Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 2013- Mod Warning Post #1

tomwaterford

Slobbery wrote: »

Hi - ya I totally agree with you - and I wasnt thinking of you by the way with my comment. but as you say this forum has been nothing short of scandalous the last while, it is one thing trying to get a reaction or reponse from people but there is alot of nasty and personal stuff on here.

I think this topic needs to be cleaned up a lot by moderators to be honest

id be as critical as any...but there no need for some of the comments that have been posted in the last few days esp since Dublin match

its getting a little out of hand...no word of what actually happened on the pitch...this training camp was well flagged-why object now??

I think its a relatively good idea...the issues will be aired and wont the piss up that's being suggested (there funding it themselves...that's great commitment in my eyes anyway)
even its a bit of drinking-so what they have no game until end of may (exluding club games...when are they to start btw??)

the league is done...Waterford relegated....hopfully the management can fix all the issues (there are many) for the end of may...otherwise it will be the shortest summer in good few years

3ships

Cornerstoner wrote: »

With respect to you as a poster, that all irrelevant now. We are down, no good with the if buts and maybes

On the ball. Its fairly hard to post without using buts,if or maybes!!. I understand the league table doesn't lie and we were truely blessed to get a home play off draw so no excuses here. The league campaign was dismantled in Ennis and Nowlan Park (well analysed by yourself) and anything resembling a decent performance in those games would have seen us ok. There will be no excuses next year to get out of 1b as well.

I still don't understand the general theme here (not you personally Cornerstoner) that we don't have the players or the players aren't good enough. Tactics and fitness and substitutions (taking off Shane Fives in Ennis and bringing on Barry Coughlan who had a yellow card from a blood sub as one example) have been questionable and going forward to the championship that needs to be put right. Our deficiency is a novice management team (hopefully they'll learn quick) and a massive injury list. Our style of play is dependent on getting players fit. You can't achieve anything without the right players. Everybody agrees the Kilkenny game last year was a step forward but less than half of those players are available at this moment and of those only Shane Fives (SOS, Prender to an extent, our all stars were not up to their level) had a good league so how do you make up the difference!!

WATERFORD (v Cats 2013 July): S O’Keeffe; S Fives, L Lawlor, N Connors; J Nagle, M Walsh, K Moran (c); R Foley, D Fives; J Dillon, S Prendergast, S O’Sullivan; J Barron, M Shanahan, B O’Sullivan.

With the championship in mind can we first improve on that team. I would say Taghe Bourke, Ray Barry, Brian O Halloran, Phillip Mahony, Paraic Mahony, Stephen Molumphy would and possibly Shane Walsh, Stephen Daniels and Paudie Prendrgast (that in addition to a half dozen lads that will serve the extended panel well)

So the players are there over to Derek McGrath to get em fit and playing with purpose!!

O Riain

Can anyone provide our scorers from play and points scored for duration of league please?

avonmore

O Riain wrote: »

Can anyone provide our scorers from play and points scored for duration of league please?

It breaks down as follows........

Paudie Mahony = 1-13
Ray Barry = 0-9
Brian O'Sullivan = 0-9
Ryan Donnelly = 0-4
Daragh Fives = 1-0
Stephen Molomphy = 0-3
Kevin Moran = 0-3
Phillip Mahony = 0-2
Maurice Shanahan = 0-2
Seamus Predergast = 0-2
Jake Dillon = 0-1
Stephen Roche = 0-1
Jamie Barron = 0-1
Shane Walsh = 0-1
Jamie Nagle = 0-1
Shane O'Sullivan = 0-1


Paudie got 0-40 from placed balls ,
Maurice Shanahan got 0-1 from placed balls
Austin Gleeson got 0-1 from a sideline cut.

robopaddy

avonmore wrote: »

It breaks down as follows........

