Windows 8 Launch Discussion

Elysian

Fysh wrote: »

Did that grouping happen automatically for you or did you have to do it manually?

I can see automatic grouping of like software applications making Notro much better; my frustration with it was the cack-handed nature of the default shortcuts (between things like the default icons including a bunch of crap I didn't want, and the weirdness of how it added shortcuts when i installed software eg not adding a steam shortcut but adding a shortcut for one of the MS runtime libraries).

When you install a program it automatically adds any shortcut to leads to a .exe file only to the UI. The grouping isn't done automatically, you need to drag each icon into the block you want it in, hopefully this pic shows what I mean:



I'm dragging my Moog Modular V icon there. If I bring it to the right of that barrier it will group with my MS Office Icons, if I bring it to the left it will group with my music app icons.

Head The Wall

stevenmu wrote: »

Are you sure about that? Do you have a source?

I know that Windows Store bought stuff will have a kill switch option. But as far as I'm aware any applications or content acquired elsewhere, no matter where, is effected.

I was at the tech day in London yesterday and this is the case, these restrictions will only apply to Windows 8 apps which will have been tested for functionality and problems by Microsoft and then certified. It'll be similar to Apples app store.
Desktops can be downloaded and installed as normal.

The tech day didn't cover 8 to much other then Direct Access and windows to go. Most of it was about Server 2012 and how easy it was to deploy, administer and lock down Windows 8. It was an interesting day though.

I can't see to many enterprises completely migrating soon but I can see some integrating purely for remote access for mobile users. The bank I worked in are only now migrating to windows 7 from XP.

Overheal

Elysian wrote: »

Not really, this is only a partial list of the shortcuts I have on my Metro UI. Since one can't scroll across ones desktop there wouldn't be enough room on it for all my applications. Not to mention I like to keep my desktop tidy.

I could use a folder of app shortcuts but with Metro the shortcuts are made automatically and unlike a folder of shortcuts I can organize these for ease of use. Notice in the picture the first block of icons are music apps, second is MS office, third is the Adobe Master Collection, fourth are general system apps etc etc.

Edit: I should also point out that I am enjoying other aspects of Metro too, some of the apps on it are great. I was just trying to show that as an organizational tool it's a lot better than the previous start menu that it's replacing or any 3rd party dock I've used before imo.

Also if you zoom out on the start menu (click in the bottom right of the screen) you can right click on any of those groups and assign them a name, eg. "Music" "Adobe" etc.

pedatron wrote: »

Installed last night and my metro tiles just do not work. The launch screen for them comes up and it just jumps back to the tiles screen. Has anyone found a solution or even had this problem as well??

You can try the windows repair utilities in the Settings menu, but also ensure you've downloaded all of your updates.

Elysian

Overheal wrote: »

Also if you zoom out on the start menu (click in the bottom right of the screen) you can right click on any of those groups and assign them a name, eg. "Music" "Adobe" etc.

I did not know that, awesome!

Mister Gooey

Upgraded from Visra over the weekend. The windows 8 operating system is so much faster on everything I've trialled. Very fast at installing software, even ITunes. The "tiles" on the Start page works very well and really changed how you will use your desktop. For a upgrade €30, it has been relatively simple. You do have to reinstall some your "old software" afterwards, such as the graphics card drivers/software, iTunes, keyboard / mouse... But the reinstalling is very fast and stable.

_Kaiser_

Right, never let it be said I won't give something a second chance

I'm typing this post from an Acer Iconia W500 that I picked up from Adverts yesterday so now I have the full "touch" experience as the devs intended, but the reason I bought this was to replace a Blackberry Playbook that I found too small and limiting as a result of its poor app support - that said, if you just want to browse, check your email and Facebook etc and read eBooks etc it's a great choice owing to its solid construction and price v storage ratio...

Anyway, having played with this W500 since yesterday evening, what are my thoughts?

