Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Charlatan "girl against flouride" finally exposed

Options
1…2022242526

Comments

  • Options
    #632
    Akrasia
    Registered Users Posts: 22,348 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Call me Al wrote: »
    Interesting interview on Sean o'Rourke right now on this.

    He has claimed that if consumed by pregnant women it can cause, ADHD, autism, and most shocking of all Down's syndrome in children.

    Who made these claims?

    Were they challenged?

    There is no evidence to support any of these claims.

    The media are genuinely failing in their duty to process information and present accurate reports to the public.

    A reporter is supposed to seperate out the false claims and misinformation and report the truth to the best of their knowledge, however, now we have 'balanced reporting' where they take two people, one on each side of a debate and let them shoot it out in a 5 minute 'debate' where the pseudo scientist gets to throw out all these false claims and the genuine expert hasn't any hope of properly countering them in the allotted time


  • Options
    #633
    AnonoBoy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,559 ✭✭✭✭AnonoBoy


    Akrasia wrote: »
    Who made these claims?

    Were they challenged?

    There is no evidence to support any of these claims.

    Pretty much everything he said was called out as false by the other guest. People are starting to stand up against this notion that fluoride is the most evil substance known to man.


  • Options
    #634
    P. Breathnach
    Registered Users Posts: 12,089 ✭✭✭✭P. Breathnach


    AnonoBoy wrote: »
    Pretty much everything he said was called out as false by the other guest....
    Keelin Shanley (filling in for SO'R) also challenged him, asking for proper sources. When he tried to bluster, she ruled that his "evidence" should be regarded as just an opinion.


  • Options
    #635
    earlyevening
    Registered Users Posts: 1,330 ✭✭✭earlyevening


    Interestingly Keelin Shanley's father is the former Dean of the Dental School in Trinity College, Professor Derry Shanley.


  • Options
    #636
    AnonoBoy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,559 ✭✭✭✭AnonoBoy


    earlyevening wrote: »
    Interestingly Keelin Shanley's father is the former Dean of the Dental School in Trinity College, Professor Derry Shanley.

    Watch the conspiracy theorists now say that she too is on the payroll of Big Fluoride!

    It's an expensive business keeping so many scientists, journalists and tweeters on your payroll. There's some money in fluoride I tells ya!


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #637
    P. Breathnach
    Registered Users Posts: 12,089 ✭✭✭✭P. Breathnach


    AnonoBoy wrote: »
    Watch the conspiracy theorists now say that she too is on the payroll of Big Fluoride!

    It's an expensive business keeping so many scientists, journalists and tweeters on your payroll. There's some money in fluoride I tells ya!
    When do I receive my payment? I haven't yet got a cent, and I might consider changing sides if the other side make me an offer.


  • Options
    #638
    Call me Al
    Registered Users Posts: 3,022 ✭✭✭Call me Al


    Akrasia wrote: »
    Who made these claims?

    Were they challenged?

    There is no evidence to support any of these claims.

    The media are genuinely failing in their duty to process information and present accurate reports to the public.

    A reporter is supposed to seperate out the false claims and misinformation and report the truth to the best of their knowledge, however, now we have 'balanced reporting' where they take two people, one on each side of a debate and let them shoot it out in a 5 minute 'debate' where the pseudo scientist gets to throw out all these false claims and the genuine expert hasn't any hope of properly countering them in the allotted time

    She pulled him on it, and challenged him to say where the specific study regarding the DS claim was published and he couldn't.
    I agree regarding the format of the "discussion". Throw enough mud and some will stick and cast doubts in people's minds.


  • Options
    #639
    AnonoBoy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,559 ✭✭✭✭AnonoBoy


    P. Breathnach wrote: »
    When do I receive my payment? I haven't yet got a cent, and I might consider changing sides if the other side make me an offer.

    Head to the Freemason's Hall on Molesworth street on the fourth Friday of a Full Moon Month. Perform the secret knock CORRECTLY and gain entrance. Then just leave your bank account number (don't forget it has to be SEPA compliant), your sort code and your credit card details and you get your payment after the next super secret Big Fluoride Meeting.




