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Sexton and the Leinster backline

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  • 09-05-2009 12:04pm
    #1
    wixfjord
    Site Banned Posts: 5,346 ✭✭✭


    Just wanted to get the forums views on this. From my point of view, when sexton has been playing this year, Leinsters backs have looked much more deep and dangerous. I feel that sexton is a better passer and playmaker than contepomi was and a much more natural 10. A lot of Leinster fans, myself included, have said that Leinster would never be successful with conters at 10 and he is undoubtedly a much better 12 as shown when playing for the pumas. This isnt a reaction to a hollow victory over a poor scarlets side last night or last saturday, I feel that Sexton has really got the backs moving this season when playing. Also it isnt a slight on dr phil who has been my favourite player for years and Im very sad to see him go. The future looks bright, and hopefully the sex and reddan can find some form together next year.


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    #2
    anonymous_joe
    Registered Users Posts: 9,255 ✭✭✭anonymous_joe


    Easy to forget that Contepomi's a 12 first and a 10 second. The game's moved on defensively massively in the past few seasons, and the sheer magic of a Contepomi became less influential, throw in the value of a scrum-half who suits the out-half and Sexton can get more out of the Leinster backline.

    Thought Whitaker's delivery wasn't too bad last night (not as good as against Munster but better than most games this season) and that helped too.

    I've heard Sexton described as a 'classic' out-half, and usually compared to O'Gara. There's a lot of talent there, and he's answered his critics after a tough season.


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    #3
    danthefan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭danthefan


    He has more elements to his game than ROG, he's far more physical and a lot quicker. He has the passing game and his tactical kicking against Munster and Scarlets was very good. Just a matter of whether he has the head for it and can deliver on his potential. He has the potential to be better than ROG imo.


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    #4
    anonymous_joe
    Registered Users Posts: 9,255 ✭✭✭anonymous_joe


    danthefan wrote: »
    He has more elements to his game than ROG, he's far more physical and a lot quicker. He has the passing game and his tactical kicking against Munster and Scarlets was very good. Just a matter of whether he has the head for it and can deliver on his potential. He has the potential to be better than ROG imo.

    More physical and quicker for sure, but his vision and kicking's not up to O'Gara's standards yet.

    Hopefully will be soon.


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    #5
    Crash
    Registered Users Posts: 11,195 ✭✭✭✭Crash


    Couple of excellent kicks in behind last night, was impressed as that was an area I felt he lacked a bit.


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    #6
    escobar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 283 ✭✭escobar


    danthefan wrote: »
    He has more elements to his game than ROG, he's far more physical and a lot quicker. He has the passing game and his tactical kicking against Munster and Scarlets was very good. Just a matter of whether he has the head for it and can deliver on his potential. He has the potential to be better than ROG imo.

    He's a great passer...The backs really open up when he plays. I'll not miss felipe when he's gone.

    As for the O Gara question probably a little too soon yet but I would agree with you, he has the potential to be a better all round , his try for example was exceptional. It's great to finally have backup for O Gara ....

    The game was a joy to watch, Leinster are peaking at the right time. I'd say tigers are quaking in their boots after that performance...


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    #7
    anonymous_joe
    Registered Users Posts: 9,255 ✭✭✭anonymous_joe


    escobar wrote: »
    He's a great passer...The backs really open up when he plays. I'll not miss felipe when he's gone.

    As for the O Gara question probably a little too soon yet but I would agree with you, he has the potential to be a better all round , his try for example was exceptional. It's great to finally have backup for O Gara ....

    The game was a joy to watch, Leinster are peaking at the right time. I'd say tigers are quaking in their boots after that performance...

    I'd be amazed if they quake in their boots before any game. ^^


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    #8
    escobar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 283 ✭✭escobar


    anonymous_joe wrote: »
    I'd be amazed if they quake in their boots before any game. ^^

    I don't know about that. Leinster fronted up to Munster and have now with sexton releasing their backline....... Their looking really good and have peaked at the perfect time.....

    If I was on an opposing team I would be gravely concerned.
    Rightfully so Leicester will feel lucky to have gotten through the semis on kicks and would consider themselves the underdogs for the final tie.... Leinster are damn lucky leicester got through....I'd much prefer them than the blues....

    It'll be a tough match but leinster should open up and take controle in the last quarter.


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    #9
    wixfjord
    Site Banned Posts: 5,346 ✭✭✭wixfjord


    escobar wrote: »
    I don't know about that. Leinster fronted up to Munster and have now with sexton releasing their backline....... Their looking really good and have peaked at the perfect time.....

