF FG SF, etc none of which represent the Irish people.

Its great to see the Irish people stand up from themselves.

Yep, sure they're just democratically elected representatives after all. I heard Enda Kenny isnt even Irish.

Karl Stein

Dean0088 wrote: »

I'm open to all sides on this debate and remain as such. However, I've yet to hear an argument as to how Ireland could do what you're saying. Put numbers down on a page and spell it out. Otherwise it's just wishful thinking.

I'm not an economist and I haven't carried out a survey on what the costs would be. Let's take what we already know and see if a different, potentially better, approach could have been taken seeing as you've ignored it once.

There's already going to be €1Bn spent on setting up Irish water as what essentially amounts to a private bureaucracy. That's €1Bn that could have been spent modernising the water infrastructure generating jobs for unemployed people and boosting the economy nationwide.

Short of a civil war, the water meters are going in.

Ah, now we see the violence inherent in the system! Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony.

Celly Smunt

Dean0088 wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j3mMzMI8t8A

Here it is: Once the garda car leaves, a group of 6-8 people (from a group of 30+) close in on the car. A couple of really brave lads decide to kick the car too and one top heavy idiot falls over.

These protesters are the kind of people that ruin many areas of Dublin with anti social behavior and generally acting like idiots. And yet they're actually being cast as heros here. :eek: :mad:

I love how they say "woman" for emotive reasons and then you see a female who would outweigh and punch the head off the manliest of men.

Kippure

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

I thought you didn't live in Ireland anymore?

Easy to say that from abroad when you don't have to live with it nor take the consequences.

You bet.

You have a choice. I have a choice.

I choose to Split.

Looking in from aboard. Irelands a sad place. Its just run into the ground.

If I could change it, I would, for everyone. It would be the right thing to do.

Make every ones life better.

Fukuyama

Kippure wrote: »

Its great to see the Irish people stand up from themselves.

Proving one thing.

The elite are obsolete.

I've yet to see the Irish people stand up against Irish Water - mostly because there's a tacit acceptance that as a modern country it's pretty much a requirement.

What I see if a core group of hard left militants who, going by their YouTube history, are no stranger to whipping up crowds into mobs. Their numbers are bolstered by young males in tracksuits with nothing better to do and small numbers of local residents, all of whom seem to think they're above the law. On top of this we have fringe republican movements and "freeman" law 'experts' who outright reject the State.

The majority of people don't want to tell these idiots to fcuk off because these groups use intimidation, numbers and illegal protests to shout down any kind of opposition to their "protests". However, they enjoy little active support from the community and depend on the local idiot brigade who seem used to dealing with gardaí.

Stench Blossoms

I don't get the point of these protests at all. The people installing the meters are just doing their jobs to put a house over their heads and food on the table. If they are going to protest why not protest outside their local TDs office or the Dail?

And pushing back the barriers and shoving the Gardai? Sure that's grand as long as you're shouting 'PEACEFUL PROTEST!"

Kippure

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

So what was all that voting for? I thought the general election was to pick the people who represented us.

Who knows? Votings a great idea. Has it worked in Ireland over the past 100 years? Same people in power etc.

The political system in Ireland is rotten to the core.

Every one knows it.

Fukuyama

Kippure wrote: »

You bet.

You have a choice. I have a choice.

I choose to Split.

Looking in from aboard. Irelands a sad place. Its just run into the ground.

If I could change it, I would, for everyone. It would be the right thing to do.

Make every ones life better.

I've never been to country with police as light handed as Gardaí (with the exception of MAYBE parts of the UK). German police deploy teargas and pepper spray as soon as a crowed tries to push beyond their lines. Head further east and rubber bullets are par for the course. And yet the guards are painted (and literally called) Nazis....

Since you're abroad I'm sure you could confirm this.

Kippure

Celly Smunt wrote: »

Yep, sure they're just democratically elected representatives after all. I heard Enda Kenny isnt even Irish.

Since when in Ireland did politicians represent its people, unless there was something in it for them.

Enda Kennys Irish? When did that happen......

