Why Are Irish Rail Failing so badly

Jamie2k9

one (0505), and this is some sort of calamity breaching the Holy Covenant Of The Clockface,

06.15

Losty Dublin

foggy_lad wrote: »

There would also be fights amongst the drunks over who gets to "drive the train".

Reported for being another side swipe at RPSI and IRRS members.

Jamie2k9

At a timetable of 3h05m, a departure of 0505 and an oversized train in a Mark4 it's easy to see how the numbers don't add up, but the reality is that the first train Cork-Dublin is surely going to slip beyond the current 0810 even with more aggressive timetabling of the new 0600. I would have switched the 0505 to a 3x22K, reworked the stopping pattern of it and the Limerick service to take account of the new line speeds and only then decided if the market was indifferent.

I can see why the 05.05 being dropped as line speeds will not relay affect the journey because of all the stops. The new 06.00 will be in Heuston between 08.00-08.15 so that will result in the 05.05 being empty from Cork and Mallow. The 05.30 from Limerick will pick up BallyB and another service will pick up Newbridge if not the 05.30. If the 05.05 was to stay then running a 3 car to Portlaois then join another 3 would make sense as I can't see the stopping pattern changing. The ICR's would be better suited with the constent breaking. Charville passengers will only lose out is there many from there on the service?

What is key to this timetable is the journey times from X to Portarlington/Cherryville are achievable particularly Cork services as the majority of Galway/Wesport and Waterford services are achievable. Adding time at the end is great for OTP but not for overall service in general as one service with a 5 min + delay after these points cause most other service delays.

Off topic but recently I learned the 06.35 limited stop from Galway is only 3 car set, are numbers that low?

ArmaniJeanss

parsi wrote: »

You don't get the point.

It's not about Cork.

It's about introducing a clockface service and then ditching it.

Clockface is the Holy Grail of transport. Companies strive to get there and hang onto it.

IE have obviously decided that they don't care. This is bad for customers and also bad for enthusiasts as it suggests that the company is incompetent.

Clockface timetabling would be somewhere at the bottom of my list of issues when it comes to public transport to be honest. Reliability, efficiency, punctuality, speed, comfort, cleanliness, frequency, safety would be way ahead of it.

Granted there may well have been a time when clockface was handy - 10/15 years ago finding out the time of the next afternoon train from Sligo to Dublin would have been a bit of chore (ringing the station but not getting through, then frantically searching for a timetable in the bookcase) , so '20 past the hour every second hour' clockfacing would have been handy.

However in the Internet/smartphone age whatever advantages it had are lessened to the extent, imo, that its not worth bothering with if it causes other disadvantages.

thisisadamh

Where is everyone getting the information about the new timetables? Any information about the Westport/Galway services timetable change? What are the travel times looking like?

Jamie2k9

posted on page 50

Monday night IE trialled a Dublin - Galway train with a 2:05 journey time and 3 stops. Tonight they will trial a Dublin - Galway train with a 2:11 journey time and 6 stops. An outline of what to expect in the new timetable

IE will release the draft one is the next week or two.

thisisadamh

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

posted on page 50

Monday night IE trialled a Dublin - Galway train with a 2:05 journey time and 3 stops. Tonight they will trial a Dublin - Galway train with a 2:11 journey time and 6 stops. An outline of what to expect in the new timetable

IE will release the draft one is the next week or two.

Thanks Sounds good, so possible an hour to Athlone, that will be handy!

CIE

Since when is "trial" a verb? What was wrong with the verb "try", which "trial" is the noun form of anyway?

Sponge Bob

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

posted on page 50

Monday night IE trialled a Dublin - Galway train with a 2:05 journey time and 3 stops. Tonight they will trial a Dublin - Galway train with a 2:11 journey time and 6 stops.

They need at least 3 trains each way each day with A NO MORE THAN 2:15 time as the express buses do 2:30 from O Connell Bridge and you gotta get down the quays to Heuston.

Really they need 1:59 times...1 stop only...and consistently.

Solair

CIE wrote: »

Since when is "trial" a verb? What was wrong with the verb "try", which "trial" is the noun form of anyway?

It's defined as both a noun and a verb in many major dictionaries.
Language evolves!

Sponge Bob

Language evolves but de brudders will always need regular 'tea breaks' even if they all drink double lattes nowadays.

foggy_lad

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

posted on page 50

Monday night IE trialled a Dublin - Galway train with a 2:05 journey time and 3 stops. Tonight they will trial a Dublin - Galway train with a 2:11 journey time and 6 stops. An outline of what to expect in the new timetable

IE will release the draft one is the next week or two.