    If I was on an opposing team I would be gravely concerned.
    Rightfully so Leicester will feel lucky to have gotten through the semis on kicks and would consider themselves the underdogs for the final tie.... Leinster are damn lucky leicester got through....I'd much prefer them than the blues....

    It'll be a tough match but leinster should open up and take controle in the last quarter.


    Are you a leicester fan in disguise wanting one of us leinstermen to give ye some ammunition for the dressing room wall in murrayfield by saying "ah yeah its a foregone conclusion"? :pac:


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    #10
    anonymous_joe
    Registered Users Posts: 9,255 ✭✭✭anonymous_joe


    escobar wrote: »
    I don't know about that. Leinster fronted up to Munster and have now with sexton releasing their backline....... Their looking really good and have peaked at the perfect time.....

    If I was on an opposing team I would be gravely concerned.
    Rightfully so Leicester will feel lucky to have gotten through the semis on kicks and would consider themselves the underdogs for the final tie.... Leinster are damn lucky leicester got through....I'd much prefer them than the blues....

    It'll be a tough match but leinster should open up and take controle in the last quarter.

    Leicester are one of the toughest nastiest and most effective teams in rugby. This hasn't been a stirling year for them by any stretch of the imagination but they're in the running for a GP title and the HC. There's no way you can write a team like that off.

    It'll be a bloody difficult game for both sides I'd reckon.


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    #11
    escobar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 283 ✭✭escobar


    anonymous_joe wrote: »
    Leicester are one of the toughest nastiest and most effective teams in rugby. This hasn't been a stirling year for them by any stretch of the imagination but they're in the running for a GP title and the HC. There's no way you can write a team like that off.

    It'll be a bloody difficult game for both sides I'd reckon.


    No team that gets into the HC final is a bad team but as a long waiting leinster supporter I feel it is our time.

    Of course it will be a war of attrition and leinster will have to watch out for leicester tactics.... after all they were called Leicester cheetas for a season wern't they.;)

    But on the whole Leinster on form are the better team . Now this is not dicounting it's a cup final game and anything could happen but I'm just starting enjoy myself a little....:) It's gonna be a great match!!!

    p.s. perhaps if you made a comparison of Leicester and sterling's performance over the last year you might find leicester have had more than a sterling season....;)


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    #12
    danthefan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭danthefan


    anonymous_joe wrote: »
    Leicester are one of the toughest nastiest and most effective teams in rugby. This hasn't been a stirling year for them by any stretch of the imagination but they're in the running for a GP title and the HC. There's no way you can write a team like that off.

    It'll be a bloody difficult game for both sides I'd reckon.

    Eh? GP and HEC final? How could they possibly be having a better year up to this point?


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    #13
    anonymous_joe
    Registered Users Posts: 9,255 ✭✭✭anonymous_joe


    escobar wrote: »
    No team that gets into the HC final is a bad team but as a long waiting leinster supporter I feel it is our time.

    Of course it will be a war of attrition and leinster will have to watch out for leicester tactics.... after all they were called Leicester cheetas for a season wern't they.;)

    But on the whole Leinster on form are the better team . Now this is not dicounting it's a cup final game and anything could happen but I'm just starting enjoy myself a little....:) It's gonna be a great match!!!

    p.s. perhaps if you made a comparison of Leicester and sterling's performance over the last year you might find leicester have had more than a sterling season....;)

    Well... I'm just trying to be cautious. We've a good chance, but it won't be easy. ^^


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    #14
    danthefan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,770 ✭✭✭danthefan


    Anyway as for Sexton, his passing is really superb. He's involved in 6 of the 7 tries from the other night, I think the BOD one is the only one he doesn't touch the ball in somewhere.


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    #15
    escobar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 283 ✭✭escobar


    danthefan wrote: »
    Eh? GP and HEC final? How could they possibly be having a better year up to this point?

    What about winning the whatsitsname cup, you know the one that never really took off and the welsh kept winning. Think it's gone now...


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    #16
    escobar
    Closed Accounts Posts: 283 ✭✭escobar


    danthefan wrote: »
    Anyway as for Sexton, his passing is really superb. He's involved in 6 of the 7 tries from the other night, I think the BOD one is the only one he doesn't touch the ball in somewhere.

    It's absolutely brilliant, he's really stepped up with felipe gone.

    The way they're played reminded me of the drubbing they used to give the welsh sides when they had 9 teams.....superb ......

    If he keeps this form up he could be looking at an place on the Irish team . no mean feat....