- Yes touch input makes Win 8 a LOT more usable
- It is nice having certain apps I use on my Galaxy Note available on my Windows desktop, eg: TuneIn
- As a power user having everything I use on my laptop available on a tablet is a huge plus, as opposed to "making do" with Android versions for example

But....
- The keyboard, just as it is with Windows Phone, is muck. Having to switch to a alternate screen to get numbers and characters is painful and unnecessary when you contrast it to say Swiftkey on Android
- It BADLY needs predictive text and auto correction. Typing this post has taken a lot longer than it should and I'm usually a pretty fast/good typist
- I prefer Chrome to IE so was happy to see a version for Win8 but there's issues with it yet - seems sluggish and the keyboard behaves a bit oddly - but hopefully these will be resolved sooner rather than later
- This tablet has an SD slot so I will upgrade/double the storage space from the onboard 32GB as otherwise I could see space rapidly becoming an issue as it's already nearly half full and I haven't installed Office yet
- I installed Classic Shell as while the Start screen is a lot better on a tablet, a hobbled desktop is still stupid, especially for getting quick access to advanced settings

Regardless though, this won't be making it to my laptop as it just does not work well enough with traditional input methods

BostonB

You must have not liked the Android keyboard either, which is why you replaced it with swiftkey. I don't think its a valid comparison comparing an on screen keyboard with a regular keyboard on a laptop? You won't be using the onscreen keyboard on a laptop? Similarly criticism of Chrome performance has no relation to how it will be on a laptop with difference hardware. Kinda odd comparisons.

Reviews seem to that tablet its kinda slow for W8.

Using this tablet is akin to tapping away on a fairly slow Windows laptop. There are nods to touchscreen-only use, but the screen is not sufficiently sensitive nor the CPU sufficiently fast to keep pace with what you expect to be able to do.

Read more: http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/reviews/tablets/3279702/acer-iconia-tab-w500-review/#ixzz2AadbqBPS

The processor speed is somewhere between a single core 1.6 GHz Atom N455 and a dual core Atom N550 depending on the benchmark (see below). Therefore, the performance is still in netbook regions and only suited for low demanding tasks.

http://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-C-50-Notebook-Processor.40960.0.html

I think W8 flies on an dual core old laptop I have. No problems with Chrome on that. However IE10 desktop I think is noticeable faster.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/robohornet-web-browser-performance,3303-3.html
http://www.webmonkey.com/2012/10/review-internet-explorer-10-bests-the-competition-on-windows-8-tablets/

That said its an interesting to see your take on it. Personally I don't think any touch screen experience beats apples.
But you pay through the nose for it.

_Kaiser_

BostonB wrote: »

You must have not liked the Android keyboard either, which is why you replaced it with swiftkey. I don't think its a valid comparison comparing an on screen keyboard with a regular keyboard on a laptop? You won't be using the onscreen keyboard on a laptop? Similarly criticism of Chrome performance has no relation to how it will be on a laptop with difference hardware. Kinda odd comparisons.

I agree that there's not an on screen keyboard yet that can compare to a physical one for responsiveness - but I was comparing it to Swiftkey which is far superior.

It's not going to be good enough for MS to say "it's a new platform.. we're still learning" etc. Potential buyers will be weighing it up against what else is out there NOW and having a poor keyboard interface, no auto correction etc is not a good start - besides, given that "Modern" HAS been around a while (in WP7) there really IS no excuse for it what, 2 years on? Especially if they're going to lock you in to using only that keyboard as they've done in WP7

Reviews seem to that tablet its kinda slow for W8.

But it boots up really fast!! Hasn't that been one of the main advantages I've read here from people who are advocating this new OS as "a good thing" :rolleyes:

But seriously, yes it's not going to be blazingly fast, but it's not actually that bad in the main either. Bottom line, I only paid just over €200.. naturally I'm not going to get the same performance as with my €1200 laptop, but REGARDLESS of how fast the underlying hardware may or may not be, if the functionality isn't there that's a big issue.

That said its an interesting to see your take on it. Personally I don't think any touch screen experience beats apples.
But you pay through the nose for it.

