Random Running Questions

dukeraoul

RayCun wrote: »

this year's MSB one certainly was!;)
Flat course all right, but a lot of corners

Haters gonna hate...

ooter

When you're working on improving your endurance over longer distances is it a given that your speed over shorter distances will suffer?
Did an all out 10k today fully expecting to get close to my PB or even bag a new one but I was nowhere near.:(

dna_leri

ooter wrote: »

When you're working on improving your endurance over longer distances is it a given that your speed over shorter distances will suffer?
Did an all out 10k today fully expecting to get close to my PB or even bag a new one but I was nowhere near.:(

It depends on the demands of the different distances.
If Usain Bolt decided to work on his endurance with a view to improving his marathon time, of course his 100m time would suffer. That's because the energy systems are very different for both events.

For something like a 10K and Marathon (which I am guessing you are training for) the energy systems for both are basically the same - aerobic. Most people will find that when they do extra endurance training for a marathon that their 10K time improves in parallel.

If your 10K time has deteriorated, then you should look elsewhere for the reason.
Was the 10K in a race with all of the build-up and pacing and competition that goes along with that?
Was the course ideal for a fast time, were the weather conditions perfect?
Were you tired from your recent endurance training? Normally before a 10K race you would be well rested and recovered. If for example you did a 20-mile long run last weekend that might still be in your legs.

ooter

dna_leri wrote: »

It depends on the demands of the different distances.
If Usain Bolt decided to work on his endurance with a view to improving his marathon time, of course his 100m time would suffer. That's because the energy systems are very different for both events.

For something like a 10K and Marathon (which I am guessing you are training for) the energy systems for both are basically the same - aerobic. Most people will find that when they do extra endurance training for a marathon that their 10K time improves in parallel.

If your 10K time has deteriorated, then you should look elsewhere for the reason.
Was the 10K in a race with all of the build-up and pacing and competition that goes along with that?
Was the course ideal for a fast time, were the weather conditions perfect?
Were you tired from your recent endurance training? Normally before a 10K race you would be well rested and recovered. If for example you did a 20-mile long run last weekend that might still be in your legs.

yeah,did a 20 miler last sunday and a vo2 max session on tuesday.
it wasn't in a race, just ran 10k up and down conyngham road after about a 3k warm up.the wind was horrendous but i'm not going to blame that.
thanks for the reply.

pconn062

+1 for Jingle Bells 5k, ran it for the first time last year and it's a super quick course. If you can get to 3.5k in decent shape then the last 1500m can be really attacked, had great fun over that last mile last year.

walshb

What's the craic with precision timing (race) having a chip time only at the finish line?

lachin

This has more than likely being asked and discussed before but what do people do when they have a Headcold?

Came on me fri, kept running away,felt ok, no problem apart from sweating like mad! Tonight I feel like death....completely blocked up and chesty/wheezy/sore when swallowing( keep it clean!!;-) )

Have a half next weekend, and my question is what do I do for the next few days? Run and sweat it out of me or rest? Really I'd rather not rest as I'd worry it would hamper my progress.

gerard_65

Don't run with a chest cold. If its above the neck take is easy. A couple of days off won't have much of an impact on your fitness. You would have been tapering this week before the half anyway.

DarByrne1980

has anybody ever followed an online programme. I see that lad Greg mcMillian emails programmes at a price. WOuld like to know if they are any use before I buy one through. Making it down to a club is not an option at the moment so looking for a alternative

28064212

walshb wrote: »

What's the craic with precision timing (race) having a chip time only at the finish line?

Depends on the system used, a mat at the start and finish is more expensive. Some races only go with a mat at the end, so you'll only have a gun time, rather than both a gun time and a chip time. Not generally a big issue, unless there's 100+ people, all of a similar ability

ooter

DarByrne1980 wrote: »

has anybody ever followed an online programme. I see that lad Greg mcMillian emails programmes at a price. WOuld like to know if they are any use before I buy one through. Making it down to a club is not an option at the moment so looking for a alternative

Have you had a look at hal higdon's programmes?

DarByrne1980

ooter wrote: »

Have you had a look at hal higdon's programmes?

on;y in brief. Would you recommend them. Have you had good results with him

tipping

So for lsr when do you need to be bringing water or something with you?
Did 9 miles today in about 1hr 16, building up to half marathon and felt empty in the last 2 miles. Similar feeling on 8 mile run last week. Is it just the distance building up or the lack of fuel at those kind of distances/times.

walshb

28064212 wrote: »

Depends on the system used, a mat at the start and finish is more expensive. Some races only go with a mat at the end, so you'll only have a gun time, rather than both a gun time and a chip time. Not generally a big issue, unless there's 100+ people, all of a similar ability

Thanks. Yes, I was thinking that the reason may be price. So it's imperative the runners time themselves.

ooter

DarByrne1980 wrote: »

on;y in brief. Would you recommend them. Have you had good results with him

I followed his novice programme last year for my first marathon and found it fine,doing a p+d plan at the most and am finding it very good.

