Marmotte 2015

Jim Stynes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=160qwlWGyWU

I really hope this climb is in it! looks class

Leroy42

mp2012 wrote: »

Col de la Croix de Fer, as usual made look easy by Mike Cotty. Long climb at 30k though. Looking forward to finally finding out how much more we will have to climb!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqK9s1epBqw

Thats the Col du Glandon really in terms of Marmotte. It takes the left turn at the cafe and CdF takes the right and goes for antoher 2.5K or so.

The climb as per the video (up to the turn) is always on the route. It appears, from rumours, that we will be climbing back up the Croix de Fer from Saint Jean de Maurienne.

In terms of the Glandon, it is a very tough climb alright. It is somewhat overlooked when people talk about the Marmotte as is comes 1st and people are generally in good spirits and the recall how tough Galibier and Alpe is but is a challenge in its own right.

Kyran7

Hi Lads,
Any update on the new route?

Tree Scape

Jim Stynes wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=160qwlWGyWU

I really hope this climb is in it! looks class

I've seen a spate on bike radar (i think) as to whether it is on etape route or not,
doesn't look like it
http://www.cyclinglocations.com/col-du-chaussy-from-hermillon-climb-alps/

don't think its on mrmotte either

Red Belly

Route Marmotte 2015 has been confirmed:

The 2015 round tour will feature similar numbers than the historical route: 170 km and 5100 m height gain.
The itinerary will be located in the Oisans and Maurienne areas, with mythical roads and cols:
– Bourg d’Oisans (719 m),
– col du Glandon (1 924 m),
– Montvernier hairpins (777 m),
– col du Mollard (1 630 m),
– col de la Croix de Fer (2 058 m),
– Bourg d’Oisans (719 m),
– Alpe d’Huez (1 880 m).

Jim Stynes

Red Belly wrote: »

Route Marmotte 2015 has been confirmed:

The 2015 round tour will feature similar numbers than the historical route: 170 km and 5100 m height gain.
The itinerary will be located in the Oisans and Maurienne areas, with mythical roads and cols:
– Bourg d’Oisans (719 m),
– col du Glandon (1 924 m),
– Montvernier hairpins (777 m),
– col du Mollard (1 630 m),
– col de la Croix de Fer (2 058 m),
– Bourg d’Oisans (719 m),
– Alpe d’Huez (1 880 m).

Excited and scared! Anyone know anything about these roads or could they give us a run down of what to expect. If I am fit to do the galibier the next day then I am nearly glad the route is changed. I would never have done those other climbs otherwise.

barryf42

Folks

I can't post the link or attach the photo download , but if you go to Facebook - there is a page la marmotte and about 3 hours ago a chap published a map of 'new official route' for this year, that was from cycling tours.dk

I can mail the download if someone wants to put it up - appears to be valid - its 170km with 5100m of climbing

thanks
Barry

barryf42

i think this is it now attached11401386_832515353522745_3744856915002385132_n.jpg

mp2012

This is my mapping of it, seems to be more or less the route based on the profile above, maybe some changes in towns etc.

http://ridewithgps.com/routes/8462762

garethpmorgan

Hi there,

New to the board but been following waiting for updates.

Just back from France where I was out for Marmotte recce purposes which was a little difficult once it was clear the normal route wouldn't be followed and a new one hadn't been announced but I'd seen rumours that Lacets would be included and it was obvious Croix de Fer would be. I also had a hunch on Mollard so I did that too.

So, the new stuff:

Obviously there's as much distance and climbing (roughly) as the old route but if you like lots of switchbacks it's probably "easier".

Lacets de Montvernier is a fun little climb. Only 300m with 28 (I think) switchbacks stacked on top of each other. I really enjoyed it; all fairly steady gradient.

Mollard has about 40 switchbacks in woodland (so hopefully cooler) all pretty steady gradient. It then comes out of the woodland into Alpine meadows and has a gentle gradient for a while before a steepish final pull up. Stunning scenery.

6km down about 400m before rejoining the usual eastern route up Croix de Fer which is gentle up to the final ski resort then there's a sharp gradient through Saint-Sorlin and it remains pretty steep most of the way up. There are a couple of switchbacks to ease the gradient and views are great. Obviously not as high as Galibier so that also probably makes it easier as the penultimate climb.

The way back down is as you came up first thing once you get back down to the Glandon junction. Don't forget the drop down the steep switchbacks on the way up Glandon which becomes a steep little leg burner on the way back.

