GoT Illiterate Season 4 finale *HAVE NOT READ THE BOOKS*

Adamocovic

Links234 wrote: »

Ok, I've been rewatching a bit of Season 3 and something makes me wonder about the Hound...

After winning trial by combat with Beric Dondarrion, they're releasing him and Arya protests, Beric tells her it's not their place to judge and then says "Go in peace Sandor Clegane, the lord of light isn't done with you yet" and this has me wondering about the Hound's fate, suggesting he's got some sort of destiny, so now I'm wondering if the brotherhood without banners don't stumble upon him again and revive him and he joins up with them? Not beyond the realms of possibility, but after being so sure the Mountain was a goner and I was adamant that he wasn't gonna get back up again, I'm a little hesitent to call someone's death now unless it's Oberynly obvious and we didn't actually see the Hound die, did we?

Edit: I know I've been told spoiler tags aren't nessecary for speculation from what we've seen in the show, but it's kinda habit.

I hope you're right! Looking back it makes sense and to be honest if that's how they leave the hound it's very poor. Not the sort of exit his character deserved.

Lothaar v2

Speaking of heirs to the throne... I've had a theory about Jon Snow since S1, when Ned Stark read through the book that specified all Baratheons as being 'black of hair'. Why did we never find out who Jon's mother is? Last time Ned and Jon spoke, Ned said he'd talk to Jon about his mother when they meet again.

I reckon Jon is the child of Robert Baratheon and Ned's sister. For some reason unknown to us, Ned didn't tell Robert (or anyone) about Jon's true parentage. He pretended Jon was his own bastard. It never really made sense that honourable Ned would father a bastard.

I've no idea what circumstances could've led to Ned pretending Jon was his bastard but I reckon it's a plot twist that will be revealed at some point in the future and maybe explained then.

I've thought this all along... but when Melisandre was staring at him during the S4 finale, I really started to believe I was right. She'll know he has king's blood, same as Gendry. Moreover, if he IS the son of Robert and Ned's sister, that would probably make him the rightful heir to the throne, which makes the whole Stannis-Jon storyline a lot more interesting.

Note: I'm not a book reader. If I happen to be right here, please don't add spoiler tags or get the pitchforks out, as that will confirm I'm right and ruin the surprise! I'm just theorising and, knowing GoT, I may well have fallen for a well-placed red herring.

golfball37

Lothaar v2 wrote: »

Speaking of heirs to the throne... I've had a theory about Jon Snow since S1, when Ned Stark read through the book that specified all Baratheons as being 'black of hair'. Why did we never find out who Jon's mother is? Last time Ned and Jon spoke, Ned said he'd talk to Jon about his mother when they meet again.

I reckon Jon is the child of Robert Baratheon and Ned's sister. For some reason unknown to us, Ned didn't tell Robert (or anyone) about Jon's true parentage. He pretended Jon was his own bastard. It never really made sense that honourable Ned would father a bastard.

I've no idea what circumstances could've led to Ned pretending Jon was his bastard but I reckon it's a plot twist that will be revealed at some point in the future and maybe explained then.

I've thought this all along... but when Melisandre was staring at him during the S4 finale, I really started to believe I was right. She'll know he has king's blood, same as Gendry. Moreover, if he IS the son of Robert and Ned's sister, that would probably make him the rightful heir to the throne, which makes the whole Stannis-Jon storyline a lot more interesting.

Note: I'm not a book reader. If I happen to be right here, please don't add spoiler tags or get the pitchforks out, as that will confirm I'm right and ruin the surprise! I'm just theorising and, knowing GoT, I may well have fallen for a well-placed red herring.

I'm not a book reader either but from watching the history and lore series I am convinced Jon Snow is the son of Neds sister alright but Rhaegar Targaryen is his father.

Awkward Badger

If he was Roberts son Ned would have told him, I don't see any reason why he'd take him as his own bastard. So he cant be Roberts son but its possible he is the son of Rhaegar and Lyanna. All it mentions in the show is that Robert was to marry her and Rhaegar kidnapped her which triggered the war.

Perhaps Ned thought that Robert would have him killed and couldn't see his sisters son die regardless of who his father was and took him as his own bastard.

Then again Ned was a good man so if Jon really was his sisters son he surely would have told Catelyn. She despised Jon all his life because he was Neds bastard and must have held it against Ned too. Its strange he'd allow all that to happen to keep the secret when the truth would have allowed Catelyn to accept Jon as a Stark without it being such a betrayal.