Paudie Mahony = 1-13
Ray Barry = 0-9
Brian O'Sullivan = 0-9
Ryan Donnelly = 0-4
Daragh Fives = 1-0
Stephen Molomphy = 0-3
Kevin Moran = 0-3
Phillip Mahony = 0-2
Maurice Shanahan = 0-2
Seamus Predergast = 0-2
Jake Dillon = 0-1
Stephen Roche = 0-1
Jamie Barron = 0-1
Shane Walsh = 0-1
Jamie Nagle = 0-1
Shane O'Sullivan = 0-1


Paudie got 0-14 from placed balls ,
Maurice Shanahan got 0-1 from placed balls
Austin Gleeson got 0-1 from a sideline cut.

The much maligned ray barry and b o sullivan are nearly the best we have when you look at the stats.

seananigans

Apparently Derek got Mullane to come out of retirement. Surely this shows desperation on his part

robopaddy

seananigans wrote: »

Apparently Derek got Mullane to come out of retirement. Surely this shows desperation on his part

Also strong rumours from last night that brick walsh has left the panel due to 'personal reasons'. Talk about a shambles. Portugal should be fun...

Horseboxhead

Ah Stop , No Really STOP.

Brad1234

I heard a rumour Paddy Joe Ryan has split with the Sliabh gcua Ramblers

STIG83

And Brian Cody has left KK and will be the new Waterford manager :pac:

hardybuck

STIG83 wrote: »

And Brian Cody has left KK and will be the new Waterford manager :pac:

He's actually going to be the new Waterford football manager.

Dantheman11

Yere only turning this into a whole piss take now lads come on

cul beag

Dantheman11 wrote: »

Yere only turning this into a whole piss take now lads come on

No harm in some light relief on here especially after the personal poison you posted up here yesterday. Pity i don't have any connection with him or his family or with another player that was named on here for looking to get Scully out cos id be telling them to report these cyber bullies to the guards. That's the only way these brainless idiots will be thought a lesson. Maybe some of their families do read these sites and take my advice. I certainly hope they do.

paddypounder

cul beag your a bit too big for your boots i didn't attack any player on the panel just gave my personal opinion which is what a forum is for. I don't see you giving any suggestions or advice how we can improve the panel or team all i see is you slating other posters.

Ropaire

Dantheman11 wrote: »

Yere only turning this into a whole piss take now lads come on

Its April fools day, sure if ya can't take the piss today when can ya take the piss?

Ropaire

avonmore wrote: »

It breaks down as follows........

Paudie Mahony = 1-13
Ray Barry = 0-9
Brian O'Sullivan = 0-9
Ryan Donnelly = 0-4
Daragh Fives = 1-0
Stephen Molomphy = 0-3
Kevin Moran = 0-3
Phillip Mahony = 0-2
Maurice Shanahan = 0-2
Seamus Predergast = 0-2
Jake Dillon = 0-1
Stephen Roche = 0-1
Jamie Barron = 0-1
Shane Walsh = 0-1
Jamie Nagle = 0-1
Shane O'Sullivan = 0-1


Paudie got 0-14 from placed balls ,
Maurice Shanahan got 0-1 from placed balls
Austin Gleeson got 0-1 from a sideline cut.

Paudie has 1-47 or something scored total, is it 1-13 from play and the rest frees? Pretty poor return from the other forwards bar Ray Barry and Brian O'Sullivan. O'Sullivan could and prob should have a few more beside his name for the amount of gametime he's had, but he can't win his own ball and and playing as the only forward couldn't help either.

Cornerstoner

3ships wrote: »

On the ball. Its fairly hard to post without using buts,if or maybes!!. I understand the league table doesn't lie and we were truely blessed to get a home play off draw so no excuses here. The league campaign was dismantled in Ennis and Nowlan Park (well analysed by yourself) and anything resembling a decent performance in those games would have seen us ok. There will be no excuses next year to get out of 1b as well.