TFBubendorfer

tipping wrote: »

So for lsr when do you need to be bringing water or something with you?
Did 9 miles today in about 1hr 16, building up to half marathon and felt empty in the last 2 miles. Similar feeling on 8 mile run last week. Is it just the distance building up or the lack of fuel at those kind of distances/times.

Depends what time of day you are running and what the temperatures are like.
I never bring water or anything else with me on my runs, and that includes runs of 20 miles or a bit more on occasion.

But I run early in the morning when temperatures are low, I wouldn't do that if I did a long run during the afternoon.

I also make sure to drink plenty of water immediately before I go out.

You won't NEED anything for the length of a half-marathon. If you WANT something, that's a different matter. But if you're running longer than ever before, you will tend to feel a bit empty toward the end, no matter what.

Krusty_Clown

tipping wrote: »

So for lsr when do you need to be bringing water or something with you?
Did 9 miles today in about 1hr 16, building up to half marathon and felt empty in the last 2 miles. Similar feeling on 8 mile run last week. Is it just the distance building up or the lack of fuel at those kind of distances/times.

When I first started running, I used to bring water with me for runs longer than an hour. Like TFBubendorfer, I don't need them any longer (up to 20 miles). Not sure if it was psychological or not, but it certainly felt like it helped at the time. The goal should be ultimately to wean yourself off of the need to carry water/nutrition on your long runs. Building endurance is a gradual process though, and the immediate goal is to cover the distance. It will get easier, but if you need water or jelly babies to cover the distance, then so be it.

PaulieC

Wise Runners,

HM this Saturday coming and I'm unsure how to approach it. Plans says there should be a 10m PMP run on Saturday and 20 LSR on Sunday. I can't decide whether to go eyes out in the HM and then just do what I can on Sunday or else use the HM as a PMP session and tack on a few miles at the end for a 20 and then do 10 the next day.

Pros of 1st approach: Would give me a good indication of where I am at wrt the DCM.

Pros of 2nd approach: Would be a great PMP workout and it's always nice to have as many 20+ runs in the bag (for me anyway).

Any thoughts ?

davedanon

PaulieC wrote: »

Wise Runners,

HM this Saturday coming and I'm unsure how to approach it. Plans says there should be a 10m PMP run on Saturday and 20 LSR on Sunday. I can't decide whether to go eyes out in the HM and then just do what I can on Sunday or else use the HM as a PMP session and tack on a few miles at the end for a 20 and then do 10 the next day.

Pros of 1st approach: Would give me a good indication of where I am at wrt the DCM.

Pros of 2nd approach: Would be a great PMP workout and it's always nice to have as many 20+ runs in the bag (for me anyway).

Any thoughts ?

Bloke down the club and I took both approaches in the park 10 miler there. He ran 'easy' (or said he did; he nearly caught me at the finish), I ran it as hard as I could, then did a very easy 22 miler the following day. He ran 12 miles immediately following the race to complete his long run. I felt ok, I ran as slowly as I needed to on the Sunday. He said he was absolutely knackered doing 12 on top of the race. I felt I kind of got the better of the deal, to be honest. Although on the Tuesday following there was a track session scheduled, and I really felt the effects then.

tipping

TFBubendorfer wrote: »

Depends what time of day you are running and what the temperatures are like.
I never bring water or anything else with me on my runs, and that includes runs of 20 miles or a bit more on occasion.

But I run early in the morning when temperatures are low, I wouldn't do that if I did a long run during the afternoon.

I also make sure to drink plenty of water immediately before I go out.

You won't NEED anything for the length of a half-marathon. If you WANT something, that's a different matter. But if you're running longer than ever before, you will tend to feel a bit empty toward the end, no matter what.

Thanks guys. Kinda felt like that but just wanted the reassurance. Heres to more and longer runs.

Finnt

Anyone ever use ultrasound? I've been have trouble with my calves, has anyone used ultrasound on similar and how'd ye find it?

sideswipe

Need some advise please folks.

Following P&D 55-70m. Hit all targets until this week which is an important one with 2 of my most important sessions-
12m w/7@ half mara/15k pace and a 18m w/12@pmp .
This is a change to the original plan as i changed around LSR's from last weekend (22m) to this weekend to run the Dublin half as a marathon paced run.

Went out for the 7@HMP yesterday and within 5 mins I knew I was cooked, just wasn't in me. Heart rate shot up and I had to call it after 2.5 miles.....gutted. Thought I'd try again last night but have been feeling terrible and know I'm not quite right.

Was going to do my scheduled 15 MLR today and throw in a few at half pace to make it up, but again I'm not right this morning and the humidity out there would probably kill me off. Will try again this evening but just wonder had anybody any thoughts on doing the 15 with maybe 6@ half pace? Or would it be best to forget that session and move on?

Hate to miss a session, especially as I'm following a 12 week plan.

Sorry for the long winded question, advice greatly appreciated!

Krusty_Clown

sideswipe wrote: »

Need some advise please folks.