I may have a watch of the lore series though and see what actually went on before the show picks up the story.

Lemlin

Lothaar v2 wrote: »

Speaking of heirs to the throne... I've had a theory about Jon Snow since S1, when Ned Stark read through the book that specified all Baratheons as being 'black of hair'. Why did we never find out who Jon's mother is? Last time Ned and Jon spoke, Ned said he'd talk to Jon about his mother when they meet again.

I reckon Jon is the child of Robert Baratheon and Ned's sister. For some reason unknown to us, Ned didn't tell Robert (or anyone) about Jon's true parentage. He pretended Jon was his own bastard. It never really made sense that honourable Ned would father a bastard.

I've no idea what circumstances could've led to Ned pretending Jon was his bastard but I reckon it's a plot twist that will be revealed at some point in the future and maybe explained then.

I've thought this all along... but when Melisandre was staring at him during the S4 finale, I really started to believe I was right. She'll know he has king's blood, same as Gendry. Moreover, if he IS the son of Robert and Ned's sister, that would probably make him the rightful heir to the throne, which makes the whole Stannis-Jon storyline a lot more interesting.

Note: I'm not a book reader. If I happen to be right here, please don't add spoiler tags or get the pitchforks out, as that will confirm I'm right and ruin the surprise! I'm just theorising and, knowing GoT, I may well have fallen for a well-placed red herring.

I've had this theory myself for a good while and I'm not a book reader. It seems a bit too, well, happy for GoT but it seems to me that Jon is being set up to be a hero a bit like Aragorn in LoTR.

I've seen in the online videos that Ned's sister had a secret she asked him to keep before she died. I think it was Jon and he either didn't tell Robert because he wanted to protect the child or because his sister had asked him too. I think it mentioned in those videos that Lysa wasn't overly fond of Robert because he had a roving eye.

Either that or Rheagar was his father and that is why it was never revealed. Robert would have had Jon killed. The Targareyn's also allege that Lysa went of her own free will with Rhaegar.

It would certainly make sense because Ned seems too honourable to have an affair and he refuses to discuss Jon's mother with either Jon or Robert in S1.

Pugsly wrote: »

If he was Roberts son Ned would have told him, I don't see any reason why he'd take him as his own bastard. So he cant be Roberts son but its possible he is the son of Rhaegar and Lyanna. All it mentions in the show is that Robert was to marry her and Rhaegar kidnapped her which triggered the war.

Perhaps Ned thought that Robert would have him killed and couldn't see his sisters son die regardless of who his father was and took him as his own bastard.

Then again Ned was a good man so if Jon really was his sisters son he surely would have told Catelyn. She despised Jon all his life because he was Neds bastard and must have held it against Ned too. Its strange he'd allow all that to happen to keep the secret when the truth would have allowed Catelyn to accept Jon as a Stark without it being such a betrayal.

I may have a watch of the lore series though and see what actually went on before the show picks up the story.

The only reason I can think of for this is that Ned was trying to be honourable by keeping his sister's dying wish.

Da Shins Kelly

Jon is quite clearly being set up to be a hero, as is Bran, I think, more so than anyone else in the show. I think both of them will be there for sure at the story's conclusion. If Jon is the son of a Targareyn, it could make for interesting alliance possibilities between Daenerys and the Starks.

The aul Targareyn lad at the wall might know something about Jon. He is old enough to remember the rebellion and everything that happened back then. He could know things about Jon that Jon doesn't even know about himself.

DeVore

Da Shins Kelly wrote: »

Jon is quite clearly being set up to be a hero, as is Bran, I think, more so than anyone else in the show. I think both of them will be there for sure at the story's conclusion. If Jon is the son of a Targareyn, it could make for interesting alliance possibilities between Daenerys and the Starks.

The aul Targareyn lad at the wall might know something about Jon. He is old enough to remember the rebellion and everything that happened back then. He could know things about Jon that Jon doesn't even know about himself.

See, now Mance will kill Jon in the season opener next year.... and it will be all your fault.

Da Shins Kelly

I will happily shoulder the blame if Jon takes an axe to the face within the first five minutes of next season's opener.

Lothaar v2

Can someone provide a link to those videos? And are they spoiler-free? I try to avoid the entire internet when it comes to GoT.

Awkward Badger

Lothaar v2 wrote: »

Can someone provide a link to those videos? And are they spoiler-free? I try to avoid the entire internet when it comes to GoT.