I still don't understand the general theme here (not you personally Cornerstoner) that we don't have the players or the players aren't good enough. Tactics and fitness and substitutions (taking off Shane Fives in Ennis and bringing on Barry Coughlan who had a yellow card from a blood sub as one example) have been questionable and going forward to the championship that needs to be put right. Our deficiency is a novice management team (hopefully they'll learn quick) and a massive injury list. Our style of play is dependent on getting players fit. You can't achieve anything without the right players. Everybody agrees the Kilkenny game last year was a step forward but less than half of those players are available at this moment and of those only Shane Fives (SOS, Prender to an extent, our all stars were not up to their level) had a good league so how do you make up the difference!!

WATERFORD (v Cats 2013 July): S O’Keeffe; S Fives, L Lawlor, N Connors; J Nagle, M Walsh, K Moran (c); R Foley, D Fives; J Dillon, S Prendergast, S O’Sullivan; J Barron, M Shanahan, B O’Sullivan.

With the championship in mind can we first improve on that team. I would say Taghe Bourke, Ray Barry, Brian O Halloran, Phillip Mahony, Paraic Mahony, Stephen Molumphy would and possibly Shane Walsh, Stephen Daniels and Paudie Prendrgast (that in addition to a half dozen lads that will serve the extended panel well)

So the players are there over to Derek McGrath to get em fit and playing with purpose!!

Without personally attacking Derek McGrath, its clear that at this moment in time he hasn't the tactical nouse. It may come in time as other posters have said. And thats fine, but what's not ok is his attitude that he believes he holds all the answers when he does not. Outside expertise is required at the top level in this day and age. Just look at the size of the back room team Davy has at Clare. Hes got experts in every department, forward coaches etc. A managers job is to manage, not do everything himself. Manage your resources (players and coaches), if you don't have them within your camp then you go get them. Just look at the way Laois are going this year, all down to a superbly constructed backroom team

Dantheman11

cul beag wrote: »

No harm in some light relief on here especially after the personal poison you posted up here yesterday. Pity i don't have any connection with him or his family or with another player that was named on here for looking to get Scully out cos id be telling them to report these cyber bullies to the guards. That's the only way these brainless idiots will be thought a lesson. Maybe some of their families do read these sites and take my advice. I certainly hope they do.

I dont know what your talking about, I never mentioned any players name on here, or said anything about Scully. I merely alluded to the fact that I heard from a reliable source that these holidays have the potential to turn out differently than expected.

avonmore

Ropaire wrote: »

Paudie has 1-47 or something scored total, is it 1-13 from play and the rest frees? Pretty poor return from the other forwards bar Ray Barry and Brian O'Sullivan. O'Sullivan could and prob should have a few more beside his name for the amount of gametime he's had, but he can't win his own ball and and playing as the only forward couldn't help either.

The first figures in bold are from play.

The figures underneath are from placed balls but, apologies, I think Paudie got about 0-40 not 0-14 from these.

Shane O'Sullivan would have started and finished nearly all six games played.

Barry's and Donnelly's averages are probably better, seeing as they didn't see as much gametime.

TheBomber14

a lot of tripe being spouted here the last day or two, from what iv seen in the last couple of days it seems that 1 or 2 posters are trying to control the majority of the rest of people, this is not a dictatorship and people are allowed express their views however crazy they may seem. I have gone through the posts of the previous day and found nothing defamatory or personally vindictive within the posts. It seems that some posters on here have a chip on their shoulder regards certain aspects of the countys gaa scene. I am a proud waterford man and hope nobody else will resort to this bullying of fellow members from now on. desie abu

alllcounty

Cornerstoner wrote: »

Without personally attacking Derek McGrath, its clear that at this moment in time he hasn't the tactical nouse. It may come in time as other posters have said. And thats fine, but what's not ok is his attitude that he believes he holds all the answers when he does not. Outside expertise is required at the top level in this day and age. Just look at the size of the back room team Davy has at Clare. Hes got experts in every department, forward coaches etc. A managers job is to manage, not do everything himself. Manage your resources (players and coaches), if you don't have them within your camp then you go get them. Just look at the way Laois are going this year, all down to a superbly constructed backroom team

Hit the nail on the head. I would much prefer to have a manager that has a very good back room team around him and has the ability to take a step back and bring the best out of the rest of the management team than having a manager that is over powering and not realising we have a problem that may need expertise outside of the county to fix it.