Following P&D 55-70m. Hit all targets until this week which is an important one with 2 of my most important sessions-
12m w/7@ half mara/15k pace and a 18m w/12@pmp .
This is a change to the original plan as i changed around LSR's from last weekend (22m) to this weekend to run the Dublin half as a marathon paced run.

Went out for the 7@HMP yesterday and within 5 mins I knew I was cooked, just wasn't in me. Heart rate shot up and I had to call it after 2.5 miles.....gutted. Thought I'd try again last night but have been feeling terrible and know I'm not quite right.

Was going to do my scheduled 15 MLR today and throw in a few at half pace to make it up, but again I'm not right this morning and the humidity out there would probably kill me off. Will try again this evening but just wonder had anybody any thoughts on doing the 15 with maybe 6@ half pace? Or would it be best to forget that session and move on?

Hate to miss a session, especially as I'm following a 12 week plan.

Sorry for the long winded question, advice greatly appreciated!

I'd be like you - would hate to miss a session, but as was pointed out to me a few times in the last few days, sometimes it's better just to move on. It sounds like the best return for your training investment would be to make sure you are well and healthy for your marathon pace session at the weekend. I appreciate the irony of providing this advice having done the opposite at the weekend, but maybe it's from learning from my mistakes?!

sideswipe

Cheers KC. We truly are a stubborn bunch us runners! I think I know whats best myself and even hearing your advice I still have visions of trying to knock out a few HMP miles later on! Sometimes it seems much harder to give yourself a pass rather than push yourself. It's just that when looking at the plan from the outset that particular session stood out as a benchmark......'nail that 5 weeks out and your on track', not doing it makes me uneasy!

PS having a bad race in a half mara and jogging home to finish in 1:20 xx is the kind of bad day I dream of:pac:

ooter

Looking for a bit of advice meself folks.
Wasn't planning on doing the HM this Saturday but I've been given a number by a friend so considering doing it now,I was due to do 18 miles w 14 @ MP on Sunday so I'm going to do it Saturday instead,4 miles easy before the HM and then the HM.
I've to do a LT session this evening,12 miles tomorrow and 5 mile recovery friday,would it really make much difference if I didn't do the recovery run on Friday?

sideswipe

ooter wrote: »

Looking for a bit of advice meself folks.
Wasn't planning on doing the HM this Saturday but I've been given a number by a friend so considering doing it now,I was due to do 18 miles w 14 @ MP on Sunday so I'm going to do it Saturday instead,4 miles easy before the HM and then the HM.
I've to do a LT session this evening,12 miles tomorrow and 5 mile recovery friday,would it really make much difference if I didn't do the recovery run on Friday?

Skipping a recovery run the day before won't make any difference. Winning an age or gender category while running under somebody else's name......thats another story:p

kit3

Just wondering how much of an effect would a 45 minute cycle have on a later run ? I've started cycling into work & would usually run at lunchtime. Cycle takes me about 45 minutes and legs were heavy doing my run at lunchtime then (had cycled in & out the last two days also & run Monday lunchtime (about 50mins) ). Trying to figure out how much of that I can put down to the cycle .....if that makes any sense

wowzer

kit3 wrote: »

Just wondering how much of an effect would a 45 minute cycle have on a later run ? I've started cycling into work & would usually run at lunchtime. Cycle takes me about 45 minutes and legs were heavy doing my run at lunchtime then (had cycled in & out the last two days also & run Monday lunchtime (about 50mins) ). Trying to figure out how much of that I can put down to the cycle .....if that makes any sense

I cycle commute to work each day a 17 mile round trip and I don't think it has too much effect on my running. I run 45-50 miles a week.

I actually think it helps with recovery, if for some reason I don't cycle for a few days my legs certainly feel heavier when running.

nerraw1111

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

I'd be like you - would hate to miss a session, but as was pointed out to me a few times in the last few days, sometimes it's better just to move on. It sounds like the best return for your training investment would be to make sure you are well and healthy for your marathon pace session at the weekend. I appreciate the irony of providing this advice having done the opposite at the weekend, but maybe it's from learning from my mistakes?!

KC, what do you reckon is more beneficial at this stage in a 12 week plan in terms of approach to running Dublin hm.

A MP session or trying to set a PB in a half marathon?

Krusty_Clown

nerraw1111 wrote: »

KC, what do you reckon is more beneficial at this stage in a 12 week plan in terms of approach to running Dublin hm.

A MP session or trying to set a PB in a half marathon?

Depends on how much quality marathon pace work you have done over those 12 weeks and how quickly you recover from a half marathon race. Also, what is your primary focus for the year? Becoming a better well-rounded runner and collect a range of PBs, or to run the best possible marathon time? If the focus is the marathon, you got your answer there. Racing your best ever HM 5 weeks out from your goal marathon will not help you greatly from a marathon-preparation perspective; certainly not as much as running 13 miles at marathon pace. It might give you a confidence boost (it certainly has done for me in the past), but it can also go the other way (as happened to so many people at the weekend!). The other point is the opportunity cost in terms of training. If it reduces your potential for training over the ensuing week/two weeks, during what is effectively 'prime-time', then you have to ask yourself is it worth the PB?