I agree.. Apples stuff is wayyy overpriced for what it is, but again the restricted "you'll take what you're given and like it!" approach that MS are now aping with Win 8/Modern would put me off a lot quicker than a slightly slower machine.

fits

I installed Windows 8 yesterday. I wouldnt be a power user or anything like that. Just a standard PC user. I have a Windows Phone for the last 18 months and love the live tiles, and hey, I was bored yesterday so I installed windows 8 on my Dell Inspiron laptop with I3 Core processor.

Initial impressions are that it looks great and I can really see where they are going with the touch interface. I love the live tiles and being able to check your emails, notifications, the weather etc at a glance from the start screen. Thats really useful to me. Its also very fast. Also coming from windows phone, I've no problem navigating around windows 8.

Only downside so far is that it has been a tiny bit buggy and restarted a couple of times but since it was only released widely on Friday, I'm willing to cut microsoft some slack.

I think the surface is going to be really useful for people like myself who travel a lot for work, and I wouldnt mind one. As a gadget I'd prefer the ipad, but the Surface is much more practical and if I were contemplating spending 500 euro on something, that would be what I'd go for.

BostonB

You might want to make sure you've all the right drivers. I used some from W7. I've not had any version of W8 restart and I've had different versions installed for about a year.

fits

I havent really identified a pattern with the restarts yet. I updated all the apps, and I'm not getting any particular error messages. I'm sure I will figure it out.

desaparecidos

Can't believe how buggy the "modern ui" is. Some apps open for a second, crash and go back to the start menu. How some of the usability aspects and basic bug detection got past testing is amazing!

BostonB

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

I agree that there's not an on screen keyboard yet that can compare to a physical one for responsiveness - but I was comparing it to Swiftkey which is far superior....

That essentially a 3rd party app. its not comparing the stock keyboard with other stock keyboards.

As such you might want to look at alternate keyboards.

http://forum.tabletpcreview.com/umpc-ultra-mobile-pc/29943-alternative-onscreen-keyboard-windows-7-a.html

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

But it boots up really fast!! Hasn't that been one of the main advantages I've read here from people who are advocating this new OS as "a good thing" :rolleyes:

Theres a lot of useful info in the thread. You choose what you find useful.

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

But seriously, yes it's not going to be blazingly fast, but it's not actually that bad in the main either. Bottom line, I only paid just over €200.. naturally I'm not going to get the same performance as with my €1200 laptop, but REGARDLESS of how fast the underlying hardware may or may not be, if the functionality isn't there that's a big issue.

I gave you a link that complained that this specific tablet performance limitation causes problem with smooth user input. Which is the same issue if you use a low end android, or obsolete Iphone with the latest updates. The hardware isn't up to it. Simple as. That €200 tablet is inadequate to a €100 laptop in that regard.

While its useful to see how hear how it runs on underpowered tablet. Its not that relevant to compare with using it on a desktop or laptop. I would suggest that using W8 under a touch input merits its own thread, rather than this one which (I assume) is people using it without touch input.

BostonB

desaparecidos wrote: »

Can't believe how buggy the "modern ui" is. Some apps open for a second, crash and go back to the start menu. How some of the usability aspects and basic bug detection got past testing is amazing!

TBH I haven't used them much at all. Didn't like them. I Use the desktop versions. Which apps are crashing?

Are you logging in using a live account. I didn't. I've currently on the Windows 8 Enterprise Evaluation relase not the consumer release one. Maybe things have changed.

fret_wimp2

Installed Windows 8 two nights ago and have spent the last few days getting to grips with it.

Its very different but once you get used to the keyboad shortcuts its a doddle to navigate on a non touch screen device. Also its super fast. On an SSD start up and shutdown times are 3 seconds or less, almost instant. It also feels slightly faster in general use.

One thing that must be stressed, after install, you do need a good hour of removing useless apps from the start menu, adding useful ones and setting up the start menu with the apps you want and not what microsoft wants you to use. This means that you shouldnt judge it after playing with it for 5 minutes.

Also, its very different but not in a bad way. its new so expect a little while to get used to it.

It installed flawlessly and all my hardware just worked, which is a first for me with windows.

I have a snapshot of my windows 7 configuration should i want to go back but dont think i will unless something major crops up.