I know some won’t like me saying this but Laois currently have a set up that we had last year. Their manager Seamus Plunkett reminds me of Michael Ryan, he has assembled a very good back room team and Plunkett helps to bind the management team together so collectively the players get the best from the management set up. They also have 3 of our backroom team from last year doing their hurling training and their strength & conditioning. This year they have been excellent. If we had a similar manager and backroom team we would be playing very good hurling now instead of this mess we are now in.

avonmore

alllcounty wrote: »

Hit the nail on the head. I would much prefer to have a manager that has a very good back room team around him and has the ability to take a step back and bring the best out of the rest of the management team than having a manager that is over powering and not realising we have a problem that may need expertise outside of the county to fix it.



I know some won’t like me saying this but Laois currently have a set up that we had last year. Their manager Seamus Plunkett reminds me of Michael Ryan, he has assembled a very good back room team and Plunkett helps to bind the management team together so collectively the players get the best from the management set up. They also have 3 of our backroom team from last year doing their hurling training and their strength & conditioning. This year they have been excellent. If we had a similar manager and backroom team we would be playing very good hurling now instead of this mess we are now in.

I maybe wrong, but I thought the idea behind Derek's backroom team was that Willie Maher would be look after the management side, leaving Derek and Frank Flannery to look after the coaching side.

Whatever the make up, things are definitely not as they should be, as of now anyway.

cul beag

paddypounder wrote: »

cul beag your a bit too big for your boots i didn't attack any player on the panel just gave my personal opinion which is what a forum is for. I don't see you giving any suggestions or advice how we can improve the panel or team all i see is you slating other posters.

Sorry now but this will be my last post to you and your other a/c bomber14 or whatever your name is today. You spread a malicious rumour about a player on here that you knew was bull**** because of your personal hatred for the youngfella. You were happy to put it out there hoping to land the guy in a load of bother. How vindictive is that. As for debating about the future of Waterford hurling I have no problem in doing so but only with genuine supporters not with people on here that are using this forum to try to character assassinate the good names of players who are giving their utmost for Waterford hurling. Don't try to cover your poison with ur deise Abu tripe we can all see through it. Yes this form is for personal opinions but not for personal vendettas like yours.

paddypounder

I never mentioned any names ye all assumed and you should never assume anything.

bruschi

to give an oustsiders view, from someone who would see a bit of Waterford hurling,

I'm not sure why all the anger? Firstly, you were favorites to be relegated, and all the pundits and media commentators picked Waterford to go down. This in itself caused a lot of indignation on here and people getting upset over it. But it was a call based on reality, and one that was shown to be the case. Of the teams in Div 1, I would pick Waterford and Dublin to be at the bottom end of them. So to me, its not a shock that you have been relegated. Especially considering the turnover in players and management in off season.

Division 2 wont set you back. It wont do you any favours either, but taken the right way, it could prove beneficial for blooding younger players next season where the fear of relegation wont be an issue. Its far from ideal, but it shouldnt be a long term thing. there would be 2 good games with Limerick and Wexford, and even Antrim and Laois would prove a good test for a young side.

Again, from an outside view, the trip to Portugal is baffling. Waterford have been struggling (or at least seems to be) with funds for a few years. The squad have come out and fund raised for this, fair play and all that. But seriously, would the money they are raising not be far better spent on something else rather than a trip away. Yes, there is no doubt they'll train and all that, but you can train anywhere. Going to Portugal seems like a massive waste of funds for a county that cant spare it. Especially at this time of year. Going to Portugal now is a nice holiday, not an intensive training camp. They may not drink much, and they may train hard, but at the end of it all, its still a nice holiday away in the sun. Now maybe people will think they deserve it, or it would be a good break for them, and so be it.