This is the collection from season 1. I haven't watched it (I will shortly though) but it seems to be a history leading up to where the show or books pick up the story. But as I said I dont know what exactly is in it so watch it at your own risk and aviod the comments at all costs.

wp_rathead

Lothaar v2 wrote: »

Can someone provide a link to those videos? And are they spoiler-free? I try to avoid the entire internet when it comes to GoT.

Just youtube- "history and folk lore game of thrones"

If you can get the one where the guy has added music from the series - they are spoiler free if you up to date with show - they are on the Blu Ray boxsets of each season so they legit TV Show canon

just:
DO NOT READ THE COMMENTS

RichFTW

wprathead wrote: »

Just youtube- "history and folk lore game of thrones"

If you can get the one where the guy has added music from the series - they are spoiler free if you up to date with show - they are on the Blu Ray boxsets of each season so they legit TV Show canon

just:
DO NOT READ THE COMMENTS

I have learned this the hard way. Some amount of a-holes on youtube putting spoilers in the comments on purpose. Saw one that said Oberyn was going to die in the fight before the episode aired.

Then when he knocked the mountain down. I was thinking stupid troll trying to ruin GOT on me, Oberyn just won...oh wait, no, his head is now smashed open. Oh well.

Mickeroo

The latest thing I've seen happen with regularity is people posting game of thrones spoilers on videos that have nothing to do with show in a bid to catch people unawares. Baffling.

bluesfan

Da Shins Kelly wrote: »

The aul Targareyn lad at the wall might know something about Jon. He is old enough to remember the rebellion and everything that happened back then.

He wouldn't have to be that old to remember. The rebellion toook place just 15 year before season one. There's been 4 or 5 years passage of time since then. That means any character in their mid thirtys upward probably fought in the war.

Da Shins Kelly

bluesfan wrote: »

He wouldn't have to be that old to remember. The rebellion toook place just 15 year before season one. There's been 4 or 5 years passage of time since then. That means any character in their mid thirtys upward probably fought in the war.

Well yeah, I just mean that he was around when the sh*t was hitting the fan and was part of the most powerful family before the rebellion, so he may well know a lot more than your average soldier and he may know exactly who Jon is (this providing that Jon is actually a Targareyn).

Mickeroo

Da Shins Kelly wrote: »

Well yeah, I just mean that he was around when the sh*t was hitting the fan and was part of the most powerful family before the rebellion, so he may well know a lot more than your average soldier and he may know exactly who Jon is (this providing that Jon is actually a Targareyn).

Aemon was already at the wall during the rebellion, he mentions what he went through during a conversation with Jon in season 1 when Jon was thinking of deserting.

Da Shins Kelly

Mickeroo wrote: »

Aemon was already at the wall during the rebellion, he mentions what he went through during a conversation with Jon in season 1 when Jon was thinking of deserting.

Oh yeah, I know. I'm just saying that given he is a living Targareyn who was alive for the rebellion, he may be aware of who Jon is, if Jon actually is a Targareyn. I'm sure he probably knows that Rhaegar took Lyanna Stark as a hostage. It just wouldn't really surprise me if he knew all along or something.

wp_rathead

Folk Lore and History WITH Music - you will be surprised how much better this makes it (also has subtitles for season 1&2)

Seasone ONE:

Season TWO:

Season THREE:

badger57

Wasn't that great imo. Not sure I'll tune in next season.

Roar

Mickeroo wrote: »

The latest thing I've seen happen with regularity is people posting game of thrones spoilers on videos that have nothing to do with show in a bid to catch people unawares. Baffling.

This has become essential

Youtube Comment Blocker Extension for Chrome

https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/commentblocker/lhkjhnbkeibefoijmacgnnkddlkkmjaf?hl=en-GB

Pepe LeFrits

Roar wrote: »

This has become essential

Youtube Comment Blocker Extension for Chrome

https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/commentblocker/lhkjhnbkeibefoijmacgnnkddlkkmjaf?hl=en-GB

Watch out for Google auto-complete too. Before I'd read the books I typed a character name into google and it added on something I really didn't want to know :mad:

conorhal

Pepe LeFrits wrote: »

Watch out for Google auto-complete too. Before I'd read the books I typed a character name into google and it added on something I really didn't want to know :mad:

Don't worry. At the rate that George RR Martin is writing the shoe will soon be on the other foot! I can see a lot of buuk readers desperately trying to complete the latest 15,000 page opus while show watchers threaten them with massive spoilers :pac:

kryogen

Gonna re watch the last three episodes tonight, see how they feel second time around. Some seriously good moments in there

Al Capwned

I hurt my shoulder at the weekend, so can't work for a while, so I'm starting from scratch again....
Winter is coming.....