    Or else just hang out in Buswell's and any member of government will pay you off if you buy them a few pints.


  • Options
    #640
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 90,966 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    AnonoBoy wrote: »
    People are starting to stand up against this notion that fluoride is the most evil substance known to man.
    Chlorine Tri Fluoride is pretty close
    Chlorine trifluoride, ClF 3 , or "CTF" as the engineers insist on call-
    ing it, is a colorless gas, a greenish liquid, or a white solid. It boils at
    12° (so that a trivial pressure will keep it liquid at room temperature)
    and freezes at a convenient —76°.
    ..
    All this sounds fairly academic and innocuous, but when it is trans-
    lated into the problem of handling the stuff, the results are horren-
    dous. It is, of course, extremely toxic, but that's the least of the prob-
    lem. It is hypergolic with every known fuel, and so rapidly hypergolic
    that no ignition delay has ever been measured. It is also hypergolic
    with such things as cloth, wood, and test engineers, not to mention
    asbestos, sand, and water —with which it reacts explosively. It can be
    kept in some of the ordinary structural metals — steel, copper, alumi-
    num, etc. —because of the formation of a thin film of insoluble metal
    fluoride which protects the bulk of the metal, just as the invisible coat
    of oxide on aluminum keeps it from burning up in the atmosphere.
    If, however, this coat is melted or scrubbed off, and has no chance to
    reform, the operator is confronted with the problem of coping with a
    metal-fluorine fire. For dealing with this situation, I have always rec-
    ommended a good pair of running shoes.

    ClF3 is pretty much like the blood of the creatures in Alien. Except it's boiling and it gives off more fumes. And flames.


  • Options
    #641
    AnonoBoy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,559 ✭✭✭✭AnonoBoy


    Capt'n Midnight wrote: »
    Chlorine Tri Fluoride is pretty close

    Thanks for the cut and paste.

    What's the point you're making?


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #642
    tommythecat
    Registered Users Posts: 687 ✭✭✭tommythecat


    AnonoBoy wrote: »
    Thanks for the cut and paste.

    What's the point you're making?

    A Joke I'D Say

    4kwp South East facing PV System. 5.3kwh Weco battery. South Dublin City.



  • Options
    #643
    AnonoBoy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,559 ✭✭✭✭AnonoBoy


    tommythecat wrote: »
    A Joke I'D Say

    Hah! I saw a wedge of text and didn't even bother to read it!


  • Options
    #644
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,034 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Call me Al wrote: »
    Interesting interview on Sean o'Rourke right now on this.

    He has claimed that if consumed by pregnant women it can cause, ADHD, autism, and most shocking of all Down's syndrome in children.

    Declan Waugh?

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Options
    #645
    P. Breathnach
    Registered Users Posts: 12,089 ✭✭✭✭P. Breathnach


    Joeytheparrot wrote: »
    Declan Waugh?
    Yup.


  • Options
    #646
    turbot
    Registered Users Posts: 1,106 ✭✭✭turbot


    Joeytheparrot wrote: »
    It's about pointing out the dangerous idiocy of her beliefs so that serious decision makers do not rashly decide on a public healthcare issue.

    Joey, please can you disclose for us your qualifications and basis of expertise that you seem to assume equip you to judge the belief systems of the girl against flouride?

    Do you make the logical leap that because some of the things she believes in seem idiotic to you, she shouldn't request that flouride be removed from the public water supply?

    Also, please qualify for us, are you a qualified scientific researcher?


  • Options
    #647
    Muise...
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,512 ✭✭✭Muise...


    turbot wrote: »
    Joey, please can you disclose for us your qualifications and basis of expertise that you seem to assume equip you to judge the belief systems of the girl against flouride?

    Do you make the logical leap that because some of the things she believes in seem idiotic to you, she shouldn't request that flouride be removed from the public water supply?

    Also, please qualify for us, are you a qualified scientific researcher?

    Jesus take the wheel, the "logical leap" is to find that some of the things she believes in are illogical. This is based on evidence and reason. Let her get her tits out and make all the requests she wants, the concern is that she might be heeded in her delusions.