Fukuyama

Celly Smunt wrote: »

I love how they say "woman" for emotive reasons and then you see a female who would outweigh and punch the head off the manliest of men.

This is a common theme on that YouTube channel. At several points

• the camera man insults gardaí for arresting females
• females are given some sort of "untouchable" status
• Females assault gardaí and try to prevent arrests

Boggles the mind.

Kippure

Dean0088 wrote: »

I've never been to country with police as light handed as Gardaí (with the exception of MAYBE parts of the UK). German police deploy teargas and pepper spray as soon as a crowed tries to push beyond their lines. Head further east and rubber bullets are par for the course. And yet the guards are painted (and literally called) Nazis....

Since you're abroad I'm sure you could confirm this.

You must live in a nice neighbour hood in Ireland.

Lets see how light handed the gardai are.

Mayday.
Corrib.
Student protests in Dublin.
Palestine Protests
Irish water.

BoJack Horseman

Karl Stein wrote: »

I'm not an economist and I haven't carried out a survey on what the costs would be. Let's take what we already know and see if a different, potentially better, approach could have been taken seeing as you've ignored it once.

There's already going to be €1Bn spent on setting up Irish water as what essentially amounts to a private bureaucracy. That's €1Bn that could have been spent modernising the water infrastructure generating jobs for unemployed people and boosting the economy nationwide.

In 2013 the government spent €240m on water infrastructure.
This did not create many jobs.

The costs of creating IW (meter costs aside) will cost north of €180m

So, in reality, the IW startup money would go practically nowhere in arresting any water infrastructure deficit.

Gatling

They should go after the so called professionals trouble makers dole payments

Fukuyama

Karl Stein wrote: »

I'm not an economist and I haven't carried out a survey on what the costs would be. Let's take what we already know and see if a different, potentially better, approach could have been taken seeing as you've ignored it once.

So, basically you don't like the solution every other modern country in the northern hemisphere and beyond has taken, think Ireland is a special country that can come up with it's own innovatie way of making the water infrastructure pay for itself?

Because that's all I've heard from the left so far.

If there was a way to avoid water charges, FG would take it and coast to victory in the next general election. But there's not. It was recommended by the Troika, EU and IMF. It was a laughable situation for Ireland to be in. The only mistake made was that it wasn't implemented when the boom was still going strong.

There's already going to be €1Bn spent on setting up Irish water as what essentially amounts to a private bureaucracy. That's €1Bn that could have been spent modernising the water infrastructure generating jobs for unemployed people and boosting the economy nationwide.

Surely this is exactly what's happening now with installing meters. Upgrades will come in the next few years. In fact, they simply HAVE to.

Ah, now we see the violence inherent in the system! Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony.

I mentioned "civil war" because many of these left groups repeatedly call for "revolution" - despite the fact that every general election shows majority support for center, responsible policies. I don't think this crowd could organise a piss up in a brewery.

My real fear is that when you gather a load of local idiots in one area, and the gardaí treat them with kid gloves, they can grow braver and braver. One incident could spark a situation like London 2011 riots.

Kippure

Dean0088 wrote: »

I've yet to see the Irish people stand up against Irish Water - mostly because there's a tacit acceptance that as a modern country it's pretty much a requirement.

What I see if a core group of hard left militants who, going by their YouTube history, are no stranger to whipping up crowds into mobs. Their numbers are bolstered by young males in tracksuits with nothing better to do and small numbers of local residents, all of whom seem to think they're above the law. On top of this we have fringe republican movements and "freeman" law 'experts' who outright reject the State.

The majority of people don't want to tell these idiots to fcuk off because these groups use intimidation, numbers and illegal protests to shout down any kind of opposition to their "protests". However, they enjoy little active support from the community and depend on the local idiot brigade who seem used to dealing with gardaí.

You know what dean, your right.
I think we the Irish will never stand up for ourselves.
We just keep been beaten down and accepting it.
And the governments of the day know that.
I would like to think some day we might stand up for ourselves against what only be called nowadays as Government Oppression.
As a poster said above, maybe a civil war is needed...

All these protests are pointless when you really think about it.
Nothing but shouting and pushing.