Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread II

ssaye

totallegend wrote: »

I dunno, I'd say they're aiming somewhat higher than that. The quotes from Richie Murphy are definitely not an unequivocal endorsement of Madigan being the future, I'd say they'd like a semi-decent fallback option if Madigan turns out not to be up to the job.

Semi Decent to me is 6 or starts a season or do you mean an established 2nd choice happy to play that role.


Getting a waning Ex International NH/SH or midtable Aviva Prem may fit the bill

We probably mean the same thing just wording it differently.

CatFromHue

Depending on who they can get we could be in a tricky situation at the start of next season if Madigan goes on tour with Ireland in the Summer. The last game for that tour is on 22 June which could/would delay him starting the season due to the player welfare scheme.

Any SANZAR International player won't be available until after the 4 Nations which finishes on 5th October.

The ITM Cup in New Zealand and the Currie Cup in SA both run until the end of October so unless we get an Aussie non international who will be free after the Super XV then we will be caught for No.10's in September.

Winters

That makes Berquist sound more and more suitable. I would be happy to see him back.

totallegend

ssaye wrote: »

Semi Decent to me is 6 or starts a season or do you mean an established 2nd choice happy to play that role.


Getting a waning Ex International NH/SH or midtable Aviva Prem may fit the bill

We probably mean the same thing just wording it differently.

No, I mean good enough to be first choice if Madigan can't hack it... Ideally someone who could cover 12 too.

Don't mean to be pessimistic but as good as Madigan has been, he hasn't had a run of top level games so he is unproven. Leinster have to recognise that.

irishbucsfan

I really can't see any tri nations players being targets. Maybe lealifano or whatever he's called?

molloyjh

totallegend wrote: »

No, I mean good enough to be first choice if Madigan can't hack it... Ideally someone who could cover 12 too.

Don't mean to be pessimistic but as good as Madigan has been, he hasn't had a run of top level games so he is unproven. Leinster have to recognise that.

Prior to Croke Park Sexton had only started 1 HEC game. He had been tested even less than Madigan has been. We need back-up to Madigan, but I want to see us to back the guy. We backed Sexton and it worked out very well.

[Jackass]

Madigan has given us no reason to believe he's not up to the job. He's been superb, and whilst not perfect, is a more rounded player than Sexton was when given the helm and is far ahead of where Sexton was at 23.

Next season may take a bit of bedding in with his game management, his weakest aspect, but if he can improve that on the same steep curve that Sexton did, he could well be better than Sexton.

Alas, a crucial aspect of this depends on Kidney and fast tracking him with international rugby also, but with the MRP in full swing and paying dividends and with good excuse not to include him in Jackson (and almost comically, still ROG), I can't see him doing Leinster any favours in that regard - presumably he'll have Keatley ahead of him too and may drop him from the squad altogether now that he needs that international training camp assistance.

totallegend

molloyjh wrote: »

Prior to Croke Park Sexton had only started 1 HEC game. He had been tested even less than Madigan has been. We need back-up to Madigan, but I want to see us to back the guy. We backed Sexton and it worked out very well.

Yeah, all true. But if Contepomi hadn't been injured and Sexton had got no game time in Croke Park or in Edinburgh, how confident would we have been going into the next season with Sexton and Berne?

I've a lot of faith in Madigan and a small part of me is glad to see Sexton going so he gets more game time, just reading the comments from Murphy today I think Leinster are aiming higher than people here think.

Podge_irl

totallegend wrote: »

Yeah, all true. But if Contepomi hadn't been injured and Sexton had got no game time in Croke Park or in Edinburgh, how confident would we have been going into the next season with Sexton and Berne?

I would have been quite confident.

Sexton had a poor run of form around Christmas that year (a run of form I don't think was anywhere near as bad as Cheika apparently did), but was excellent the previous season. I don't think Madigan has had as good a season as Sexton did in 07/08, but I do think he is capable of it.

irishbucsfan

Sexton made clear progress on areas where he was weak in 2008 and it was very evident before Croke Park. Some of the best rugby we played that Spring was when he was coming off the bench, Contepomi was playing pretty badly that year.

Madigan on the other hand still has the same weaknesses. He needs a run in the team to shift them like Sexton had. I am a little worried.

Podge_irl

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Sexton made clear progress on areas where he was weak in 2008 and it was very evident before Croke Park. Some of the best rugby we played that Spring was when he was coming off the bench, Contepomi was playing pretty badly that year.

I don't remember the details, but I'm pretty sure Leinster scored more tries that season with Sexton at 10 despite him playing far less time there. I think I've mentioned it before, but I was half hoping Sexton would start that semi-final, I don't think Madigan is at that kind of level yet.

shuffol

My memories of Sexton was that he was having a really poor season prior to the semi in 09.

TheGoldenAges

shuffol wrote: »

My memories of Sexton was that he was having a really poor season prior to the semi in 09.

Pretty much true, he played a few games for Marys due to not being involved in the matchday 23s

irishbucsfan

shuffol wrote: »

My memories of Sexton was that he was having a really poor season prior to the semi in 09.

