***ALL THINGS IRISH WATER/WATER CHARGE RELATED POST HERE***

Cuttlefish

Rosa Hot Lumberman wrote: »

And taxes have been reduced in the budget to compensate, leaving many people actually better off.

Yes and I see also "tax breaks" for developers

Same old gravy train running except in this case hey say the men/ women in power… we have a big hammer to hit people on the head with and that is the bailout program and the subsequent impact it has had on ordinary Irish people.

What the government giveth they also taketh away in the water charges.

Cantona's Collars

Barely There wrote: »

Hopefully the water charge will increase significantly over the next few years, given the current charge isn't nearly enough to cover water provision bonus,car allowances,unused office space,general squandering of money costs.

FYP.

Barely There

Cuttlefish wrote: »

I tell you what why don't you instead of paying just what they are looking for… pay a load more.

In essence given them some of your money for free.

Why would I want to do that?

Cuttlefish wrote: »

How much are you willing to pay so?

The cost associated with collecting, purifying, distributing water, along with collection, treatment and disposal of wastewater, not to mention repairing, improving and upgrading our current infrastructure to cater for future population growth.

How much are you willing to pay?

Cuttlefish wrote: »

So you want to "jack" up the prices even more…what is your aim to get Ireland to the top of the leader board with regards to water charges??

My 'aim' would be to get the costs associated will all of the above covered by a water charge, as opposed to our current system which pays it our of central exchequer funding, on the whim of the Minister of Finance and has ensured we've ended up with a system which has been under-invested in for years and is becoming unfit for purpose.



What way would you like to do it????

Daith

zerks wrote: »

FYP.

You forgot taxpayer funded gym there.

Barely There

zerks wrote: »

FYP.

Oh look - he did a funny.


*slow hand clap*

Cantona's Collars

Daith wrote: »

You forgot taxpayer funded gym there.

Covered in general squandering.

Oh,I forgot the expensive courses in how to deal with stress from dealing with "customers".

Cuttlefish

Rosa Hot Lumberman wrote: »

Please, what a load of nonsense.

let the country be ruined over a few hundred euro of a water charge, some people really need to take a look at themselves.


And long may it continue creating jobs and improving the conditions and pay of those who spent years in university qualifying in many different science, engineering and IT fields. Sure lets artificially prevent people getting jobs and pay rises just out of begrudgery :rolleyes:.

It is not about the "few hundred euros" alone

It is also that ordinary Irish people are paying through USC charge (whom some people say should be used for IW), LPT and NOW Water charges.

USC charges (accounts for 25% of income tax take) was supposed to be for only a few years but is now a crutch for the finances, What did Mr Noonan say when asked about abolishing it…

Sure why would I do that?!!

'Tis here to stay

Cuttlefish

Barely There wrote: »

Why would I want to do that?


Sure you want the charges increased dramatically, you said so.

The cost associated with collecting, purifying, distributing water, along with collection, treatment and disposal of wastewater, not to mention repairing, improving and upgrading our current infrastructure to cater for future population growth.

And only in 2014 we decide to start ALL what you are purporting to?



How much are you willing to pay?

Pay for it already, and BTW I aint paying for highly paid employees of IW to have private gyms, bouses for under performing etc etc etc!!






My 'aim' would be to get the costs associated will all of the above covered by a water charge, as opposed to our current system which pays it our of central exchequer funding, on the whim of the Minister of Finance and has ensured we've ended up with a system which has been under-invested in for years and is becoming unfit for purpose.

And the central funding??? We will see it refunded to tax payer in some way, I doubt it



What way would you like to do it????

I dont agree with IW and Water Charges, especially now… the very very least the timing is so wrong.

Ghost Buster

Barely There wrote: »

Oh look - he did a funny.


*slow hand clap*

No. he pointed out the elephant in the room. The one you are prepared to ignore at all costs.

Creative Juices

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Another thing thats hardly rocket science is, if we are so broke how can we afford a utility which before even becoming properly established has a 'bonuses for all' policy, can have the likes of John Tierney and Hubert Kearns, who have a string of disasterous rolls behind them (Kearns left Sligo 80m in debt) running the utility on 6 figure sums, can give board rolls to the likes of Coleman Shanley who has no qualifications but whos family regularly donate to FG. Then we have our politicains who whilst governing a broke country can be amongst the worlds most highly paid. Combine this with all the waste, corruption and general paddy whackery.
So, how is this going on if we are broke. Its not rocket science:rolleyes:

Great reply.

Barely There

Ghost Buster wrote: »

No. he pointed out the elephant in the room. The one you are prepared to ignore at all costs.

The elephant in the room that so many protestors are willing to ignore is the cost of water provision.

Gyms and bonus are peanuts in comparison.

moxin

Barely There wrote: »

The elephant in the room that so many protestors are willing to ignore is the cost of water provision.

Gyms and bonus are peanuts in comparison.

Motor tax and VAT pay for it, you do not know the history of Irish taxation.

Cuttlefish

Barely There wrote: »

The elephant in the room that so many protestors are willing to ignore is the cost of water provision.

Gyms and bonus are peanuts in comparison.

Agree to some extent BUT it is the optics of it all


I mean to say under performing bonuses!!! Private gyms


This aspect of the company and their sheer arrogance is disturbing to say the least.

Again I repeat myself.. people have had enough.

Cuttlefish

moxin wrote: »

Motor tax and VAT pay for it, you do not know the history of Irish taxation.