All in all im quite pleased but worth repeating, take an hour or two to get used to it and set the start menu up the way you want it.And Learn the keyboard shortcuts, they make it infinitely better on a non touchscreen device.

Overheal

Kaiser2000 wrote: »

- The keyboard, just as it is with Windows Phone, is muck. Having to switch to a alternate screen to get numbers and characters is painful and unnecessary when you contrast it to say Swiftkey on Android

Should be an option in settings to show a fuller size keyboard as an option (in addition to your split-thumb keyboard etc.) I prefer the big touch version though, fewer keystroke misses and when I go to buttons I am usually jamming a lot of them, number strings are common in my passwords so the numpad is nice.

Regardless though, this won't be making it to my laptop as it just does not work well enough with traditional input methods

There are several touch input options available in the aftermarket, and surely more will follow. Logitech and Microsoft both have touch capable mice that can perform gesture control, and logitech put out a wireless trackpad that is multitouch and feels almost better than stroking the back of yer wan's leg. Acer also has put out the first ever aftermarket touchscreen monitor I've seen on a shelf.

matrim

Is is still possible to get the pre-release / beta to give it a quick go in a virtual machine before deciding to buy the upgrade license (have a new Win7 license so upgrade is only €15)

desaparecidos

Had to install Start8 to make any sense of the OS.
http://www.stardock.com/products/start8/

Well worth the couple of Euro. Thankfully I'm no longer confronted with a touch interface start or touch optimized app when trying to change system settings etc.

The boot on this particular machine takes a lot longer than Win 7. Are people who say the boot time is really fast sure they aren't just waking the PC from sleep?

peking97

fret_wimp2 wrote: »

I have a snapshot of my windows 7 configuration should i want to go back but dont think i will unless something major crops up.

Is that an option that is offered during every upgrade or is it something you organized yourself? I'm keen to try out the new OS but I'd prefer to be able to revert to Win 7 if I don't like 8.

mossie

desaparecidos wrote: »

Had to install Start8 to make any sense of the OS.
http://www.stardock.com/products/start8/

Well worth the couple of Euro. Thankfully I'm no longer confronted with a touch interface start or touch optimized app when trying to change system settings etc.

The boot on this particular machine takes a lot longer than Win 7. Are people who say the boot time is really fast sure they aren't just waking the PC from sleep?

Mine is much quicker from a cold boot than windows 7. Possibly because a lot of the crap autostarting with windows isn't windows 8 compliant so uninstalled?

Fysh

peking97 wrote: »

Is that an option that is offered during every upgrade or is it something you organized yourself? I'm keen to try out the new OS but I'd prefer to be able to revert to Win 7 if I don't like 8.

As far as I know you need to take a system image yourself before running through the upgrade. Something like Clonezilla or DriveImage XML can be used to do it for free, or you can use commercial products like Acronis True Image (bear in mind that if you've got a Seagate or Western Digital drive you may qualify for a free branded version of the basic TrueImage software - see here for Western Digital or here for Seagate).

Tinie

http://classicshell.sourceforge.net/

Also a start menu add on for those that want it for free.

Torqay

peking97 wrote: »

Is that an option that is offered during every upgrade or is it something you organized yourself? I'm keen to try out the new OS but I'd prefer to be able to revert to Win 7 if I don't like 8.

You'll have to organise this yourself, I'm afraid.

I connect another hard disk if I want to toy around with Windows 8 (of course, the old paranoia kicks in and I disconnect all other drives on which I don't want Microsoft snooping around). If I need to do serious computing, I just swap the HDD, a 2 Minutes job with reboot and I'm back to normal.

Or backup your drive as an image to another HDD so you can always revert back if you don't like it. (i.e. with Symantec Ghost, Drive Snapshot, EaseUs To Do Backup, Acronis TI, DriveImage XML or Clonezilla, to name but a few).

Or use a virtual machine to try Windows 8.