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    #17
    Tim Robbins
    Registered Users Posts: 8,965 ✭✭✭Tim Robbins


    anonymous_joe wrote: »
    Easy to forget that Contepomi's a 12 first and a 10 second.
    In my few 10, 12 should be interchangable.
    Michal Lynagh, Gary Ella, Jonny Wilkonson, Daniel Carter, Aran Mauger all played both as did many other great players including Dr. Felipe.

    The thinking that someone is an out and out 10 is very Irish and it comes from the same type of thinking where everyone claps if the 10 makes 25 yards in a touch kick but forget he's just given possesion away.

    Contemponi was a world class 10 and 12. His passing, ball carrying, tackling, rugby brain are all better than Sexton's. Sexton has come on a lot this season and has done very well in his last few games.

    But let's not get carried away with ourselves. Before the world cup, everyone was saying O'Gara was the second best outhalf in the world because he had a few big games in the VI nations. But in reality the top 5 NZ 10's (Carter, Evans, McCallister, Mauger, Holwell) were probably all better than him.

    So let's not get carried away with hype.


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    #18
    anonymous_joe
    Registered Users Posts: 9,255 ✭✭✭anonymous_joe


    Tim Robbins wrote: »
    In my few 10, 12 should be interchangable.
    Michal Lynagh, Gary Ella, Jonny Wilkonson, Daniel Carter, Aran Mauger all played both as did many other great players including Dr. Felipe.

    The thinking that someone is an out and out 10 is very Irish and it comes from the same type of thinking where everyone claps if the 10 makes 25 yards in a touch kick but forget he's just given possesion away.

    Contemponi was a world class 10 and 12. His passing, ball carrying, tackling, rugby brain are all better than Sexton's. Sexton has come on a lot this season and has done very well in his last few games.

    But let's not get carried away with ourselves. Before the world cup, everyone was saying O'Gara was the second best outhalf in the world because he had a few big games in the VI nations. But in reality the top 5 NZ 10's (Carter, Evans, McCallister, Mauger, Holwell) were probably all better than him.

    So let's not get carried away with hype.

    But look what I said - 12 first 10 second.

    I think it's natural that all players would prefer one, or specialise more in one, however you want to put it.

    I actually think looking at how Sexton plays it's half Contepomi half O'Gara. The influence of the Argentine on a somewhat traditional Irish out-half can only have been a good thing.


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    #19
    Tim Robbins
    Registered Users Posts: 8,965 ✭✭✭Tim Robbins


    anonymous_joe wrote: »
    But look what I said - 12 first 10 second.
    I did and I don't agree. I think he's equally good at both.
    It's bit like worrying if Simon Geoghan is better on the left wing or right wing.
    I think it's natural that all players would prefer one, or specialise more in one, however you want to put it.
    I heard him interviewed once and he said he prefered 10.


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    #20
    anonymous_joe
    Registered Users Posts: 9,255 ✭✭✭anonymous_joe


    Tim Robbins wrote: »
    I did and I don't agree. I think he's equally good at both.
    It's bit like worrying if Simon Geoghan is better on the left wing or right wing.


    I heard him interviewed once and he said he prefered 10.

    Really?

    I've always viewed him more as a 12 and I know Argentina did, but ah well. ^^


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    #21
    Tim Robbins
    Registered Users Posts: 8,965 ✭✭✭Tim Robbins


    anonymous_joe wrote: »
    Really?

    I've always viewed him more as a 12 and I know Argentina did, but ah well. ^^
    Argentina played him there because Hernadez went to 10.


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    #22
    Podge_irl
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,711 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    Tim Robbins wrote: »
    Contemponi was a world class 10 and 12. His passing, ball carrying, tackling, rugby brain are all better than Sexton's. Sexton has come on a lot this season and has done very well in his last few games.

    I don't think he was ever really a world-class 10 tbh. In my view he was definitely a better 12.


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    #23
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    Contempomi isn't a world class anything any more. Apart from kicker maybe He hasn't been all this season, and for a little of last season, although my memory of last season isnt the best anymore!

    Contepomi was a good 10 when he actually had the pace, flare and desire to get the backline moving. He was always a better 12 than 10, maybe if we had someone to challenge him for the position wed have been able to see that. This season however he's been awful as a 10, and I was getting extremely tired of seeing him play there... Great servant to the team though


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    #24
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    blah


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    #25
    subfreq
    Registered Users Posts: 634 ✭✭✭subfreq


    I have to say I think felipe is one of the most over rated players in World Rugby. He plays the odd gem but in general I think he is average. Very predictable in running possession(was that another step inside off your left foot with a 2 man overlap gone begging again?), passing slow, and his kicking unreliable.