It is easy achieve those times on a clear road! I wonder what time bus Eireann trialled their fictional timetables, middle of the night sounds about right, how much time are they allowing for the three stops? One minute? Three? Have they allowed for delays to the oncoming traffic leaving them sat at a station for 15+ minutes?

Sponge Bob

This was all well foretold. The only surprise is the fossilised and utterly inadequate response by the myriad €100k salarymen in CIE.

As I said over 4 years ago in this forum.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57243855&postcount=6

The move will more likely be to EXPRESS buses at the expense of rail post 2010 .The Motorways will simply murder Iarnród Éireann I fear .

Victor

gobythewall wrote: »

Not THAT much work

Play nice

Moderator

Victor

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Reported for being another side swipe at RPSI and IRRS members.

Knock it off.

If you have a problem with a post, either counter it or report it. None of this snide 'I'm telling on you' stuff.

Moderator.

---

You do realise he was slagging people who insist on sitting up the front on trains and buses?

Although many tend to be 6, not drunk.

parsi

dowlingm wrote: »

the Holy Covenant Of The Clockface,

If someone could photoshop this I'd be grateful - it's a killer phrase.

parsi

foggy_lad wrote: »

It is easy achieve those times on a clear road! I wonder what time bus Eireann trialled their fictional timetables, middle of the night sounds about right, how much time are they allowing for the three stops? One minute? Three? Have they allowed for delays to the oncoming traffic leaving them sat at a station for 15+ minutes?

He was talking about a train - not a bus.

Interesting question about the timing of stops. Far too often these seem to be based on 5 athletic Germans standing to attention and ready to jump on as soon as the doors open rather than the reality of 1 nun, 1 pensioner, 1 parent trying to manhandle a buggy and a kid across the gaping gap (especially in Cork) and a golden pass holder trying to figure which of the two trains he can see is the one that exists.

foggy_lad

parsi wrote: »

He was talking about a train - not a bus.

Interesting question about the timing of stops. Far too often these seem to be based on 5 athletic Germans standing to attention and ready to jump on as soon as the doors open rather than the reality of 1 nun, 1 pensioner, 1 parent trying to manhandle a buggy and a kid across the gaping gap (especially in Cork) and a golden pass holder trying to figure which of the two trains he can see is the one that exists.

like a bus travelling in the dead of night a train being trialled at night will not have any of the normal "congestion" such as having to wait on trains at single tracked sections or having to slow down to allow other trains to overtake them.

The Idyl Race

parsi wrote: »

If someone could photoshop this I'd be grateful - it's a killer phrase.

That makes three: the most recent two are:

Its a bus. With a jax.

Willy Wonka's Golden Ticket

Cavehill Red

Had to go to Belfast and back today with junior. Tried to book train tickets online. The website wouldn't offer any return journey seats. Went down to Connolly. Was offered zero discount for travelling on a day return. Price requested was 55 euro per ticket, no negotiation, no apology, no concern at losing the custom. I walked round to Busaras and got two bus tickets for 40 euro. Two fat controllers sat in the booth with the Sunday World open in front of them, saying 'Like it or lump it.' This, in a nutshell, is why Irish Rail is screwed.

The Idyl Race

Cavehill Red wrote: »

Had to go to Belfast and back today with junior. Tried to book train tickets online. The website wouldn't offer any return journey seats. Went down to Connolly. Was offered zero discount for travelling on a day return. Price requested was 55 euro per ticket, no negotiation, no apology, no concern at losing the custom. I walked round to Busaras and got two bus tickets for 40 euro. Two fat controllers sat in the booth with the Sunday World open in front of them, saying 'Like it or lump it.' This, in a nutshell, is why Irish Rail is screwed.

This has been Irish Rail's attitude since time immemorial - good times and bad times in the past never shifted it - short of sacking the lot of them and starting again it won't change. Google railusers.ie and Maynooth.

Cavehill Red

Solair wrote: »

Belfast and Dublin are too close together for Intercity rail to have much advantage and because of partition and the troubles there's relatively limited interaction between them anyway. People don't actually travel as much between Dublin and Belfast as you'd find between other similarly located cities in Britain or elsewhere. Business and social connections between the two places were pretty underdeveloped and largely still remain so.
That's slowly changing, but it is still impacting on relatively low uptake on cross-border services compared to what you'd expect given their proximity.