Enlighten us so, please do

mzungu

Irish Steve wrote: »

AAAARRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHHHHH!

Where's the head banging against the wall smiley when you need it.

This thread is nearly at the message count limit for one thread, and we're STILL getting the same stuff that was dealt with back in the first 100 messages.

So let's expand things a little, and see where we go.

WARNING, it's not going to be short reply.

TLDR summary. FF signed us up for it before the last elections, and it's going to happen, and if done properly it needs to happen, but IW as presently structured is the wrong way, the wrong people and the wrong culture to do it properly.

Not going to quote the whole post, but fair play it was well written and I enjoyed reading it.

Barely There

moxin wrote: »

Motor tax and VAT pay for it, you do not know the history of Irish taxation.

And you don't know how to make a point.

I presume there's one hiding somewhere in your post? - I struggle to see what it is though.

listermint

Irish Steve wrote: »

TLDR summary. FF signed us up for it before the last elections, and it's going to happen, and if done properly it needs to happen, but IW as presently structured is the wrong way, the wrong people and the wrong culture to do it properly.

I am not sure BoJack read what he was thanking. Its not his modus operandi

BoJack Horseman

listermint wrote: »

I am not sure BoJack read what he was thanking. Its not his modus operandi

What do you mean buddy?

Caliden

Cuttlefish wrote: »

Enlighten us so, please do

Legislation introduced in 1997, the last time water charges almost went ahead.

Instead of water charges we got a 2% VAT increase and 5% motor tax increase to cover the cost.

listermint

BoJack Horseman wrote: »

What do you mean buddy?

Just everything youve wrote in the past is all for IW. You havent really complained about its make up.

Ghost Buster

Barely There wrote: »

The elephant in the room that so many protestors are willing to ignore is the cost of water provision.

Gyms and bonus are peanuts in comparison.

But gyms, bonus', waste and disproportionate wages would a logical and fair place to start,. You do agree with fairness don't you. And, as another poster here said "it's not rocket science" to realise that you would have much more goodwill from the population if that came first.

listermint

Ghost Buster wrote: »

But gyms, bonus', waste and disproportionate wages would a logical and fair place to start,. You do agree with fairness don't you. And, as another poster here said "it's not rocket science" to realise that you would have much more goodwill from the population if that came first.

He doesnt see the Croynism, jobs for the boys, entitlement and untouchable nature of Irish Politics as the elephant in the room.

Ghost Buster

listermint wrote: »

He doesnt see the Croynism, jobs for the boys, entitlement and untouchable nature of Irish Politics as the elephant in the room.

Hmmmmmm, curious that. It's almost like. ..

Cuttlefish

Caliden wrote: »

Legislation introduced in 1997, the last time water charges almost went ahead.

Instead of water charges we got a 2% VAT increase and 5% motor tax increase to cover the cost.

So in essence will we see a 2% VAT reduction and a 5% Motor Tax reduction?

Banjo String

Cuttlefish wrote: »

So in essence will we see a 2% VAT reduction and a 5% Motor Tax reduction?

As my dad would say......

Ye will in your balls.

BoJack Horseman

listermint wrote: »

Just everything youve wrote in the past is all for IW. You havent really complained about its make up.

Ive said a few times that I support a single water provision entity.

I also support the charging all users for water usage

My personal choice would have been a national statutory agency (quango) like the NRA for example.
I'm not appalled by its semi state status, I can see the logic, its just a preference.

I'm not fond of the leadership, but I don't know anyone better for the roles...... Wasn't happy with the lack of more transparent directorial recruitment mind

however I still support the principle of IW.
I think long term its best for Ireland.... Once its not killed in its embryonic state that is.

Cuttlefish

Caliden wrote: »

Legislation introduced in 1997, the last time water charges almost went ahead.

Instead of water charges we got a 2% VAT increase and 5% motor tax increase to cover the cost.

Covers the rumblings from the Government that we hear about €100 off your first bill etc

What they giveth in one hand they taketh away in the other

Cuttlefish

Banjo String wrote: »

As my dad would say......

Ye will in your balls.

LOL I see the funny side!

Cuttlefish

Geuze wrote: »

Why we won’t be paying twice for water

During 2013 the Govt collected €60,837m, or 61bn approx. During 2013 the Govt spent €70,804, or €71bn approx.

The general Govt deficit was €9,967 or nearly 10bn.

http://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/er/gfsa/governmentfinancestatisticsoctober2014/#.VFtxzPmsWSp


Currently the Central Govt pay grants to the local councils to run the 1000+ water and wastewater treatment plants.

The idea is that Govt grants to IW will fall, and be replaced by people paying water charges.

The costs to run the 1000+ plants shouldn’t change, but people will be paying for them directly, rather than then via Govt grants to councils.

So the Govt will spend less, and the fiscal deficit will fall, as it has to.

So nobody will be “paying twice”.

Yes, people will be paying a new tax/charge to help reduce the fiscal deficit.

So, to be clear, the LPT and water charges are new taxes/charges to help reduce public borrowing, and are part of the broadening of the tax base.

Of course, nobody likes new or higher taxes. An alternative to the LPT and water charges is higher consumption taxes or higher income taxes.

To people who say: “we already pay” – yes we already pay taxes, but they are not enough to cover public spending.

Yet we can write off €100m debt for Siteserv?

tayto lover

I wonder if many people will sell their PPS numbers for 100 euro?