  • Options
    #648
    jescart
    Registered Users Posts: 140 ✭✭jescart


    Does bottled water have fluoride? Either sparkling or still.


  • Options
    #649
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,216 ✭✭✭jh79


    http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/colette-browne/claims-by-antiflouride-campaigners-just-dont-wash-with-the-facts-30084145.html


  • Options
    #650
    MS.ing
    Closed Accounts Posts: 680 ✭✭✭MS.ing


    its this simple really, just wear your tinfoil hat and that will protect you from the flouride.


  • Options
    #651
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,034 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    P. Breathnach wrote: »
    Yup.

    Thought so
    http://gerbyrne.blogspot.ie/2014/02/inside-mind-of-anti-fluoridationist.html?m=1

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #652
    AnonoBoy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,559 ✭✭✭✭AnonoBoy


    turbot wrote: »
    Also, please qualify for us, are you a qualified scientific researcher?

    I'm not but I trust those who are highly qualified in their field. I would certainly trust them over the Girl Against Fluoride who seems to not even have an understanding of science up to Junior Cert level.


  • Options
    #653
    Capt'n Midnight
    Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 90,966 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    MS.ing wrote: »
    its this simple really, just wear your tinfoil hat and that will protect you from the flouride.
    That's what they want you to think.

    Tinfoil hats aren't shields, it's more like wearing a satellite dish tuned to government frequencies. http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/tinfoil-hats-actually-amplify.html


  • Options
    #654
    turbot
    Registered Users Posts: 1,106 ✭✭✭turbot


    Muise... wrote: »
    Jesus take the wheel, the "logical leap" is to find that some of the things she believes in are illogical. This is based on evidence and reason. Let her get her tits out and make all the requests she wants, the concern is that she might be heeded in her delusions.

    Actually, if you study belief systems, you'll find there is great variance in what people believe.

    A large proportion of the World believe in an imaginary friend called God who they think controls everything. A large proportion of the people in the World believe in multiple imaginary friends they refer to as Gods. Like Robert Anton Wilson says, some people spend their whole lives engaged in religious wars alledgely based upon whos imaginary friend is better.

    If a person believes in some stuff that seems stupid to you, it does not mean that all their perceptions are flawed, or requests incorrect. And science is an evolving field, in 100 years time, we will have completely different views on what we think is true today, and look back upon our current ideas as being as crude as medicinal practices from 1910.

    Obviously you have never read: http://www.amazon.com/The-Structure-Scientific-Revolutions-Edition/dp/0226458083


  • Options
    #655
    Plates
    Registered Users Posts: 925 ✭✭✭Plates


    turbot wrote: »
    Actually, if you study belief systems, you'll find there is great variance in what people believe.

    A large proportion of the World believe in an imaginary friend called God who they think controls everything. A large proportion of the people in the World believe in multiple imaginary friends they refer to as Gods. Like Robert Anton Wilson says, some people spend their whole lives engaged in religious wars alledgely based upon whos imaginary friend is better.

    If a person believes in some stuff that seems stupid to you, it does not mean that all their perceptions are flawed, or requests incorrect. And science is an evolving field, in 100 years time, we will have completely different views on what we think is true today, and look back upon our current ideas as being as crude as medicinal practices from 1910.

    Obviously you have never read: http://www.amazon.com/The-Structure-Scientific-Revolutions-Edition/dp/0226458083


    Jesus


  • Options
    #656
    Muise...
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,512 ✭✭✭Muise...


    turbot wrote: »
    Actually, if you study belief systems, you'll find there is great variance in what people believe.

    Indeed.

    Some beliefs are based on the best of our knowledge and open to correction.

    Some beliefs are based on false information.

    Some beliefs are based on wishful thinking.

    Some beliefs are so fcuking wrong they can't even see how wrong they are because fragile idiots hold on to them all their might.

    I "believe" I'd rather let experts (who know things) decide on public health matters based on evidence.

    Science is not a belief system.


    [Also, I'm not saying that everything TGAF believes is wrong; just the nonsense about fluoride - you know, the actual subject of this thread.]