Finally, the valley back to Alpe suffers from headwinds I think.

Should be good. Not as epic perhaps but some stunning roads and views.

Leroy42

According to my Strava route, it has more climbing compared to the normal Marmotte route, 5800 against 4800.

It would appear first glance that it is harder as they have essentially taken out the 'flat' 40km run from base of Glandon to Telegraph and replaced it with lacets. However, I have never ridden the Molard or the Croix but I can't believe they can be as tough as the Galibier.

Still not sure what they propose to do with the turn back to Bourg after the Glandon descent at Rochetaille. This requires that you cross a main road, I would guess they will have to have the road closed are pretty much closed as cyclists will be hitting this in a pretty constant stream of groups. I'm sure they will have it sorted.

It will be different anyway. Without the Galibier I agree that it isn't as epic but it seems a very challenging course regardless and once the weather is good it should be a memorable ride.

garethpmorgan

My Strava route (Strava's routing tool isn't great I have to say) gives me 5,200m and 172km and on Ridewithgps I get 5,300m and 171km.

I think the big plus of the revised route is the removal of the flat section to the base of Telegraphe. The last 12km of Croix de Fer is tough but not like Galibier. It's lower for a start and it doesn't have that sense of isolation half way up a mountain and the ramps aren't as steep.

Lacets and Mollard are great climbs.

Good point on the left hand turn at Rochetaillee. It may just be heavily stewarded. Bear in mind that the traffic is a bit lighter than normal due to the road closure beyond Bourg. there were certainly big gaps in traffic when I was there on Tuesday.

It will be an excellent La Marmotte I'm sure.

Leroy42

Right, Sportcommunication have put the new route on their website, same as was leaked Wednesday. I would have thought it was slower than the original Marmotte route but they seem to have kept the same timings.

Descent off Glandon is still neutralised. Slightly shorter and slightly more climbing but in the end it all comes down to the Alpe.

Jim Stynes

Been looking at the new route a little closer. More climbing, less flat bits and only slightly shorter! Looks like it's going to be harder than the normal one. Going through the panic of will I won't I finish. Did Wicklow in 7.36 moving time and 8.20 elapsed time. Felt ok at the end apart from the last 5 mile where I felt a bit of cramp but other than that it was an easier day than expected. It wasn't my hardest day on the bike or anything and the climbs were easier than I expected. How does this compare to the likes of La Marmotte?

fat bloke

Jim Stynes wrote: »

How does this compare to the likes of La Marmotte?

From ridewithgps it appears you climbed 3000 metres over 200k.

The Marmotte is over 5000 metres over 170k.


Yes. It's going to be harder.

Jim Stynes

Yeah I would say that it pretty obvious! But this new route looks much harder than the normal one. Some saying nearly 5500m or more.

Also the Lacets De Montvernier is in todays Dauphine stage

fat bloke

Jim Stynes wrote: »

Also the Lacets De Montvernier is in todays Dauphine stage

Nice one, must watch that.

Leroy42

fat bloke wrote: »

Nice one, must watch that.

Lacets de montvernier

Farloo

Hi all, I'm going to be in the area when this Sportive is on. I know its sold out ages ago but does anyone know where you might get a ticket, maybe from a tour operator even if it costs a bit more?!

pumatrev

Lads this is definitely going to be the toughest Marmotte yet. All climbing no flat bits at the start. Serious stuff ahead

Leroy42

@Jim, jebus 7.36 for W200 is really flying. You certainly have the endurance and speed for Marmotte. I wouldn't be worried about whether you can complete it or not, it really is just a matter of what time you do it in. Due to the route change this year that is even more tricky than usual. In terms of the relative difficulty or the two events, they really can't be compared. W200 is hard, no doubt, but is doable by most given the right pacing. THe marmotte could break you if you haven't got the right training done (you have).

The main difference, be it the W200 or MB200 or whatever, is that Marmotte ends on Alpe D'Huez. So the last 14k is on an 8% climb. We have no climb that replicates that and certainly no sportive that comes close to having a finish like that. The last 20/30k of most sportives are usually flat/rolling and such gives you an 'easier' run to the finish. So pace yourself. You know from the W200 and other rides what you can sustain and when you are pushing into the red and just make sure you stay out of the red zone. Whilst no matter what you will feel tired and struggle on the Alpe, if you push too hard prior to Alpe it has the capacity to break you. I have seen many people simply crack on that climb.