I think there may be a false sense of reality as to where Waterford currently stand in the pecking order. I have seen it for years in Wexford. Always 'ah sure on our day, championship brings the best out of them, we'll come right yet', and here we are years down the line barely getting a grasp on things now again. Its very easy to sit back and think things will be rosy, and to try mask over where you really are. You are certainly not back where Wexford are right now, but without the proper structures and a sense of reality that things have to change, then we'll soon be passing you out. There is a good minor crop there, between the succesful school and county teams, and they need to be harnessed in the right way. You only have to look at a 3 in a row U21 winning Limerick team to realise that underage titles mean nothing unless they are brought through to senior in the right way.

Waterford will be back, but it wont happen overnight. McGrath may or may not be the right man, but if he has a 3 year plan, then he should be let work on it through this championship and into Div2 of the legue next year.

cul beag

Hectic schedule by all accounts for the hurlers in Portugal. I spoke with one of the players dad's earlier and he said its full on from the minute they landed today. 2 sessions booked in for today alone,and 3 for each day after that. Hopefully they can work on whatever game plan or plans that they're trying to implement and iron out the problems especially from the last 3 games.

paddypounder

Forever blue and white

paddypounder

Anyone know how the footballers are going

Brad1234

alllcounty wrote: »

Hit the nail on the head. I would much prefer to have a manager that has a very good back room team around him and has the ability to take a step back and bring the best out of the rest of the management team than having a manager that is over powering and not realising we have a problem that may need expertise outside of the county to fix it.



I know some won’t like me saying this but Laois currently have a set up that we had last year. Their manager Seamus Plunkett reminds me of Michael Ryan, he has assembled a very good back room team and Plunkett helps to bind the management team together so collectively the players get the best from the management set up. They also have 3 of our backroom team from last year doing their hurling training and their strength & conditioning. This year they have been excellent. If we had a similar manager and backroom team we would be playing very good hurling now instead of this mess we are now in.

Just on this and the ryan issue the main point id like to make is:

He never had a settled backroom team..

He was looking for a top class coach a couple of times a year but never got them.. Even again in his 'media appearances' on his backroom team after the players said they didnt want him he said i was in the process of looking for a top class coach and all i could think of is you've had two years to get one..

The idea that cunningham was rowing in is laughable after his 3 visits last year.. This isnt a defence of Mcgrath far from it but the people heralding Michael Ryan as some sort of super manager need to stop spouting baseless information..

Comparing Laois is ridiculous they are two years down the line with that manager and are still going to be bang average come summer.. Just cause they ran a clare side close in the league when clare probably played in neutral doesn't make him world beaters.. Seen Laois 4 or times over last two years and its a worse style then the Donegal 2011 Football side so again people wouldn't be happy with that either.

If Ryan really wanted to get a top class coach he'd have no problem getting them but he didn't and thats completely where he failed i believe in the players eyes..


McGrath has a lot of work to do after a poor league but to be championing ryan is ridiculous.. he had an incredible amount of flaws and with the expectation some of the people have on this board of the players why shouldn't the players expect the same level of training in order to meet the expectation.

avonmore

Folks, it mightn't be a bad idea to get away from the doom and gloom of the Country set up by discussing the club championship.

The two groups....

Passage, Abbeyside, De La Salle, Fourmilewater, Roanmore, Lismore.

Ballygunner, Mount Sion, Dungarvan, Ballyduff, Tallow, Ardmore


Even allowing for Passages brilliant victory last year, I would rate the teams in three tiers as below.

Ballygunner, De La Salle, Mount Sion.

Passage, Abbeyside, Ballyduff, Lismore, Fourmilewater, Dungarvan

Tallow, Roanmore and Ardmore.

I group one DLS and Passage will definitely qualify, it will be a dog fight between Abbeyside, Lismore and Foumilewater for 2 of 3.

Lismore were very bad last year and would need to improve. Fourmilewater and Abbeyside are always very strong in the early rounds until the football gets in the way.


As for the second group, I would say Ballygunner, Mount Sion, Dungarvan and Ballyduff will all make the knockouts.

Ballyduff were by far the most competitive of the teams in the far west last year. Ardmore just coming up will definitely target Tallow who have been in decline now for a few years and will be vulnerable.