Pepe LeFrits

kryogen wrote: »

Gonna re watch the last three episodes tonight, see how they feel second time around. Some seriously good moments in there

I re-watched the last episode there and it was basically a series of season-ender scenes. Any one of them could have had the end-credits roll follow and I would have been all "Bravo, well played sirs! etc

nxbyveromdwjpg

Lothaar v2 wrote: »

Speaking of heirs to the throne... I've had a theory about Jon Snow since S1, when Ned Stark read through the book that specified all Baratheons as being 'black of hair'. Why did we never find out who Jon's mother is? Last time Ned and Jon spoke, Ned said he'd talk to Jon about his mother when they meet again.

I reckon Jon is the child of Robert Baratheon and Ned's sister. For some reason unknown to us, Ned didn't tell Robert (or anyone) about Jon's true parentage. He pretended Jon was his own bastard. It never really made sense that honourable Ned would father a bastard.

I've no idea what circumstances could've led to Ned pretending Jon was his bastard but I reckon it's a plot twist that will be revealed at some point in the future and maybe explained then.

I've thought this all along... but when Melisandre was staring at him during the S4 finale, I really started to believe I was right. She'll know he has king's blood, same as Gendry. Moreover, if he IS the son of Robert and Ned's sister, that would probably make him the rightful heir to the throne, which makes the whole Stannis-Jon storyline a lot more interesting.

Note: I'm not a book reader. If I happen to be right here, please don't add spoiler tags or get the pitchforks out, as that will confirm I'm right and ruin the surprise! I'm just theorising and, knowing GoT, I may well have fallen for a well-placed red herring.

I just started watching again from the start and just watched S01E02 tonight, Jon leaving for the wall.

I had either completely forgotten or just not really taken it in the first time around but there will definitely be something to do with his parentage.

No one has ever seen his mother and Robert also mentions that that was apparently the only time Ned ever had an affair. Ned also says to Jon "You don't have my name, but you have my blood"... so, I guess he could be the sisters then?? Although I didn't put that together until I read that post above.

In a way I hope we're not right, if we are I won't even be reading this non-book readers thread again.

wp_rathead

Lothaar v2 wrote: »

Moreover, if he IS the son of Robert and Ned's sister, that would probably make him the rightful heir to the throne, which makes the whole Stannis-Jon storyline a lot more interesting.

He would still be a bastard though wouldn't he? Just not a Snow but either a Water or a Storm

DerekDGoldfish

Chears for those links wprathead

As someone who has been to lazy to catch up on the books it was nice to get some more background on the history of the houses etc, while there is a lot of repetition in them they are certainly worth viewing while people are waiting for the new series.

It does make make me think Roberts Rebellion would make a very interesting mini-series between normal series if HBO thought they could make enough money from it although the cost of full scale battles could be prohibitive.

GerB40

DerekDGoldfish wrote: »

Chears for those links wprathead

As someone who has been to lazy to catch up on the books it was nice to get some more background on the history of the houses etc, while there is a lot of repetition in them they are certainly worth viewing while people are waiting for the new series.

It does make make me think Roberts Rebellion would make a very interesting mini-series between normal series if HBO thought they could make enough money from it although the cost of full scale battles could be prohibitive.

Not if they spent two or three years making it like a proper movie and make it into a fifteen/twenty episode series. HBO know that after GoT is over there's still a goldmine left in the franchise with Roberts Rebellion being the main focus and I can't imagine HBO not taking full advantage if that..
It will (i really, really hope) happen.

bnt

Just finished S4, so finally it's safe to venture in to this thread. A couple of observations which could be totally wrong, but what the heck:
- I don't think Cersei will be too bothered about the death of Tywin. He was trying to marry her off, against her wishes, and send her away. The last time we saw her she was putting her foot down and saying no to Tywin. With him gone, she's pretty much free to do as she wants now, which is to stay with her son the King.
- I thought Shae turned against Tyrion because he sent her away for her safety. He'd tried doing that before by telling her she was in danger, which didn't work, so he had to dump her to get her to leave. Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned ... :eek:
- A bit of circularity: the crossbow that Tyrion used to kill Tywin was made for Joffrey: crossbows normally require great strength to cock, but this one had that handle to make it easy for someone of limited strength. Such as Joffrey, who used it to torture and kill Ros when he found out she was an informant for Varys. Or Tyrion.