My view is that this course is indeed tougher than the normal route. They have kept the cut-off times the sames (for Gold etc) but this looks like it will take longer.

The 22k 'flat' section which took you from Glandon descent to Telegraph was a case of sitting in a big group and saving your energy but moving at a good clip. There is now only about 5k until the Lacets.

I have never ridden that climb but it looks steep (3.4k @ 8.2%) and twisty and from what I gather the descent is twisty as well.

According to Strava the ascent for normal Marmotte is 4850m whilst this alternative is coming in at 5800+. In any body's book that has got to be harder. I know SC are saying they are roughly the same and that this altitude gain figures differ across the different map apps but that still looks like quite a difference.

But sure if it was easy everyone would be doing it and by completing it will be be even bigger heros than normal.

Red Belly

@Leroy 42. As someone with experience and a useful perspective on the challenge ahead, could I trouble you for last minute training advice? Do you think what I'm planning for the next fortnight is on track?

I've done the MB200 and W200 on consecutive week-ends.

10:30ish moving time for MB200 and 8:30ish moving time for W200.

My focus now is on maintaining endurance. Too late to worry about speed. I reckon I currently have the endurance to get to the bottom of the Alpe within the cut-off - the great unknown is the psychological challenge of the Alpe at that stage of the day and how the thought of it may effect me earlier on - I need to be conservative at the start. A bigger concern I have now is over-training and bringing on an injury, so I plan to take almost all of my rides from now on at a conservative pace.

I was slower than most around me towards the end of MB200/W200 but felt I could have kept going at the end of both rides. I did a 105km ride and a 60km ride this week-end and plan a 100k flattish sportive next Saturday and the Big Dragon (140k-incl Mt. Leinster near the end) next Sunday, i.e. on consecutive days. My thinking here is to push it on Saturday, and be conservative for the first 100k of the Big Dragon on Sunday. This should see me starting the climb of Mt. Leinster already knackered and thus simulating the Alpe (I know nothing here can simulate that but at least I'll be facing a tough climb when I'm already shattered).

Then, the week-end before the Marmotte I plan an "easy" 100km ride and I'm on the ferry on Monday.

In the midweeks between now and then I plan to get out for shortish rides (20-50k) whenever I can.

What ya think?

Rb

07Lapierre

Red Belly wrote: »

@Leroy 42. As someone with experience and a useful perspective on the challenge ahead, could I trouble you for last minute training advice? Do you think what I'm planning for the next fortnight is on track?

I've done the MB200 and W200 on consecutive week-ends.

10:30ish moving time for MB200 and 8:30ish moving time for W200.

My focus now is on maintaining endurance. Too late to worry about speed. I reckon I currently have the endurance to get to the bottom of the Alpe within the cut-off - the great unknown is the psychological challenge of the Alpe at that stage of the day and how the thought of it may effect me earlier on - I need to be conservative at the start. A bigger concern I have now is over-training and bringing on an injury, so I plan to take almost all of my rides from now on at a conservative pace.

I was slower than most around me towards the end of MB200/W200 but felt I could have kept going at the end of both rides. I did a 105km ride and a 60km ride this week-end and plan a 100k flattish sportive next Saturday and the Big Dragon (140k-incl Mt. Leinster near the end) next Sunday, i.e. on consecutive days. My thinking here is to push it on Saturday, and be conservative for the first 100k of the Big Dragon on Sunday. This should see me starting the climb of Mt. Leinster already knackered and thus simulating the Alpe (I know nothing here can simulate that but at least I'll be facing a tough climb when I'm already shattered).

Then, the week-end before the Marmotte I plan an "easy" 100km ride and I'm on the ferry on Monday.

In the midweeks between now and then I plan to get out for shortish rides (20-50k) whenever I can.

What ya think?

Rb

Jesus! I'm exhausted just reading your training plan! compared to the training I did for the marmotte I'll be disappointed if you don't come home with a Gold Medal!

Red Belly

07Lapierre wrote: »

Jesus! I'm exhausted just reading your training plan! compared to the training I did for the marmotte I'll be disappointed if you don't come home with a Gold Medal!

Sincerest thanks for that! As you might be able to read between the lines, I'm currently absolutely racked with self-doubt so your comment is most welcome. However, I won't even dream of targeting a medal, my only goals are a) hit the bottom of the Alpe within the cut-off, b) get to the top before sunset!