No, he was poor for a small while in the very beginning of the season. After christmas he was a breath of fresh air off the bench. Our flat line attack didn't suit Felipe at all, it was very stale.

Podge_irl

TheGoldenAges wrote: »

Pretty much true, he played a few games for Marys due to not being involved in the matchday 23s

He played one game for Marys. And he was in excellent form off the bench come March/April.

irishbucsfan

If I remember correctly, the Sexton loop was perfect in those months.

TheGoldenAges

irishbucsfan wrote: »

If I remember correctly, the Sexton loop was perfect in those months.

We're calling it the Sexton loop now

shuffol

irishbucsfan wrote: »

No, he was poor for a small while in the very beginning of the season. After christmas he was a breath of fresh air off the bench. Our flat line attack didn't suit Felipe at all, it was very stale.

I dunno, my recollection is different, I think Nacewa being preferred at fly half for a large part of the season is indicative of Sextons struggles.

Podge_irl

shuffol wrote: »

I dunno, my recollection is different, I think Nacewa being preferred at fly half for a large part of the season is indicative of Sextons struggles.

Admittedly this thread is from after the semi final so opinions will be coloured but its worth a glance -> http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=60186044

Just wanted to get the forums views on this. From my point of view, when sexton has been playing this year, Leinsters backs have looked much more deep and dangerous. I feel that sexton is a better passer and playmaker than contepomi was and a much more natural 10. A lot of Leinster fans, myself included, have said that Leinster would never be successful with conters at 10 and he is undoubtedly a much better 12 as shown when playing for the pumas. This isnt a reaction to a hollow victory over a poor scarlets side last night or last saturday, I feel that Sexton has really got the backs moving this season when playing. Also it isnt a slight on dr phil who has been my favourite player for years and Im very sad to see him go. The future looks bright, and hopefully the sex and reddan can find some form together next year.

Tox56

Podge_irl wrote: »

Admittedly this thread is from after the semi final so opinions will be coloured but its worth a glance -> http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=60186044

Some good stuff in that thread:

Great Leinster servant and imo Sexton wont ever be near his level.I hope im wrong

There's no doubt that as an attacking 10, Sexton was the great play maker of our backline. He's always been superb at throwing the long, flat pass which puts players through at pace and makes breaks (simular to O'Garas passing for the national team).

The question marks over him were always his place kicking, but he seems to have put some serious work into that and well done to Sexton, Leinster coaching and Felipe because he has improved beyond recognition..

Sounds a lot like Madigan, so hopefully he can have a similarly rapid rise

irishbucsfan

The best part of that thread (apart from me seemingly being very tired of watching Felipe) was the guy who had been questioning whether Nacewa could play 15. I probably had done at some point as well. Shows what a difference a few years can make!

shuffol

Podge_irl wrote: »

Admittedly this thread is from after the semi final so opinions will be coloured but its worth a glance -> http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=60186044

Maybe his form picked up sooner than I thought, just looking at match reports he didnt play a minute between the defeat away to Castres in December which he started and the game away to Scarlets in late February(6 games later) where he came on after an hour. He then came on at a similiar point in most ML games up until the HEC semi.

Looking through the reports its striking how little rotation there was then compared to now.

Podge_irl

shuffol wrote: »

Looking through the reports its striking how little rotation there was then compared to now.

Not Cheika's strong point. I didn't like how he treated Sexton either.

irishbucsfan

I was talking to him the night of that Castres game and he was pretty disappointed with how he played. That game was quite important in getting them motivated I think.

Cheika was more conservative than most. He made Kidney look like Schmidt!

shuffol

Podge_irl wrote: »

Not Cheika's strong point. I didn't like how he treated Sexton either.

I remember how Whittaker was really struggling for most the season(was incredible away to Quins though) and being annoyed how POD could barely get a look in at all, Cheika's since being proven right but at the time he was really impressing for Clontarf and looked the best young 9 in the country.

Tox56

shuffol wrote: »

Looking through the reports its striking how little rotation there was then compared to now.

There was always the annual trip away to the Dragons where he would throw a team of kids together and send them off, and that was about it. One of Schmidt's lasting legacies will be the youth he helped bring through and develop, but at the same time ensuring we were the best team in Europe

shuffol

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I was talking to him the night of that Castres game and he was pretty disappointed with how he played. That game was quite important in getting them motivated I think.

Cheika was more conservative than most. He made Kidney look like Schmidt!

Some of the criticism after the game was pretty scathing, they were completely beaten up at the breakdown and the ladyboy jibes were in full flow. I wonder how much the reaction spurred them on, it was a different side that went to Quins.

danthefan

Cheika use to wreck my head picking players like Shaun Berne and Cameron Jowitt ahead of the likes of Madigan/McKinley or a young SOB. He was like Kidney or EOS for sure, he had his first XV and that was it, end of story. He did a huge amount for Leinster and as a supporter I'm thankful for that but it was definitely time for him to move on.

Hype710

Michael Berne and Christian Warner used to get selected ahead of McFadden and O'Malley too.

Donald Coyle

Hype710 wrote: »

Michael Berne and Christian Warner used to get selected ahead of McFadden and O'Malley too.

Was Clint Newland ever picked ahead of anyone?