    Sexton has phenomenal raw talent. I think he really gels the talents in the Leinster back line and changes up the play nicely. His kicking out of hand in particular is fantastic. The more I read and see of him the more I understand he needs to control his aggression/discipline but that is not entirely a bad thing. If channeled properly by the coaches I think he could be a top International.

    He will certainly have to stop giving away yellow cards if he is to break into the international team. The margins are so tight at that level he will have to give Declan complete faith in his discipline. You can't have the fly half of all players getting binned.

    Next season when he is number one and Reddan is by his side it will be very interesting.


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    #26
    twinytwo
    Registered Users Posts: 5,175 ✭✭✭twinytwo


    escobar wrote: »
    He's a great passer...The backs really open up when he plays. I'll not miss felipe when he's gone.

    As for the O Gara question probably a little too soon yet but I would agree with you, he has the potential to be a better all round , his try for example was exceptional. It's great to finally have backup for O Gara ....

    The game was a joy to watch, Leinster are peaking at the right time. I'd say tigers are quaking in their boots after that performance...

    Dont be getting ahead of yourself its easy to look good when Leinter are on fire... lets see him face down an all black/bok pack or have the likes of Nonu/Burger running at/into him a couple of times and see if he is any good.


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    #27
    [Jackass]
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,193 ✭✭✭[Jackass]


    There's no doubt that as an attacking 10, Sexton was the great play maker of our backline. He's always been superb at throwing the long, flat pass which puts players through at pace and makes breaks (simular to O'Garas passing for the national team).

    The question marks over him were always his place kicking, but he seems to have put some serious work into that and well done to Sexton, Leinster coaching and Felipe because he has improved beyond recognition.

    I am perfectly happy with Sexton starting at 10 in the final and think it's our most dangerous back line.

    His tactical kicking is good and he's a good all around player. It's funny, but it just seems the Leinster backline have really found there rythm over the last couple of days and please god they can carry it through to the final and we'll have a chance.

    As for Leicester, they are a superb side, not a whole lot unlike Munster, and will be dangerous from all over the field.

    If we are going to win, we will need another barnstorming, body on the lines, total commitment performance.

    I believe!!

    COME ON LEINSTER!!!


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    #28
    justsomebloke
    Registered Users Posts: 10,407 ✭✭✭✭justsomebloke


    I have to say I never understood why sexton wasn't played at 10 this year from the especially when they tried to force Isa in at number 10. I thought sexton had a good first year last year when he was playing, yes he still needed a lot of experience at top level but his talent was there. However with Contempomi never to play in a Leinster jersey again I don't think there is much to talk about as Sexton should now be given a proper chance to prove himself.

    Truthfully though I think the performace that has had me really scratching my head over what to do is Isa at 15. I think he has had 2 real stand out performance at 15 and I think he can bring an extra depth to the postition when compared to Kearney


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    #29
    raven136
    Registered Users Posts: 1,929 ✭✭✭raven136


    I love the revisionism here about Dr Phil.Didnt see many complaints about his running the Leinster backline as they scored try after try a few years back.Not many moaned about his performace in Toulose.

    He wasnt at his best this season but he has gotten older.
    Great Leinster servant and imo Sexton wont ever be near his level.I hope im wrong.
    A few months ago when Contepomi said he was leaving,there was plenty saying Leinster should get in a new 10 and now after a few good games Sexton is the great white hope.


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    #30
    wixfjord
    Site Banned Posts: 5,346 ✭✭✭wixfjord


    raven136 wrote: »
    I love the revisionism here about Dr Phil.Didnt see many complaints about his running the Leinster backline as they scored try after try a few years back.Not many moaned about his performace in Toulose.
    raven136 wrote: »
    He wasnt at his best this season but he has gotten older.

    Answer your own q?

    Also as somebody said in this thread I think, rugby has changed a lot in the last few years and improved a lot defensively. Also his style of play was suiting neither the position, the scrum half he was playing with or the backs he was playing with


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    #31
    Podge_irl
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,711 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    raven136 wrote: »
    I love the revisionism here about Dr Phil.Didnt see many complaints about his running the Leinster backline as they scored try after try a few years back.Not many moaned about his performace in Toulose.

    He wasnt at his best this season but he has gotten older.
    Great Leinster servant and imo Sexton wont ever be near his level.I hope im wrong.
    A few months ago when Contepomi said he was leaving,there was plenty saying Leinster should get in a new 10 and now after a few good games Sexton is the great white hope.

    Leinster still need a new ten, they're hardly going to get through a season with Sexton and, god help us, Nacewa as the only fly-halves. Sexton has the potential to be a much better fly-half then Contepomi, probably not a better all round player though. He's already better at a lot of things.


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