Rb

07Lapierre

Red Belly wrote: »

Sincerest thanks for that! As you might be able to read between the lines, I'm currently absolutely racked with self-doubt so your comment is most welcome. However, I won't even dream of targeting a medal, my only goals are a) hit the bottom of the Alpe within the cut-off, b) get to the top before sunset!

Rb

You've nothing to worry about. unless you have a mechanical or an accident, you WILL get to the Alpe with plenty of time to spare. My advise is pace yourself on all the climbs and save yourself for the Alp. Its the climb up the Alp where you will loose the most time. Eat and drink very often, more often then you do at present, especially if its a hot day.

Also you have to buy the medals at the finish (or exchange your timing chip for one)..so buy a gold one!

decrrrrrr

Different people, different approaches Red Belly but I certainly won't be trying to pack that much in - with less that 3 weeks to go, you're not really going to gain much more in terms of strength/fitness. Keeping the legs ticking over is what I'll be thinking about.

It sounds like you have the endurance piece covered - you got around MB and WW and you're putting back to back distances together. Pacing, eating and drinking will then get you through on the day.

Some additional thoughts for all on the thread (I'm sure a lot of it has been said already):

- What I find about the longs climbs is that you need to break them into sections. For me, I break them into 1km sections. At the end of each section, I stand up and stretch, have a drink/something to eat, and then start again.

- try and get the head up, look around and take it all in. Crack a smile if you can. It all helps

- think about your 'wet weather' story and have the necessary clothing with you.

07Lapierre

The last Big event I did before the Marmotte was always the WW200. I then did our club tour one week beforehand. In between these two, I did my usual daily commute and one 100K spin around Wicklow.

07Lapierre

Red Belly wrote: »

Sincerest thanks for that! As you might be able to read between the lines, I'm currently absolutely racked with self-doubt so your comment is most welcome. However, I won't even dream of targeting a medal, my only goals are a) hit the bottom of the Alpe within the cut-off, b) get to the top before sunset!

Rb

Did you read this? http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057044244&page=13

Leroy42

@RedBelly - Tapering is very individual, and almost impossible to get 'right' so don't over think it. You have done all the hard work, as you say the endurance is already there. Nothing you do now is going to make much difference from a positive point of view (I mean you're not going to suddenly increase your watts by 50 or whatever) but overdoing it can be a negative. In saying that, since you have a good level of fitness, none of the rides you mentioned is anything different from what you normally do and as such won't be too overtaxing on you. I plan on doing the Dragon next week, but will be doing it with non-Marmotte training friends so will be taking it relatively easy. i normally do the Naas 3 peaks the week before as the final 'test' run but its more about testing the kit, bike, gels, running in new tyres or whatever rather than looking to make any gains. Even if you stopped training today your endurance will hold up pretty well, its the last thing to go. Speed will be effective quicker, but luckily Marmotte is about endurance.

I wouldn't be too quick to knacker yourself at this stage, you do need to make sure you hit Saturday 4th fresh. If you haven't injured yourself from all your training then you're unlikely to do so now.

In terms of trying to replicate the Alpe, really it a mental challenge. No matter how you tackle the ride up to that point, Alpe is going to be hard. It will more than likely be hot, you'll already have 150k+ in your legs. You need to stay positive, remember all the training you have done. You have the endurance as you've shown in MB200 & W200 so you're not going to fall off your bike but obviously this is a different beast than those.

As Decrrrrrr said it is important to break the climbs down. Whatever system works best for you, but focus on the positives throughout. The climbs are long, but on the whole fairly steady so get into a rhythm you can sustain and as 07 says the Alpe is where you can lose buckets of time.

One tip I would give is to avoid stopping too long at the food stops. Take a few minutes to grab some food, stretch etc but don't hang around. It's wasted time. Better to get back on your bike a spin/take it really easy as at least you are moving.

cheerspal

There is a food stop just before the start of D'huez fill up with water and food there. I was sick of eating at the end of the day but it all helps. I think I took a gel aswell. Get your head straight about what's ahead and take each hairpin as they come and give yourself a pat on the back after each one. I presume you will have driven up the day before or are staying up the top so will know what the first few bends are like. I was ****ting it driving up the bloody thing!

There will be loads of people walking up so even being on the bike at this stage is an achievement. There is a water stop halfway up,again fill up and take a moment to refocus. Lots of people will be clapping and cheering which can give you a boost so make eye contact with folks for a little extra "whoop".

Ignore people passing you out and stay within your zone 3 or whatever you have been doing in training.

Most of all try and enjoy it. It's a great climb!!