  • Options
    #657
    Jonny7
    Registered Users Posts: 6,696 ✭✭✭Jonny7


    turbot wrote: »
    Actually, if you study belief systems, you'll find there is great variance in what people believe.

    A large proportion of the World believe in an imaginary friend called God who they think controls everything. A large proportion of the people in the World believe in multiple imaginary friends they refer to as Gods. Like Robert Anton Wilson says, some people spend their whole lives engaged in religious wars alledgely based upon whos imaginary friend is better.

    If a person believes in some stuff that seems stupid to you, it does not mean that all their perceptions are flawed, or requests incorrect. And science is an evolving field, in 100 years time, we will have completely different views on what we think is true today, and look back upon our current ideas as being as crude as medicinal practices from 1910.

    Obviously you have never read: http://www.amazon.com/The-Structure-Scientific-Revolutions-Edition/dp/0226458083

    I thought everyone will be dead from fluoride poisoning in 100 years? - maybe the few survivors, the ones who only drank bottled water, bought bio lettuce and had regular acupuncture will dig up this thread in the archives and lament that we didn't all listen to fluoride girl


  • Options
    #658
    weisses
    Registered Users Posts: 9,448 ✭✭✭weisses


    Neurodevelopmental disabilities, including autism, attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder, dyslexia, and other cognitive impairments, affect millions of children worldwide, and some diagnoses seem to be increasing in frequency. Industrial chemicals that injure the developing brain are among the known causes for this rise in prevalence. In 2006, we did a systematic review and identified five industrial chemicals as developmental neurotoxicants: lead, methylmercury, polychlorinated biphenyls, arsenic, and toluene. Since 2006, epidemiological studies have documented six additional developmental neurotoxicants—manganese, fluoride, chlorpyrifos, dichlorodiphenyltrichloroethane, tetrachloroethylene, and the polybrominated diphenyl ethers. We postulate that even more neurotoxicants remain undiscovered. To control the pandemic of developmental neurotoxicity, we propose a global prevention strategy. Untested chemicals should not be presumed to be safe to brain development, and chemicals in existing use and all new chemicals must therefore be tested for developmental neurotoxicity. To coordinate these efforts and to accelerate translation of science into prevention, we propose the urgent formation of a new international clearinghouse.

    Another nice one ...Labelling fluoride as a developmental neurotoxicant

    To control the pandemic of developmental neurotoxicity, we propose a global prevention strategy

    Probably another wacky CT conclusion .... Ohh wait

    http://www.thelancet.com/journals/laneur/article/PIIS1474-4422%2813%2970278-3/abstract


  • Options
    #659
    P. Breathnach
    Registered Users Posts: 12,089 ✭✭✭✭P. Breathnach


    weisses wrote: »
    Another nice one ...Labelling fluoride as a developmental neurotoxicant

    To control the pandemic of developmental neurotoxicity, we propose a global prevention strategy

    Probably another wacky CT conclusion .... Ohh wait

    http://www.thelancet.com/journals/laneur/article/PIIS1474-4422%2813%2970278-3/abstract
    Just about every substance is dangerous when the dosages are high enough. The abstract you link gives no indication of the dosage that gives rise to concern.


  • Options
    #660
    weisses
    Registered Users Posts: 9,448 ✭✭✭weisses


    P. Breathnach wrote: »
    Just about every substance is dangerous when the dosages are high enough. The abstract you link gives no indication of the dosage that gives rise to concern.
    To control the pandemic of developmental neurotoxicity, we propose a global prevention strategy. Untested chemicals should not be presumed to be safe to brain development, and chemicals in existing use and all new chemicals must therefore be tested for developmental neurotoxicity.

    The fact they are worried should make you a bit more conscious as well

    The "everything can be dangerous" spin doesn't fly here


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #661
    Muise...
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,512 ✭✭✭Muise...


    weisses wrote: »
    The fact they are worried should make you a bit more conscious as well

    The "everything can be dangerous" spin doesn't fly here

    It's not the fluoride in the water supply they are worried about as that is measured and tested.


Advertisement