Read back through this thread and came across this nonsense. I'd suggest that charging 55 euro a day return when the bus does a ticket for less than half of that and gets closer to the city centre (in Belfast) in much the same time is why there is relatively low uptake on the cross-border service.
They can run buses 24 hours a day, such is the demand. I believe it's the only transport route on the entire island that runs around the clock. There's plenty of travel between the two, and they both function as hubs for their hinterlands and for further travel. Due to no train connection to Dublin airport, rail is already at a loss on the Belfast-Dublin airport route. To claim traffic on the Belfast-Dublin route they'd need to be at least competitive. Instead, they're over twice the price. That's why the buses are running 24/7 and are full, and why the trains have 'low uptake'.

Sponge Bob

Cavehill Red wrote: »

They can run buses 24 hours a day, such is the demand. I believe it's the only transport route on the entire island that runs around the clock.

No, Galway runs all night too.

Cavehill Red

Sponge Bob wrote: »

No, Galway runs all night too.

I'm guessing you're not referring to the train route.

foggy_lad

Sponge Bob wrote: »

No, Galway runs all night too.

When did that start? Afaik the last bus out of Galway is 8.30pm and 9pmex Dublin. With city link their last bus ex Galway is at 7.15pm and 8.15pm on Sunday.The last daily service from Galway with gobus is at 6.45pm with a couple of later buses on Sundays.

bk

foggy_lad wrote: »

When did that start? Afaik the last bus out of Galway is 8.30pm and 9pmex Dublin. With city link their last bus ex Galway is at 7.15pm and 8.15pm on Sunday.The last daily service from Galway with gobus is at 6.45pm with a couple of later buses on Sundays.

It isn't clockface, but there are late night buses. Citylink 1:15, 2:15 (both skip the city center and go straight to the airport) and then from 5:15 on. GoBus 1:45 (skips the city), 3:45, 5:45, on.

There is a similar story with GoBE and Aircoach in Cork.

schemingbohemia

Cavehill Red wrote: »

Had to go to Belfast and back today with junior. Tried to book train tickets online. The website wouldn't offer any return journey seats. Went down to Connolly. Was offered zero discount for travelling on a day return. Price requested was 55 euro per ticket, no negotiation, no apology, no concern at losing the custom. I walked round to Busaras and got two bus tickets for 40 euro. Two fat controllers sat in the booth with the Sunday World open in front of them, saying 'Like it or lump it.' This, in a nutshell, is why Irish Rail is screwed.

Why couldn't you book online? The rugby was on on Saturday so there may have been "the quota" of seats already booked - they tend to keep a lot of seats for walk-ups.

How late did you realise you needed to go to Belfast? If you book 3 days in advance you get a fare of 30e and 15e for the child (if between 5 and 16).

foggy_lad

bk wrote: »

It isn't clockface, but there are late night buses. Citylink 1:15, 2:15 (both skip the city center and go straight to the airport) and then from 5:15 on. GoBus 1:45 (skips the city), 3:45, 5:45, on.

There is a similar story with GoBE and Aircoach in Cork.

On the daily GoBus service there is a 7 hour gap between 6.45pm and 1.45am ex Galway while Citylink have a 6 hour gap between 7.15pm and 1.15am ex Galway. There are similar gaps on services ex Dublin/Airport with gaps of 5 hours on daily services with all operators This is not clockface but also not buses through the night. Bus Éireann have no night services but they do offer the latest regular services leaving both Dublin(9pm) and Galway(8.30pm).

Irish Rail on the other hand do have 2 early trains to Dublin out of the 8 a day each way on the line but the earliest they can get you to Galway is 10.15am

bk

Er foggy_lad, isn't that exactly what I said?

That it isn't clockface, but there are night services!!

stop

foggy_lad wrote: »

On the daily GoBus service there is a 7 hour gap between 6.45pm and 1.45am ex Galway while Citylink have a 6 hour gap between 7.15pm and 1.15am ex Galway. There are similar gaps on services ex Dublin/Airport with gaps of 5 hours on daily services with all operators This is not clockface but also not buses through the night. Bus Éireann have no night services but they do offer the latest regular services leaving both Dublin(9pm) and Galway(8.30pm).

Irish Rail on the other hand do have 2 early trains to Dublin out of the 8 a day each way on the line but the earliest they can get you to Galway is 10.15am

The reason for the gap in services to Dublin Airport can be found here
http://www.dublinairport.com/gns/flight-information/live-departures.aspx
and here
http://www.dublinairport.com/gns/flight-information/live-arrivals.aspx