Overheal

desaparecidos wrote: »

Had to install Start8 to make any sense of the OS.
http://www.stardock.com/products/start8/

Well worth the couple of Euro. Thankfully I'm no longer confronted with a touch interface start or touch optimized app when trying to change system settings etc.

The boot on this particular machine takes a lot longer than Win 7. Are people who say the boot time is really fast sure they aren't just waking the PC from sleep?

Boot times should be faster. You won't see 3 seconds though without an SSD. Have you done a defragment if youre on an HDD? Try downloading Defraggler and let it do a boot time defragglerock

FYI: Control panel is still accessible from the start menu. You can also press Windows + X at any time to pull up the power user commands. And to see the admin control panel in Start, load the settings charm up in the start menu and the option should show up there: don't click into "PC Settings" -up at the top it says "Tiles". Click that, and switch "Show Administrative Tools" on.

desaparecidos

Overheal wrote: »

Boot times should be faster. You won't see 3 seconds though without an SSD. Have you done a defragment if youre on an HDD? Try downloading Defraggler and let it do a boot time defragglerock

FYI: Control panel is still accessible from the start menu. You can also press Windows + X at any time to pull up the power user commands. And to see the admin control panel in Start, load the settings charm up in the start menu and the option should show up there: don't click into "PC Settings" -up at the top it says "Tiles". Click that, and switch "Show Administrative Tools" on.

I did a clean install which formatted the partition. Even if it's a quick format would all new files written (e.g. Win8 files) not be written in the same part of the disk? Haven't tried Win8 on an SSD yet.

Having the Administrative Tools in as part of the Start screen is not any improvement really. Using big tiles with a mouse pointer just feels wrong.

My biggest gripe and why I'm going to keep using Start8:

I want to get to Devices and Printers:

• You hit Win key and start typing "Devices"
• Search results are filtered by Apps, so you have to choose Settings (two down key presses or move mouse and click)
• Now "Devices" is highlighted in the search results
• But wait, it's the stupidly large interface touch optimized version!
• Yes I'm on a desktop so give me normal version please. Arrow key right, hit enter.

Windows 7 version...

• Win key and start typing "Devices"
• Hit enter

Also Control Panel is filtered under Apps rather than Settings in search results which is just confusing. How is Control Panel more an app than Devices and Printers?

Skylinehead

Thinking about upgrading to Win8, few questions:

- Can I keep my programs? It's not a huge issue, but it would be nice, as I have Eclipse set up the way I want it. Bear in mind I'll be using a full version of Win8 Pro, free from Dreamspark (student yay :pac:)

- Any compatibility issues found?

Thanks in advance.

dulpit

Skylinehead wrote: »

Thinking about upgrading to Win8, few questions:

- Can I keep my programs? It's not a huge issue, but it would be nice, as I have Eclipse set up the way I want it. Bear in mind I'll be using a full version of Win8 Pro, free from Dreamspark (student yay :pac:)

- Any compatibility issues found?

Thanks in advance.

I upgraded and when I started the process it went through my apps for compatibility issues before it upgraded. All my apps were fine (although I only have things like VLC, Itunes & Football Manager as my commonly used apps). MS Office was fine too...

Tinie

Skylinehead wrote: »

Thinking about upgrading to Win8, few questions:

- Can I keep my programs? It's not a huge issue, but it would be nice, as I have Eclipse set up the way I want it. Bear in mind I'll be using a full version of Win8 Pro, free from Dreamspark (student yay :pac:)

- Any compatibility issues found?

Thanks in advance.

Its not in my software catalogue on dreamspark. What section was it under for you? All Im seeing is windows server 2012.

fret_wimp2

peking97 wrote: »

Is that an option that is offered during every upgrade or is it something you organized yourself? I'm keen to try out the new OS but I'd prefer to be able to revert to Win 7 if I don't like 8.

I just took a snapshot using the windows tools. that and a recovery disk and you can restore an old configuration. no need for 3rd party tools free or otherwise.

wotzgoingon

What is the best touch screen device to use with windows 8? I'm downloading the upgrade now. I'm thinking something a small bit bigger than a tablet that I can put on my lap and work away. Connect with HDMI. Is there even such a device?